19 isn't that young considering kids are having sex as young as 13. If she made it this far then she seems to be doing alright. Not to mention this terminology is also known as the common vernacular even among people up in their 30s. Besides not everyone goes around terrified of bogeymen on the internet. Are they there yes. Am I worried about them around every corner? nope. And if I had my own I'd be a decent enough parent that they didn't have to go online and ask random strangers.
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A
False. Scripture teaches holiness and purity both in and out of marriage both implicitly and explicitly all through the Bible. You should read it sometime rather than falsely assert it has nothing to say about God's design for sexuality after two people marry.
For example, Paul exhorts Christians to avoid "uncleanness" in Galatians 5:19 which covers a wide range of sensual sin, whether in thought or deed inside and outside of marriage, including "all uncleanness" Ephesians 4:19 and all other species of uncleanness up to and including the unnatural lust of Romans 1:24. Paul exhorts every Christian to put these "deeds or doings of the body" to death by the Spirit in Romans 8:13.
Furthermore, in classical Greek, the biblical adjective ἀσέλγης describes a man insolently and wantonly reckless in his treatment of others; but in the New Testament it points specifically to unabashed open indulgence in impurity both inside and outside of marriage.
The ancient church father Saint Jerome, who was well known for outlining the type of lifestyle that was acceptable for Christians living in cosmopolitan centers of sinful sexual indulgence such as Rome, observed that when Paul used the term 'fornication" in its general sense, it denoted ALL improper relations between the sexes, married or single.
It's easy to keep going due to the large quantity of such scripture and apostolic and patriarchal history concerning it. You should read the HOLY Bible and dispel your biblical illiteracy for it is brimming with verses that address human conduct both in and out of a marriage context.
For example, Paul exhorts Christians to avoid "uncleanness" in Galatians 5:19 which covers a wide range of sensual sin, whether in thought or deed inside and outside of marriage, including "all uncleanness" Ephesians 4:19 and all other species of uncleanness up to and including the unnatural lust of Romans 1:24. Paul exhorts every Christian to put these "deeds or doings of the body" to death by the Spirit in Romans 8:13.
Furthermore, in classical Greek, the biblical adjective ἀσέλγης describes a man insolently and wantonly reckless in his treatment of others; but in the New Testament it points specifically to unabashed open indulgence in impurity both inside and outside of marriage.
The ancient church father Saint Jerome, who was well known for outlining the type of lifestyle that was acceptable for Christians living in cosmopolitan centers of sinful sexual indulgence such as Rome, observed that when Paul used the term 'fornication" in its general sense, it denoted ALL improper relations between the sexes, married or single.
It's easy to keep going due to the large quantity of such scripture and apostolic and patriarchal history concerning it. You should read the HOLY Bible and dispel your biblical illiteracy for it is brimming with verses that address human conduct both in and out of a marriage context.
J
to the OP: My best advice (and that's all it is) is to do what you feel is right through the Lord in your soul. If you have ideas, think about how the Lord would feel about them, and as well how YOU truly feel about them. Ultimately you are the one who will live with the results. God will always be there when you call upon him for clarity, especially if you listen to/for Him.
And don't forget to desire someone equally yoked, as in one who values the Holy Spirit as much as you do.
Mainly, follow your heart and pray for wisdom. May your life be blessed.
And don't forget to desire someone equally yoked, as in one who values the Holy Spirit as much as you do.
Mainly, follow your heart and pray for wisdom. May your life be blessed.
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J
First of all, I have personal reasons for not getting married YET. Medical, mainly. And that's personal, don't go there.
Secondly, I know of no verse that says not to explore sex with your wife. Basically is seems to me you're just looking for an argument. In which place you have found the right person. Let er' rip!!!
Secondly, I know of no verse that says not to explore sex with your wife. Basically is seems to me you're just looking for an argument. In which place you have found the right person. Let er' rip!!!
J
Since your post was right after mine, and no reference was given, I guess my psychic abilities should have kicked in, right!
Yes if you prefer to think so, I have a "terribly Over-inflated sense of importance". Does that make you feel more "superior"? I hope so.
I find it ironic how this forum has changed over the last year. It seems that there is an "in" crowd here, and I'm looking in from the outside. I come here speaking truth, and I get argument. From the same ones, everytime for the most part. Nothing new over the past few months. So I will let all the real posters here have your site. I am done. Goodbye.
Yes if you prefer to think so, I have a "terribly Over-inflated sense of importance". Does that make you feel more "superior"? I hope so.
