The Herods
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Daniel 11
37 Neither shall he regard the God of his fathers, nor the desire of women, nor regard any god: for he shall magnify himself above all.
......
okay.
as i said the theory is this is referring to HEROD.
the chapter covers all of Israel's history (concerning the image), including the babylonians and greeks; the parts about seleucus and ptolemy; antiochus epiphanes; and the maccabees also are there (aren't they?).
so what comes after or in time with them? the romans.
and at the same time as the romans we had the herods.
they play such an important role in the New Testament they HAVE to be in Daniel (Daniel 2?)
i'm pretty sure they are in Revelation....however symbolically they may be portrayed.
i'm not trying to go all hyper-preterist, or deny any future fulfillment....just to finish up this study (dan. 11) and see if the Herods fit in.
Caesar (Augustus?) does too! - why wouldn't they? they're part of the last kingdom, and everyone agrees on that.
does this fit Herod?
Daniel 11
37 Neither shall he regard the God of his fathers, nor the desire of women, nor regard any god: for he shall magnify himself above all.
- the temple was built by the king - Herod.
- if Herod was an Edomite, the "the God of his fathers" fits, doesn't it?
- "Neither shall he regard the God of his fathers, nor the desire of women" - what did scripture says is the desire of women?
isn't it children? he slaughtered the innocents and his own children! and lots of others. and women.
- "nor regard any god: for he shall magnify himself above all." well, he clearly was in league with the romans (pagan gods), but didn't care about them either. and i think i can find stuff that shows he magnified himself above "all".
k.....puppy sitting.
back later if possible.
please help if anybody has any ideas or info.
william - anything?
37 Neither shall he regard the God of his fathers, nor the desire of women, nor regard any god: for he shall magnify himself above all.
......
okay.
as i said the theory is this is referring to HEROD.
the chapter covers all of Israel's history (concerning the image), including the babylonians and greeks; the parts about seleucus and ptolemy; antiochus epiphanes; and the maccabees also are there (aren't they?).
so what comes after or in time with them? the romans.
and at the same time as the romans we had the herods.
they play such an important role in the New Testament they HAVE to be in Daniel (Daniel 2?)
i'm pretty sure they are in Revelation....however symbolically they may be portrayed.
i'm not trying to go all hyper-preterist, or deny any future fulfillment....just to finish up this study (dan. 11) and see if the Herods fit in.
Caesar (Augustus?) does too! - why wouldn't they? they're part of the last kingdom, and everyone agrees on that.
does this fit Herod?
Daniel 11
37 Neither shall he regard the God of his fathers, nor the desire of women, nor regard any god: for he shall magnify himself above all.
- the temple was built by the king - Herod.
- if Herod was an Edomite, the "the God of his fathers" fits, doesn't it?
- "Neither shall he regard the God of his fathers, nor the desire of women" - what did scripture says is the desire of women?
isn't it children? he slaughtered the innocents and his own children! and lots of others. and women.
- "nor regard any god: for he shall magnify himself above all." well, he clearly was in league with the romans (pagan gods), but didn't care about them either. and i think i can find stuff that shows he magnified himself above "all".
k.....puppy sitting.
back later if possible.
please help if anybody has any ideas or info.
william - anything?
Daniel 11
37 Neither shall he regard the God of his fathers, nor the desire of women, nor regard any god: for he shall magnify himself above all.
......
Herod (Hebrew: הוֹרְדוֹס, Hordos, Greek: Ἡρῴδης, Hērōdēs), also known as Herod I and Herod the Great.... in Jericho[1][2][3][4][5]), was a Roman client king of Judea.[6][7][8] He has been called "a madman who murdered his own family and a great many rabbis" and "the greatest builder in Jewish history".[9]
He is known for his colossal building projects in Jerusalem and elsewhere, including his expansion of the Second Temple in Jerusalem (sometimes referred to as Herod's Temple) and the construction of the port at Caesarea Maritima.
Herod was born....in the south (Idumea was the most southern region).[11][12]
Herod was practicing Judaism, as many Edomites and Nabateans had been commingled with the Jews and adopted their customs.[13]
These "Judaized" Edomites were not considered Jewish by the dominant Pharisaic tradition, so even though Herod may have considered himself of the Jewish faith, he was not considered Jewish by the observant and nationalist Jews of Judea.[14]
He enjoyed the backing of Rome but his brutality was condemned by the Sanhedrin.[15]
Herod went back to Judea to win his kingdom from Antigonus and at the same time he married the teenage niece of Antigonus, Mariamne (known as Mariamne I), in an attempt to secure a claim to the throne and gain some Jewish favor.
