Is Obama the anichrist discussion
- Thread starter Blain
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
By Roy Davison
Through the centuries thousands of different individuals have been designated as 'the antichrist'. In each generation we are confronted with sensationalists who label some contemporary as 'the antichrist'.
Is the antichrist one specific person or a class of people portrayed as one person?
The word 'antichrist' appears five times in Scripture: twice in 1 John 2:18, and also in 1 John 2:22; 4:3 and 2 John 7. The prefix 'anti' means 'against'. The word refers to someone who is against Christ, the opponent of Christ or the opposite of Christ.
The identity of the antichrist is described in these and related passages.
"Little children, it is the last hour; and as you have heard that the Antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come, by which we know that it is the last hour" (1 John 2:18).
Although this is the first time that the word 'antichrist' appears in the New Testament, readers are expected to be familiar with the concept. They knew he would coming.
Jesus had warned: "Take heed that no one deceives you. For many will come in My name, saying, 'I am the Christ,' and will deceive many" (Matthew 24:4, 5); "Then many false prophets will rise up and deceive many. And because lawlessness will abound, the love of many will grow cold" (Matthew 24:11, 12); "For false christs and false prophets will arise and show great signs and wonders, so as to deceive, if possible, even the elect. See, I have told you beforehand" (Matthew 24:24,25); "Take heed that you not be deceived. For many will come in My name, saying, 'I am He,' and, 'The time has drawn near.' Therefore do not go after them" (Luke 21:8).
We are warned about "false christs and false prophets" and Jesus says their coming will be accompanied by lawlessness.
Peter gave a similar warning: "But there were also false prophets among the people, even as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Lord who bought them, and bring on themselves swift destruction. And many will follow their destructive ways, because of whom the way of truth will be blasphemed. By covetousness they will exploit you with deceptive words" (2 Peter 2:1-3).
From these warnings of Christ and Peter, which were written down many years earlier than John's letters, Christians knew there would be an apostasy. There would be many false teachers and many would follow them. Lawlessness would be prevalent among those who claimed to be Christians!
In 1 John 2:18 we also notice that John was able to draw a conclusion: "Little children, it is the last hour; and as you have heard that the Antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come, by which we know that it is the last hour."
This prevalence of false teachers was proof that the last hour had come.
We can better understand John's conclusion by comparing this statement (written about 90 AD) with what Paul wrote some 40 years earlier. In his letter to the Thessalonians in about 53 AD he says:
"Now, brethren, concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, we ask you, not to be soon shaken in mind or troubled, either by spirit or by word or by letter, as if from us, as though the day of Christ had come. Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition, who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God. Do you not remember that when I was still with you I told you these things? And now you know what is restraining, that he may be revealed in his own time. For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work; only He who now restrains will do so until He is taken out of the way. And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord will consume with the breath of His mouth and destroy with the brightness of His coming. The coming of the lawless one is according to the working of Satan, with all power, signs, and lying wonders, and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved. And for this reason God will send them strong delusion, that they should believe the lie, that they all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness" (2 Thessalonians 2:1-12).
In 53 AD there were certain predictions that still had to be fulfilled before the return of Christ. The "falling away" had to occur and "the man of sin" would be revealed, the "son of perdition, who opposes." Paul speaks of the "mystery of lawlessness". Christ had foretold that lawlessness would abound (Matthew 24:12). Paul also calls this "man of sin" the "lawless one" and alludes to a Messianic prophesy in Isaiah 11:4. Some at Thessalonica thought Christ was returning immediately. Paul explains that a large-scale apostasy among Christians would occur first.
Forty years later, when John wrote, the situation had changed. John's readers knew about the prophecy of an apostasy (Matthew 24:4,5,11,23-26; Mark 13:6,21- 23; Luke 21:8; 2 Thessalonians 2:1-12). In the meantime, this prophecy had been fulfilled: the antichrist had come (1 John 2:18; 4:3; 2 John 7), apostasy had occurred (1 John 2:19), and Christ could come at any moment. It was the last hour.
Since then, Christ can come any time. Whoever denies this is a false teacher.
