Proof of a Future Millennial Kingdom

zone · Sep 3, 2013

could you show me where "the anti-Messiah sets up satan's kingdom on earth"?

Jesus said his Kingdom in not of this world. He is ruling over the earth, in the midst of His enemies. the OBJECT is the salvation of souls for the eternal Kingdom. this is through the church....

He will never set up His throne on this earth. He is reigning now, from heaven.
the Pharisees didn't understand it - or they did and said "this is the heir, come let us kill Him and the inheritance will be ours" - so?
will you make the same mistake?

He will return on Judge, and we will enter the Heavenly Zion.

if you have biblical evidence to the contrary, please post it.
the passages. ty.

doulos · Sep 3, 2013

Hizikyah said:

Mar_9:1 And he said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That there be some of them that stand here, which shall not taste of death, till they have seen the kingdom of God come with power.

So do you believe Christ lied when He said this? Or are you suggesting there are some really old people (like1900+ years) still with us?

By the way you still haven’t explained why you don’t believe we are already kings and priests despite the fact Scripture states we are.

Rev 1:6 And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen
Rev 5:10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth

Do you believe the Scriptures? It appears you do not!

zone · Sep 3, 2013

doulos said:

So lets look at those verses.
Rev 11:3 And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand G5507 chilioi) two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.
Rev 12:6 And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand G5507 chilioi) two hundred and threescore days.
In the above two verses the term chilioi translated as thousand is used in conjunction with other numbers making it a definite number in those cases. In the following verses it is not used in conjuction with other numbers so it is our responsibility to determine if it is used figuratively or literally.
2Pe 3:8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand (G5507 chilioi) years, and a thousand years as one day.
When we look at the above verse there is nothing in the verse or the surrounding verses that can provides us with a reason to believe this is figurative language.
Rev 20:2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand (G5507 chilioi) years,
Rev 20:3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand (G5507 chilioi) years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.
Rev 20:6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand (G5507 chilioi) years.
Rev 20:7 And when the thousand (G5507 chilioi) years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,
To quote a friend of mine “Figurative language must be interpreted figuratively. Only a small portion of the Bible is figurative, but interpreting figurative passages figuratively is of major importance to us because every end-time prophecy in the Bible is figurative in nature. Revelation is a prophetic vision and as such it is primarily figurative, but since part of the 20[SUP]th[/SUP] Chapter of Revelation appears to be literal, in 1640 a Dutch Reformed theologian, Jean de Labadie, concluded that Jesus would return to rule over the earthly kingdoms of men for 1000 years at the end of the Christian Era. This "millennium," as it is called, would then be followed by a second Armageddon (Rev 20:8), after which would come the great white throne of judgment. Jean de Labadie's premillennial theory fit perfectly with the Lacunza, Darby, Macdonald, Scofield eschatological scheme of things, so the futurists added premillennialism to their body of doctrine. However, the Reformers of de Labadie's day were not so easily fooled. They saw de Labadie’s view as erroneous and excommunicated him from the Dutch Reform Church. Here is why: The only support in the whole Bible for a pre-millennial view is Revelation 2:20 and it only works there if we interpret Revelation 2:20 literally in a book most serious eschatologists understand to be figurative. Even to arrive at his view, de Labadie had to ignore two universally accepted rules of Bible interpretation:
Reason #1. No scripture should be interpreted apart from its context. As already stated, most of Revelation is figurative and there is no textual reason to interpret chapter 20 differently than its context.
Reason #2. The Greek word for 1000 is "chilias." The Greek word translated thousand in Rev 20 is "chilioi", an indefinite plural. As an indefinite plural, "chilioi" could mean one thousand, but it could also mean many thousands. Point being: it appears the premillennials are basing a definite end-time doctrine on an indefinite plural. Even though the translation of chilioi as "a thousand" is not incorrect, if we insist on it meaning just one thousand, the intended sense of the passage could be lost.”