Three years later, Herod and the Romans finally captured Jerusalem and executed Antigonus.
Herod took the role as sole ruler of Judea and the title of basileus (Gr. Βασιλευς, king) for himself, ushering in the Herodian Dynasty and ending the Hasmonean Dynasty.
wiki
Herod was not completely sensitive to traditional Jewish observances and was met with opposition from many Jews.
As highlighted in Jewish Antiquities, one of the major complaints from Jews towards Herod were his violations of traditional Jewish law.[23]
In Jerusalem, he built a theater and an amphitheater where different forms of entertainment were staged that were foreign to Judaism and met with great animosity.[23]
Although Herod adhered to many of the demands of the Pharisees regarding aspects of the Temple's construction, he ignored them in other respects which made them continue to be hostile toward Herod.[25]
In regards to the Temple, he offended many Jews by introducing Roman trophies into the Temple and by erecting a golden eagle over its entrance.[23]
The Sadducees were also opposed to him because he constantly appointed and removed high priests.
The high priests were appointed from members of the priestly families of Babylonia and Alexandria.[25]
These individuals were appointed in an attempt to bolster support from the Diaspora population.
However, his appointments did not follow existing traditions and resulted in an increased loss of respect for this old institution.[24]
wiki
As highlighted in Jewish Antiquities, one of the major complaints from Jews towards Herod were his violations of traditional Jewish law.[23]
In Jerusalem, he built a theater and an amphitheater where different forms of entertainment were staged that were foreign to Judaism and met with great animosity.[23]
Although Herod adhered to many of the demands of the Pharisees regarding aspects of the Temple's construction, he ignored them in other respects which made them continue to be hostile toward Herod.[25]
In regards to the Temple, he offended many Jews by introducing Roman trophies into the Temple and by erecting a golden eagle over its entrance.[23]
The Sadducees were also opposed to him because he constantly appointed and removed high priests.
The high priests were appointed from members of the priestly families of Babylonia and Alexandria.[25]
These individuals were appointed in an attempt to bolster support from the Diaspora population.
However, his appointments did not follow existing traditions and resulted in an increased loss of respect for this old institution.[24]
wiki
HEROD THE KING
Daniel 11:37
Neither shall he regard the God of his fathers, nor the desire of women, nor regard any god: for he shall magnify himself above all.
Daniel 11:38
But in his estate shall he honour the God of forces: and a god whom his fathers knew not shall he honour with gold, and silver, and with precious stones, and pleasant things.
In regards to the Temple, he offended many Jews by introducing Roman trophies into the Temple and by erecting a golden eagle over its entrance.
wiki
Daniel 11:38
But in his estate shall he honour the God of forces: and a god whom his fathers knew not shall he honour with gold, and silver, and with precious stones, and pleasant things.
in keeping with the theory that Herod is contemporaneous with Caesar (Augustus) in history and in Daniel 11:
- Augustus is declared a god.
- He amasses enormous military forces, and absolute power.
- the word augustus etymologically linked with auctoritas : power backed by military force
In the following year the balance of power began to change: whereas Antony’s eastern expedition failed, Octavian’s (AUGUSTUS) fleet—commanded by his former schoolmate Marcus Agrippa, who, although unpopular with the influential nobles, was an admiral of genius—totally defeated Sextus Pompeius off Cape Naulochus (Venetico) in Sicily.
At this point the third triumvir, Lepidus, seeking to contest Octavian’s supremacy in the west by force, was disarmed by Octavian, deprived of his triumviral office, and forced into retirement.
Ignoring Antony’s right to settle his own veterans in Italy and recruit fresh troops, Octavian discharged many legionaries and founded settlements for them.
His deliberate rivalry with Antony for the eventual mastership of the Roman world became increasingly apparent.
Octavian’s marriage two years earlier had begun to win over some of the nobles who had previously been Antony’s supporters.
Octavian also launched elaborate religious and patriotic publicity, centring on the classical god of order, Apollo, in contrast to Antony’s less Roman patron, Dionysus (Bacchus).
