Jesus and the Bible

[Bowman]

Largest growing religion in the world! Don't be mad

No.

Islam is the fast declining religion in the world.

 

[Bowman]

Mystical creatures like demons..that's a pagan belief. As is the idea that God has a son.

The authors of the Koran differ with you...

 

[Bowman]

The Koran contains at least nine suras named in honor of the Devil and his demons:

• Sura 1 “The Opening”….named in honor of Satan
• Sura 16 “The Swarm”…named in honor of demons
• Sura 31 “The Devourer”…named in honor of Satan
• Sura 44 “The Rising Evil”…named in honor of demons
• Sura 72 “The Demons”…named in honor of demons
• Sura 100 “The Horses of the Warriors”…named in honor of demons
• Sura 104 “The Accuser”…named in honor of Satan
• Sura 113 “Hell”…named in honor of Satan
• Sura 114 “The People”…named in honor of Satan

Thus, one must have to wonder exactly why a “holy” book would give honor to the devil and his demons in the first place……right?

 

[Bowman]

The Koran even has some chapters narrated by demons!

 

[Deadtosin]

Buddhists and hi she claim to be enlightened and at peace too. Meaning people of different religions which may or not be true claim to have feelings of being happy through their religion. Which goes to show the power of belief in general. Mehar you felt is not an indication of Christianity being the religon of God and that goes for people of other religion as well. The true peace can only be found through Islam

feeling? no sir, I was blinded on the side of a highway by a homeless man dressed in tattered robes. For three days my friends and I had dreams that manifested into reality, there were 5 of us involved. one of which was blinded beside me by the homeless man. Just before he tranced out and said "THUS SAYS THE LORD" he was telling us how he left his life behind 30 years before. I can't help you to see the truth of what I'm telling you. But I can and will pray for you and everybody else.

 

[Tintin]

Where are the at least intelligent Christians at?

So far I've gotten lower tier people who have been left to get false translations instead of actual ones..which is just weird

This and your post above it indicate you think Christians are stupid. You didn't say it outright (use the word 'stupid') but your manner and defensive nature strongly imply that you think we are.

 

[Angela53510]

Angela it's clear there's anger and hate in your tone. Like I stated in my post i only come here to arrive at what's true. No brownie points. I'm here in my own to discuss and live in tolerance and peace. Obviously that doesn't sit well with you.

Sleepy, you totally misunderstood me. I just wanted a honest answer, and I hope I got it. I would much rather discuss religious issues with people who are here freely. I guess you don't know the history of this forum, but we just had some JW's again creating threads and arguing they are right and mainstream Christians are wrong. There was no give and take, which is what it was beginning to sound like with you, which is why I asked. And they used their corrupted New World Living Translation, which is just wrong in the Greek, which I do read. So that is the hornet's nest you walked into!

The only problem is the truth is Jesus Christ, born a man, healed the sick and the lame, preached the gospel to the poor, and asked for repentance and total commitment to those who would follow him.

That is the only truth that really matters - Jesus Christ, crucified on the cross (not Judas in his place) raised from the dead on the third day, seen by many over 500 and ascended to heaven where he sits at the right hand of the Father, interceding for his people day and night.

I was actually delighted you came in. I had hoped we could show you the real Jesus, not the watered down one. I hoped we could discuss the differences between Allah and YHWH, between the Qur'anic Jesus (Isa) and the Biblical Jesus.

I can see that is not happening here. Because you are so resistant to the truth. Jesus told his disciples to wipe the dirt off their sandals and leave if they were not well received.

We received you with love, trying to show you the error of your ways and you turned around and called us false, liars and many other names.

I pray one day you will know that God is love (1 John 4:8,16). I pray you will understand the incarnation of God was a miraculous happening, that saved humanity forever.

I apologize if I seemed harsh. And thank you for answering my question, I was not sure what the motive was!

 

[Sleepy]

Sleepy, you totally misunderstood me. I just wanted a honest answer, and I hope I got it. I would much rather discuss religious issues with people who are here freely. I guess you don't know the history of this forum, but we just had some JW's again creating threads and arguing they are right and mainstream Christians are wrong. There was no give and take, which is what it was beginning to sound like with you, which is why I asked. And they used their corrupted New World Living Translation, which is just wrong in the Greek, which I do read. So that is the hornet's nest you walked into!

The only problem is the truth is Jesus Christ, born a man, healed the sick and the lame, preached the gospel to the poor, and asked for repentance and total commitment to those who would follow him.

