Is having a baby by IVF using donor sperms a sin?

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Philo

Guest
#1
Hi ya'll . Am single and recently underwent surgery where by tubes were removed. My fertility is at risk and the doctor advises I move quickly to having one. I love children and family and have been waiting for marriage . However am currently not dating and this situation even makes it harder.

I am thinking seriously of having IVF with donor sperms. This way I will not commit any sin and it will be more like Mary mother of Jesus.

Do you think this is godly ?
 
C

coby

Guest
#2
No, with IVF a few may die. The kid won't know his or her dad. A man God has for you might not be interested when you have a kid. Why not just believe God for an Isaac?
 

blue_ladybug

Senior Member
Feb 21, 2014
70,869
9,601
113
#3
If your tubes (ovaries, fallopian tubes, etc) were removed, then it's impossible to get pregnant even using IVF. :confused: The comment about it will be more like Mary confuses me. Mary was divinely impregnated, but IVF uses a man's sperm so even though you don't have sex, you're still being impregnated by a man. You ain't gonna be having no divinely immaculate birth..lol

Btw, many children are waiting to be adopted. Why bring one more into this fallen evil world? Adopt a few kids, and leave the IVF alone..

*feels uncomfortable talking about IVF..lol*
 
Nov 25, 2014
942
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#4
If your tubes (ovaries, fallopian tubes, etc) were removed, then it's impossible to get pregnant even using IVF. :confused: The comment about it will be more like Mary confuses me. Mary was divinely impregnated, but IVF uses a man's sperm so even though you don't have sex, you're still being impregnated by a man. You ain't gonna be having no divinely immaculate birth..lol

Btw, many children are waiting to be adopted. Why bring one more into this fallen evil world? Adopt a few kids, and leave the IVF alone..

*feels uncomfortable talking about IVF..lol*
Actually, a pregnancy can be created in a lab without the presence of fallopian tubes. It's likely that before the pregnancy she harvested some eggs. If she has a uterus, then she could carry the baby--tubes are no longer necessary. So, basically, she's curious about the ethical ramifications of fertilizing some of her already harvest eggs and having those implanted in her still-existing uterus.
 

blue_ladybug

Senior Member
Feb 21, 2014
70,869
9,601
113
#5
Actually, a pregnancy can be created in a lab without the presence of fallopian tubes. It's likely that before the pregnancy she harvested some eggs. If she has a uterus, then she could carry the baby--tubes are no longer necessary. So, basically, she's curious about the ethical ramifications of fertilizing some of her already harvest eggs and having those implanted in her still-existing uterus.


Ewwww..lol.. Nothing against IVF, but I think I'd rather wait and make a baby the old-fashioned way.. With a MAN, not a test tube..
 
Nov 25, 2014
942
44
0
#6
Hi ya'll . Am single and recently underwent surgery where by tubes were removed. My fertility is at risk and the doctor advises I move quickly to having one. I love children and family and have been waiting for marriage . However am currently not dating and this situation even makes it harder.

I am thinking seriously of having IVF with donor sperms. This way I will not commit any sin and it will be more like Mary mother of Jesus.

Do you think this is godly ?
Christians have varying views about the ethics of engaging with extreme fertility interventions. There is more to be examined than simply "should I do this to get pregnant?"

Here are some things you need to consider:
(Note, some of these will be uncomfortable to consider. I'm not trying to be mean or harsh. I just think that such a huge decision really requires a clear-eyed examination of all possible ramifications).

1. Why are you prioritizing "birthing" a child? Is there something that makes a child you birth more valuable to you than say, adopting and raising a child? Could this desire possibly be a selfish desire based on your own expectations vs. God's plan for you?

2. Is it ethical to create fertilized eggs that will likely be destroyed? The typical course for IVF is that many, many eggs are fertilized. Two are implanted. If those are successful, the others are kept frozen for a period and then destroyed. (I do know that it's possible to donate fertilized eggs, but if there are no takers, eventually eggs are destroyed). If you believe that life begins at conception, how is allowing for the destruction of already fertilized eggs any different than abortion?