In addition, Octavian had started to prefix his name with the designation “Imperator,” to suggest that he was the commander par excellence; and now, although he continued to use his triumviral powers, he omitted all reference to them from his coins, gradually concentrating on the plain, emotive name “Caesar Son of a God.”
The seizure of Cleopatra’s treasure enabled him to pay off his veterans and made him finally master of the entire Greco-Roman world. From this point on, by a long and gradual series of tentative, patient measures, he established the Roman principate, a system of government that enabled him to maintain, in all essentials, absolute control. Gradually reducing his 60 legions to 28, he retained approximately 150,000 legionaries, mostly Italian, and supplemented them by about the same number of auxiliaries drawn from the provinces. A permanent bodyguard (the Praetorians), based on the bodyguards maintained by earlier generals, was stationed partly in Rome and partly in other Italian towns. A superb network of roads was created to maintain internal order and facilitate trade, and an efficient fleet was organized to police the Mediterranean. In 28 bce Octavian and Agrippa held a census of the civil population, the first of three during the reign. They also reduced the Senate from about 1,000 to 800 (later 600) compliant members, and Octavian was appointed its president.
...he was granted a 10-year tenure of an area of government (provincia) comprising Spain, Gaul, and Syria, the three regions containing the bulk of the army.
Four days after these measures, his name Caesar, acquired through adoption in Julius’s will, was supplemented by “Augustus,” an appellation with an antique religious ring, believed to be linked etymologically with auctoritas and with the ancient practice of augury.
The word augustus was often contrasted with humanus; its adoption as the title representing the new order cleverly indicated, in an extraconstitutional fashion, his superiority over the rest of mankind.
Augustus (Roman emperor) : Government and administration -- Encyclopedia Britannica ' click
......
so what do we have (in theory):
King Herod, in his estate, shall honor Augustus, the God of forces:
Daniel 11:38
But in his estate shall he honour the God of forces: and a god whom his fathers knew not shall he honour with gold, and silver, and with precious stones, and pleasant things.
Four days after these measures, his name Caesar, acquired through adoption in Julius’s will, was supplemented by “Augustus,” an appellation with an antique religious ring, believed to be linked etymologically with auctoritas and with the ancient practice of augury.
Augustus (Roman emperor) : Government and administration -- Encyclopedia Britannica - click
auctoritas:
Caesar citing his divine origins.......the ancient Roman private virtue of Auctoritas (Authority).
Auctoritas can be translated a number of ways. “Authority” to modern ears may sound simply like law enforcement, but the Romans had other words for this: potestas (power through coercion, such as police enforcement) and imperium (power backed by military force).
so far so good
yes...no...maybe
Daniel 11:37
Neither shall he regard the God of his fathers, nor the desire of women, nor regard any god: for he shall magnify himself above all.
Daniel 11:38
But in his estate shall he honour the God of forces: and a god whom his fathers knew not shall he honour with gold, and silver, and with precious stones, and pleasant things.
In regards to the Temple, he offended many Jews by introducing Roman trophies into the Temple and by erecting a golden eagle over its entrance.
wiki
Daniel 11:38
But in his estate shall he honour the God of forces: and a god whom his fathers knew not shall he honour with gold, and silver, and with precious stones, and pleasant things.
in keeping with the theory that Herod is contemporaneous with Caesar (Augustus) in history and in Daniel 11:
- Augustus is declared a god.
- He amasses enormous military forces, and absolute power.
- the word augustus etymologically linked with auctoritas : power backed by military force
In the following year the balance of power began to change: whereas Antony’s eastern expedition failed, Octavian’s (AUGUSTUS) fleet—commanded by his former schoolmate Marcus Agrippa, who, although unpopular with the influential nobles, was an admiral of genius—totally defeated Sextus Pompeius off Cape Naulochus (Venetico) in Sicily.
At this point the third triumvir, Lepidus, seeking to contest Octavian’s supremacy in the west by force, was disarmed by Octavian, deprived of his triumviral office, and forced into retirement.
Ignoring Antony’s right to settle his own veterans in Italy and recruit fresh troops, Octavian discharged many legionaries and founded settlements for them.
His deliberate rivalry with Antony for the eventual mastership of the Roman world became increasingly apparent.
Octavian’s marriage two years earlier had begun to win over some of the nobles who had previously been Antony’s supporters.
