Attack of the seventh day adventists

[Josh321]

come to think about it that is why so many people stop from being a christian... how dare can someone tell another person to come follow this law when the person is still in the flesh, it's sad how this man made theology leading thousands away to their damnation, the worst part is i can't even help my adventist friends.. because of how brain washed they are all i can do is pray for them, some time back he came and told me " Josh i want to change " and was asking me how i was able to drastically change like this then he began to tell me that he is addicted to sex and drinking and can't stop, then i told him that is why we must be born again he didn't fully understand what i meant by that, but lets take a look at this..

17 Thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's house, thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's wife, nor his manservant, nor his maidservant, nor his ox, nor his ass, nor any thing that is thy neighbour's.

alot of people are gonna to have to anwser for this.. how dare CAN ANYONE tell another person come follow this? it's ridiculous...and pittyful actually i see all of my friends and can't do nothing to help them if i as much as try to talk to them and say such and such they won't even listen to me because it isn't an adventist theory i'm telling them, my other friend also i was asking him ( i knew of course but was just asking him ) how does someone know they are saved, then he replied and told me i don't know no one does, and this same person is addicted to lust, do you think this is right? to mislead people like this? alot of people will be judged for that...

 

[Josh321]

But doesn't Jesus say pretty plainly that you are to do the Law and to teach others to do it?

now tell me this if the bible states that we the gentiles do the things by nature contained in the law, then who is this meant for? think about it

 

[Hizikyah]

i will copy paste what i previously wroted above in hopes that you may anwser it

none of you are also yet to anwser my question 9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work: what about the children? there is no age limit on this should 12 years old quit school and start LABOURING DOING HARD PHYSICAL work? or what about if someone is crippled and can't walk and in a wheel chair should this person have to do PHYSICAL HARD LABOUR WORK AS WELL? or did you all forget this is in the commandment? oh yea i forgot once you keep the sabbath everything else doesn't matter right? what about when we become older and reach an age where our bones are old and we can't do much should this person still labour 6 days a week, what about me i applied for a job at 6 places and didn't get the job, open your eyes people... stop blinding yourselves

6 days doesnt mean you have to work for ceasar at the iron mill paying taxes, this could be mow the lawn, do laundry, walk the lambs (i think they do that?) vacum, etc etc etc

your looking at this with a pharisees eye, dont take that as an offence, just consider Yahweh made these Laws as righteous trainers, not mean old rules.

 

[KohenMatt]

This is a key point of that parable: that perfection is achieved by following Christ, not the law.

Exactly! Well said!

 

[john832]

First off, I can't help but to notice how you left off what Jesus said in verse 17. Verse 17 puts the rest into it's proper context:


By taking things out of context, one can put a spin on things. Ask yourself this" Paul did away with circumcision which is a part of the law. So did Paul violate verses 18 and 19 of Matt. 5?" He did, didn't he? In Galations 5 Paul very clearly states that circumcision has no place in Christianity. So by your own twisted Pharisaical thinking, Paul must be counted as least in the kingdom of God as Paul did away with part of the law---OR Jesus meant something else entirely different.

If we are to interpret Matt 5:17-19 we must first understand what Jesus meant by "fullfill". If we only read verses 18 and 19 then by all means lets adhere to all 619 Jewish laws, fully embrace all Jewish rituals, start observing circumcision, Sabbath, Passover, all dietary restrictions and toss out the New Testament teachings on grace too.

So do me a favor and next time you quote scripture, please quote it in it's proper context. Otherwise you are guilty of twisting it and creating new doctrines that God does not embrace.

Hmmm,

G4137
πληρόω
plēroō
play-ro'-o
From G4134; to make replete, that is, (literally) to cram (a net), level up (a hollow), or (figuratively) to furnish (or imbue, diffuse, influence), satisfy, execute (an office), finish (a period or task), verify (or coincide with a prediction), etc.: - accomplish, X after, (be) complete, end, expire, fill (up), fulfil, (be, make) full (come), fully preach, perfect, supply.

G4137
πληρόω
plēroō
Thayer Definition:
1) to make full, to fill up, i.e. to fill to the full
1a) to cause to abound, to furnish or supply liberally
1a1) I abound, I am liberally supplied
2) to render full, i.e. to complete
2a) to fill to the top: so that nothing shall be wanting to full measure, fill to the brim
2b) to consummate: a number
2b1) to make complete in every particular, to render perfect
2b2) to carry through to the end, to accomplish, carry out, (some undertaking)
2c) to carry into effect, bring to realisation, realise
2c1) of matters of duty: to perform, execute
2c2) of sayings, promises, prophecies, to bring to pass, ratify, accomplish
2c3) to fulfil, i.e. to cause God’s will (as made known in the law) to be obeyed as it should be, and God’s promises (given through the prophets) to receive fulfilment
Part of Speech: verb
A Related Word by Thayer’s/Strong’s Number: from G4134
Citing in TDNT: 6:286, 867

Now that you have brought this up, perhaps you can show us where in the defintions of the word fulfill, it means no longer applicable, or not to be done? No longer used?