I find it ironic how this forum has changed over the last year. It seems that there is an "in" crowd here, and I'm looking in from the outside. I come here speaking truth, and I get argument. From the same ones, everytime for the most part. Nothing new over the past few months. So I will let all the real posters here have your site. I am done. Goodbye.
EASY! Wow, you may not have needed to apologize for your previous post, but you should apologize for THIS one.
I really enjoyed what you had written, and I hope you come back. I know I'm not among the "in crowd" I just joined the site 3 months ago, and I still haven't really figured out who anyone is. I hope you do continue to contribute in the Singles area (or wherever you enjoy posting).
Both of you are acting a little sensitive around the subject - or how your posts are being received. For the most part, you've both been interesting to read. Please be respectful of each other and slow to offense. I hope you both continue to post here.
I really enjoyed what you had written, and I hope you come back. I know I'm not among the "in crowd" I just joined the site 3 months ago, and I still haven't really figured out who anyone is. I hope you do continue to contribute in the Singles area (or wherever you enjoy posting).
Both of you are acting a little sensitive around the subject - or how your posts are being received. For the most part, you've both been interesting to read. Please be respectful of each other and slow to offense. I hope you both continue to post here.
M
You really don't get it do you - women, especially young women
are far more vulnerable than men when it comes to Internet use,
grooming of young people and abuse is common - although this can
affect men also.
Another woman was only recently just commenting on how most
women on the live chat, usually get hit upon within a very short time of
chatting to people.
The survey, the way it was set out was an open invitation to any weirdos
who might have been trolling the forum, which could have been detrimental
to the OP. It invited men to confirm how far they would go and as I said
before, the OP did not state her age though the way it was posted and set
out, suggested it was a young person. If I was able to work that out, then
others could too.
We need to look out for each other on CC - can we at least agree on that.
you have taken something, the greek word aselgia, and twisted it to fit your narrow purposes. simply because you are capable of copy/pasting commentary and throwing around ἀσέλγης you're acting as though what you've brought to the table is an indisputable edict applying specifically to marriage bed conduct.
there is no relationship between the usage of this word and directive to the conduct inside a holy marriage.
while i would never refer to myself as a scholar of greek, i have studied aselgia, both in biblical use as well as its use in greek literature along with all the greek descriptors you've referenced in your post. this is a rather threadbare effort to draw a relationship between the sinful, sensual behavior of those who had little concern for lawful and moral practice; also, you reference verses that refer to pornea (all sex outside marriage, roughly speaking) and akatharsia, which references impurity as a rejection to the consecration/adherence of holy living in rather general concept, which again, are only serve as cautionary for general behavior and overall living.
your desire to apply description for lawless, hedonistic, impure and immoral behavior to fit inside the boundaries of marriage just doesn't work as none of these references speak directly to marriage but rather general behavior and overall conduct. you are free to choose that interpretation for yourself, but it's not directly supported by any references that speak to the marriage bed.
second, as sorry as i am to have seen this subject go awry in this poor young lady's thread, your posting this stuff as law and, and calling folks immoral for disagreeing with you is unfair, and inappropriate. the reason i respond to stuff like this is i hate it when people trot out a few greek words and use them to prove a point they are failing to make. and people read this stuff and think, "hmmm, maybe this IS what the bible says".
if you want to argue what is allowable sexual practice inside a marital union and want to push your agenda there, feel free (though another thread, ideally in the bdf : ) ). because i am just going to say right now, you're on shaky ground. however, i really commend you for seeking your values and determining what is best for you, but please don't condemn folks for what is your values and beliefs. please call it what it is:
"this is my interpretation of the scripture..."
"this is how i see it..."
"i believe we can view this to mean..."
because you're not providing undisputed law, like the first commandment. follow? and i don't think we should be using our opined views as factual and use them to insult our brothers and sisters, as i believe the bible make quite clear that leaders and teachers of these matters are judged at a higher standard, and i personally take that warning quite seriously. every time i allow myself to be in a position where i am stating something as biblical truth or "the christian way" i like to check and double check my facts. because the last thing i want to be responsible for is personally misleading someone, especially when i'm presenting my interpretation of scripture vs. purely repeating the verse.
there is no relationship between the usage of this word and directive to the conduct inside a holy marriage.
while i would never refer to myself as a scholar of greek, i have studied aselgia, both in biblical use as well as its use in greek literature along with all the greek descriptors you've referenced in your post. this is a rather threadbare effort to draw a relationship between the sinful, sensual behavior of those who had little concern for lawful and moral practice; also, you reference verses that refer to pornea (all sex outside marriage, roughly speaking) and akatharsia, which references impurity as a rejection to the consecration/adherence of holy living in rather general concept, which again, are only serve as cautionary for general behavior and overall living.