Octavian also launched elaborate religious and patriotic publicity, centring on the classical god of order, Apollo, in contrast to Antony’s less Roman patron, Dionysus (Bacchus).
In addition, Octavian had started to prefix his name with the designation “Imperator,” to suggest that he was the commander par excellence; and now, although he continued to use his triumviral powers, he omitted all reference to them from his coins, gradually concentrating on the plain, emotive name “Caesar Son of a God.”
The seizure of Cleopatra’s treasure enabled him to pay off his veterans and made him finally master of the entire Greco-Roman world. From this point on, by a long and gradual series of tentative, patient measures, he established the Roman principate, a system of government that enabled him to maintain, in all essentials, absolute control. Gradually reducing his 60 legions to 28, he retained approximately 150,000 legionaries, mostly Italian, and supplemented them by about the same number of auxiliaries drawn from the provinces. A permanent bodyguard (the Praetorians), based on the bodyguards maintained by earlier generals, was stationed partly in Rome and partly in other Italian towns. A superb network of roads was created to maintain internal order and facilitate trade, and an efficient fleet was organized to police the Mediterranean. In 28 bce Octavian and Agrippa held a census of the civil population, the first of three during the reign. They also reduced the Senate from about 1,000 to 800 (later 600) compliant members, and Octavian was appointed its president.
...he was granted a 10-year tenure of an area of government (provincia) comprising Spain, Gaul, and Syria, the three regions containing the bulk of the army.
Four days after these measures, his name Caesar, acquired through adoption in Julius’s will, was supplemented by “Augustus,” an appellation with an antique religious ring, believed to be linked etymologically with auctoritas and with the ancient practice of augury.
The word augustus was often contrasted with humanus; its adoption as the title representing the new order cleverly indicated, in an extraconstitutional fashion, his superiority over the rest of mankind.
Augustus (Roman emperor) : Government and administration -- Encyclopedia Britannica ' click
......
so what do we have (in theory):
King Herod, in his estate, shall honor Augustus, the God of forces:
Daniel 11:38
But in his estate shall he honour the God of forces: and a god whom his fathers knew not shall he honour with gold, and silver, and with precious stones, and pleasant things.
Four days after these measures, his name Caesar, acquired through adoption in Julius’s will, was supplemented by “Augustus,” an appellation with an antique religious ring, believed to be linked etymologically with auctoritas and with the ancient practice of augury.
Augustus (Roman emperor) : Government and administration -- Encyclopedia Britannica - click
auctoritas:
Caesar citing his divine origins.......the ancient Roman private virtue of Auctoritas (Authority).
Auctoritas can be translated a number of ways. “Authority” to modern ears may sound simply like law enforcement, but the Romans had other words for this: potestas (power through coercion, such as police enforcement) and imperium (power backed by military force).
so far so good
yes...no...maybe
Last edited:
k....this whole deal was going to be
about Herod(s) being godlike king
Caesar(s) being king or god:
Daniel 11 not being about
a future king or kings.
was just about to:
Daniel 11
VERSES
36-39 - Herod
40-43 - Augustus
44-45 - Herod.....
then just found this,
haven't seen it before.
reading now.
has anyone read this?
The Seventy Weeks
and the Great Tribulation
A Study of the Last Two Visions of Daniel,
and of the Olivet Discourse of the Lord Jesus Christ
by Philip Mauro
Written in 1921, revised in 1944
http://www.preteristarchive.com/Books/pdf/1921_mauro_seventyweeks.pdf < click PDF
oh, endless resources why are you so hard?
about Herod(s) being godlike king
Caesar(s) being king or god:
Daniel 11 not being about
a future king or kings.
was just about to:
Daniel 11
VERSES
36-39 - Herod
40-43 - Augustus
44-45 - Herod.....
then just found this,
haven't seen it before.
reading now.
has anyone read this?
The Seventy Weeks
and the Great Tribulation
A Study of the Last Two Visions of Daniel,
and of the Olivet Discourse of the Lord Jesus Christ
by Philip Mauro
Written in 1921, revised in 1944
http://www.preteristarchive.com/Books/pdf/1921_mauro_seventyweeks.pdf < click PDF
oh, endless resources why are you so hard?