3. Considering the importance of fathering, and the way that children suffer when they are inadequately fathered, is it ethical to deliberately decide to give birth to a child who will have no father? Could your desire to bear a child regardless of the presence of a father be a kind of selfishness--like you will make sure you fulfill your dreams without considering how painful it might be for a child to grow up without a father?

4. Are you in a position to actually raise a child by yourself? (Or CHILDREN, since IVF often results in twins). Do you have the extensive spiritual, social, familial, and financial support you'll need to really do right by the child? Can you supply for all the child's basic needs? Will you be able to handle the enormous stress of single-parenting?

5. Can I afford these procedures? IVF can be very expensive, sometimes without a resulting birth. Does your insurance cover this? Do you have savings to pay for it? Is it ethical to accrue a serious amount of debt to have a child and potentially cause suffering for the child (due to financial stress) after the child is born?

If it helps, these are all issues I have personally considered in my own life. I was raised in a large family and always wanted to have many children. When I was in my 30s, the fact that I was unmarried and childless was very painful to me. Now that I'm 45, barring some miracle, it's unlikely that I will ever bear children. Over the years, various friends have suggested, "Why don't you just have a baby?" Even now, people say to me, "Oh, medicine is so advanced...women are having babies in their 50s." Having examined these questions, here's what I've decided:

1. I genuinely love children and don't think a child has to come from my body to be valuable and worthy of love. While it might have been an adventure to experience pregnancy, my happiness and purpose are not based on having this experience.

2. I find IVF, and other extreme procedures, to be very morally dicey. I am "prolife" in the largest sense of the word. I believe abortion is wrong, but so is destroying fertilized eggs. I could never engage with a method that would give me a benefit (I get to have a baby) at the expense of others (the destroyed eggs).

3. I think giving birth to a child without a father is completely unethical. If someone becomes pregnant and the father opts out...that's one thing. Deliberately choosing a fatherless life for a child is another. For me, the idea that I'm so special that I deserve to be self-fulfilled regardless of any pain my fatherless child would experience is not morally sound.

4. While I have a stable income, family, friends, etc., I don't know that I would make a good single parent. Certainly, I *could* do it if it was necessary and God would provide, but to deliberately decide to do it seems like it would set me up to potentially create a mess. I don't think that my desire for a child outweighs the discomfort and pain my child would experience having an introverted, slightly anxious mother with no spousal support. I also don't think that I could teach full time (which is very high-energy and demanding), and raise a child well. I'd likely be both a C-level teacher and a C-level mother.

So, obviously, having examined these questions, I decided that the answer for me was "NO." I could not in good conscience get pregnant and have a child. Because of this, I have submitted myself to God's will regarding this issue. It's not fun. I don't entirely understand why I, who really love children, have none, while others, who clearly don't, have children of their own. It can still be a painful area for me. However, I do believe that God is good. If this is His will for me, I don't need to fully understand it now, I just need to accept it and trust that His plan for me is better than what I always imagined for myself.

I'm not presuming that my conclusions will be your conclusions. I'm simply sharing the ideas I examined around this issue. It's possible that you could examine these ideas and decide that your conscience would allow you to go forward with this idea. Ultimately, it is between you and God.
 
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violakat

Senior Member
Apr 23, 2014
1,236
21
38
#7
What Mary said.
Christians have varying views about the ethics of engaging with extreme fertility interventions. There is more to be examined than simply "should I do this to get pregnant?"

Here are some things you need to consider:
(Note, some of these will be uncomfortable to consider. I'm not trying to be mean or harsh. I just think that such a huge decision really requires a clear-eyed examination of all possible ramifications).

1. Why are you prioritizing "birthing" a child? Is there something that makes a child you birth more valuable to you than say, adopting and raising a child? Could this desire possibly be a selfish desire based on your own expectations vs. God's plan for you?

