sunday worship is it just tradition ?

[john832]

Galatians 3
King James Version (KJV)
3 O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you?
2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?
3 Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?
4 Have ye suffered so many things in vain? if it be yet in vain.
5 He therefore that ministereth to you the Spirit, and worketh miracles among you, doeth he it by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?
6 Even as Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.
7 Know ye therefore that they which are of faith, the same are the children of Abraham.
8 And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed.
9 So then they which be of faith are blessed with faithful Abraham.
10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.
11 But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith.
12 And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them.
13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:
14 That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.
15 Brethren, I speak after the manner of men; Though it be but a man's covenant, yet if it be confirmed, no man disannulleth, or addeth thereto.
16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.
17 And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect.
18 For if the inheritance be of the law, it is no more of promise: but God gave it to Abraham by promise.
19 Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator.
20 Now a mediator is not a mediator of one, but God is one.
21 Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law.
22 But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe.
23 But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.
24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.
26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.


Adam and Eve did not need to rest on the seventh day.
Genesis does not command anyone to keep the Sabbath.
Jews understood that Abraham did not keep the Sabbath.
God called the seventh day holy, but he did not command it as a day of rest until the days of Moses.

Hmmm, then how did this misprint get into the Bible?

Gen 26:5 Because that Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws.

Can you guess what the word for Law is here? I won't keep you in suspense...

H8451
תּרה תּורה
tôrâh tôrâh
to-raw', to-raw'
From H3384; a precept or statute, especially the Decalogue or Pentateuch: - law.

The Ten Commandments were not thought up on Mt. Sinai...

Rom 4:15 Because the law worketh wrath: for where no law is, there is no transgression.

Rom 5:13 (For until the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law.
Rom 5:14 Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come.

Now why do you suppose death reigned from Adam to Moses?

Rom 6:23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

And we just read that there is no sin where there is no Law. By the way, what is sin?

1Jn 3:4 Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.

 

[Kingdom_Mystic]

What I don't understand is how Christian literalists can say Jesus was in the grave three days based on their own traditions? How can you call Christ dying on a Friday and raising on a Sunday three days??? Its only ONE AND HALF days. Yet, they are so literalistic on creation being SIX 24 HOUR days. In order to be true to scripture and the Passover festival Christ was crucified on Wednesday not Friday as tradition would have you believe then Christ rose on Sunday morning!

 

[john832]

What I don't understand is how Christian literalists can say Jesus was in the grave three days based on their own traditions? How can you call Christ dying on a Friday and raising on a Sunday three days??? Its only ONE AND HALF days. Yet, they are so literalistic on creation being SIX 24 HOUR days. In order to be true to scripture and the Passover festival Christ was crucified on Wednesday not Friday as tradition would have you believe then Christ rose on Sunday morning!

I don't believe in a Good Friday/Ishtar Sunday myth. Christ was crucified on the Passover, 31 AD. Buried just at sunset and the arose three days and three nights later on Sabbath afternoon at about sunset.

 

[Hizikyah]

I don't believe in a Good Friday/Ishtar Sunday myth. Christ was crucified on the Passover, 31 AD. Buried just at sunset and the arose three days and three nights later on Sabbath afternoon at about sunset.

 

[Hizikyah]

Oh wait you mean to tell me the SUN died on THEIR cross? And was reborn Dec 25?

Oh than this makes perfect sense now:
IHS = Isis, Horus, Seb the egyptian trinity

So thats what they mean by SUNday service?

 

[john832]

*The truth of the three days and nights*
(Rather than copy and paste the above)

Very nicely done and 100% accurate.

 

[john832]

Oh wait you mean to tell me the SUN died on THEIR cross? And was reborn Dec 25?

Oh than this makes perfect sense now:
IHS = Isis, Horus, Seb the egyptian trinity

So thats what they mean by SUNday service?

That is EXACTLY what they mean!

 

[Hizikyah]

Very nicely done and 100% accurate.

When I found out I had been lied to I set out to find the truth, and the truth does set you free.

I love yahshua and I love Yahweh so I felt I must:

Yahchanan (John) 4:24, "Yahweh is a Spirit Being ; and those who worship Him bmust worship Him in Spirit and in truth."

 

[Hizikyah]

That is EXACTLY what they mean!

Right, I mean could it even be any clearer? All the SUN idols, crazy right in everyones face.

