Keep The Commandments

[Laodicea]

Only one problem. Abraham was never given the law. He was long since dead around 400 years before the law was even given.. So I have a problem with this reasoning.

Genesis 26:5 KJV
(5) Because that Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws.

Read the book of Genesis and you will find each of the 10 commandments mentioned

 

[eternally-gratefull]

what?!? where did this come from?
definitely not what I posted.......

lol. It is what I said,, you claimed it was in error.. Sorry if I misunderstood ya.

you forget about the strongholds people still need to tear down.

No. that is why we need to be in deep christian open relationships. we can not do this on our own.. Which was my point.

The worst thing we can do is be like some and thing we are righteous because we obey gods law already, thus do not need help.. Their focus is on everyone elses sin, they are blinded to their own sin. (I had to learn this the HARD way)

before you can teach anyone anything, you have to show them that you truly love them. then you have to teach in the manner God taught you: with patience, gentleness, impartiality and Truth. James 3

True.. but when that is worn out. Then we must show the truth in love, even if it hurts someone, to hide the truth, or be afraid to show them truth is not loving at all.. This is what is wrong with the world today, we are afraid we are going to hurt someones feelings.. Lets all be happy together, Doing this will lead many to hell.

sometimes i think you push to hard. you have to remember that they are not you and you might be misreading them.

True. But when I do, They correct me, or I ask them (like I asked you and a few others on a comment they made yesterday) If I can't be humble enough to admit I made a mistake. I am no better than others..

But when they continually misread and misinterpret me. That is when problems come, it is a tactic of theirs. Then it becomes not trying to show them truth, but show others who read the fallacys in their doctrines..

its just a reminder that there are wolves in sheep clothing, that are often not caught in the beginning.

True, In some cases. But it is just as true, many want freedom, but can;t get help because they are too afraid to admit their sin.. This is what legalism does. and just one of many reasons why it is so dangerous.

yes but too often it is not found at this stage or they never had a true discipleship relationship at all.

Most churches do not even understand this concept. Or practice it. This is a sad state in the church.. Most pastors do not even have someone to hold them accountable. Then of course you have people like the Pope. His word is Gods word. blah blah blah.. you get the point. I agree..

kay I'm glad one of us does.

 

[JaumeJ]

There was oral tradition which included the laws from the time of Noah until Moses. Otherwise, how do you suppose Abram continued worshiping the true El? He also conversed with Him. So, yes, Abram obeyed God's commandments.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Will these people keep God's commandments? Even if it is GOD who MAKES (CAUSE) them keep HIS JUDGEMENTS (commandments?) ... Are this true?

And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.

Note who will, and whose spirit it is, and who cause who to DO IT.... There is no way these people will not obey God 100% ALL THE TIME....

This will only happen when we get to heaven.

Even david, a man after Gods heart, who was called righteous, could not achieve sinlessness. Paul did not. Peter sure did not, a few of his sins we are shown.

so why do you think these great, humble people of God could not do it. but someone else could?

 

[john832]

could you clarify what you mean by the word "this" ?

Bill Clinton said the same thing about the word "is". LOL. Just a little humor there.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I'm a Seventh Day Adventist. I suggest you ask the author of this thread. He is also a 7th Day Adventist. You can research my doctrine and get every answer to why I believe the way I do. IMO, the well is poisoned. Again, if you think this is a popularity contest where you can gain support by saying things like: " Your refusal to answer questions should show the whole chatroom your heart." then you are severely decieved. I am not obligated to answer you. I have answers to every question you could ask me. Chances are I already had the same questions,as I always make an extreme effort at collecting data before I make a decision. But, the well is poisoned, therefore, I shall keep my pearl.

1. I could care less what church you go to.
2. You do not appear to believe as the author does. I know him well, and we have had open discussions with no hate mongering. i heard you say stuff I never heard him say or claim.. like we will get out of hell one day.

he also always seems to answer my questions, especially when he misreads me and I point out to him I do not think he read me right. as I have done with you, but you refuse to look.

3. if your going to make claims (like I lied) and show proof by posting something I said, then when you are asked to show how I erred by the correct interpretation of what i said, and to show where I was wrong, yet REFUSE to answer. you have shown yourself to be in error. so stop getting so upset when you are asked over and over to back your claims.. YOU DO NOT CALL SOMEONE A LIAR, THEN REFUSE TO ANSWER THEIR QUESTIONS TO BACK UP YOUR OWN ACCUSATIONS)

You made the claim. don;t run when you are asked to defend your claim about what others said or believe.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Genesis 26:5 KJV
(5) Because that Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws.