2. Is it ethical to create fertilized eggs that will likely be destroyed? The typical course for IVF is that many, many eggs are fertilized. Two are implanted. If those are successful, the others are kept frozen for a period and then destroyed. (I do know that it's possible to donate fertilized eggs, but if there are no takers, eventually eggs are destroyed). If you believe that life begins at conception, how is allowing for the destruction of already fertilized eggs any different than abortion?

3. Considering the importance of fathering, and the way that children suffer when they are inadequately fathered, is it ethical to deliberately decide to give birth to a child who will have no father? Could your desire to bear a child regardless of the presence of a father be a kind of selfishness--like you will make sure you fulfill your dreams without considering how painful it might be for a child to grow up without a father?

4. Are you in a position to actually raise a child by yourself? (Or CHILDREN, since IVF often results in twins). Do you have the extensive spiritual, social, familial, and financial support you'll need to really do right by the child? Can you supply for all the child's basic needs? Will you be able to handle the enormous stress of single-parenting?

5. Can I afford these procedures? IVF can be very expensive, sometimes without a resulting birth. Does your insurance cover this? Do you have savings to pay for it? Is it ethical to accrue a serious amount of debt to have a child and potentially cause suffering for the child (due to financial stress) after the child is born?

If it helps, these are all issues I have personally considered in my own life. I was raised in a large family and always wanted to have many children. When I was in my 30s, the fact that I was unmarried and childless was very painful to me. Now that I'm 45, barring some miracle, it's unlikely that I will ever bear children. Over the years, various friends have suggested, "Why don't you just have a baby?" Even now, people say to me, "Oh, medicine is so advanced...women are having babies in their 50s." Having examined these questions, here's what I've decided:

1. I genuinely love children and don't think a child has to come from my body to be valuable and worthy of love. While it might have been an adventure to experience pregnancy, my happiness and purpose are not based on having this experience.

2. I find IVF, and other extreme procedures, to be very morally dicey. I am "prolife" in the largest sense of the word. I believe abortion is wrong, but so is destroying fertilized eggs. I could never engage with a method that would give me a benefit (I get to have a baby) at the expense of others (the destroyed eggs).

3. I think giving birth to a child without a father is completely unethical. If someone becomes pregnant and the father opts out...that's one thing. Deliberately choosing a fatherless life for a child is another. For me, the idea that I'm so special that I deserve to be self-fulfilled regardless of any pain my fatherless child would experience is not morally sound.

4. While I have a stable income, family, friends, etc., I don't know that I would make a good single parent. Certainly, I *could* do it if it was necessary and God would provide, but to deliberately decide to do it seems like it would set me up to potentially create a mess. I don't think that my desire for a child outweighs the discomfort and pain my child would experience having an introverted, slightly anxious mother with no spousal support. I also don't think that I could teach full time (which is very high-energy and demanding), and raise a child well. I'd likely be both a C-level teacher and a C-level mother.

So, obviously, having examined these questions, I decided that the answer for me was "NO." I could not in good conscience get pregnant and have a child. Because of this, I have submitted myself to God's will regarding this issue. It's not fun. I don't entirely understand why I, who really love children, have none, while others, who clearly don't, have children of their own. It can still be a painful area for me. However, I do believe that God is good. If this is His will for me, I don't need to fully understand it now, I just need to accept it and trust that His plan for me is better than what I always imagined for myself.

I'm not presuming that my conclusions will be your conclusions. I'm simply sharing the ideas I examined around this issue. It's possible that you could examine these ideas and decide that your conscience would allow you to go forward with this idea. Ultimately, it is between you and God.
 
W

WarriorForChrist

Guest
#8
Hi ya'll . Am single and recently underwent surgery where by tubes were removed. My fertility is at risk and the doctor advises I move quickly to having one. I love children and family and have been waiting for marriage . However am currently not dating and this situation even makes it harder.

I am thinking seriously of having IVF with donor sperms. This way I will not commit any sin and it will be more like Mary mother of Jesus.

Do you think this is godly ?
Why don't you trust in the Lord? You claim to be single and I don't believe the Lord intended women or men to raise a child on their own. God will provide you with a Godly man if you allow Him to. I also believe God wants you to have a child as well and will provide one for you.
 

seoulsearch

OutWrite Trouble
May 23, 2009
14,944
4,588
113
#9
Have you possibly considered adopting?