 

[john832]

When I found out I had been lied to I set out to find the truth, and the truth does set you free.

I love yahshua and I love Yahweh so I felt I must:

Yahchanan (John) 4:24, "Yahweh is a Spirit Being ; and those who worship Him bmust worship Him in Spirit and in truth."

Yep, during my very early years I was a Methodist. They believe the same hogwash.

 

[cfultz3]

Tannar,

What do you make of post 313?

 

[TannarDarr]

From another thread:



What then is the purpose of being chastised by the Lord if we do not give into temptations (sin)?

Ask GOD that's HIS purview. Why do you focus on the "chastising" and ignore all the other ways you are led by God? AND why do you think it's all about sin? You are so scared of sin and judgement you can't see the purpose of the Gospel. I don't mean that nearly as catty as it sounds.

18 There is no fear in love; but perfect love casts out fear, because fear [e]involves punishment, and the one who fears is not perfected in love.

Are you saying the Lord will chastise His children when they did nothing wrong?

Why are you building this strawman? Do you have a straw fetish? It doesn't warrant an answer, because there is nothing indicating any reason for you to ask the question. Why do you not like watermelon with horse raddish on it? ANd do you realize what that has to do with the conversatioN? About the same as your question has. You are griping at me over what GALATIANS 5:16 says. TAKE IT UP WITH GAL 5:16, not me. Do you realize what you are doing?

I show you scripture and interpret it with reasoning and taking the verse literally.

YOUR REBUTTAL is not to question my interpretation of what the verse means, but attempt to change the subject. TAKE THE VERSE and show me how it can mean anything other than what I said. THEN show me how what I claimed is wrong. THEN you have an argument. As it sits now, you are arguing PAUL WAS WRONG.

BTW, your chastisement comes at judgement, why do you act like it's on earth during maturation? eheehehe... man...

Does God only teach once or is He merciful?

What does merciful have to do with anything? His mercy isn't in question, what is the matter with you. Are you going to talk EVER about what I said, or is all your comments going to be strawmen you make up and burn in effigy of my explanations?

Paul shows Titus one of the steps TO MATURATION/PERFECT/TELIOO. It takes nothing from my position, just adds definition TO it.

Why would the Lord chastise and flog us if we do not sin?

He wouldn't.l WHY are you so interested in being spanked? WHY are you focused ONLY on the sin? IF YOU WILL NOTE THE VERSE ABOVE, by focusing on the love you are made mature. If you fear sin (*which you show repeatedly you do) then you are not yet mature. You have a choice. You can continue to fight sin to appease God, and you think that wins you approval of Him, OR YOU CAN FOCUS ON LEARNING TO LOVE as God instructed, and never fear sin again.

You are having God correcting us and whipping us for no reason at all by saying that they who are led by the Spirit (the children of God) do not sin (give into temptation).

No I'm not, you are building a ridiculous strawman, and trying to denigrate my thoughts with something I never presented or said. You try to imply it must be that way, which makes it also a false dilemma.

Generally, people do those fallacies because they are either uneducated in logic/argument; or because they had nothing to refute the actual comments/arguments made.

I encourage you to NOT run from what I said, and to actually read it, understand it, examine the scripture for it, test the scripture and see if it COULD be represented as I said, and then ARGUE WHAT I SAID, not your fantasy.

 

[TannarDarr]

most of those listed here have nothing to do with the Scriptures, they are Jewish tradition

Mark 7:7-9, "But in vain do they worship Me, teaching as doctrine the commandments of men. For laying aside the Law of Yahweh, you hold the tradition of men! Then He said to them: How well you reject the Law of Yahweh, so that you
may keep your own tradition!"

Yahweh's Sabbaths are

The 7th day Sabbath (Exodus 20:8-11)

and the "High" Sabbaths

Passover
Feast of Unleavend Bread
Feast of Weeks
Feast of Trumpets (all found in Leviticus 23)
Day of Atonement
Feast of Tabernacles
The Last great Day

You think the Jews of Paul's day didn't have tradition?

The point was, Paul's conversation was not about THE Sabbath.

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

What I don't understand is how Christian literalists can say Jesus was in the grave three days based on their own traditions? How can you call Christ dying on a Friday and raising on a Sunday three days??? Its only ONE AND HALF days. Yet, they are so literalistic on creation being SIX 24 HOUR days. In order to be true to scripture and the Passover festival Christ was crucified on Wednesday not Friday as tradition would have you believe then Christ rose on Sunday morning!

