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Nice shot,,,see, it's okay that you insult my Religion and my Doctrine,,,I'm not going to threaten you with a report, or threaten to have you removed because of your careless, arrogant, cheap shots.. But you and your friends threaten me,,, while you claim I am a troll and I give it a break on Sabbath.
How christlike of you to make that comment. But of course,, you said it with Love,, just like ol Danschance claims. He claims I am a cultist,,, but, he said it with love, so Jesus supports him,, right? right.
How christlike of you to make that comment. But of course,, you said it with Love,, just like ol Danschance claims. He claims I am a cultist,,, but, he said it with love, so Jesus supports him,, right? right.
E
Dude, now your on outright lying. You can;t even prove we despise gods law. All you can do is keep hashing out the same argument, and not even able to admit when you are wrong.
I asked you to prove we despise Gods law. Even Showed how I do not and you continue to spatter the same old lies. You just like the rest who have come and gone. You have no meat. You can;t answer the hard questions. and you do not respond when you are exposed. so you resort to calling people names. And bearing false witness against those who do not agree with you. (breaking one of the commands you fight so hard for in the process).
You want to excuse your own sin, while judging others. Fine, keep doing it. Your true inner self shows through for all to see..
wow. Now I am like Obama? Yet another HATE tactic coming from someone who claims to love the law of God. How many times are you going to break Gods law in an attempt to prove how much you love it??
Keep on talking.. Your proving to everyone who reads these threads your true inner self. I do not even have to expose it, it is layed out for ALL to see.
I asked you to prove we despise Gods law. Even Showed how I do not and you continue to spatter the same old lies. You just like the rest who have come and gone. You have no meat. You can;t answer the hard questions. and you do not respond when you are exposed. so you resort to calling people names. And bearing false witness against those who do not agree with you. (breaking one of the commands you fight so hard for in the process).
You want to excuse your own sin, while judging others. Fine, keep doing it. Your true inner self shows through for all to see..
wow. Now I am like Obama? Yet another HATE tactic coming from someone who claims to love the law of God. How many times are you going to break Gods law in an attempt to prove how much you love it??
Keep on talking.. Your proving to everyone who reads these threads your true inner self. I do not even have to expose it, it is layed out for ALL to see.
You are the liar here. You are the one that has been a false witness. God knows it! He is watching. I see no reason in rehashing the evidence that you are a liar. I presented it yesterday.. You got mad, you claimed you were going to have me tossed. Go for it! You and your little band of oppose me. You have threatened to have me removed.. all because I disagree with you.. So, have at it!
When I first came here,, the very first post that was sent to me was a warning aginst you and a couple of other people on this chat. They told me I would run into problems on this site because I beleive we are to keep the Commandments of God,, and he was right!!!!!!!
When I first came here,, the very first post that was sent to me was a warning aginst you and a couple of other people on this chat. They told me I would run into problems on this site because I beleive we are to keep the Commandments of God,, and he was right!!!!!!!
A
that explains why you are still always looking for a fight.
If you give it to Jesus He might heal you of that hurt and break down that stronghold of aggression that the bullies have help you construct in your mind.
[h=3]Ephesians 4:25-27[/h]New King James Version (NKJV)
[SUP]25 [/SUP]Therefore, putting away lying, “Let each one of you speak truth with his neighbor,”[SUP][a][/SUP] for we are members of one another. [SUP]26 [/SUP]“Be angry, and do not sin”:[SUP][b][/SUP] do not let the sun go down on your wrath, [SUP]27 [/SUP]nor give place to the devil.
so I guess this commandment gets tossed out the window?
Leviticus 19
[SUP]16 [/SUP]You shall not go about as a talebearer among your people;
If you give it to Jesus He might heal you of that hurt and break down that stronghold of aggression that the bullies have help you construct in your mind.
[h=3]Ephesians 4:25-27[/h]New King James Version (NKJV)
[SUP]25 [/SUP]Therefore, putting away lying, “Let each one of you speak truth with his neighbor,”[SUP][a][/SUP] for we are members of one another. [SUP]26 [/SUP]“Be angry, and do not sin”:[SUP][b][/SUP] do not let the sun go down on your wrath, [SUP]27 [/SUP]nor give place to the devil.
so I guess this commandment gets tossed out the window?
Leviticus 19
[SUP]16 [/SUP]You shall not go about as a talebearer among your people;
E
This sounds so jewish. And is not what Grace teaches.