your desire to apply description for lawless, hedonistic, impure and immoral behavior to fit inside the boundaries of marriage just doesn't work as none of these references speak directly to marriage but rather general behavior and overall conduct. you are free to choose that interpretation for yourself, but it's not directly supported by any references that speak to the marriage bed.
second, as sorry as i am to have seen this subject go awry in this poor young lady's thread, your posting this stuff as law and, and calling folks immoral for disagreeing with you is unfair, and inappropriate. the reason i respond to stuff like this is i hate it when people trot out a few greek words and use them to prove a point they are failing to make. and people read this stuff and think, "hmmm, maybe this IS what the bible says".
if you want to argue what is allowable sexual practice inside a marital union and want to push your agenda there, feel free (though another thread, ideally in the bdf : ) ). because i am just going to say right now, you're on shaky ground. however, i really commend you for seeking your values and determining what is best for you, but please don't condemn folks for what is your values and beliefs. please call it what it is:
"this is my interpretation of the scripture..."
"this is how i see it..."
"i believe we can view this to mean..."
because you're not providing undisputed law, like the first commandment. follow? and i don't think we should be using our opined views as factual and use them to insult our brothers and sisters, as i believe the bible make quite clear that leaders and teachers of these matters are judged at a higher standard, and i personally take that warning quite seriously. every time i allow myself to be in a position where i am stating something as biblical truth or "the christian way" i like to check and double check my facts. because the last thing i want to be responsible for is personally misleading someone, especially when i'm presenting my interpretation of scripture vs. purely repeating the verse.
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I've been thinking about how I and future boyfriends can stay sexually pure in relationships. I wanted some insight into how young Christian males would feel about my relationship preferences, and I also wanted to find out their own preferences. I've created a survey, which isn't the best in the world lol, but I'd really appreciate it if you could answer as honestly as you can.
https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/2DXDPMV
Thank you very much
https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/2DXDPMV
Thank you very much
M
Hi BB, please don't be put off by this thread, there has been various other threads
across the forums which raise similar issues about purity before marriage and
people's perception of what is right and wrong. You might want to check them out
or maybe start another one of your own seeking out people's thoughts on the matter
generally if it is something you feel you need to ask.
Just be aware though that not everyone on here is a Christian; also that even as Christians
we are all at different places in our walk with God.
As well as the singles forum there is
also a ladies only forum. I'm not sure if that is open to you just yet, I can't remember
whether or not you need to have a certain amount of posts before you can see it.
There is also a family forum which both married and single people post in.
For a more balanced viewpoint you might want to open up the question to
both men and women - just a suggestion
"women, especially young women are far more vulnerable than men when it comes to Internet use,"
Posible reasons for "vulnerability"?
1) Easily enticed for what they think they saw or heard?
2) Less life experience that those who are mature enough in both fields, the online field and real human life?
3) Do they really believed what they saw and heard?
News:
Cowboy conman jailed for targeting old folk - Chronicle Live
If a oung woman lacks a good family, a desirable social condition, strong family bonds ... and love ones, she is at risk of being lied (online, more).
This article shows part of that side of emotional disasters and those stresses:
"...After a disaster, women become vulnerable to rape, trafficking, forced marriage and domestic violence due to the breakdown of societal mechanisms, distress and lawlessness..."
How disasters affect women
Posible reasons for "vulnerability"?
1) Easily enticed for what they think they saw or heard?
2) Less life experience that those who are mature enough in both fields, the online field and real human life?
3) Do they really believed what they saw and heard?
News:
Cowboy conman jailed for targeting old folk - Chronicle Live
If a oung woman lacks a good family, a desirable social condition, strong family bonds ... and love ones, she is at risk of being lied (online, more).
This article shows part of that side of emotional disasters and those stresses:
"...After a disaster, women become vulnerable to rape, trafficking, forced marriage and domestic violence due to the breakdown of societal mechanisms, distress and lawlessness..."
How disasters affect women
A
No I have not. I took the New Testament usage definition for that Greek word directly from the pulpit commentary which is a homiletic commentary on the Bible created during the nineteenth century under the direction of Rev. Joseph S. Exell and Henry Donald Maurice Spence-Jones which consists of 23 volumes with 22,000 pages and 95,000 entries written over a 30 year period with 100 contributors and is among the most respected and recognized homiletic commentary on the Bible ever produced.