John continues: "Who is a liar but he who denies that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist who denies the Father and the Son" (1 John 2:22). One can deny with his mouth, but also through false doctrines and unauthorized practices, as indicated in 2 John 9: "Whoever transgresses and does not abide in the doctrine of Christ does not have God. He who abides in the doctrine of Christ has both the Father and the Son."
John also mentions the spirit of the antichrist. "By this you know the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is of God, and every spirit that does not confess that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is not of God. And this is the spirit of the Antichrist, which you have heard was coming, and is now already in the world" (1 John 4:2, 3).
Notice the movement from the plural to the singular. Every spirit who does not confess Christ, is the spirit of antichrist. In other words, the antichrist spirit represents all spirits who are against Christ.
We find the same movement from plural to singular in 2 John 7. "For many deceivers are gone forth into the world, even they that confess not that Jesus Christ cometh in the flesh. This is the deceiver and the antichrist" (ASV). Some translators change "the" to "a" in this last sentence. In the original Greek text, however, it is literally, word for word: "This is the deceiver and the antichrist." In other words, the many deceivers are the deceiver and the antichrist.
Who is the antichrist? According to John, "the antichrist" represents the many false christs and false prophets whom Jesus said would arise and deceive many. The antichrist stands for all the false teachers in the world, people who are opponents of Christ or who put themselves in the place of Christ.
Let us beware of the antichrist spirit, the spirit of lawlessness, the spirit that contradicts the word of God.
Through the centuries thousands of different individuals have been designated as 'the antichrist'. In each generation we are confronted with sensationalists who label some contemporary as 'the antichrist'.
Is the antichrist one specific person or a class of people portrayed as one person?
The word 'antichrist' appears five times in Scripture: twice in 1 John 2:18, and also in 1 John 2:22; 4:3 and 2 John 7. The prefix 'anti' means 'against'. The word refers to someone who is against Christ, the opponent of Christ or the opposite of Christ.
The identity of the antichrist is described in these and related passages.
"Little children, it is the last hour; and as you have heard that the Antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come, by which we know that it is the last hour" (1 John 2:18).
Although this is the first time that the word 'antichrist' appears in the New Testament, readers are expected to be familiar with the concept. They knew he would coming.
Jesus had warned: "Take heed that no one deceives you. For many will come in My name, saying, 'I am the Christ,' and will deceive many" (Matthew 24:4, 5); "Then many false prophets will rise up and deceive many. And because lawlessness will abound, the love of many will grow cold" (Matthew 24:11, 12); "For false christs and false prophets will arise and show great signs and wonders, so as to deceive, if possible, even the elect. See, I have told you beforehand" (Matthew 24:24,25); "Take heed that you not be deceived. For many will come in My name, saying, 'I am He,' and, 'The time has drawn near.' Therefore do not go after them" (Luke 21:8).
We are warned about "false christs and false prophets" and Jesus says their coming will be accompanied by lawlessness.
Peter gave a similar warning: "But there were also false prophets among the people, even as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Lord who bought them, and bring on themselves swift destruction. And many will follow their destructive ways, because of whom the way of truth will be blasphemed. By covetousness they will exploit you with deceptive words" (2 Peter 2:1-3).
From these warnings of Christ and Peter, which were written down many years earlier than John's letters, Christians knew there would be an apostasy. There would be many false teachers and many would follow them. Lawlessness would be prevalent among those who claimed to be Christians!
In 1 John 2:18 we also notice that John was able to draw a conclusion: "Little children, it is the last hour; and as you have heard that the Antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come, by which we know that it is the last hour."
This prevalence of false teachers was proof that the last hour had come.
We can better understand John's conclusion by comparing this statement (written about 90 AD) with what Paul wrote some 40 years earlier. In his letter to the Thessalonians in about 53 AD he says:
"Now, brethren, concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, we ask you, not to be soon shaken in mind or troubled, either by spirit or by word or by letter, as if from us, as though the day of Christ had come. Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition, who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God. Do you not remember that when I was still with you I told you these things? And now you know what is restraining, that he may be revealed in his own time. For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work; only He who now restrains will do so until He is taken out of the way. And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord will consume with the breath of His mouth and destroy with the brightness of His coming. The coming of the lawless one is according to the working of Satan, with all power, signs, and lying wonders, and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved. And for this reason God will send them strong delusion, that they should believe the lie, that they all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness" (2 Thessalonians 2:1-12).