Read the book of Genesis and you will find each of the 10 commandments mentioned

Not only will I find them mentioned. But I will find the people knew them long before they were written in stone, (it was written in their heart)

by the way can you show your brother SDA this, he seems to want to deny the very thing you just said and proved.

remember, the book of genesis was written by Moses. NO ONE ALIVE before this time had the written word..

So it can not be used..

 

[sunshinelovin1700]

1. I could care less what church you go to.
2. You do not appear to believe as the author does. I know him well, and we have had open discussions with no hate mongering. i heard you say stuff I never heard him say or claim.. like we will get out of hell one day.

he also always seems to answer my questions, especially when he misreads me and I point out to him I do not think he read me right. as I have done with you, but you refuse to look.

3. if your going to make claims (like I lied) and show proof by posting something I said, then when you are asked to show how I erred by the correct interpretation of what i said, and to show where I was wrong, yet REFUSE to answer. you have shown yourself to be in error. so stop getting so upset when you are asked over and over to back your claims.. YOU DO NOT CALL SOMEONE A LIAR, THEN REFUSE TO ANSWER THEIR QUESTIONS TO BACK UP YOUR OWN ACCUSATIONS)

You made the claim. don;t run when you are asked to defend your claim about what others said or believe.

I'm not trying to impose but I wish you guys would just agree to disagree. It is awful to see this much arguing going on here.

 

[john832]

Not only will I find them mentioned. But I will find the people knew them long before they were written in stone, (it was written in their heart)

by the way can you show your brother SDA this, he seems to want to deny the very thing you just said and proved.

remember, the book of genesis was written by Moses. NO ONE ALIVE before this time had the written word..

So it can not be used..

Can you explain the last statement for simple minded folk like myself? What is it you are saying when you say "So it can not be used.."?

 

[Laodicea]

Not only will I find them mentioned. But I will find the people knew them long before they were written in stone, (it was written in their heart)

by the way can you show your brother SDA this, he seems to want to deny the very thing you just said and proved.

remember, the book of genesis was written by Moses. NO ONE ALIVE before this time had the written word..

So it can not be used..

Yes it means they knew about the sabbath, idols, false gods, adultery etc before they were given on Sinai. Also about clean and unclean foods as shown in the time of Noah's ark. Man has degenerated over time. Man used to live over 900 years, they would have been better physically and would have had better memories and since man has decreased as the Bible shows then there was a need to write things down.

 

[Michael50]

1. I could care less what church you go to.
2. You do not appear to believe as the author does. I know him well, and we have had open discussions with no hate mongering. i heard you say stuff I never heard him say or claim.. like we will get out of hell one day.

he also always seems to answer my questions, especially when he misreads me and I point out to him I do not think he read me right. as I have done with you, but you refuse to look.

3. if your going to make claims (like I lied) and show proof by posting something I said, then when you are asked to show how I erred by the correct interpretation of what i said, and to show where I was wrong, yet REFUSE to answer. you have shown yourself to be in error. so stop getting so upset when you are asked over and over to back your claims.. YOU DO NOT CALL SOMEONE A LIAR, THEN REFUSE TO ANSWER THEIR QUESTIONS TO BACK UP YOUR OWN ACCUSATIONS)

You made the claim. don;t run when you are asked to defend your claim about what others said or believe.

Okay,, you say: "I heard you say stuff that iI never heard him say or claim..like we will get out of hell one day."

Okay,, present your evidence? I understand hell so well, that I started to make a thread about it. But, I am going to wait and see if you have me kicked.. Don't want to waste my time making the thread, just to be kicked from CC because I oppose you and refuse to allow you to wipe your feet off on me.

There is no relief for those that are cast into the lake of fire (earth on fire), which is the 2nd Death. When I say "relief", I mean a ressurection. The wicked will be destroyed. They are burned up. They become ashes. Satan will become ashes as well. So,, once again, you are bearing false witness against me.,, I never said folks will get out of the lake of fire. You have erred again.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I'm not trying to impose but I wish you guys would just agree to disagree. It is awful to see this much arguing going on here.

I just wish people would admit they made a mistake. And stop bearing false witness against half the people in this chatroom.

Which is why I will confront them when they do this.