Or perhaps you might want to take your own advice.

 

[danschance]

I apologize for leaving out the 1 verse I've quoted dozens of times in this thread alone.

So are you saying that this 1 word "fulfill" negates the following concepts that Jesus said?
1) “Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets (insert your 1 word argument, "fulfill" here.
2) until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished.
3) Therefore anyone who sets aside one of the least of these commands and teaches others accordingly will be called least in the kingdom of heaven
4) but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

So Jesus say's he fulfilled the Law. OK, but He also said He didn't come to abolish it. Then He said the Law won't disappear. Then He said you should do the Law. Then He said you should teach others to do it.

4-1. That's 4 Pro-Law remarks vs. your 1 "fulfill"

Like I said before. If you think all Jewish laws are still in effect because of verse 18 and 19, than Paul is wrong on circumcision and he is wrong on grace, wrong on the law. Then you must FULLY observe all Jewish laws(Obey the Sabbath, Obey circumcision, obey animal sacrifice, obey all Jewish dietary restrictions, obey the law of not wearing clothing made of mixed fibers, obey the law of tithing, etc, etc, etc...) Other wise you are a liar and/or a hypocrite. You can't tell me the law is still in effect and not obey it. You must observe all of it, if it is still in effect.

 

[john832]

now tell me this if the bible states that we the gentiles do the things by nature contained in the law, then who is this meant for? think about it

Does it mean you do everything contrary to the Law?

 

[KohenMatt]

now tell me this if the bible states that we the gentiles do the things by nature contained in the law, then who is this meant for? think about it

These people:

Matthew 5:1 "Now when Jesus saw the crowds, he went up on a mountainside and sat down. His disciples came to him,2 and he began to teach them."

 

[Josh321]

6 days doesnt mean you have to work for ceasar at the iron mill paying taxes, this could be mow the lawn, do laundry, walk the lambs (i think they do that?) vacum, etc etc etc

your looking at this with a pharisees eye, dont take that as an offence, just consider Yahweh made these Laws as righteous trainers, not mean old rules.

so i can wash the dishes and that's it? interesting. let's see what the word labour means work, esp. hard physical work.[COLOR=#878787 !important][/COLOR]
[COLOR=#878787 !important]"the price of repairs includes labor and parts"[/COLOR]
[TABLE="class: vk_tbl vk_gy"]
[TR]
[TD="class: lr_dct_nyms_ttl"]synonyms:[/TD]
[TD]work, hard work, toil, exertion, industry, drudgery, effort, menial work;[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]


[h=3]Mark 16:15[/h]King James Version (KJV)

15 And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.



wonder how you will do this, since your too busy working 6 days for the rest of your life

 

[Josh321]

Does it mean you do everything contrary to the Law?

how many times we going to go over this..? i couldn't do anything in the law because it was by our nature( the gentiles ) to do the things contained in the law but through christ Jesus he set me free and made me a new creature so i'm not longer under the yoke of sin because he made me a new creature [h=3]2 Corinthians 5:17[/h]King James Version (KJV)

17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.


but you won't truly understand this because you too busy putting something else in the way instead of seeking out God for understand but this is the laodicea age people just lock Jesus out and worship in vain but he is always knocking just waiting for whoever to hear to open the door

 

[john2ghost]

Oh Hades, I can't read all these posts. First page was "Attack of the 7th Day," by Adventists? But biblical speaking, 7 Days a week is a a sign of what? Seven days a week...I wonder who came up with that? a pretty smart caveman? maybe a real smart monkey? or something found recorded in a book? from way back when? 7 Days a week is a sign of God...or maybe you know more than that?

So...7 Days a week...around and around it goes.
Every 7th Day is Sabbath, a rest with God, set aside.
Every 7th Day Sabbath...it is, it just is. A day of rest. Seven days a week.

Then comes along Sunday, 1st Day of the week, a new Sabbath.
And this was wrought about by the the kings and the churches.
A new sabbath born in confusion, as if 8 Days a week. Since the Day of the Sun was on the 4th Day, Wednesday, they missed it that Day and catch it second time around: Sunday...every 4th Day, two four day weeks = 8 Days a week Sunday sabbath? I guess that makes sense.

First Day of the Week, right after God's Sabbath, a new sabbath. No longer seven days a week...but who are we fooling? Sunday sabbath is a tradition of men. Seventh day Sabbath since time began, and still spinning in alignment as if the word of God.

8 days a week, how does it go for you...8 days a week? a little out of alignment?

Why would I want two four day weeks, rest every second week? or do you think the sun was made on the first day of the week? Nothing before the day of the sun? that the day of the sun was the first day? traditions of men.

Well...seven days a week still agrees with me. And many deceivers have ran off to some phony-christ without those 7 Spirits in his right hand. Those 7 Spirits that come from those 4 Spirits that go forward from before the face of the Lord: "Let there be light," Daylight, Darkness, Dusk, and Dawn. Four seven spirits even unto seven days a week...those 7 Spirits in the right hand of Christ. Whom is soon to appear, and for good, or for evil your reward is with him...