1. We do not need the law for this, As has been shown, This aspect (what is right and wrong) was written in our hearts. so we KNOW what is right and what is wrong.
2. The law proves to us (leaves us no excuse) that we have sinned, when we break any aspect of any command. (ie... It is written in our heart we are not to bear false witness. We know this is wrong, But before the law we could hide it in our heart and deny it is even true, The written law takes this excuse away, and proves we have broken it. thus are guilty of breaking the WHOLE LAW. and thus rightly condemned.
3. When we sin. We KNOW we are sinning, there is no "I did not know what I was doing" We are either hiding it through hardheartedness. or claiming ignorance (which would be a lie) for 90 % of the sins we commit.
4. When we find Grace, We learn God is not saying no just to Lord over us and make us right on our own merit, he already claimed we can;t do it on our own. He gives us the power to do this with his spirit. he gives us the knowledge through his word why he says no (nothing like saying no with no explanation to cause us to sin, as Paul explained over and over. it is in our nature. Like telling a kid no to something, just because. The temptation becomes to strong and the kid fails) we to are susceptible to this. And learn the spiritual way of things.
5. We do not need the law to obey, We learn through the spirit. If we Love others as God tells us (the law of faith) we will not be tempted to break Gods commands. Because we will not even be thinking of them to be tempted. Temptation can not come unless the thought is in our head. Those who try to be right by law are continually reminded of sin, and thus bring temptation on there own. Then HIDE it because they are afraid of being judged. Why do we think so many higher ups in the Christian church are found to be hiding double lives? Because of judgment. There is no judgment in Grace, Only love and hope. We are free to confess our thoughts to those around us not fearing judgment, And are able to get help. (this is the way God works. We are not given the spirit of fear. But of adoption. I do not fear judgment, I instead find HOPE.
1. We do not need the law for this, As has been shown, This aspect (what is right and wrong) was written in our hearts. so we KNOW what is right and what is wrong.
2. The law proves to us (leaves us no excuse) that we have sinned, when we break any aspect of any command. (ie... It is written in our heart we are not to bear false witness. We know this is wrong, But before the law we could hide it in our heart and deny it is even true, The written law takes this excuse away, and proves we have broken it. thus are guilty of breaking the WHOLE LAW. and thus rightly condemned.
3. When we sin. We KNOW we are sinning, there is no "I did not know what I was doing" We are either hiding it through hardheartedness. or claiming ignorance (which would be a lie) for 90 % of the sins we commit.
4. When we find Grace, We learn God is not saying no just to Lord over us and make us right on our own merit, he already claimed we can;t do it on our own. He gives us the power to do this with his spirit. he gives us the knowledge through his word why he says no (nothing like saying no with no explanation to cause us to sin, as Paul explained over and over. it is in our nature. Like telling a kid no to something, just because. The temptation becomes to strong and the kid fails) we to are susceptible to this. And learn the spiritual way of things.
5. We do not need the law to obey, We learn through the spirit. If we Love others as God tells us (the law of faith) we will not be tempted to break Gods commands. Because we will not even be thinking of them to be tempted. Temptation can not come unless the thought is in our head. Those who try to be right by law are continually reminded of sin, and thus bring temptation on there own. Then HIDE it because they are afraid of being judged. Why do we think so many higher ups in the Christian church are found to be hiding double lives? Because of judgment. There is no judgment in Grace, Only love and hope. We are free to confess our thoughts to those around us not fearing judgment, And are able to get help. (this is the way God works. We are not given the spirit of fear. But of adoption. I do not fear judgment, I instead find HOPE.
E
Another fable.
The others teach we can't keep Gods law as he demands (100% Perfection) Thus salvation can never be earned by our own actions. we will always need grace.
While some, Like yourself, Teach obay Gods commands and he will save you. Unwilling to admit you will never be able to obay them good enough (100 % perfection) to be saved by the law. Thus excusing your own sin, while judging others for not being as good as you..
HUGE DIFFERENCE.
A
??? it might be a simplification of what Grace teaches but I don't really see what you see wrong with his statement.
pronouns like "this" and "it" are confusing could you clarify what you are referring to with those words? thanks.
that's not true Satan whispers lies into people's heads all the time. its one of the reason people are told to test the spirit. take captive their thoughts, tear down strongholds that war against the knowledge of Christ. to be tempted is not a sin, because Jesus was tempted in the desert and remained sinless.