Kind of hard to agree to disagree when they keep bearing false witness against you and others

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Can you explain the last statement for simple minded folk like myself? What is it you are saying when you say "So it can not be used.."?

I am saying you can not use that example, when the law which he claimed was given to isreal., was not even given yet.

He said, what is the law. he showed it was the one given to moses and Isreal to take with them.

then he used abraham as his example.. You can not use it, because abraham did not even have the law given to isreal ( the whole law)

just saying he needs to use a different example to make his point.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Yes it means they knew about the sabbath, idols, false gods, adultery etc before they were given on Sinai. Also about clean and unclean foods as shown in the time of Noah's ark. Man has degenerated over time. Man used to live over 900 years, they would have been better physically and would have had better memories and since man has decreased as the Bible shows then there was a need to write things down.

I agree with most everything you said.

However, I disagree with the reasoning why things (especially the law) was written down.

Scripture tells us the law was written down to shut us up. To prove we could not fulfill the law, and thus be acceptable to god by the law. And to be a schoolmaster to lead us to God, to the one who would remove the penalty of sin for us, so we could have the only hope of having our relationship with God restored. (Christ)

The temple sacrifices could not do it. The law could not do it. The ten commands could not do it (because we can not even keep these ten) etc etc.

Anyway, Romans explains this well, especially in the first three chapters/.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Okay,, you say: "I heard you say stuff that iI never heard him say or claim..like we will get out of hell one day."

Okay,, present your evidence? I understand hell so well, that I started to make a thread about it. But, I am going to wait and see if you have me kicked.. Don't want to waste my time making the thread, just to be kicked from CC because I oppose you and refuse to allow you to wipe your feet off on me.

There is no relief for those that are cast into the lake of fire (earth on fire), which is the 2nd Death. When I say "relief", I mean a ressurection. The wicked will be destroyed. They are burned up. They become ashes. Satan will become ashes as well. So,, once again, you are bearing false witness against me.,, I never said folks will get out of the lake of fire. You have erred again.

Ok. Then I mistook you.

You did claim some people will suffer more did you not? and did you also not say some peoples suffering would end in hell? if not I misunderstood you.

(see it is not so hard to admit you may have made a mistake, now is it??)

 

[Michael50]

Ok. Then I mistook you.

You did claim some people will suffer more did you not? and did you also not say some peoples suffering would end in hell? if not I misunderstood you.

(see it is not so hard to admit you may have made a mistake, now is it??)

I said some people will burn longer than others. Such as Hitler will burn longer than say, some atheist that did nothing but drink beer and smoke cigarettes will. Satan will burn longer than anybody,, for he has inflenced every single person on the planet to sin. The suffering of the wicked will end. In DEATH!!!!!!
The wicked do not live forever, they are destroyed. So,, even God has compassion on the wicked. Yet some believe God has an eternal torture chamber where he keeps the wicked alive and tortures them for all eternity. That lie originated from Satan, who teaches that the soul is immortal. Satan knows many will turn against God if they believe God tortures people for al eternity,, and he is right. More people have turned from God because of that lie, than any other.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I said some people will burn longer than others. Such as Hitler will burn longer than say, some atheist that did nothing but drink beer and smoke cigarettes will. Satan will burn longer than anybody,, for he has inflenced every single person on the planet to sin. The suffering of the wicked will end. In DEATH!!!!!!

This makes no sense. How can the dead die again? John tells us those who are banished to the lake of fire have already suffered the second death. Now you want me to think there is a third?? or am I mistaking you again?

Do you understand what spiritual death means? Just asking..

The wicked do not live forever, they are destroyed. So,, even God has compassion on the wicked. Yet some believe God has an eternal torture chamber where he keeps the wicked alive and tortures them for all eternity. That lie originated from Satan, who teaches that the soul is immortal. Satan knows many will turn against God if they believe God tortures people for al eternity,, and he is right. More people have turned from God because of that lie, than any other.

Um. God does not turture people. Hell is people torturing themselves. because they have to live for all eternity thinking of the many times they had a chance to see truth, and rejected it. This is hell.. This is also spiritual death, which will rear its full head when it becomes final.

The worm does not die means just that, The soul will NEVER DIE. it will torure itself for all eternity KNOWING they could have been living in paradise if they just humbled themselves. why? As romans 1 says, they HAVE NO EXCUSE. they KNEW THEY WERE GUILTY by the law written on their hearts, and all the proofs God gave them.. But they willingly rejected him..