That is the only truth that really matters - Jesus Christ, crucified on the cross (not Judas in his place) raised from the dead on the third day, seen by many over 500 and ascended to heaven where he sits at the right hand of the Father, interceding for his people day and night.

I was actually delighted you came in. I had hoped we could show you the real Jesus, not the watered down one. I hoped we could discuss the differences between Allah and YHWH, between the Qur'anic Jesus (Isa) and the Biblical Jesus.

I can see that is not happening here. Because you are so resistant to the truth. Jesus told his disciples to wipe the dirt off their sandals and leave if they were not well received.

We received you with love, trying to show you the error of your ways and you turned around and called us false, liars and many other names.

I pray one day you will know that God is love (1 John 4:8,16). I pray you will understand the incarnation of God was a miraculous happening, that saved humanity forever.

I apologize if I seemed harsh. And thank you for answering my question, I was not sure what the motive was!

You hadn't even addressed any of the single verses in my original post

 

[Sleepy]

This and your post above it indicate you think Christians are stupid. You didn't say it outright (use the word 'stupid') but your manner and defensive nature strongly imply that you think we are.

Tintin, you're lying and being dishonest. That post doesn't imply I think Christians are stupid. I simply said what was true the Christians I've talked to so far are strange because they've been giving false translations of the Quran which normal Christians don't even do when you're having a discussion. If you don't have an open enough mind to understand that than is your problem

 

[Sleepy]

The Koran contains at least nine suras named in honor of the Devil and his demons:

• Sura 1 “The Opening”….named in honor of Satan
• Sura 16 “The Swarm”…named in honor of demons
• Sura 31 “The Devourer”…named in honor of Satan
• Sura 44 “The Rising Evil”…named in honor of demons
• Sura 72 “The Demons”…named in honor of demons
• Sura 100 “The Horses of the Warriors”…named in honor of demons
• Sura 104 “The Accuser”…named in honor of Satan
• Sura 113 “Hell”…named in honor of Satan
• Sura 114 “The People”…named in honor of Satan

Thus, one must have to wonder exactly why a “holy” book would give honor to the devil and his demons in the first place……right?

I'm done replying to you after this post until you want to provide the true English translation of the Quran. You are one sad human being, it's honestly making me laugh...

 

[Rickee]

Hello everybody. Peace be upon all of you. There are many different verses within the Bible. I want to point out a few and discuss what it means in regards to Jesus and Christianity and for all of us to arrive at the truth because we all do know there will be a Day of Judgement.

Mark 13:32
"But of that day and that hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, neither the Son, but the Father."

In Christianity, Jesus is considered God. But the verse is clearly telling Christians that Jesus is not all knowing. It cannot make sense that a being that is being worshiped as a God is not all-knowing. That defeats the purpose of God and basic metaphysics of God. This is besides the fact that one version of the God knows while the other doesn't. Many times Christians will make claims that Jesus and God are physically different but mentally and spiritually the same though for some reason one version of the God doesn't know the last day. Doesn't make sense to me.


Matthew 26:39-42

"And he went a little farther, and fell on his face, and prayed, saying, O my Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me: nevertheless not as I will, but as thou wilt.

40 And he cometh unto the disciples, and findeth them asleep, and saith unto Peter, What, could ye not watch with me one hour?

41 Watch and pray, that ye enter not into temptation: the spirit indeed is willing, but the flesh is weak.

42 He went away again the second time, and prayed, saying, O my Father, if this cup may not pass away from me, except I drink it, thy will be done."

Starting from the beginning. Jesus fell on his face and prayed. Christians do not pray like that though the supposed goal is to model the character of Jesus. The only people that pray in such a manner are Muslims....

Does it make sense that God is going to pray to God and in such a manner where the tone suggests two different Beings?


Original sin.
The fathers shall not be put to death for the children, neither shall the children be put to death for the fathers: every man shall be put to death for his own sin.

Adam did wrong by eating from the tree. How can a physical act of a human being taint the pure and clean souls created by God that go wrong based off the sins they commit. Adam cannot change anything of God's or taint it.


Jesus and laws
God has no bounds. He cannot be bounded. Nothing exists independent of him, everything is dependent on him. He depends on no other. No other can influence or affect him. How can it be that God "has" to do something. He has to eat, he has to pee, he's under influence of gravity, physical laws, being hurt, cut. Nothing can affect him but he affects all.


I look forward to hearing back, Sleepy561

Jesus is the fleshly creation of God (The Son) and God the creator/ The eternal spirit is ( The Father) in the Godhead.