In 53 AD there were certain predictions that still had to be fulfilled before the return of Christ. The "falling away" had to occur and "the man of sin" would be revealed, the "son of perdition, who opposes." Paul speaks of the "mystery of lawlessness". Christ had foretold that lawlessness would abound (Matthew 24:12). Paul also calls this "man of sin" the "lawless one" and alludes to a Messianic prophesy in Isaiah 11:4. Some at Thessalonica thought Christ was returning immediately. Paul explains that a large-scale apostasy among Christians would occur first.
Forty years later, when John wrote, the situation had changed. John's readers knew about the prophecy of an apostasy (Matthew 24:4,5,11,23-26; Mark 13:6,21- 23; Luke 21:8; 2 Thessalonians 2:1-12). In the meantime, this prophecy had been fulfilled: the antichrist had come (1 John 2:18; 4:3; 2 John 7), apostasy had occurred (1 John 2:19), and Christ could come at any moment. It was the last hour.
Since then, Christ can come any time. Whoever denies this is a false teacher.
John continues: "Who is a liar but he who denies that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist who denies the Father and the Son" (1 John 2:22). One can deny with his mouth, but also through false doctrines and unauthorized practices, as indicated in 2 John 9: "Whoever transgresses and does not abide in the doctrine of Christ does not have God. He who abides in the doctrine of Christ has both the Father and the Son."
John also mentions the spirit of the antichrist. "By this you know the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is of God, and every spirit that does not confess that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is not of God. And this is the spirit of the Antichrist, which you have heard was coming, and is now already in the world" (1 John 4:2, 3).
Notice the movement from the plural to the singular. Every spirit who does not confess Christ, is the spirit of antichrist. In other words, the antichrist spirit represents all spirits who are against Christ.
We find the same movement from plural to singular in 2 John 7. "For many deceivers are gone forth into the world, even they that confess not that Jesus Christ cometh in the flesh. This is the deceiver and the antichrist" (ASV). Some translators change "the" to "a" in this last sentence. In the original Greek text, however, it is literally, word for word: "This is the deceiver and the antichrist." In other words, the many deceivers are the deceiver and the antichrist.
Who is the antichrist? According to John, "the antichrist" represents the many false christs and false prophets whom Jesus said would arise and deceive many. The antichrist stands for all the false teachers in the world, people who are opponents of Christ or who put themselves in the place of Christ.
Let us beware of the antichrist spirit, the spirit of lawlessness, the spirit that contradicts the word of God.
P
You are very clever only giving us 4 verses to choose from to show an end time event when there are 31000 and more verses in the bible to choose from.
If you are just looking at 4 verses to find the truth of an end time event you are so limiting yourself and trying to limit others.
There are lots of antichrists about and have been since john’s day.
But as you can see there is a pacific antichrist and antichrists in the bible that must come before gathering together unto him,
1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,
2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.
3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.
5 Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you, I told you these things?
6 And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.
7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.
8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:
9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,
And here is another 10 kings antichrists that make war with the lamb in the last days
Rv17:12 And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast.
13 These have one mind, and shall give their power and strength unto the beast.
14 These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful.
And here is another king coming out of the 10 kings that make war with the saints in the Ancient of days, the little horn
Daniel7:21 I beheld, and the same horn made war with the saints, and prevailed against them;
22 Until the Ancient of days came, and judgment was given to the saints of the most High; and the time came that the saints possessed the kingdom.
You and a limiter, you limit your self and try to limit others,
Trying to give us 4 peaces of bread crumbs, when there is a whole loaf
Very clever.
If you are just looking at 4 verses to find the truth of an end time event you are so limiting yourself and trying to limit others.
There are lots of antichrists about and have been since john’s day.
But as you can see there is a pacific antichrist and antichrists in the bible that must come before gathering together unto him,
1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,
2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.
3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.
5 Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you, I told you these things?
6 And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.
7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.
8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:
9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,
And here is another 10 kings antichrists that make war with the lamb in the last days
Rv17:12 And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast.
