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[Elin]

The Jews are a stubborn and blinded lot and are enemies of the gospel of Christ, but
are never the less God's people.

Not according to Jesus.

None who reject Jesus Christ are God's people (Jn 3:18, 36).
God has only one people, those who are in Christ Jesus.

God has one fold and one shepherd (Jn 10:16).
You must belong to that fold to be the people of God.

That is likewise a confounding of the NT.
God has hardened and blinded the majority of Jews, and they reject Christ (Ro 11:25).
Christ rejecters are not God's people (Jn 3:18, 36).

Unbelieving Jews have been cut off from the one olive tree of God's people (Ro 11:17-21),
the Church of believing Jews and Gentiles.

Do you have less favor toward the Jews than you do the Gentiles
who are also a disobedient lot?

Do you have more favor toward the Jews than you do the Gentiles who are also a disobedient lot?

Both are a disobedient lot, and neither are God's people until they come to saving faith in Christ Jesus.

They are God's people, he has not forsaken them and they are the apple of his eye

More confounding of the NT.

No Christ rejecters are God's people until they come to saving faith in Christ Jesus.

Rejecters of the Father's one and only divine Son are not the apple of the Father's eye,
until they come to saving faith in that one and only Son.

Do you believe the NT word of God?

 

[Elin]

Most do not and all the more reason to intercede for them that God would remove the blindness that is over their heart, just like he did for Paul on the road to Damascus and with many others who heard the gospel. What makes you and others so sure that the Jews have heard the gospel from a Spirit filled believer that has no animosity toward them?

Love it!

Their hearts remain hardened because the wrong people are taking the gospel to them.

Only in Jewish thinking, not in NT thinking.

 

[Elin]

Before Christ, many Jews looked at the sacrificial system in the very same way the pagans looked at such as sacrificing babies, it was to appease God. In Isaiah it tells how God said He hated that kind of sacrifice

Not quite.

Their sacrifices were displeasing to God because they were offered in hypocrisy, without repentance for
the sin for which they were offered.

You are saying that it is dangerous to follow Jews teachings, yet it was
God that suggested those practices as ways to keep His laws in our lives every minute.

Not quite.

Nothing in the Mosaic law is suggested. It is all commanded.

And the sin sacrifice laws were for actual reconciliation with God, not just the way to keep his laws in
their lives every minute.

It was man who decided the practice was important, the laws weren't.

Not sure what you mean by "practice was important, the laws weren't."

What's the difference?

 

[BradC]

brad



So that should only be done for ethnic jews ? What about gentiles who need blindness of heart removed ? Are thy less important than ethnic jews ?

This is the dispensation of the grace of God to the Jew and to the Gentile, but let's not exclude the Jew because of prejudice or a lack of compassion. I am a Gentile lead to the Lord by a Gentile, with parents who who were also born of God through the witness of a Gentile. I have witnessed the gospel to hundreds of Gentiles and many Jews, some unknowingly, with the same gospel. Some have responded and some have not. You have a prejudice that has blinded your own heart and it has made you see things from that point of view.

 

[BradC]

Love it!

Their hearts remain hardened because the wrong people are taking the gospel to them.

Only in Jewish thinking, not in NT thinking.

You are contrary in your heart and nothing I can say will persuade you otherwise. When was the last time you witnessed the gospel of Christ to an unconverted Jew? Maybe you never have and never will, that my be how you have purposed it in your own heart.

 

[svedbygrace]

This is the dispensation of the grace of God to the Jew and to the Gentile, but let's not exclude the Jew because of prejudice or a lack of compassion. I am a Gentile lead to the Lord by a Gentile, with parents who who were also born of God through the witness of a Gentile. I have witnessed the gospel to hundreds of Gentiles and many Jews, some unknowingly, with the same gospel. Some have responded and some have not. You have a prejudice that has blinded your own heart and it has made you see things from that point of view.

We should pray for the Salvation of anyone Christ shed His Blood for, ethnicity should not be a issue. Did Jesus Christ only die for ethic jews ? Or did He die for mean and women of all ethnicity's ?

You have trust and confidence in the flesh of a man. Thats respect of persons.

 

[zone]

This is the dispensation of the grace of God to the Jew and to the Gentile, but let's not exclude the Jew because of prejudice or a lack of compassion. I am a Gentile lead to the Lord by a Gentile, with parents who who were also born of God through the witness of a Gentile. I have witnessed the gospel to hundreds of Gentiles and many Jews, some unknowingly, with the same gospel. Some have responded and some have not. You have a prejudice that has blinded your own heart and it has made you see things from that point of view.

tweaking your Dispensational dogma to be a little more palatable?
i thought this was the 'Mystery Gentile Church Age' and the jews are blinded - by God UNTIL the gentile age (cough) is over - signified by the RAPTURE of the gentile church bride to be with her husband Jesus - while the Father God (this brand of dispensationalism has 2 gods/2 wives) calls back HIS WIFE - ISRAEL...on earth while the gentile church is having a wedding in heaven.

right?
don't bother denying it Red.