My parents adopted me from another country and I've met at least 2 other adoptees like myself who were adopted by single moms. Their mothers never married (never met the right person and never felt the need for a husband) and the children they adopted never felt a need for a father. I met these adoptees as adults and they said their family just felt complete the way it was.

God knits families together in very different ways, and people have very individual callings.
 

Roh_Chris

Senior Member
Jun 15, 2014
4,728
58
48
#10
Just a suggestion... perhaps the mods could move this thread to the women's section? :)
 
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Philo

Guest
#11
Thanks . Sometimes you develop doubts and start having ideas but certainly I can wait. Thanks
 
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Philo

Guest
#12
Wow thanks for the detailed response. Indeed you raise valid questions but really it's because of pressure and expectations. I will continue trusting God and see where he will lead me.
 
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Philo

Guest
#13
Thanks . I will give God a chance
 
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Philo

Guest
#14
Hi. I didn't see a women's forum section. However I believe this is a unisex topic .
 
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Philo

Guest
#15
Wow ! Thanks for sharing . I can now see things in perspective
 

zeroturbulence

Senior Member
Aug 2, 2009
24,581
4,269
113
#16
I don't think its a sin. Only God can decide if a baby is made or not, whether it be in a test tube or a tummy...
 
S

Smilernat

Guest
#17
Is that photo under your name from a movie? If so, could you please reply to me what the title of the movie is. I saw one like that as a child, and I have been searching for it forever...thank you.
 
X

Xeano321

Guest
#18
I love children and family and have been waiting for marriage . However am currently not dating and this situation even makes it harder.

I am thinking seriously of having IVF with donor sperms.
Though it seems like you have come to a conclusion already, I'll comment for the heck of it.

I would consider the priorities here before trying to reason whether it is a sin or not, take a step back and look at the picture:

You want a child because you love children and family. You're not married. You have no reasonable chance of marriage happening anytime soon.

Having a baby now would put an enormous strain on your economic and emotional situation. You would have no help once the baby is born, you would be the sole provider of shelter, food... Does this sound like a wise decision? Would this decision potentially affect your relationship with God? Is it without a doubt a door God has opened for you, or is it more of something you want? (since you know that you will undoubtedly become infertile.) Just a couple thoughts to kick around :)

~

Coming back to the topic of whether IVF is a sin... I've heard a lot of arguments going both ways. In my humble opinion, I don't believe it's natural. God designed the human body with a marvelous reproductive system. Sometimes this system fails for one reason or another (You're not alone, this has happened to women for a few thousand years!) If our bodies are not capable of reproduction naturally, should it be forced?

Up until the last few decades humans did not possess the technology for IVF to be possible. If you were in this situation 100 years ago, no alternative (apart from adoption. Keep that in mind for later in life.) would be available... If God has not intended your body to produce children, I would take that as his will... I believe Corinthians states "...honor God with your body".

IVF is on a fine fine line. It could go either way (sin or not sin) but I wouldn't try it and find out. Err on the side of it being a sin.
-

Stay strong, God has something going for you.;)
 
S

shlee23

Guest
#19
I don't believe it's a sin. Not everyone is blessed with a partner and adoption is pretty difficult. Only you know your situation and what you want. Continue to seek guidance from the Lord and I pray that you find the solution that is best for YOU.
 
K

Kaycie

Guest
#20
It is natural to want to be a mother. But it is devastating to a child to not have a mother and a father, so to do that purposely is wrong. I don't see anything wrong with the procedure for a married couple who can't conceive, however there are many created children already who need to be adopted. Becoming a mother is a hard, lifetime commitment, yet rewarding, make sure you know what you're getting into. Imagine the worse that can happen, talk to other moms, because you can't break up with your child and say this is just not working out. Try being a foster mom first.

speaking as a child whose mother never wanted her, it just seemed like the thing to do. I wish I would have been adopted or fostered.
 
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