What Laws are still valid to christians
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Take "to" out also, verse 16 still says the OPPISITION was abolished not the INSTRUCTIONS.
It would be unfair and sin to reject someone for doing something that is ok to do, and not binding any longer.
Revelation 22:15, "For outside are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and worshipers of gods and everyone who professes to love, yet practices falsehood."
What Law is against "dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers"
It is amazing the endurance many have to fight against the Instructions of Yahweh, especially when you consider the fact that that Messiah told us to follow these.
Mattithyah 5:19, "Whosoever, therefore, will break one of the least of these Laws, and will teach men so, hhe will be called the least in the Kingdom of Yahweh; but whosoever will do and teach them, the same will be called great in the Kingdom of Yahweh."
"Blessed are those who keep His Laws, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city."
It would be unfair and sin to reject someone for doing something that is ok to do, and not binding any longer.
Revelation 22:15, "For outside are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and worshipers of gods and everyone who professes to love, yet practices falsehood."
What Law is against "dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers"
It is amazing the endurance many have to fight against the Instructions of Yahweh, especially when you consider the fact that that Messiah told us to follow these.
Mattithyah 5:19, "Whosoever, therefore, will break one of the least of these Laws, and will teach men so, hhe will be called the least in the Kingdom of Yahweh; but whosoever will do and teach them, the same will be called great in the Kingdom of Yahweh."
"Blessed are those who keep His Laws, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city."
This is my topic concering Shaul, andit does not say how it originated, it says it is allowed to continuse the keep Shaul humbled before Yahweh. THE ORIGIN IS NOT STATED.
There are many prophecies dealing with endtimes that are addressed to the body of Messiah. All the prophets and yahshua, the disciples and the apostle Shaul ALL spoke obedience to Yahweh, turning away from the world and to Yahweh, none of them said sin and you wont have any bad consequenses.
Yahchanan 5:14, "Afterward, Yahshua found him in the sacred precincts and said to him: Behold, you are healed. Sin no more, or a worse thing will come upon you."
And if you want to play the "you have to look at who there talking to" you may as well disregard 99% of the book, because very rarely are we, modern day body of Messiah DIRECTLY spoken to.
People say all the time Im doing nothing wrong and yet this, this and this happened, if you believe the Scriptures:
Proverbs 26:2, "As a fluttering sparrow, or a flying swallow will alight, so a curse causeless will not come."
Just because one says they are doing the will of Yahweh, even if they really believe they are dioes not mean they are in reality doing Yahweh's will. When someone is going through troubles, my advice is always read 2 Corinthians 12:7-10, Hebrews12:3-11, obedience is keyand what is to come is not to be compared with the sorrows of this life.
To me what is dangerous is allowing people to contiue to walk off the cliff, but we are told the mystery of iniquity will reach its fullness so I understand you problem with my doctrine, the world teaches, let your brother sin, dont ever tell him hes wrong, your wrong if you tell them to stop their sin. I agreed we are to rebuke in a measured manner, but inn no way do we let our brothers and sisters continue in error so we dont hurt their feelings.
There are many prophecies dealing with endtimes that are addressed to the body of Messiah. All the prophets and yahshua, the disciples and the apostle Shaul ALL spoke obedience to Yahweh, turning away from the world and to Yahweh, none of them said sin and you wont have any bad consequenses.
Yahchanan 5:14, "Afterward, Yahshua found him in the sacred precincts and said to him: Behold, you are healed. Sin no more, or a worse thing will come upon you."
And if you want to play the "you have to look at who there talking to" you may as well disregard 99% of the book, because very rarely are we, modern day body of Messiah DIRECTLY spoken to.
People say all the time Im doing nothing wrong and yet this, this and this happened, if you believe the Scriptures:
Proverbs 26:2, "As a fluttering sparrow, or a flying swallow will alight, so a curse causeless will not come."
Just because one says they are doing the will of Yahweh, even if they really believe they are dioes not mean they are in reality doing Yahweh's will. When someone is going through troubles, my advice is always read 2 Corinthians 12:7-10, Hebrews12:3-11, obedience is keyand what is to come is not to be compared with the sorrows of this life.
To me what is dangerous is allowing people to contiue to walk off the cliff, but we are told the mystery of iniquity will reach its fullness so I understand you problem with my doctrine, the world teaches, let your brother sin, dont ever tell him hes wrong, your wrong if you tell them to stop their sin. I agreed we are to rebuke in a measured manner, but inn no way do we let our brothers and sisters continue in error so we dont hurt their feelings.
I see where you're coming from, but your descriptions are confusing. I still don't agree with your train of thought, even though I understand your definitions. That was redundant. sorry.