The words, “nor the desire of women,” are very significant. There can scarcely be any doubt that they refer to Christ, and that Daniel would so understand them. For, of course, the “women” must be understood to be women of Israel; and the ardent “desire” of every one of them was that she might be the mother of Christ.
The same word is found in (Haggai 2:7): “And the Desire of all nations shall come.” Evidently then it is Christ who is referred to as “the desire of women”; and if so, then we have a striking fulfilment of these words in Herod’s attempt to murder the infant Messiah.
http://www.preteristarchive.com/Books/pdf/1921_mauro_seventyweeks.pdf < click p. 55
it's Herod
CHAPTER 9
The King
We come now to a remarkable personality, one who fills a large and prominent place in the prophecy,
and who is introduced in these words:
“And the king shall do according to his will; and he shall exalt himself, and magnify himself above every god, and shall speak marvelous things against the God of gods and shall prosper until the indignation be accomplished” (Daniel 11:36).
p. 52
The Seventy Weeks
and the Great Tribulation
A Study of the Last Two Visions of Daniel,
and of the Olivet Discourse of the Lord Jesus Christ
by Philip Mauro
Written in 1921, revised in 1944
The same word is found in (Haggai 2:7): “And the Desire of all nations shall come.” Evidently then it is Christ who is referred to as “the desire of women”; and if so, then we have a striking fulfilment of these words in Herod’s attempt to murder the infant Messiah.
http://www.preteristarchive.com/Books/pdf/1921_mauro_seventyweeks.pdf < click p. 55
it's Herod
CHAPTER 9
The King
We come now to a remarkable personality, one who fills a large and prominent place in the prophecy,
and who is introduced in these words:
“And the king shall do according to his will; and he shall exalt himself, and magnify himself above every god, and shall speak marvelous things against the God of gods and shall prosper until the indignation be accomplished” (Daniel 11:36).
p. 52
The Seventy Weeks
and the Great Tribulation
A Study of the Last Two Visions of Daniel,
and of the Olivet Discourse of the Lord Jesus Christ
by Philip Mauro
Written in 1921, revised in 1944
Last edited:
"In connection with the prediction of what this king would do in the chief strongholds “with a strange god,” mention should be made of the many images, statues of Caesar, which Herod set up to be worshipped in various fortified places. He even went so far in his sacrilege as to place a huge golden eagle (the adored emblem of imperial Rome) at the very gate of the temple, thus giving rise to a tumult and insurrection among the people.
In this way did he, in his estate (office), “honor the god of forces” (Caesar) whose statues he everywhere introduced as objects of worship. He fulfilled with literal exactness the words, “Thus shall he do in the most strongholds,” (which expression would apply to the citadel of the temple, where he erected the Tower of Antonia) “with a strange god, whom he shall acknowledge, and increase with glory” (Daniel 11:39). The last clause finds a striking fulfillment in Herod’s extravagant pains to glorify Caesar, which, as we have shown, went beyond all bounds.
The words “dividing the land for gain” (or parceling it out for hire) were fulfilled in the practice adopted by Herod of parceling out among persons favorable to himself, the land adjacent to places which it was important for him to control in case of emergency. Josephus speaks of this (Ant. XV 8, 5)."
http://www.preteristarchive.com/Books/pdf/1921_mauro_seventyweeks.pdf < click p.57
In this way did he, in his estate (office), “honor the god of forces” (Caesar) whose statues he everywhere introduced as objects of worship. He fulfilled with literal exactness the words, “Thus shall he do in the most strongholds,” (which expression would apply to the citadel of the temple, where he erected the Tower of Antonia) “with a strange god, whom he shall acknowledge, and increase with glory” (Daniel 11:39). The last clause finds a striking fulfillment in Herod’s extravagant pains to glorify Caesar, which, as we have shown, went beyond all bounds.
The words “dividing the land for gain” (or parceling it out for hire) were fulfilled in the practice adopted by Herod of parceling out among persons favorable to himself, the land adjacent to places which it was important for him to control in case of emergency. Josephus speaks of this (Ant. XV 8, 5)."
http://www.preteristarchive.com/Books/pdf/1921_mauro_seventyweeks.pdf < click p.57
Tidings From East and North
We come now to the last two verses of Chapter 11, which read thus:
“But tidings out of the east and out of the north shall trouble him; therefore he shall go forth with great fury to destroy, and utterly to make away many. And he shall plant the tabernacles of his palace between the seas in the glorious holy mountain; yet he shall come to his end and none shall help him” (Daniel 11:44–45).