Christ most likely died on a Weds. and was raised sometime early Sunday at the end of the sabbath. weds/thurs, thurs/fri, fri/sat = 3 days.

 

[cfultz3]

Ask GOD that's HIS purview. Why do you focus on the "chastising" and ignore all the other ways you are led by God? AND why do you think it's all about sin? You are so scared of sin and judgement you can't see the purpose of the Gospel. I don't mean that nearly as catty as it sounds.

18 There is no fear in love; but perfect love casts out fear, because fear [e]involves punishment, and the one who fears is not perfected in love.




Why are you building this strawman? Do you have a straw fetish? It doesn't warrant an answer, because there is nothing indicating any reason for you to ask the question. Why do you not like watermelon with horse raddish on it? ANd do you realize what that has to do with the conversatioN? About the same as your question has. You are griping at me over what GALATIANS 5:16 says. TAKE IT UP WITH GAL 5:16, not me. Do you realize what you are doing?

I show you scripture and interpret it with reasoning and taking the verse literally.

YOUR REBUTTAL is not to question my interpretation of what the verse means, but attempt to change the subject. TAKE THE VERSE and show me how it can mean anything other than what I said. THEN show me how what I claimed is wrong. THEN you have an argument. As it sits now, you are arguing PAUL WAS WRONG.

BTW, your chastisement comes at judgement, why do you act like it's on earth during maturation? eheehehe... man...



What does merciful have to do with anything? His mercy isn't in question, what is the matter with you. Are you going to talk EVER about what I said, or is all your comments going to be strawmen you make up and burn in effigy of my explanations?

Paul shows Titus one of the steps TO MATURATION/PERFECT/TELIOO. It takes nothing from my position, just adds definition TO it.



He wouldn't.l WHY are you so interested in being spanked? WHY are you focused ONLY on the sin? IF YOU WILL NOTE THE VERSE ABOVE, by focusing on the love you are made mature. If you fear sin (*which you show repeatedly you do) then you are not yet mature. You have a choice. You can continue to fight sin to appease God, and you think that wins you approval of Him, OR YOU CAN FOCUS ON LEARNING TO LOVE as God instructed, and never fear sin again.



No I'm not, you are building a ridiculous strawman, and trying to denigrate my thoughts with something I never presented or said. You try to imply it must be that way, which makes it also a false dilemma.

Generally, people do those fallacies because they are either uneducated in logic/argument; or because they had nothing to refute the actual comments/arguments made.

I encourage you to NOT run from what I said, and to actually read it, understand it, examine the scripture for it, test the scripture and see if it COULD be represented as I said, and then ARGUE WHAT I SAID, not your fantasy.

Oh boy...you said that those who are led by the Spirit do not give into temptation (sin). And it was shown to you that God chastises/whips those who are His. The question remains: are you saying that God chastises/whips for no reason? Would a physical father whip you because you are a good kid?

 

[TannarDarr]

If you say that they who are led by the Spirit

I don't say it, I repeat it. PAUL said it, your beef is with HIM. ALTHOUGH John also said it but with different phrasing and framing.

do not give into temptation and further say that you give into temptation, are you then saying that you are not led by the Spirit?

I do indeed say I am not INDWELLED by the Spirit yet.

You have two relationships with the Spirit, but only one at a time.

There is a time he works ON YOU, and there is a time he works from IN you.

He works ON YOU, leads you like a horse on a leash (gal 5:18 see Greek on led) to get you there, and a time He is in you and at that point you are no longer in the flesh, your walk is not by the flesh but by the Spirit, and you do not give into temptations of the flesh.

YOU can get off my back, and you can show me I am wrong about scripture. I could give a flying raccoon's smelly flatulence what you believe. You can show me what scripture says.

It says EXACTLY as I have worded it here. You want to imply I am wrong, because I repeat scripture that says something you do not approve of.

Which is wiser, bending your life's walk to fit scripture, OR forcing scripture to adopt your lifestyle?

 

[cfultz3]

I do indeed say I am not INDWELLED by the Spirit yet.

Rom 8:16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:

Rom 8:14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.

So, if you are not "indwelt" with the Spirit, then who tells you that you are a child of God?

If you are not "indwelt" with the Spirit, then neither are you a son of God....