The only change to the law is the administrator. (Our Messiah) The words haven't been changed for God doesn't change what He has ordained from the beginning. If I read you right, you are saying the law changed because of the change of the tribe. I'm saying the Priesthood changed hands, which was the plan from the beginning because Christ created all things. Colossians 1. The Words that came out of God's mouth to Moses never changed, and there is nothing in the Bible that says it did. God intended the law to be what it is today by putting it in place (to the detail) during the time of Moses.
Malachi 3:4-6 (KJV)
[SUP]4 [/SUP]Then shall the offering of Judah and Jerusalem be pleasant unto the LORD, as in the days of old, and as in former years.
[SUP]5 [/SUP]And I will come near to you to judgment; and I will be a swift witness against the sorcerers, and against the adulterers, and against false swearers, and against those that oppress the hireling in his wages, the widow, and the fatherless, and that turn aside the stranger from his right, and fear not me, saith the LORD of hosts.
[SUP]6 [/SUP]For I am the LORD, I change not; therefore ye sons of Jacob are not consumed.
The only change to the law is the administrator. (Our Messiah) The words haven't been changed for God doesn't change what He has ordained from the beginning. If I read you right, you are saying the law changed because of the change of the tribe. I'm saying the Priesthood changed hands, which was the plan from the beginning because Christ created all things. Colossians 1. The Words that came out of God's mouth to Moses never changed, and there is nothing in the Bible that says it did. God intended the law to be what it is today by putting it in place (to the detail) during the time of Moses.
Malachi 3:4-6 (KJV)
[SUP]4 [/SUP]Then shall the offering of Judah and Jerusalem be pleasant unto the LORD, as in the days of old, and as in former years.
[SUP]5 [/SUP]And I will come near to you to judgment; and I will be a swift witness against the sorcerers, and against the adulterers, and against false swearers, and against those that oppress the hireling in his wages, the widow, and the fatherless, and that turn aside the stranger from his right, and fear not me, saith the LORD of hosts.
[SUP]6 [/SUP]For I am the LORD, I change not; therefore ye sons of Jacob are not consumed.
E
Your dangerous. People like you keep people from God. Keep people discouraged. and keep them not understanding the LOVE and GRACE of God.
If you want to teach a spirit of fear. Your on your own.
As for what Paul said....
Romans 8:15 For you did not receive the spirit of bondage again to fear, but you received the Spirit of adoption by whom we cry out, “Abba, Father.”
The law places us under bondage and fear. You can have your fear. For the rest of us children of God. We will come to him as an abba father..
W
ACTS 15:19 WHERE FOR MY sentence is, that we trouble them not, which from the gentiles have turned unto God 
20) but that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood. (24) Forasmuch as we have heard,that certain which went out from us have troubled you with words, subverting your souls, saying, ye must be circumcised, and keep the law:to whom we gave no such commandment28) For iit seemed good to the Holy Ghost ,and to us,to lay no greater burden than these necessary things; that ye abstain from meats offered to idols, and from blood, and from things stangled, and from fornication: from which if you keep yourselves, you shall do well.
20) but that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood. (24) Forasmuch as we have heard,that certain which went out from us have troubled you with words, subverting your souls, saying, ye must be circumcised, and keep the law:to whom we gave no such commandment28) For iit seemed good to the Holy Ghost ,and to us,to lay no greater burden than these necessary things; that ye abstain from meats offered to idols, and from blood, and from things stangled, and from fornication: from which if you keep yourselves, you shall do well.
Something that has helped me tremendously in all of this, and something I haven't really tried to communicate....All of these commands, blessings and curses have spiritual and personal applications of them. Obviously, there is a physical or geographical aspect to these promises that might not seem applicable to us. But what can the Spirit teach us through these things. People might not have the desire to do so, or even see the relevance. Personally, I have read through entire Torah multiple times through and I can find a personal and spiritual application in every single command. The actual action and physical application of those commands has provided a great blessing to me.
If one is against the law, then their relationship with the law is enmity with the God. If you are over the law and are disobedient to the law, then you are asked to repent, and confess the transgression, because the law was given to you because of the transgression so you would know where you messed up. If one neglects that instruction and continues in the infraction, you are under the curse of the law. Enmity defines a relationship, not with the law, but with God Himself.
I mostly agree with you here. You're right about what the sign points to, and how that sign is in our hearts as well. I still maintain that the covenant of circumcision and the commandment was never done away by Jesus. And as I have stated many times, He encouraged the following of the Law. The fact that He never bothered to change it Himself tells me it's still applicable.