Chilioi is a plural of uncertain affinity it could be a thousand or thousands. So let’s have a look at some other verses that demonstrate timing and see if they help us determine if the kingdom is present or future.
1Co 15:20-26 But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept. For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead. For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive. But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming. Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power. For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet. The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.
So when does this occur?
1Co 15:51-54 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.
Notice that Paul used the term we, which includes himself so this must occur at the same time as the following verses because in them Paul also includes himself when he uses the term we.
1Th 4:16-17 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
So we have established the fact that the millenial reign ends at the last trump and at that time we are in the eternal kingdom of God. So is this the 7[SUP]th[/SUP] trump of Revelation? Sure it is and here is how we know this.
Rev 11:15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.
As we can see from Rev11:15 at the 7[SUP]th[/SUP] trump of Rev we are in the eternal kingdom of God not the millenial reign. Rev10:6-7 further establishes that fact.
Rev 10:6-7 And sware by him that liveth for ever and ever, who created heaven, and the things that therein are, and the earth, and the things that therein are, and the sea, and the things which are therein, that there should be time no longer: But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as he hath declared to his servants the prophets.
Rev10:6-7 tells us the mystery of God is finished and time is no longer when the 7[SUP]th[/SUP] trump sounds. If the mystery of God is finished then the millenium must take prior to the last trump. If there is time no longer at the seventh trump then how can there be a thousand year reign? Can you show me where in Scripture Christ returns prior to the last trump at which point He delivers the kingdom to His Father?

I addressed the points you have raised maybe you would be kind enough to answer a few questions for me.
Rev 1:6 And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.
Rev 5:10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.
The above verses show that we have been made kings. If we are not presently in the millenial kingdom and have no kingdom what have we been made kings of?
Col 1:13 Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:
How is it that we have already been translated into the kingdom of His dear Son if that kingdom is future?
Rev 1:9 I John, who also am your brother, and companion in tribulation, and in the kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ, was in the isle that is called Patmos, for the word of God, and for the testimony of Jesus Christ.
Was John lying when he said he was “the kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ” while on the isle of Patmos? How could he be in Christ’s kingdom if it was future?
Joh_18:36 Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.
Why don’t you believe Jesus when He said His kingdom is not of this world?
Can you show me the verse that says while Christ is reigning He is on earth instead of seated at His Fathers right hand?

clicking LIKE.

thank you doulos for remaining on topic on this thread.
nuff said

Hizikyah · Sep 3, 2013

zone said:

Daniyl 7:23, "This is what he said; The fourth beast will be the fourth kingdom upon earth, which will be different from all other kingdoms, and will devour the whole earth, and will tread it down, and break it in pieces."

Revelation 13:17, "And the ten horns which you saw are ten kings, which as yet have not
received a kingdom; but receive authority as kings one hour with the beast."

Revelation 17:18, "And the woman whom you saw, is that great city which reigns over the
kings of the earth."

Revelation 13:7, "And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them. And authority was given him over all tribes, and peoples and languages, and nations."

not of this world means the kingdom of Yahweh does not originate in this world.

Revelation 21:1-2, "And I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and there was no more sea. And I, Yahchanan, saw the holy city, Yahweh Shammah, coming down from Yahweh out of heaven, prepared as brides adorned for their husbands."

YAHWEH SHAMMAH means Yahweh Is There.

Hizikyah · Sep 3, 2013

doulos said:

Actually I did answer you already, no problem I will do it again and with a little more.

Isayah 66:21-22, "And I will also take of them for priests and for Levites, says Yahweh. For as the new heavens and the new earth which I will make will remain before Me, says Yahweh: so will your seed and your name remain."

Revelation 1:5-6, "And from Yahshua Messiah, the faithful witness, and the firstborn from the dead, and the Ruler of *future kings of the earth. To Him Who loved us and freed us from our sins by His own blood, And has made us a kingdom of priests
to Yahweh our Father--to Whom belongs glory and power forever and ever. (HalleluYahweh!)"

*Verse 1:5 -- Greek basileon, meaning those who will rule in Yahweh's Kingdom. Thayer's Greek Lexicon, Pages 96-98.