 

[svedbygrace]

bradc

but let's not exclude the Jew because of prejudice or a lack of compassion.

God has excluded the jew and gentile who were not Chosen in His Beloved Son before the foundation of the world. God does not have respect of persons because of their flesh.

 

[JaumeJ]

And Who do you suppose has the justice and judgment to choose? Certainly it is no one here. It is our duty to share with all, to give love to all without looking at whom or judging what the Lord has for any individual. Keep in mind false brethren we are to act upon when discovered, this is not judgment, it is simply treating one uncovered as such as a non believer. There are quite a few sleezing about.

 

[BradC]

tweaking your Dispensational dogma to be a little more palatable?
i thought this was the 'Mystery Gentile Church Age' and the jews are blinded - by God UNTIL the gentile age (cough) is over - signified by the RAPTURE of the gentile church bride to be with her husband Jesus - while the Father God (this brand of dispensationalism has 2 gods/2 wives) calls back HIS WIFE - ISRAEL...on earth while the gentile church is having a wedding in heaven.

right?
don't bother denying it Red.

When is the last time you witnessed Christ and him crucified to a Jew without prejudice? God is your witness and he will be writing down your answer in his book. Same question for unclefester, Elin, Praus and the like. Even if you don't answer on this site, the truth will be manifest by the light along with all those secret counsels of the heart (1Cor 4:3-5). Do you love your neighbor as yourself even if it be a Jew? If you do, then go tell your neighbor about the love of God that sent his Son into the world to seek and save that which is lost, to the Jew first and then to the Gentile (Rom 1:16).

 

[iamsoandso]

and see to me at least,the captivity of the Jews ending(dan. 9;24) and the 70 weeks are a specific numbering of days employed. on the other hand ,,,"the times of the gentiles",,,well because of disobedience Persia,Greece,Rome all still held authority over them,all of which are gentiles. and then the Jews were scattered after ad70 into the nations that divided out of Rome and still the gentiles both had power over them and their captivity of them.

then the Americas were discovered and many Jews immigrated there,,but they were still captive under the authority of gentile rulers. so year after year,generation after generation Jews were born in these nations where they were scattered. and the whole while other governments dwelt and ruled in Jerusalem.,,,but then came 1948 and well,,,now the gentiles do not hold authority over the jews nor do they hold possession of Jerusalem.,,,,,,,hmmm,wonder when the times of the gentiles will be full,,,,,

 

[JaumeJ]

Too much discussion on who is saved and who is not, as though Yeshua has already given each of us judgment. We will indeed receive judgment on His Day, at His time.

Stop worrying about which nation is or is not, people from all of them will be saved, providing they accept Yeshua, and no one is empowered to say a person does or does not truly accept Him for Who He is. Yes, we may shun any who claim to love Him in spirit and truth while ignoring His Gospel...............that is a spiritual no brainer.

 

[Elin]

You are contrary in your heart and nothing I can say will persuade you otherwise. When was the last time you witnessed the gospel of Christ to an unconverted Jew? Maybe you never have and never will, that my be how you have purposed it in your own heart.

Are you sure about that?

More blame-shifting to the wrong party.

 

[Elin]

When is the last time you witnessed Christ and him crucified
to a Jew without prejudice? God is your witness and he will be writing down your answer in his book.
Same question for unclefester, Elin, Praus and the like.

So prejudice of believers is why the Jew is not converted. . .

Blame-shifting to the wrong parties again.

 

[Bryancampbell]

I think following the history of the Jews is an interesting study! I have friends who spent several months helping with the many Jews arriving in Jerusalem. They said none that they knew of had any idea it was God's plan they return. Most did not include God in their life.

I don't think any of this is anything for us to judge, our place is only to follow and trust in our Lord. If you and I had the right to decide about all of this we would simply pronounce that all Jews would accept Jesus as Messiah, and make Him the center of their lives. Even God gives them a choice, and it is God who decides how our world will operate as a result of those decisions.

I also find it interesting to follow the practice of "Judaism" as todays church looks at it. Constantine used these practices to declare Christianity a brand new religion and sever it from "Judaism". Before Christ, many Jews looked at the sacrificial system in the very same way the pagans looked at such as sacrificing babies, it was to appease God. In Isaiah it tells how God said He hated that kind of sacrifice. You are saying that it is dangerous to follow Jews teachings, yet it was God that suggested those practices as ways to keep His laws in our lives every minute. It was man who decided the practice was important, the laws weren't.