 

[Michael50]

This makes no sense. How can the dead die again? John tells us those who are banished to the lake of fire have already suffered the second death. Now you want me to think there is a third?? or am I mistaking you again?

Do you understand what spiritual death means? Just asking..


Um. God does not turture people. Hell is people torturing themselves. because they have to live for all eternity thinking of the many times they had a chance to see truth, and rejected it. This is hell.. This is also spiritual death, which will rear its full head when it becomes final.

The worm does not die means just that, The soul will NEVER DIE. it will torure itself for all eternity KNOWING they could have been living in paradise if they just humbled themselves. why? As romans 1 says, they HAVE NO EXCUSE. they KNEW THEY WERE GUILTY by the law written on their hearts, and all the proofs God gave them.. But they willingly rejected him..

I will back up so that you may understand the Truth.. Souls die. God says "The soul that sinneth shall die".... Satan says "Ye shall not surely die." And you say "The soul will NEVER DIE." So,, you are on the same page that Satan is teaching from. You agree with Satan. I agree with God, Souls die.

I am ONLY speaking of the dead here: The rightous dead are raised at the appearance of Jesus. The wicked dead remain in their graves. They will be raised 1000 years later. So, there is 2 ressurections. One for the Rightous when Jesus appears. And, one for the wicked at the end of the 1000 years. The wicked are raised back to life and punished. Which means they are burned up.
If you go to luke 12:47,48,, you will see that Jesus spoke of different degrees of punishment.

So because you belief the false teaching that the soul is immortal, there will be a great gulf between us.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I will back up so that you may understand the Truth.. Souls die. God says "The soul that sinneth shall die"....

Again. I ask you if you understand what spiritual death means? Adam died the moment he sinned. yet he did not die physically for another 900 some years.

If we do not understand this, We will not understand God and his truth.

Sin causes spiritual (soul) death, I agree. But not in hell. the soul was already dead the moment it entered hell.

Satan says "Ye shall not surely die." And you say "The soul will NEVER DIE." So,, you are on the same page that Satan is teaching from. You agree with Satan. I agree with God, Souls die.

We are talking about two different deaths here.. Death means separation

Physical death is the separation of the soul from the body
Spiritua;l death is the separation of God from man due to sin.

Satan tried to fool Adam into thinking phsyical death also. That is how he tricked him..Adam died the moment he ate of the fruit (spiritually) he died physically many years later.

Anialation (or ending of existance) is not the death God speaks of..

those dead outside of christ are dead.. yet they still conscious of life and the things around them.

I am ONLY speaking of the dead here: The rightous dead are raised at the appearance of Jesus. The wicked dead remain in their graves. They will be raised 1000 years later. So, there is 2 ressurections. One for the Rightous when Jesus appears. And, one for the wicked at the end of the 1000 years. The wicked are raised back to life and punished. Which means they are burned up.
If you go to luke 12:47,48,, you will see that Jesus spoke of different degrees of punishment.

So because you belief the false teaching that the soul is immortal, there will be a great gulf between us.

lol. Our differences are in terms.

Spiritual death vs anialation are two different things..

 

[Michael50]

Again. I ask you if you understand what spiritual death means? Adam died the moment he sinned. yet he did not die physically for another 900 some years.

If we do not understand this, We will not understand God and his truth.

Sin causes spiritual (soul) death, I agree. But not in hell. the soul was already dead the moment it entered hell.



We are talking about two different deaths here.. Death means separation

Physical death is the separation of the soul from the body
Spiritua;l death is the separation of God from man due to sin.

Satan tried to fool Adam into thinking phsyical death also. That is how he tricked him..Adam died the moment he ate of the fruit (spiritually) he died physically many years later.

Anialation (or ending of existance) is not the death God speaks of..

those dead outside of christ are dead.. yet they still conscious of life and the things around them.



lol. Our differences are in terms.

Spiritual death vs anialation are two different things..

I said what I mean, and I mean what I said. I have spoken the Truth to you. You reject the Truth. You believe the dead are alive. Satan shall decieve the world through 2 great errors in Doctrine. The false teaching that the soul is immortal & Sunday Sacredness! The 2 are tied together. Are differences are not in mere "terms", They are in Foundational Bible Truths.

Those who believe the dead are alive will be easy prey for Satan and his last day deceptions. It is thru the agency of the dead that Satan shall decieve nearly all. You have no idea what miracles are about to wrought before the eyes of men.