MEs THINKs YURRs BYBALs BROWKENs

zone · Sep 3, 2013

Hizikyah said:

Daniel's Metal Man Image dream.
4th Kingdom of iron - Roman Empire.

fulfilled.
Daniel 7 is telling the same story, in a different way - just like Revelation does.

Daniel 2
Daniel Interprets the Dream
31“You saw, O king, and behold, a great image. This image, mighty and of exceeding brightness, stood before you, and its appearance was frightening. 32The head of this image was of fine gold, its chest and arms of silver, its middle and thighs of bronze, 33its legs of iron, its feet partly of iron and partly of clay. 34As you looked, a stone was cut out by no human hand, and it struck the image on its feet of iron and clay, and broke them in pieces. 35Then the iron, the clay, the bronze, the silver, and the gold, all together were broken in pieces, and became like the chaff of the summer threshing floors; and the wind carried them away, so that not a trace of them could be found. But the stone that struck the image became a great mountain and filled the whole earth.

36“This was the dream. Now we will tell the king its interpretation. 37You, O king, the king of kings, to whom the God of heaven has given the kingdom, the power, and the might, and the glory, 38and into whose hand he has given, wherever they dwell, the children of man, the beasts of the field, and the birds of the heavens, making you rule over them all—you are the head of gold. 39Another kingdom inferior to you shall arise after you, and yet a third kingdom of bronze, which shall rule over all the earth. 40And there shall be a fourth kingdom, strong as iron, because iron breaks to pieces and shatters all things. And like iron that crushes, it shall break and crush all these. 41And as you saw the feet and toes, partly of potter’s clay and partly of iron, it shall be a divided kingdom, but some of the firmness of iron shall be in it, just as you saw iron mixed with the soft clay. 42And as the toes of the feet were partly iron and partly clay, so the kingdom shall be partly strong and partly brittle. 43As you saw the iron mixed with soft clay, so they will mix with one another in marriage,c but they will not hold together, just as iron does not mix with clay. 44And in the days of those kings the God of heaven will set up a kingdom that shall never be destroyed, nor shall the kingdom be left to another people. It shall break in pieces all these kingdoms and bring them to an end, and it shall stand forever, 45just as you saw that a stone was cut from a mountain by no human hand, and that it broke in pieces the iron, the bronze, the clay, the silver, and the gold. A great God has made known to the king what shall be after this. The dream is certain, and its interpretation sure.”

Hizikyah said:

we can discuss it.....i believe this is also fulfilled.

but - i would prefer if possible, to remain on topic:

Re: Proof of a Future Millennial Kingdom

let's say for the sake of argument, that this is not fulfilled:

Hizikyah said:

how would this as an unfulfilled event mean there had to be a future 1,000 years?
what would it accomplish?

because as a Millennialist, you have another great beast-war - God & Magog at the end of the 1,000 years - on this old earth.
could you address THAT please

is Jesus NOT King of kings, and Lord of lords?
is not NOT already the Victor?

is He not ruling and reiging now?

if not....WHAT IS HE DOING?

Hizikyah said:

this was 1st century Jerusalem. unless you also claim Jerusalem was not the city called figuratively Sodom & Egypt - where also the Lord was crucified (outside the camp - as an OT reader, you know what this means).

The Herods
http://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/63663-herods.html < click

(sorry about the disorganization...just skim it)

Hizikyah said:

then who was this Baby, born a King?

Matthew 2:2
1Now after Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judea in the days of Herod the king, magi from the east arrived in Jerusalem, saying, 2"Where is He who has been born King of the Jews? For we saw His star in the east and have come to worship Him." 3When Herod the king heard this, he was troubled, and all Jerusalem with him.

wasn't it this King?

Zechariah 9:9
Rejoice greatly, Daughter Zion! Shout, Daughter Jerusalem! See, your king comes to you, righteous and victorious, lowly and riding on a donkey, on a colt, the foal of a donkey.

Revelation 21:1-2, "And I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and there was no more sea. And I, Yahchanan, saw the holy city, Yahweh Shammah, coming down from Yahweh out of heaven, prepared as brides adorned for their husbands."