I'd be still careful. I'm not saying God's ways are dangerous, I'm saying man's way is dangerous. The "Jewish faith" today contradicts the bible. In the ultra-orthodox they practice something called a kaparot before the day of atonement, by swinging a chicken over their head, or coins, three times to imagine their sins are being transferring, then they slaughter it or give the money. The tulmid is extremely dangerous if one wants to follow the examples of them. I'm just saying redtent, Judaism is not the same, I know, your best bet is to just follow the Lord. Which should be the only person we should follow period lol. If judging is stating what they do, then I'm judging that Muslims believe in Mohammed lol.

I don't know, I might be ignorant in my entire post, but they practice things beyond the bible and claim to be genuine. Of course depending on what types of the Jewish faith you hold. You think the Pharisees and religious leaders were bad, yea...don't walk in their example in the old testament is my opinion.

 

[Elin]

Too much discussion on who is saved and who is not, as though Yeshua has already given each of us judgment.

According to the NT he has.

See Ro 8:1.

 

[RedTent]

and see to me at least,the captivity of the Jews ending(dan. 9;24) and the 70 weeks are a specific numbering of days employed. on the other hand ,,,"the times of the gentiles",,,well because of disobedience Persia,Greece,Rome all still held authority over them,all of which are gentiles. and then the Jews were scattered after ad70 into the nations that divided out of Rome and still the gentiles both had power over them and their captivity of them.

then the Americas were discovered and many Jews immigrated there,,but they were still captive under the authority of gentile rulers. so year after year,generation after generation Jews were born in these nations where they were scattered. and the whole while other governments dwelt and ruled in Jerusalem.,,,but then came 1948 and well,,,now the gentiles do not hold authority over the jews nor do they hold possession of Jerusalem.,,,,,,,hmmm,wonder when the times of the gentiles will be full,,,,,

You are certainly ahead of your time!! I once suggested that the power of the gentiles was coming to an end and posters all but gunned me down! But I also pointed out that we didn't always use our power in the best way, just as the Jews didn't when they were in power and we should look at ourselves closely, now.

I also think that God is helping us with understanding of Him with the information that the deep sea scrolls gathered. By giving us the key to ancient languages, we can read archeology findings and interpret what God gave us in the OT much better. It took years for bible scholars to gather this information from the scrolls and it is just now filtering down to us, the "man in the street". Very few are listening, as you can tell as you read these posts. Besides, they get the mistakes the Jews made in understanding God and what God says all mixed up.

 

[JaumeJ]

There is reference of those of the House of David (Yeshua) being given judgment in the Psalms, but I am thinking specifically of the type of judgment being given to the saints when it is time to judge. Also Jesus, Yeshua, gives to us the judgment of the twelve tribes of Israel..........

If Yeshua had given us this type of judgment in this age, He would never have taught us, "JUdge not and ye shall not be judged for with the judgment ye mete out shall ye be judged..."



Rev 20:4
And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

According to the NT he has.

See Ro 8:1.

 

[zone]

and see to me at least,the captivity of the Jews ending(dan. 9;24) and the 70 weeks are a specific numbering of days employed. on the other hand ,,,"the times of the gentiles",,,well because of disobedience Persia,Greece,Rome all still held authority over them,all of which are gentiles. and then the Jews were scattered after ad70 into the nations that divided out of Rome and still the gentiles both had power over them and their captivity of them.

then the Americas were discovered and many Jews immigrated there,,but they were still captive under the authority of gentile rulers. so year after year,generation after generation Jews were born in these nations where they were scattered. and the whole while other governments dwelt and ruled in Jerusalem.,,,but then came 1948 and well,,,now the gentiles do not hold authority over the jews nor do they hold possession of Jerusalem.,,,,,,,hmmm,wonder when the times of the gentiles will be full,,,,,

??


Luke 21
Jesus Foretells Destruction of Jerusalem
20“But when you see Jerusalem surrounded by armies, then know that its desolation has come near. 21Then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains, and let those who are inside the city depart, and let not those who are out in the country enter it, 22for these are days of vengeance, to fulfill all that is written. 23Alas for women who are pregnant and for those who are nursing infants in those days! For there will be great distress upon the earth and wrath against this people. 24They will fall by the edge of the sword and be led captive among all nations, and Jerusalem will be trampled underfoot by the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled.

this people were the unbelieving jews of jerusalem.
it happened just the way the Lord said it would.

and what's this:

"then the Americas were discovered and many Jews immigrated there,,but they were still captive under the authority of gentile rulers."?

really?

 

[BradC]

bradc



God has excluded the jew and gentile who were not Chosen in His Beloved Son before the foundation of the world. God does not have respect of persons because of their flesh.

If that is true, then what was it about you and me that got us in and kept others out? There was nothing about us in our flesh that God chose that got us saved by grace to inherit the kingdom. If you think so then you are a very deceived man. God broke us down as sinners and drew our heart in humility unto himself through his Son. He will do the same to his elect Israel during the tribulation period and they will be saved by the Deliverer that comes out of Zion and he will turn away ungodliness from Jacob. That is a faithful and merciful God that keeps his word and promise no matter how prejudice people may become against the apple of his eye.