We need the law to give voice to what God has placed in our hearts and to see beyond what the world believes and thinks is right and true. The law if used lawfully is good. however, it is better to focus on what God wants us to do then our own failures. if we stumble we should repent and know that God has forgiven us. too often the Enemy tries to use our past failures to keep us from doing God's work in the present out of fear, disappointment, etc.
i haven't really read in detail a lot of what you have posted EG but some of your phrasing is kind of confusing.
there is no righteousness according to the law. However, God does want us to learn wisdom and self control. therefore there are some guidelines, or if people want to refer to them as laws, that Christians should follow.
no you see i disagree with you that this is the case for many people. I think most people don't know what it is that God requires of them. they get distracted by the external keeping of the law that they do not bother to examine the internal hurts and behaviors the world has ingrained in us. its like when you condition a dog to a bell. many people are conditioned to a few key words and attack upon command because they feel threatened.
??? most people seeking God's heart are reluctant to assume the power and responsibility of leading His people. it is easy for wolves to have the outward show of piety to deceive people because most Christians want to believe the best of others.
so are you saying those "leaders" should just openly admit to their sin instead of leading double lives?
you see the problem with your reasoning is the assumption that the person wants to STOP sinning and WANT help.
what if those "leaders" are just desiring the power, control and thrill of leading a double life?
pronouns like "this" and "it" are confusing could you clarify what you are referring to with those words? thanks.
that's not true Satan whispers lies into people's heads all the time. its one of the reason people are told to test the spirit. take captive their thoughts, tear down strongholds that war against the knowledge of Christ. to be tempted is not a sin, because Jesus was tempted in the desert and remained sinless.
We need the law to give voice to what God has placed in our hearts and to see beyond what the world believes and thinks is right and true. The law if used lawfully is good. however, it is better to focus on what God wants us to do then our own failures. if we stumble we should repent and know that God has forgiven us. too often the Enemy tries to use our past failures to keep us from doing God's work in the present out of fear, disappointment, etc.
i haven't really read in detail a lot of what you have posted EG but some of your phrasing is kind of confusing.
there is no righteousness according to the law. However, God does want us to learn wisdom and self control. therefore there are some guidelines, or if people want to refer to them as laws, that Christians should follow.
no you see i disagree with you that this is the case for many people. I think most people don't know what it is that God requires of them. they get distracted by the external keeping of the law that they do not bother to examine the internal hurts and behaviors the world has ingrained in us. its like when you condition a dog to a bell. many people are conditioned to a few key words and attack upon command because they feel threatened.
??? most people seeking God's heart are reluctant to assume the power and responsibility of leading His people. it is easy for wolves to have the outward show of piety to deceive people because most Christians want to believe the best of others.
so are you saying those "leaders" should just openly admit to their sin instead of leading double lives?
you see the problem with your reasoning is the assumption that the person wants to STOP sinning and WANT help.
what if those "leaders" are just desiring the power, control and thrill of leading a double life?
A
Matthew 5
[SUP]43 [/SUP]“You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall love your neighbor[SUP][g][/SUP] and hate your enemy.’ [SUP]44 [/SUP]But I say to you, love your enemies, bless those who curse you, do good to those who hate you, and pray for those who spitefully use you and persecute you,[SUP][h][/SUP] [SUP]45 [/SUP]that you may be sons of your Father in heaven; for He makes His sun rise on the evil and on the good, and sends rain on the just and on the unjust. [SUP]46 [/SUP]For if you love those who love you, what reward have you? Do not even the tax collectors do the same? [SUP]47 [/SUP]And if you greet your brethren[SUP][i][/SUP] only, what do you do more than others? Do not even the tax collectors[SUP][j][/SUP] do so? [SUP]48 [/SUP]Therefore you shall be perfect, just as your Father in heaven is perfect.
sometimes those who insist on keeping the outward forms of the Commandments, forget to examine their own hearts and see if they are actually following what Jesus taught.