Jesus is the " Express Image" of the Eternal Spirit ( John 4 v 24)

Jesus is God in a fleshly body, and Let' s The Spirit teach us. But he and that Spirit are ONE, and not One of TWO (John 10 v 30)

" My Father ( My Spirit) and I The flesh) are ONE" also read I Timothy 3 v 16:
"........God was manifest in THE FLESH........"

So when you say, " Jesus did not know EVERYTHING" you are in error.

Jesus himself stated: " But the Holy Ghost, whom the Father shall send in my name, Shall teach you ALL things....."

 

[Brother_Don]

Sleepy, you say Jesus was only a prophet like the others, how many of the other prophets, rose from the grave, and hung out with their followers for a while. You also say Paul never met Jesus, Paul was on his knees before Jesus after Saul was knocked off his horse.

 

[Bowman]

Run from the Arabic...

I'm done replying to you after this post until you want to provide the true English translation of the Quran.

Don't be afraid to study the Arabic of your Koran, brother...its an eye opener to say the least...

 

[homwardbound]

Hello everybody. Peace be upon all of you. There are many different verses within the Bible. I want to point out a few and discuss what it means in regards to Jesus and Christianity and for all of us to arrive at the truth because we all do know there will be a Day of Judgement.

Mark 13:32
"But of that day and that hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, neither the Son, but the Father."

In Christianity, Jesus is considered God. But the verse is clearly telling Christians that Jesus is not all knowing. It cannot make sense that a being that is being worshiped as a God is not all-knowing. That defeats the purpose of God and basic metaphysics of God. This is besides the fact that one version of the God knows while the other doesn't. Many times Christians will make claims that Jesus and God are physically different but mentally and spiritually the same though for some reason one version of the God doesn't know the last day. Doesn't make sense to me.


Matthew 26:39-42

"And he went a little farther, and fell on his face, and prayed, saying, O my Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me: nevertheless not as I will, but as thou wilt.

40 And he cometh unto the disciples, and findeth them asleep, and saith unto Peter, What, could ye not watch with me one hour?

41 Watch and pray, that ye enter not into temptation: the spirit indeed is willing, but the flesh is weak.

42 He went away again the second time, and prayed, saying, O my Father, if this cup may not pass away from me, except I drink it, thy will be done."

Starting from the beginning. Jesus fell on his face and prayed. Christians do not pray like that though the supposed goal is to model the character of Jesus. The only people that pray in such a manner are Muslims....

Does it make sense that God is going to pray to God and in such a manner where the tone suggests two different Beings?


Original sin.
The fathers shall not be put to death for the children, neither shall the children be put to death for the fathers: every man shall be put to death for his own sin.

Adam did wrong by eating from the tree. How can a physical act of a human being taint the pure and clean souls created by God that go wrong based off the sins they commit. Adam cannot change anything of God's or taint it.


Jesus and laws
God has no bounds. He cannot be bounded. Nothing exists independent of him, everything is dependent on him. He depends on no other. No other can influence or affect him. How can it be that God "has" to do something. He has to eat, he has to pee, he's under influence of gravity, physical laws, being hurt, cut. Nothing can affect him but he affects all.


I look forward to hearing back, Sleepy561

Jesus's purpose, the work he was Baptized for was to show us Father, through him. Jesus was and is the only perfect flesh that ever walked the face of this earth. The first Adam failed. But Jesus, the second Adam did not Fail. And is by his being justified in the Spirit from God the Father at the resurrection is our only way to Father, since we are in unredeemed flesh here on earth.
It is through Christ's finished work here on earth in the flesh that we who believe are made alive in the Spirit of God by God the Father.
If we are asking God for this new life in God, with just to know God, no other motive involved. God already said through Son that if we seek God's Kingdom above all else, then all of our needs will be supplied.
So then I need to say to me, what are my needs?
Is it a new Job, better money, a good spouse, everyone to like me and many other earth desires.
When in all reality what is it that all want the most? Would it be life everlasting? So how can that be unless we decide to die to self. The seed has no life unless it fall into the ground and die. So are we willing to die to self and be alive to God?
[h=3]Philippians 3:10-11[/h]Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)

[SUP]10 [/SUP]that I may know him, and the power of his resurrection, and the fellowship of his sufferings, being made conformable unto his death; [SUP]11 [/SUP]if by any means I might attain unto the resurrection of the dead.

 

[homwardbound]

Christian's view Jesus as the God-man.

What you have chosen to do is look solely at the scriptures revealing His humanity...to the exclusion of the ones revealing His divinity.