It is not at first glance apparent who is the antecedent of the pronoun “he” in these verses. But upon close attention to the text it will be seen that we have here a return to the main subject of this part of the prophecy, “the king” of verse 36, the course of the prophecy having been diverted in verses 40–43 to the subject of the conquests of Augustus Caesar. Very often, in reading the Hebrew prophets, we have to look a considerable distance backwards to find the antecedent of a pronoun. As an instance of this, Farquharson cites Bishop Horsley as saying, in commenting upon Isaiah 18, “To those to whom the prophetic style in the original is not familiar, but to those only, I think, it will appear strange that a pronoun should refer to an antecedent at so great a distance.” And Farquharson adds: “And the correctness of this view of the whole passage is confirmed by the literal manner in which the predictions in this 44th verse, and in the remaining verse of the Chapter, were fulfilled by Herod.”
”Indeed we do not see how any fulfillment could be more complete and literal than that which is given us in Matthew ‘s Gospel of the words “But tidings out of the east shall trouble him.” For it is written that “When Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judea, in the days of Herod the king, behold there came wise men FROM THE EAST to Jerusalem, saying, Where is He that is born king of the Jews? for we have seen His star IN THE EAST, and are come to worship Him. When Herod heard these things he was TROUBLED, and all Jerusalem with him” (Matthew 2:1–3).
So here we have the exact thing prophesied, namely, “tidings out of the east” which “troubled him.”
Nothing was so well calculated to “trouble” Herod as reports that someone was aspiring to his throne. In this case it is among the most familiar of all facts that Herod, being set at nought by the wise men, from whom he sought to learn the identity of the new born babe, “was EXCEEDING WROTH, and SENT FORTH, and slew all the children that were in Bethlehem, and in all the coasts thereof, from two years old and under” (Matthew 2:16). Thus we have almost verbal agreement with the words of the prophecy, “he shall Go FORTH, with GREAT FURY, to destroy and utterly to make away MANY.”
http://www.preteristarchive.com/Books/pdf/1921_mauro_seventyweeks.pdf < click p. 61
We come now to the last two verses of Chapter 11, which read thus:
“But tidings out of the east and out of the north shall trouble him; therefore he shall go forth with great fury to destroy, and utterly to make away many. And he shall plant the tabernacles of his palace between the seas in the glorious holy mountain; yet he shall come to his end and none shall help him” (Daniel 11:44–45).
It is not at first glance apparent who is the antecedent of the pronoun “he” in these verses. But upon close attention to the text it will be seen that we have here a return to the main subject of this part of the prophecy, “the king” of verse 36, the course of the prophecy having been diverted in verses 40–43 to the subject of the conquests of Augustus Caesar. Very often, in reading the Hebrew prophets, we have to look a considerable distance backwards to find the antecedent of a pronoun. As an instance of this, Farquharson cites Bishop Horsley as saying, in commenting upon Isaiah 18, “To those to whom the prophetic style in the original is not familiar, but to those only, I think, it will appear strange that a pronoun should refer to an antecedent at so great a distance.” And Farquharson adds: “And the correctness of this view of the whole passage is confirmed by the literal manner in which the predictions in this 44th verse, and in the remaining verse of the Chapter, were fulfilled by Herod.”
”Indeed we do not see how any fulfillment could be more complete and literal than that which is given us in Matthew ‘s Gospel of the words “But tidings out of the east shall trouble him.” For it is written that “When Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judea, in the days of Herod the king, behold there came wise men FROM THE EAST to Jerusalem, saying, Where is He that is born king of the Jews? for we have seen His star IN THE EAST, and are come to worship Him. When Herod heard these things he was TROUBLED, and all Jerusalem with him” (Matthew 2:1–3).
So here we have the exact thing prophesied, namely, “tidings out of the east” which “troubled him.”