13 These have one mind, and shall give their power and strength unto the beast.
14 These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful.
And here is another king coming out of the 10 kings that make war with the saints in the Ancient of days, the little horn
Daniel7:21 I beheld, and the same horn made war with the saints, and prevailed against them;
22 Until the Ancient of days came, and judgment was given to the saints of the most High; and the time came that the saints possessed the kingdom.
You and a limiter, you limit your self and try to limit others,
Trying to give us 4 peaces of bread crumbs, when there is a whole loaf
Very clever.
B
Define to me what these things are according to the Bible.
Man of sin
Beast
Temple of God
I don't want what you think it is, I want the Bible to tell me what it is. For instance. Rev 12:3-4. Who or what is the dragon and who or what is the stars? The dragon is identified with Rev 20:1-2 and the stars with Rev 1:20. This, I just gave you, is physical evidence, ACCORDING TO THE BIBLE, that clearly defines an allegorical word. In this case, stars and dragon. "The stars are the angels and the dragon is Satan!" So, if I were to read any reference in the Bible where the message is spoken allegorically when it is referring to stars and dragons, I must use the definition that was given by the Bible for that is the ONLY thing that will work.
Let's try that and see if you agree. How many angels were cast out of heaven? 1/3, right? Who did these angels follow? Satan, right?
Rev 12:3-4
3. And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon (Satan), having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads. (for simplicity, his dominion or demons. This is a whole different study of which I'm not going into right now!)
4. And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven (angels), and did cast them to the earth......
Rev 20: 1-2
1. And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
2. And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan....
Rev 1:20
20. The mystery of the seven stars which thou sawest in my right hand, and the seven golden candlesticks. The seven stars are the angels of the seven churches:.....
So, can you tell me what Scriptures lead you to say that those words I asked you to define leads you back to the only four verses in the entire Bible that says antichrist?
Man of sin
Beast
Temple of God
I don't want what you think it is, I want the Bible to tell me what it is. For instance. Rev 12:3-4. Who or what is the dragon and who or what is the stars? The dragon is identified with Rev 20:1-2 and the stars with Rev 1:20. This, I just gave you, is physical evidence, ACCORDING TO THE BIBLE, that clearly defines an allegorical word. In this case, stars and dragon. "The stars are the angels and the dragon is Satan!" So, if I were to read any reference in the Bible where the message is spoken allegorically when it is referring to stars and dragons, I must use the definition that was given by the Bible for that is the ONLY thing that will work.
Let's try that and see if you agree. How many angels were cast out of heaven? 1/3, right? Who did these angels follow? Satan, right?
Rev 12:3-4
3. And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon (Satan), having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads. (for simplicity, his dominion or demons. This is a whole different study of which I'm not going into right now!)
4. And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven (angels), and did cast them to the earth......
Rev 20: 1-2
1. And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
2. And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan....
Rev 1:20
20. The mystery of the seven stars which thou sawest in my right hand, and the seven golden candlesticks. The seven stars are the angels of the seven churches:.....
So, can you tell me what Scriptures lead you to say that those words I asked you to define leads you back to the only four verses in the entire Bible that says antichrist?
Last edited by a moderator:
D
Sounds like the voice of experience. If you would like to leave the state of ignorant bliss behind, just do as 2Ti2:15 instructs, instead of blindly following the false doctrines derived from the antireformation authors like Jesuit priest Ribera or Jesuit priest Alcazar.
"God is truth, so how well a person serves the Lord is not dependent on how artfully he can defend his doctrines, but on his willingness to seek out and follow the truth." - Ellis Skolfield.
Defend a Scripturally bankrupt doctrine (ploy of satans) designed to take the focus off the billion + antichrist (atheists, muslims etc.... and tthe list goes on and on) in todays world alone or search for truth, your choice.
As you are led friend, as you are led!
B
As you can see, we give Scriptures. I can give you none in the book of Rev that speaks of the antichrist you speak of because the antichrist you speak of does not exist.
So, are you just going to ignore my question in post #70? I'm beginning to feel there might be a problem. I can give you relevant Scriptures if you need assistance doing it but I would like to hear your version first.
So, are you just going to ignore my question in post #70? I'm beginning to feel there might be a problem. I can give you relevant Scriptures if you need assistance doing it but I would like to hear your version first.