Hizikyah said:

The LORD Our Righteousness.

WHO IS OUR RIGHTEOUSNESS?

and where does He Dwell?

where will His people dwell eternally?

Isaiah 60:14
The children of your oppressors will come bowing before you; all who despise you will bow down at your feet and will call you the City of the LORD, Zion of the Holy One of Israel.

and where will the saints live eternally?

Hebrews 11:10
For he was looking forward to the city with foundations, whose architect and builder is God.

Hebrews 11:16
Instead, they were longing for a better country--a heavenly one. Therefore God is not ashamed to be called their God, for he has prepared a city for them.

Hebrews 12
Our Kingdom Cannot Be Shaken
21And so terrible was the sight, that Moses said, "I AM FULL OF FEAR and trembling." 22 But you have come to Mount Zion and to the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to myriads of angels, 23to the general assembly and church of the firstborn who are enrolled in heaven, and to God, the Judge of all, and to the spirits of the righteous made perfect...

Ephesians 2:19
Consequently, you are no longer foreigners and strangers, but fellow citizens with God's people and also members of his household

Galatians 4:26
But the Jerusalem that is above is free, and she is our mother.

~

do you see any plan for earthly Jerusalem?

zone · Sep 3, 2013

Hizikyah said:

................

are you saved?
are you ministering the everlasting Gospel of salvation? are you a priest in Christ's Kingdom?

if not, what are you?

or do you plan to magically become a Levite?

don't you understand the hebrew types and pictures?

this is the terrible danger of trying to interpret the New Testament by the Old.

Hizikyah · Sep 3, 2013

zone said:

Nothing is ever used as if its already happened?

Also if it meant that it would contradict the earlier sentence

doulos · Sep 3, 2013

Hizikyah said:

The book of Isaiah was written 500 years or more before Rev. Have you ever considered that it is possible the millenial reign started between the time the book of Isaiah was written and the time John wrote Revelation? Like maybe Christs Millenial reign actually began in the first century (prior to John writing Rev) just as Scripture states.

Rev 1:6 And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen. KJV
Rev 1:6 and made us kings and priests to God, even His Father. To Him is the glory and the might forever and ever. Amen.LITV
Rev 1:6 And hath made us kings and priests to God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.Webster
Rev 1:6 And hath made us kings and priests to God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.YLT
Rev 1:6 And made vs kynges and priestes vnto God his father, be glorie and dominion for euermore. Amen Geneva
Rev 1:6 and made us a kingdom, priests to his God and Father, to him be glory and dominion forever and ever. Amen. ESV

Rev 5:10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth. KJV
Rev 5:10 and made us kings and priests to our God; and we shall reign over the earth.LITV
Rev 5:10 And hast made us to our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth. Webster
Rev 5:10 and didst make us to our God kings and priests, and we shall reign upon the earth.'YLT
Rev 5:10 And hast made vs vnto our God Kings and Priests, and we shall reigne on the earth. Geneva
Rev 5:10 and you have made them a kingdom and priests to our God, and they shall reign on the earth." ESV

All of these different versions show that we have already been made (past tense) kings. I see you are still grabbing at straws to hide the fact you do not believe these verses. Sad truly sad! Isn't it time you started searching for truth instead of attempting (and poorly at that) the Scripturally bankrupt premil view you are so desparately cling too?

Hizikyah · Sep 3, 2013

you guys can portray me however you like.

I gave my opinion, virtually nobody properly addresse the counter view, and i have disagreed with you in the past and it is unfruitful every time. even if I answers ALL you questions you will just pick more and more with your false doctrine

if the kingdom of Yahweh is already here for you I ask why is there still death, famine, disease, etc?

seems to me you are blinded and drooling to accept the false kingdom of the anti-Messiah.

the kingdom I want to enter is not made with human hands.

zone · Sep 3, 2013

Hizikyah said:

but.....the future Millennium would be on this earth - from earthly Jerusalem.
a city (and a kingdom) made by human hands....right?

is that when you plan to be translated into the kingdom of the Dear Son?
i assure, it'll be too late, since there is no future Millennium.

i don't mean to to portray you badly.

the things the OT prophets saw were from far off...and you know Hebrew is pictures and the Old Testament contained shadows of The Substance - Christ.

i.e: Ezekiel's temple - a real future temple?

or a picture of Jesus, His Church and New Jerusalem?