No thanks, you just give silly reasons to keep a Sunday sabbath. Look around you...how does it look to be going for you...8 days a week? So great you say? But here I am heading another way...

Daylight, Darkness.
Dusk and Dawn.
Four ends of all the earth.
Like 4 Wild Asses,
And days gone by like so many herds of wild horses.

Day after day,
Week after week,
Seven days a week,
Like seven candlesticks on one lamp stand,
Just like those seven spirits in his right hand.
Day after day,
I will choose that 7th Day alignment.
That sign of God.


So...I just guess that we don't see things the same. Not eye to eye.
Well...here's to today, and to looking back and to turning away. Why discuss anything? We all have the word of God. And sometimes understanding is not perceivable.

SSS# = 666# = $$$# = for the buying and selling of merchandise on a WorldWideWeb of commerce.
The taxing system of the kings, and they that serve this system have no rest day or night, and the voice of the Lamb will no longer be heard in them, this beast kingdom of wars, greed, and deception...all 8 Days a week, I suppose.

 

[Hizikyah]

how many times we going to go over this..? i couldn't do anything in the law because it was by our nature( the gentiles ) to do the things contained in the law but through christ Jesus he set me free and made me a new creature so i'm not longer under the yoke of sin because he made me a new creature 2 Corinthians 5:17

King James Version (KJV)

17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.


but you won't truly understand this because you too busy putting something else in the way instead of seeking out God for understand but this is the laodicea age people just lock Jesus out and worship in vain but he is always knocking just waiting for whoever to hear to open the door

the yoke of sin is the BREAKING of the Law not the KEEPING of the Law, where are you getting this doctrine from?

Romans
7:7What? Can anyone therefore say that the Law is sin? No! By no means! But to the contrary, I did not know sin;( transgression of the Law), except through the Law, for I did not know lust, unless the Law had said: Do not covet.

7:12Therefore the Law is holy, and the commandments are holy, and just, and righteous.

 

[danschance]

Hmmm,

Now that you have brought this up, perhaps you can show us where in the defintions of the word fulfill, it means no longer applicable, or not to be done? No longer used?

Or perhaps you might want to take your own advice.

Right, you are so right...wow, I have been so wrong. Oh my goodness me......

I am going to see my doctor about getting circumcised and ignoring the evil person called Paul who said Circumcision is obsolete. I will only buy kosher food, I will never wear clothing made from mixed fibers, I will tithe 10% and that includes the tomatoes I grow. I am going to observe all Jewish days like the Sabbath and Passover. Which means I will make sure there is no mold in my house before Passover.

I will tell my pastor he is wrong to preach grace. He must preach the law! I will rip out every page in the new testament that says the law is fulfilled or we are under that huge lie of grace!!! I hate Paul now because I realize he is the least of all humanity by claiming that ridiculous concept of grace!!!!

Right? Don't you agree? The law is still the law and Jesus would never undo a law, right??

 

[john832]

Who has so confused you that you believe grace and obedience are mutually exclusive? Grace is what God holds our for us when we are disobedient. When we slip and fall, Christ offers grace to justify us and forgive us and reconcile us to the Father.

 

[KohenMatt]

The law is still the law and Jesus would never undo a law, right??

Right.

Malachi 3:6 "I the Lord do not change."
Hebrews 3:8 "Jesus Christ is the same yesterday and today and forever."

 

[danschance]

Who has so confused you that you believe grace and obedience are mutually exclusive? Grace is what God holds our for us when we are disobedient. When we slip and fall, Christ offers grace to justify us and forgive us and reconcile us to the Father.

Actually, I am just trying to show you how ridiculous it is to try and claim the mosaic laws should still be observed today. The shed blood of Christ, the perfect sacrifice ended the rule of law and did away with observing the mosaic laws. Saying that even one Mosaic law is still in effect is just plain stupid.

 

[danschance]

Right.

Malachi 3:6 "I the Lord do not change."
Hebrews 3:8 "Jesus Christ is the same yesterday and today and forever."

If you can't discern a lie, how will you determine the truth?

 

[Hizikyah]

Mr Danschance, can you tell me the literal meaning of the term "mystery of iniquity"

concordance/lexicon wise

 

[KohenMatt]

If you can't discern a lie, how will you determine the truth?

Sorry, but I don't know what you're getting at here.

 

[john832]

Actually, I am just trying to show you how ridiculous it is to try and claim the mosaic laws should still be observed today. The shed blood of Christ, the perfect sacrifice ended the rule of law and did away with observing the mosaic laws. Saying that even one Mosaic law is still in effect is just plain stupid.

Hmmm, this is really meant out of love, you should really reconsider these types of statements. After all...

Exo 20:1 And God spake all these words, saying,

And we know that this is the One who became Jesus Christ. To say that it is stupid to say these Laws are still in effect after Christ said...

Luk 16:17 And it is easier for heaven and earth to pass, than one tittle of the law to fail.

Seems to put you on very dangerous ground.