 

[TannarDarr]

First, you abbreviated cuss words in other threads,

Do you know what a CURSE is in the Bible? I have used nothing that can't be used before 7:00 PM prime time TV. Also, the words used, expressed exactly the proper thought. I have not used language inappropriately. BUT just to give you something to chew on, PAUL wrote a letter where he used the most base and vulgar word for Fecal waste his language had available at the time.

now you are being too bold. You are pushing the limit.....you can relay a message without offensive speech.

Ok, I get it. You have no clue what to say about PAUL'S WORDS, so you want to attack me on character. We have a word in the ENglish language for people that do things like that.

Does not Scripture say love your enemies?

EXCUSE ME? WHERE ARE YOU COMING FROM? DO YOU HAVE THE WRONG MUSHROOMS IN YOUR OMELLETTE? Do yo have some narcissistic fantasy that I can't love someone and be ANGRY TOO? You are nuts man. You have forsaken the conversation, and attacked the person. That's wrong.

And you would allow me and Zone to walk off a cliff? That is very xian of you. Put a little Christ in your walk and be a Christian.

I Iseous Jesus' name.
X Christos, Jesus' title
O (nearly theta) for theos for God.
Y For Son.
E for Savior.

Jesus Christ, God, Son, Savior. The little fish on your key chain and bumper sticker that you think is cute has a history. People died for Christ because they were found using that to identify themselves to other believers. <IXOYE>< In Greek it's Ikthys or FISH. <><

You want to make an issue over me using Xian? You have no clue the souls you insult with your attempt to discredit me.

Fluftz, do you have anything to say about the scripture, or are you just going to take cowardly pot shots at me?

 

[TannarDarr]

Galatians 3

29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

What do you think this chapter reveals?

Adam and Eve did not need to rest on the seventh day.

Then why did GOD make the day holy? Something is made HOLY for man to recognize. GOD didn't need any reminder to remember the day. Genesis 2 the day was made holy. Let me ask you, do you suggest that GOD pays HOMAGE to things HE declares as HOLY? Heheheh He's GOD, HE pays HOMAGE TO NOTHING!

HOLY is for man's recognition. Adam and Eve were all of mankind. OF COURSE they kept the Sabbath. You saw what happened when they disobeyed GOD, since they were still there past the seventh day, you can assume they kept it.

Genesis does not command anyone to keep the Sabbath.

snorts. It doesn't say you have to OBEY GOD either. It just says there will be consequences if you don't. DO you think the JEWISH PEOPLE, as a whole, treated things that were declared "HOLY" differently?

Now, MOSES showed that something HOLY was different and set apart. GOD lived in the ark, It wasn't something GOD couldn't touch nor could GOD pay Homage to, as it was a reminder of HIM.
GOD made that day HOLY.

Who wrote that GOd made the day HOLY?
WhAT did that mean to the author? OF COURSE IT WAS A COMMAND. You have to just ignore all of Jewish History to think the day being declared HOLY had no meaning.

Jews understood that Abraham did not keep the Sabbath.

Where do you support that presumption from?

God called the seventh day holy, but he did not command it as a day of rest until the days of Moses.

What does HOLY MEAN? WHy do you think Moses showed GOD RESTED on the Sabbath then when he was writing the Jewish people's Histories?

God didn't say you can't look at porn either. if we are not going to read for comprehension, just for lists of dos and don'ts, then PORN must be a do.

IF your spouse (assuming there..) deliberately and knowingly ignored your birthday, and your anniversary, and Christmas, even though YOU gave him gifts, would you feel loved?

If not, and you ignore the Sabbath, a day GOD made HOLY for us to remember Him, how much do you love Him? That's a fair question, and I am NOT intending you to be challenged on your faith, this is for example's only....

 

[TannarDarr]

. Christian worship is therefore a CELEBRATION OF LIFE, rather than a mourning of death (we wear an empty cross, rather than the Catholics' depiction of Christ still dead, and on the cross). And, as Christ began His new role in service on the first day of the week, Christians, also, minister on the first day of the week. Paul instructed the Corinthian church to make a collection on the first day of the week (I Corinthians 16:2), the day of their weekly worship.

So, tell me, WHY did Christ defend the Sabbath Day and the covenant it was but ONE part of so many times in the Bible if HE intended

And, who, on Earth, decided a covenant issued FROM GOD, authored BY GOD, could be edited by MAN?

AND, do you think that person or people are resting well in their Graves knowing God approves of their job as editor?