Nothing was so well calculated to “trouble” Herod as reports that someone was aspiring to his throne. In this case it is among the most familiar of all facts that Herod, being set at nought by the wise men, from whom he sought to learn the identity of the new born babe, “was EXCEEDING WROTH, and SENT FORTH, and slew all the children that were in Bethlehem, and in all the coasts thereof, from two years old and under” (Matthew 2:16). Thus we have almost verbal agreement with the words of the prophecy, “he shall Go FORTH, with GREAT FURY, to destroy and utterly to make away MANY.”
http://www.preteristarchive.com/Books/pdf/1921_mauro_seventyweeks.pdf < click p. 61
hi loveme
from p. 64+
CHAPTER 10
Michael the Great Prince. The Time of Trouble.
Many Awakening. Many Running To and Fro.
Knowledge Increased. How Long the End?
The first four verses of Daniel 12 should not be disconnected from Chapter 11, for they are an integral part of the prophecy, there being no break at all at the place where the chapter division has been made. These concluding verses of the prophecy read as follows:
“And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people, and there shall be a time of trouble such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time; and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.
“And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt. And they that be wise (lit. cause to be wise) shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever. But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words and seal the book, even to the time of the end; many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.”
These are the last words of the long prophecy, and they bring it to an appropriate climax. They tell what will happen “at that time,” emphasizing this by repetition. This expression connects the passage directly with verse 40 of the preceding Chapter, where the words “at the time of the end” occur. The same words are repeated in verse 4 of Chapter 12, just quoted. There is, therefore, no room to doubt that the events here foretold were to occur during the very last stage of “the latter days” of Jewish history. Moreover, the statement of verse 7, that when the power of the holy people should be scattered, then all these things should be finished, absolutely confines the fulfillment of the entire prophecy to the period anterior to the capture of Jerusalem by Titus. We specially ask attention to the great oath recorded in this verse, and trust that our readers will not miss the meaning of it.....
http://www.preteristarchive.com/Books/pdf/1921_mauro_seventyweeks.pdf < click
The Seventy Weeks
and the Great Tribulation
A Study of the Last Two Visions of Daniel,
and of the Olivet Discourse of the Lord Jesus Christ
by Philip Mauro
Written in 1921, revised in 1944
from p. 64+
CHAPTER 10
Michael the Great Prince. The Time of Trouble.
Many Awakening. Many Running To and Fro.
Knowledge Increased. How Long the End?
The first four verses of Daniel 12 should not be disconnected from Chapter 11, for they are an integral part of the prophecy, there being no break at all at the place where the chapter division has been made. These concluding verses of the prophecy read as follows:
“And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people, and there shall be a time of trouble such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time; and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.
“And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt. And they that be wise (lit. cause to be wise) shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever. But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words and seal the book, even to the time of the end; many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.”
These are the last words of the long prophecy, and they bring it to an appropriate climax. They tell what will happen “at that time,” emphasizing this by repetition. This expression connects the passage directly with verse 40 of the preceding Chapter, where the words “at the time of the end” occur. The same words are repeated in verse 4 of Chapter 12, just quoted. There is, therefore, no room to doubt that the events here foretold were to occur during the very last stage of “the latter days” of Jewish history. Moreover, the statement of verse 7, that when the power of the holy people should be scattered, then all these things should be finished, absolutely confines the fulfillment of the entire prophecy to the period anterior to the capture of Jerusalem by Titus. We specially ask attention to the great oath recorded in this verse, and trust that our readers will not miss the meaning of it.....
http://www.preteristarchive.com/Books/pdf/1921_mauro_seventyweeks.pdf < click
The Seventy Weeks
and the Great Tribulation
A Study of the Last Two Visions of Daniel,
and of the Olivet Discourse of the Lord Jesus Christ
by Philip Mauro
Written in 1921, revised in 1944
hi loveme.
it's way past my MP3 bedtime podcast thingee.
but soon i may post on what i think i see (in scripture) remaining.
we touched on this before.
hitherto the D___ist thing has been muddying everything.
maybe i'll PM you first when i have it laid out simply (!!...like THAT's ever gonna happen)
post or do likewise with your position -
so far i'm the only one who has derailed this thread
k...nite.
grace and peace to you in Christ Our Lord
zone.
it's way past my MP3 bedtime podcast thingee.
but soon i may post on what i think i see (in scripture) remaining.
we touched on this before.
hitherto the D___ist thing has been muddying everything.
maybe i'll PM you first when i have it laid out simply (!!...like THAT's ever gonna happen
)post or do likewise with your position -
so far i'm the only one who has derailed this thread
k...nite.
grace and peace to you in Christ Our Lord
zone.