You are wrong again. I made nothing up nor twisted anything whatsoever but rather merely communicated what a hundred theologians agreed upon in a well respected homiletic commentary on the Bible. It's YOUR understanding which is in error.
In fact, your post consists of emotionally charged shoddy false assertions mixed with ad hominem. It's ridiculous. The truth is that God's holiness is not mitigated when two people marry anymore than His love is.
Both are attributes of God's own character and are inseparably intertwined together. So it shouldn't surprise you that God communicates this in His word to both the unmarried and married.
Unholy sexual deviance is outside of God's holiness. It is outside of God's design for humanity regardless of whether two people are married or not.
Rant emotionally all you like, make up false accusations, misrepresent the truth, etc... I won't stop you. I'll just correct you until I grow bored with your ignorance and rebellion and then I'll go make a pot of gourmet coffee and find something else to do.
You are wrong again. I made nothing up nor twisted anything whatsoever but rather merely communicated what a hundred theologians agreed upon in a well respected homiletic commentary on the Bible. It's YOUR understanding which is in error.
In fact, your post consists of emotionally charged shoddy false assertions mixed with ad hominem. It's ridiculous. The truth is that God's holiness is not mitigated when two people marry anymore than His love is.
Both are attributes of God's own character and are inseparably intertwined together. So it shouldn't surprise you that God communicates this in His word to both the unmarried and married.
Unholy sexual deviance is outside of God's holiness. It is outside of God's design for humanity regardless of whether two people are married or not.
Rant emotionally all you like, make up false accusations, misrepresent the truth, etc... I won't stop you. I'll just correct you until I grow bored with your ignorance and rebellion and then I'll go make a pot of gourmet coffee and find something else to do.
A
Read: H. Thielicke's 'The Ethics of Sex.'
A
Jesus wasn't married either and never even considered it. So until Jesus marries or even considers marriage as an option, you won't be listening to Him I take it? Since you're not now, in so many ways, I expect there won't be a change.
And for the record Nautilus, as I state repeatedly despite people like yourself ignoring my repeated statement, I am wholly for biblical marriage which God Himself instituted for humanity and will be happy to enter into one at such point as our present matrimonial body of law is reformed. So you can stop spreading lies about me. That behavior doesn't help you win arguments, it just reveals you have poor character.
You consistently communicate that you're happy living in a bubble of ignorance and denial and have no desire to dispel it. I watch you make null and void a correct exegesis of God's Word in your life year after year for a great many reasons, far beyond your distaste of its messengers.
You will be held accountable for it. Furthermore, everything isn't "fine" in the world. The time is rapidly approaching when you will need what you discarded and denied.
And you have no power to nullify or make void objective truth Nautilus. All you have the power to do is deny objective truth or accept objective truth. That's it. You cannot change objective truth or nullify (e.g. make void) objective truth. It's impossible. All you can do is choose to reject or accept it with all the corresponding consequences resulting from your choice. Unfortunately, you make the choice you always seem to make: denial.
And for the record Nautilus, as I state repeatedly despite people like yourself ignoring my repeated statement, I am wholly for biblical marriage which God Himself instituted for humanity and will be happy to enter into one at such point as our present matrimonial body of law is reformed. So you can stop spreading lies about me. That behavior doesn't help you win arguments, it just reveals you have poor character.
You consistently communicate that you're happy living in a bubble of ignorance and denial and have no desire to dispel it. I watch you make null and void a correct exegesis of God's Word in your life year after year for a great many reasons, far beyond your distaste of its messengers.
You will be held accountable for it. Furthermore, everything isn't "fine" in the world. The time is rapidly approaching when you will need what you discarded and denied.
And you have no power to nullify or make void objective truth Nautilus. All you have the power to do is deny objective truth or accept objective truth. That's it. You cannot change objective truth or nullify (e.g. make void) objective truth. It's impossible. All you can do is choose to reject or accept it with all the corresponding consequences resulting from your choice. Unfortunately, you make the choice you always seem to make: denial.
A
I highly recommend all obtain this book and read it. As one reviewer stated, it is the "most thoughtful discussion of human sexuality I have ever read."
The Guardian said "The book is a rare combination: insight, pastoral wisdom, and knowledge of the work of experts in the fields with which it deals... This is, in fact, the best Christian treatment of this theme which has appeared for a long time."
The topics under discussion in this thread are thoroughly addressed.
The Guardian said "The book is a rare combination: insight, pastoral wisdom, and knowledge of the work of experts in the fields with which it deals... This is, in fact, the best Christian treatment of this theme which has appeared for a long time."
The topics under discussion in this thread are thoroughly addressed.