[SUP]43 [/SUP]“You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall love your neighbor[SUP][g][/SUP] and hate your enemy.’ [SUP]44 [/SUP]But I say to you, love your enemies, bless those who curse you, do good to those who hate you, and pray for those who spitefully use you and persecute you,[SUP][h][/SUP] [SUP]45 [/SUP]that you may be sons of your Father in heaven; for He makes His sun rise on the evil and on the good, and sends rain on the just and on the unjust. [SUP]46 [/SUP]For if you love those who love you, what reward have you? Do not even the tax collectors do the same? [SUP]47 [/SUP]And if you greet your brethren[SUP][i][/SUP] only, what do you do more than others? Do not even the tax collectors[SUP][j][/SUP] do so? [SUP]48 [/SUP]Therefore you shall be perfect, just as your Father in heaven is perfect.
sometimes those who insist on keeping the outward forms of the Commandments, forget to examine their own hearts and see if they are actually following what Jesus taught.
E
lol.. Wow.. keep on talking.. Again you show your true self. I have not beard false witness against you. You have proven what I say about your gospel is correct.
Oh You did? No you took my words out of context. And claimed it to be truth.
When you were confronted to prove that those claiming to obey Gods laws to get saved (jews) were slamming and defaming and even threatening Paul. You refused to answer.
And now your going to say you prove I lied? WOW..
If you going to prove I lied. back it up with facts, Not your false interpretation of what I said. Come out of the dark and into the light so you can understand what people say, And understand you are bearing false witness against them.
No. I did not get mad. I confronted you on your false interpretation of what I said, and asked you to show me where I was wrong. As usual, you refused to do it (because you can;t)
As for saying I would report you., That was for your flaming attacks which have nothing to do with Scripture. Like calling people names. That stuff is not tolerated here. If you do not like it, And this is all you have to offer Christian chat.. Well. I will let the people who run this place deal with that. But again to warn you. Many a people have been banned for calling others name, and making attacks which have no bearing on what is being discussed. It has NOTHING to do with doctrinal beliefs.
Keep telling yourself this lie. Your only fooling yourself.
Now are you going to answer tough questions, or keep threatening and bearing false witness??
I ask you again, Prove where someone in here is saying it is OK to break gods laws. Your one example has been proven false. And while your at it. Show me where the jews did not proclaim we are to follow Gods laws to be saved, and were NOT hostile to Paul..
of course I doubt you will answer. It would show you made a mistake. Humility seems to be hard to come by these days, WE ALL MAKE MISTAKES.
lol.. I find this hard to believe, but will give ya the benefit of the doubt.
Everyone here believes we should keep gods commands. the few I know who did not are no longer here. Not sure if they were banned, or got sick of being proven wrong. but they are gone.
The problem in christianity is not cheap grace, very few believe in this, the problem is no grace (legalism) it infiltrated the church in pauls day, and is a great danger in the church today!
Oh You did? No you took my words out of context. And claimed it to be truth.
When you were confronted to prove that those claiming to obey Gods laws to get saved (jews) were slamming and defaming and even threatening Paul. You refused to answer.
And now your going to say you prove I lied? WOW..
If you going to prove I lied. back it up with facts, Not your false interpretation of what I said. Come out of the dark and into the light so you can understand what people say, And understand you are bearing false witness against them.
No. I did not get mad. I confronted you on your false interpretation of what I said, and asked you to show me where I was wrong. As usual, you refused to do it (because you can;t)
As for saying I would report you., That was for your flaming attacks which have nothing to do with Scripture. Like calling people names. That stuff is not tolerated here. If you do not like it, And this is all you have to offer Christian chat.. Well. I will let the people who run this place deal with that. But again to warn you. Many a people have been banned for calling others name, and making attacks which have no bearing on what is being discussed. It has NOTHING to do with doctrinal beliefs.
Keep telling yourself this lie. Your only fooling yourself.
Now are you going to answer tough questions, or keep threatening and bearing false witness??
I ask you again, Prove where someone in here is saying it is OK to break gods laws. Your one example has been proven false. And while your at it. Show me where the jews did not proclaim we are to follow Gods laws to be saved, and were NOT hostile to Paul..
of course I doubt you will answer. It would show you made a mistake. Humility seems to be hard to come by these days, WE ALL MAKE MISTAKES.
lol.. I find this hard to believe, but will give ya the benefit of the doubt.
Everyone here believes we should keep gods commands. the few I know who did not are no longer here. Not sure if they were banned, or got sick of being proven wrong. but they are gone.
The problem in christianity is not cheap grace, very few believe in this, the problem is no grace (legalism) it infiltrated the church in pauls day, and is a great danger in the church today!
I confess I fell into all this banter about "the law."