Ezekiel 40
Vision of the New Temple
1In the twenty-fifth year of our exile, at the beginning of the year, on the tenth day of the month, in the fourteenth year after the city was struck down, on that very day, the hand of the LORD was upon me, and he brought me to the city.a 2In visions of God he brought me to the land of Israel, and set me down on a very high mountain, on which was a structure like a city to the south. 3When he brought me there, behold, there was a man whose appearance was like bronze, with a linen cord and a measuring reed in his hand. And he was standing in the gateway. 4And the man said to me, “Son of man, look with your eyes, and hear with your ears, and set your heart upon all that I shall show you, for you were brought here in order that I might show it to you. Declare all that you see to the house of Israel.”

Revelation 21
The New Jerusalem
9Then came one of the seven angels who had the seven bowls full of the seven last plagues and spoke to me, saying, “Come, I will show you the Bride, the wife of the Lamb.” 10And he carried me away in the Spirit to a great, high mountain, and showed me the holy city Jerusalem coming down out of heaven from God, 11having the glory of God, its radiance like a most rare jewel, like a jasper, clear as crystal. 12It had a great, high wall, with twelve gates, and at the gates twelve angels, and on the gates the names of the twelve tribes of the sons of Israel were inscribed— 13on the east three gates, on the north three gates, on the south three gates, and on the west three gates. 14And the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and on them were the twelve names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb.

~

Hizikyah said:

well, the thread is about the future 1,000 years.
there must be TONS about it. it has to be even more important than this current age, since Jesus would be there in Person, right?
so that's what we needed to see - the Millennium.

Hizikyah · Sep 3, 2013

zone said:

Now in those verses I quoted earlier, Yahweh Shammah descends from the heavens, it is not made with hands.

And I do think its literal 1000 years, but it could be another length of time due to the discrepency of the origin word. either way the kingdom of Yahweh descends from above, satan is bound for a time, then loosed destroyes and all evil will be gone forever.

Also I apoligize if i was disrespectful, some of your doctriens are EXACTLY what the "cosmic christ" people teach, exactly what the masons teach, and very new agey. So it is not meant as an attack on you but the lies, I understand EVERYBODY thinks they have the truth, or they wouldnt believe it, myself included.

I hiope that Yahweh opens the eyes of as many as possible, HalleluYAHWEH!

Hizikyah · Sep 3, 2013

zone said:

I think its possible it will be rebuilt, however I dont think it is the real temple, just a knock off copy of what is to come when Yahshua returns.

Let me ask you something please,
if the kingdom is already on earth and alot is already fulfilled and alot is metaphor

how will the Messiah return? literally, metaphorically? or something else?

doulos · Sep 4, 2013

Hizikyah said:

Its not our fault you prefer to lean on doctrine instead of Scripture. Remember you are the one who said you don’t believe we have been made kings or priests despite the fact that Rev1:6 and Rev5:10 positively states that we have. If the shoe fits where it, If you don’t believe we have already been translated into the kingdom of His dear Son as Col1:13 states that is your choice but once again if the shoe fits don’t cry foul when your arguments have been proven Scripturally bankrupt!

As this thread clearly demonstrates you are guilty of doing what you accuse others of! So you are part of that virtually nobody, maybe it is time to get off your high horse and address the ponts others have raised instead of just repeating the same tired arguments that have been proven to be Scripturally bankrupt. I suggest you review the posts, it is you that have continually skipped over the points I have made in an effort to support the Scripturally bankrupt premil view.

I don’t recall you and I having any other discussions, would you be kind enough to show where (please post a link) we have disagreed before? Or is this just wishful thinking and a case of you can’t refute the points I’ve made so you go on the attack?