To pursue your line of reason, only, leads to cult status...

1 Timothy 3:16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.

1. John 4:23
   But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.
   John 4:22-24 (in Context) John 4 (Whole Chapter) Other Translations
2. John 4:24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

 

[homwardbound]

"your line of reason" How about the only line of reason. There is no mention in the bible either that Jesus, God the Father, and Holy Trinity are one.

I'm looking at the scriptures that claim to do both when in fact it's contradicting the godness, and proving he's a man. A Prophet of God. Like Abraham, like Moses, like Noah.

John 14:9 Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father?

 

[homwardbound]

God cannot be submitted to any limitations. He is the Greatest. The most Magnificent, the Most Merciful. Humans humble themselves to God. Not the other way around

God can never be subject to death for he is the only constant in a changing universe. He doesn't die, be born. He Is. He always Was. He always Will Be. He doesn't die nor does he age. He doesn't feel pain, he doesn't need food
He needs nothing. Everything needs him

Basic and at the same time logical and clear truth about God that makes sense

He created the Earth. Gravity. Laws of Physics, thermodynamics. They all depend on Him. He can never be subject to his creation.

Do you believe the verses below:
John 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
Colossians 1:22 in the body of his flesh through death, to present you holy and unblameable and unreproveable in his sight:
Colossians 1:14 in whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:
Colossians 2:13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;
1 John 2:12 I write unto you, little children, because your sins are forgiven you for his name’s sake.

 

[homwardbound]

The same Paul that never met Jesus. Some sound logic huh?

"If God is as great as you claim, and cannot subject himself to limitations does not this line of reasoning in itself place limitations on God? "
You're basically saying I'm saying God is bound to limitations by saying that nothing can limit him. Saying that nothing can limit him is not placing limitations on him, it's saying that he's the greatest. You're trying to create a circular argument which is elementary.

But Saul did meet him on the road to Damascus
[h=3]Acts 9:1-6[/h]Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)

9 And Saul, yet breathing out threatenings and slaughter against the disciples of the Lord, went unto the high priest, [SUP]2 [/SUP]and desired of him letters to Damascus to the synagogues, that if he found any of this way, whether they were men or women, he might bring them bound unto Jerusalem. [SUP]3 [/SUP]And as he journeyed, he came near Damascus: and suddenly there shined round about him a light from heaven: [SUP]4 [/SUP]and he fell to the earth, and heard a voice saying unto him, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me? [SUP]5 [/SUP]And he said, Who art thou, Lord? And the Lord said, I am Jesus whom thou persecutest: it is hard for thee to kick against the pricks. [SUP]6 [/SUP]And he trembling and astonished said, Lord, what wilt thou have me to do? And the Lord said unto him, Arise, and go into the city, and it shall be told thee what thou must do.

 

[homwardbound]

Oldhermit,

The Bible was given to Jesus because the Old Torah was corrupted. The Bible was corrupted by people such as Paul and the enemies of Jesus who deceived others into believing he was God.

He never claimed he was God. He was a Prophet like Abraham, Moses, Noah, Adam, like it had been. He was preaching the word of One God. Worship that God. Do not associate others with him. Be moral and virtuous and follow his word.

So can we get to Father any other way than through Christ the only perfect one that ever walked this earth blameless in the flesh? Born of the Virgin Mary?

 

[homwardbound]

Quran 4:171 Actual Verse

O People of the Scripture, do not commit excess in your religion or say about Allah except the truth. The Messiah, Jesus, the son of Mary, was but a messenger of Allah and His word which He directed to Mary and a soul [created at a command] from Him. So believe in Allah and His messengers. And do not say, "Three"; desist - it is better for you. Indeed, Allah is but one God. Exalted is He above having a son. To Him belongs whatever is in the heavens and whatever is on the earth. And sufficient is Allah as Disposer of affairs.


Your verse.

4.171 You The Book's family, do not go beyond the limits in your faith, and they do not say on “allah”except The Truth (is) only The Messiah Jesus, Mary's son, “allah’s” messenger, and his Word, cast forth to her, Mary, and Spirit from him; so believe by “allah”, and his messengers, and they do not say "Three." Refrain (it is) certainly agreeable to you, only “allah” one god glory be to him, that He has certainly been his Son, truly His what is in the heavens and in the earth and He sufficed by “allah”, a witness.

False once again

Jesus did only claim as the Father is the only one good. That is truth, yet the only way to Father is through Jesus, is this also truth?