Suffice it to say when we come to Yeshua, and we live in grace, our hearts are changed so that what was previously not our nature, that is obedience to the Father in Yeshua, has become our nature, and we are obedient even to the law, however if we do offend in one area, it is not we who offend but that offense which dwells in us. We are no longer habitual offenders, that is to say, sinners, and we are not governed by sin, having been freed of its curse. If this is not good for all concerned, fine. It works for me, and I get it from the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit first, and second from the teachings written down by Paul.
Anyone thinking the law is canceled out completely does not understand the teachings of Yeshua for He fulfilled the law and the prophets, He did not destroy either.
All of the above is from the Word, so it is not intended to argue, so please, do not.
Suffice it to say when we come to Yeshua, and we live in grace, our hearts are changed so that what was previously not our nature, that is obedience to the Father in Yeshua, has become our nature, and we are obedient even to the law, however if we do offend in one area, it is not we who offend but that offense which dwells in us. We are no longer habitual offenders, that is to say, sinners, and we are not governed by sin, having been freed of its curse. If this is not good for all concerned, fine. It works for me, and I get it from the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit first, and second from the teachings written down by Paul.
Anyone thinking the law is canceled out completely does not understand the teachings of Yeshua for He fulfilled the law and the prophets, He did not destroy either.
All of the above is from the Word, so it is not intended to argue, so please, do not.
A
I would agree with the above statement.
however, i would clarify by saying that even though we may sin. we are able to confess our sins and Jesus will forgive us and help us overcome the strongholds in our hearts and minds. Some we do not even realize that we are hurting others around us but sinning against God.
2 Corinthians 10:3-5 (New King James Version)
New King James Version (NKJV)
[SUP]3 [/SUP]For though we walk in the flesh, we do not war according to the flesh. [SUP]4 [/SUP]For the weapons of our warfare are not carnal but mighty in God for pulling down strongholds, [SUP]5 [/SUP]casting down arguments and every high thing that exalts itself against the knowledge of God, bringing every thought into captivity to the obedience of Christ,
We are not enslaved by sin because God's Holy Spirit has freed us, but we are to diligently add to our Faith.
2 Peter 1
[SUP]5 [/SUP]But also for this very reason, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue, to virtue knowledge, [SUP]6 [/SUP]to knowledge self-control, to self-control perseverance, to perseverance godliness, [SUP]7 [/SUP]to godliness brotherly kindness, and to brotherly kindness love. [SUP]8 [/SUP]For if these things are yours and abound, you will be neither barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ. [SUP]9 [/SUP]For he who lacks these things is shortsighted, even to blindness, and has forgotten that he was cleansed from his old sins.
one would ask what is the knowledge that we are to seek?
It would be wisdom from above that allows one to follow GOD's laws and discern what are just manmade ceremonies that have been added to what GOD teaches His children.
some people are still learning self control, that the concept of brotherly kindness and love seems like a totally foreign land.
however, i would clarify by saying that even though we may sin. we are able to confess our sins and Jesus will forgive us and help us overcome the strongholds in our hearts and minds. Some we do not even realize that we are hurting others around us but sinning against God.
2 Corinthians 10:3-5 (New King James Version)
New King James Version (NKJV)
[SUP]3 [/SUP]For though we walk in the flesh, we do not war according to the flesh. [SUP]4 [/SUP]For the weapons of our warfare are not carnal but mighty in God for pulling down strongholds, [SUP]5 [/SUP]casting down arguments and every high thing that exalts itself against the knowledge of God, bringing every thought into captivity to the obedience of Christ,
We are not enslaved by sin because God's Holy Spirit has freed us, but we are to diligently add to our Faith.
2 Peter 1
[SUP]5 [/SUP]But also for this very reason, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue, to virtue knowledge, [SUP]6 [/SUP]to knowledge self-control, to self-control perseverance, to perseverance godliness, [SUP]7 [/SUP]to godliness brotherly kindness, and to brotherly kindness love. [SUP]8 [/SUP]For if these things are yours and abound, you will be neither barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ. [SUP]9 [/SUP]For he who lacks these things is shortsighted, even to blindness, and has forgotten that he was cleansed from his old sins.
one would ask what is the knowledge that we are to seek?
It would be wisdom from above that allows one to follow GOD's laws and discern what are just manmade ceremonies that have been added to what GOD teaches His children.
some people are still learning self control, that the concept of brotherly kindness and love seems like a totally foreign land.