Even believers suffer the first death, but those who are in Christ’s kingdom need not fear the second death. I must ask about a point you skipped over. Did Christ lie when He said this?
Mar 9:1 And he said to them, "Truly, I say to you, there are some standing here who will not taste death until they see the kingdom of God after it has come with power."
Or if the kingdom has not come maybe you could show us those really old dudes who are 1900+ years old? OOPs looks like you failed to address that point. What was that you were saying about others not addressing the points? Looks like to me like the accuser is guilty of doing what he accuses others of!

Speaking of points that were not adressed you never did show me which one of the only 4 verses that tell us about antichrists tells us about antichrist having a kingdom. Looks like once again you got caught doing what you accuse others of!

Col 1:13 Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:
I am quite content in the kingdom of His dear Son!
Who said they wanted to enter a kingdom made with you human hands? Or is this just you falsely trying to imply that others are saying this?

Will you review the thread and address the points I have raised or will you continue to prove that discussion with you is an exercise in futility?

Hizikyah · Sep 4, 2013

doulos said:

If we are kings and priests now that contradicts the verses I have shown. Also do Yahweh and Yahshua not speak, at time, about future things as if they have already happend.

You did not answer all my topics from post 73, nor do I expect you too. So you cant expect something of me that you dont do.

you siad "I don’t recall you and I having any other discussions" so we didnt quote each other and rebut just a few posts ago?

you said "Even believers suffer the first death, but those who are in Christ’s kingdom need not fear the second death. I must ask about a point you skipped over. Did Christ lie when He said this?"

I adressed it to point to the truth, no contradiction no lie, you just see it your way so to you, you put the words in my mouth that a claim or THINK he lying.

you said: "Speaking of points that were not adressed you never did show me which one of the only 4 verses that tell us about antichrists tells us about antichrist having a kingdom. Looks like once again you got caught doing what you accuse others of!"

which one of 4 verses? they all point in that direction, do you need man made theology or commentary, can I not just provide Scripture?

you said: "Col 1:13 Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:
I am quite content in the kingdom of His dear Son!
Who said they wanted to enter a kingdom made with you human hands? Or is this just you falsely trying to imply that others are saying this?

Will you review the thread and address the points I have raised or will you continue to prove that discussion with you is an exercise in futility?"

if the kingdom is already here, every kingdom on earth is of earth. there is the body of Messiah on earth currently. All you did with all my points was overlook them

I have 2 questions for you,

if the kingdom is already on earth how will the Messiah return? and what will eternity be?

zone · Sep 4, 2013

Hizikyah said:

the "cosmic christ" people teach,
exactly what the masons teach,
and very new agey.

why? because we believe Jesus Returns and Judges the world and the the saints live eternally with Him?

like....the cosmic christ ppl say they have some dumb ascended christ-like whoever they worship - big deal

- Ben Creme (that nutty guy)
masons worship JahBuLon (GAOTU) - satan.
and the new agers are mystics and hippies

i'm an old hippy....but come on - i don't wear a hood and a noose; swear oaths; roll up a pant leg; making a slashing throat motion; shuffle around on a checkerboard floor and slam back scotch every Tuesday night. and i don't curse Jesus in the dark and manipulate Islam from behind the scenes.

i don't practice Yoga or Lectio Divina or pretend i'm a prophet.

i just believe God loved the world in this way:

He gave His only Son to die so that i might be reconciled to Him, since my sin has been taken away.
and we have to carry the same Good news to everybody - right now.
because His wrath remains on those who do not believe in His Son.

and then the end will come.

goodnight, friend

Hizikyah · Sep 4, 2013

zone said:

the "cosmic christ" people teach,
exactly what the masons teach,
and very new agey.

why? because we believe Jesus Returns and Judges the world and the the saints live eternally with Him?

like....the cosmic christ ppl say they have some dumb ascended christ-like whoever they worship - big deal

- Ben Creme (that nutty guy)
masons worship JahBuLon (GAOTU) - satan.
and the new agers are mystics and hippies

i'm an old hippy....but come on - i don't wear a hood and a noose; swear oaths; roll up a pant leg; making a slashing throat motion; shuffle around on a checkerboard floor and slam back scotch every Tuesday night. and i don't curse Jesus in the dark and manipulate Islam from behind the scenes.