The circumcised is the most important of all of the Torah, because without that, you miss the whole point of walking in the Torah. But that doesn't negate the actual following of the Torah. You should have that circumcised heart 1st, THEN walk in the physical.
The circumcised is the most important of all of the Torah, because without that, you miss the whole point of walking in the Torah. But that doesn't negate the actual following of the Torah. You should have that circumcised heart 1st, THEN walk in the physical.
That's it... comparing Spiritual with Spiritual
1 Corinthians 2:13 (CJB)
13 These are the things we are talking about when we avoid the manner of speaking that human wisdom would dictate and instead use a manner of speaking taught by the Spirit, by which we explain things of the Spirit to people who have the Spirit.
1 Corinthians 2:13 (CJB)
13 These are the things we are talking about when we avoid the manner of speaking that human wisdom would dictate and instead use a manner of speaking taught by the Spirit, by which we explain things of the Spirit to people who have the Spirit.
E
Thats great,
But the fact remains. The law of moses was given to Isreal. Lev 26 is the curses or blessing for obeying them or not. NOT given to us, but to them.
Again., In the NT many people do Gods will, yet suffer greatly, or go through persecution. This is not like the OT, so when we follow law. All it can do is discourage us.
Those who follow God understand God has a plan, This plan may include suffering for his purpose. It has nothing to do with the law. It is about Gods plan.
God promised Isreal all those things,, he never promised us any of it. That why they were under the old. and we under the new. God has a different plan for us,
But the fact remains. The law of moses was given to Isreal. Lev 26 is the curses or blessing for obeying them or not. NOT given to us, but to them.
Again., In the NT many people do Gods will, yet suffer greatly, or go through persecution. This is not like the OT, so when we follow law. All it can do is discourage us.
Those who follow God understand God has a plan, This plan may include suffering for his purpose. It has nothing to do with the law. It is about Gods plan.
God promised Isreal all those things,, he never promised us any of it. That why they were under the old. and we under the new. God has a different plan for us,
E
Yes it does. It does what it was intended.
It shows us our complete sinfullness and inability to live as he requires.
What it does not do, is show us how to be righteous.
If we pay to much attention to the law. We are going to worry to much about how Good we are doing, or trying to do it. We will probably miss out on things God wants us to do. and be to rigid in our thinking..
It shows us our complete sinfullness and inability to live as he requires.
What it does not do, is show us how to be righteous.
If we pay to much attention to the law. We are going to worry to much about how Good we are doing, or trying to do it. We will probably miss out on things God wants us to do. and be to rigid in our thinking..
You conveniently omitted the context.
A verse without a context is a pretext, which is what we have here.
"You who are Gentiles by birth. . .who once were far away have been brought near (with the Jews) through the blood
of Christ. For he himself is our peace, who has made the two (Gentiles and Jews) one. . .His purpose was to create in
himself one new man (the body of Christ) out of the two (Gentiles and Jews), thus making peace. . ." (Eph 2:11-15).
The hostility was not between men and the law, as your added word "to" makes it.
It was between men, the Jews and the Gentiles, and created by the defilement laws which made the Gentiles unclean.
The law was the cause of the wall of separation and hostility between Jew and Gentile, not between itself and men.
That hostility and wall of separation was taken down by the cross, which made peace
1) between Jew and Gentile (v.15) by abolishing the law for righteousness to salvation, and
2) between both and God (v.16-17) by his death which forgives the sin of those who believe in him.
You have let your theology overrun the NT Scriptures.
I'd be interested to know what parts of Scripture I deny.
Well, to this point he has blessed me with the wisdom not to alter the purport of the NT Scriptures
by adding words which change their meaning.
A verse without a context is a pretext, which is what we have here.
"You who are Gentiles by birth. . .who once were far away have been brought near (with the Jews) through the blood
of Christ. For he himself is our peace, who has made the two (Gentiles and Jews) one. . .His purpose was to create in
himself one new man (the body of Christ) out of the two (Gentiles and Jews), thus making peace. . ." (Eph 2:11-15).
The hostility was not between men and the law, as your added word "to" makes it.
It was between men, the Jews and the Gentiles, and created by the defilement laws which made the Gentiles unclean.
The law was the cause of the wall of separation and hostility between Jew and Gentile, not between itself and men.
That hostility and wall of separation was taken down by the cross, which made peace
1) between Jew and Gentile (v.15) by abolishing the law for righteousness to salvation, and
2) between both and God (v.16-17) by his death which forgives the sin of those who believe in him.
You have let your theology overrun the NT Scriptures.
If I changed that, which I can't, I would have to deny parts of scripture, and their purpose as you do.
Well, to this point he has blessed me with the wisdom not to alter the purport of the NT Scriptures
by adding words which change their meaning.
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