i don't practice Yoga or Lectio Divina or pretend i'm a prophet.

i just believe God loved the world in this way:

He gave His only Son to die so that i might be reconciled to Him, since my sin has been taken away.
and we have to carry the same Good news to everybody - right now.
because His wrath remains on those who do not believe in His Son.

and then the end will come.

goodnight, friend

LOL that gave me a sincere laugh, not mockingly.

the reason I said that is because their main focal point of their endtime doctrine says that the kingdom is already on earth, and this paves the way for the anti-Messiah to slip right into the stage they have set for him.

zone · Sep 4, 2013

Hizikyah said:

ok....so will you be duped by any false christ?

will he be jewish? islamic? a fallen angel? Obama?

Jesus said (in greek btw - ask Angela, since i'm still too lazy to learn it

) - not possible by any means, in any way, at all for His elect to be deceived - He won't allow it. but the lying stuff is already duping millions. doesn't take much apparently.

see, i don't expect anything other than the skies rolling back in burning fire and the Glorified Christ coming and EVERYBODY knowing who it is.

some guy in a robe in Jerusalem or NY snapping his fingers and causing a stir ....t'ain't nuthin.
just politiks as usual.

k.....truly.
goodnight.

à demain, Lord willing.

Kerry · Sep 4, 2013

Y'all keep saying the end will come. Nowhere in bible doesn't say there is an end. where do y'all get this stuff from? Lot a folks think that when Jesus returns thats it, but what about God's promise to King David that he would have a son to sit on the throne of Israel forever. Did God miss it, I don't think so.

doulos · Sep 4, 2013

Hizikyah said:

To the best of my knowledge you have not shown a single verse that contradicts the following verses;
Rev 1:6 And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen
Rev 5:10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.
Being a fallible human being it is possible that I overlooked the verses that supposedly contradict those, would you be kind enough to show us the verses that supposedly contradict the verses I quoted? If Scripture contradicted Scripture wouldn’t that make God a liar? Aren’t the Scriptures the inspired Word of God? How can an unchanging God (Mal3:6 and Heb13:8) contradict Himself?

Can you provide an example of where in Scripture God or Jesus spoke of future events in the past tense?

Then why did you complain that I did not address the points you raise? For starters may I suggest you review post 95 where I did address the points you made in post 73. Being a fallible human its possible that I overlooked something. Please feel free to readdress something I did not reply to.

Same thread same discussion.

No you have not addressed the verse nor have you addressed it in a manner that points to the truth. Let’s take a look at the verse in question again.

Mar 9:1 And he said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That there be some of them that stand here, which shall not taste of death, till they have seen the kingdom of God come with power.
For the above verse to be true either the kingdom of God came with power long ago or there are some people over 1900 years old that have not died. You claim that the kingdom of God is still future. For your statement to be true either Christ lied or there are some people alive today that are over 1900 years old. Which is it? Did Christ lie or are there some people still alive that are over 1900 years old?

Sure you can use Scripture show, us the Scripture that tells us about the antichrist’s kingdom. But not some doctrinally based argument that makes a beast or the man of sin some ficticous antichrist that rules the world in the end times.

Please learn to use quote boxes and quote me in my entirety. The way you do this makes it difficult to follow. If you don’t know how to use quote boxes to break someone’s post down to address the individual points raised shoot me a pm and I’ll try to explain it to you when time allows which might take a week or so as I am waiting on a phone call to find out if I need to go out of town first thing in the morning (please note I said try, I’m not the best at explaining computer stuff LOL). Could you please rephrase whatever it is you are asking here? May I ask if English is your native tongue?

Mat 24:30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

Eternity, which has no beginning or end.

Why do you believe that Christ must be present here on earth during the millennial reign instead of seated at the right hand of the Father? Have you forgotten that we were given the keys to the kingdom and it is up to us (those who have been made kings and priests) to rule until He returns?
Mat 16:19 And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.

Proof of a Future Millennial Kingdom

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