Jesus is God !

[Hizikyah]

Concerning 1 John 5:7-8, Just exposing truth so dont attack me please

Verses 5:7-8 -- In the King James
Version and later renditions of the Latin
Vulgate, the received Greek and Latin
texts include the words: “ ...In heaven,
the Father, the Word, and the Holy
Ghost, and these three are one. And there
are three that bear witness in earth... ”.
This text concerning the heavenly
witness is not contained in any authentic
Greek manuscript written earlier than the
Fifteenth Century of this current era. It
does not appear in any of the oldest
Greek manuscripts; neither does it even
appear in the earliest Latin translations.
This text is not cited by any of the Greek
or early Latin writers, even when the
subject they wrote of would naturally
have led them to appeal to its authority.
The Emphatic Diaglott by Benjamin
Wilson, Page 803, The Jerusalem Bible,
New Testament, Page 419. Other
scholars and researchers have frankly
admitted that these words are a
deliberate forgery that was never a part
of the original inspired Holy Scriptures.

New International Version
For there are three that testify:

New Living Translation
So we have these three witnesses--

English Standard Version
For there are three that testify:

New American Standard Bible
For there are three that testify:

King James Bible
For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.

Holman Christian Standard Bible
For there are three that testify:

International Standard Version
For there are three witnesses —

NET Bible
For there are three that testify,

Aramaic Bible in Plain English
And The Spirit testifies because The Spirit is the truth.

GOD'S WORD® Translation
There are three witnesses:

Jubilee Bible 2000
For there are three that bear witness in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Spirit; and these three are one.

King James 2000 Bible
For there are three that bear witness in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Spirit: and these three are one.

American King James Version
For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.

American Standard Version
And it is the Spirit that beareth witness, because the Spirit is the truth.

Douay-Rheims Bible
And there are three who give testimony in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost. And these three are one.

Darby Bible Translation
For they that bear witness are three:

English Revised Version
And it is the Spirit that beareth witness, because the Spirit is the truth.

Webster's Bible Translation
For there are three that bear testimony in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Spirit, and these three are one.

Weymouth New Testament
For there are three that give testimony-- the Spirit, the water, and the blood;

World English Bible
For there are three who testify:

Young's Literal Translation
because three are who are testifying in the heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Spirit, and these -- the three -- are one;

 

[Hoffco]

This sounds so good; I almost don't dare to ask this question. BUT, I need to. Are you talking of the Trinity? The Father, son and the Holy Spirit. The three eternal, co equal persons of the Godhood? I question you because you have said nothing of the Holy Spirit. Love to all, Hoffco

 

[Hizikyah]

I dont understand why everyone (not attcaking you Hoffco) says "co-equal" when Yahshua Himself said:

Yahchanan (John) 14:28, "You have heard that I told you: I go away, but come again to you. If you loved Me, you would have rejoiced that I am going to the Father, for the Father is greater than I."

 

[Hoffco]

The New King James Bible 1979 has the "the Father, the Word, and the Holy Spirit; and these three are one." Even if it is not in the Greek text, It is the truth. 1Jh.5:20 "...the Son of God has come and has given us an understanding, that we may know Him who is truth; and we are in Him who is true, in His Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God and eternal life." Jesus is the true God in the flesh. 2Jh.vs.3,7-9 "Grace, mercy, and peace will be with you from God the Father and from the Lord Jesus Christ, the Son of the Father, in truth and love.....For many deceivers have gone out into the world who do not confess Jesus Christ as coming in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist. Look to yourselves, that we do not lose those things we worked for, but that we may receive a full reward. Whoever, transgresses and does not abide in the doctrine of Christ does not have God. He who abides in the doctrine of Christ has both the Father and the Son." The spirit of antichrist denies that the eternal SON of GOD has become man,NOW the GOD/man. Savior and God and man. 3Jh. v.11 "Beloved, do not imitate what is evil, but what is good. He who does good is of God, but he who does evil has not seen God." This is the teaching of the whole New Testament , One must abide in the teaching of the Trinity and maintain good works to be saved. Grace, Faith, works. Love to all, Hoffco

 

[Hizikyah]

I dont like ANYTHING added to the Scriptures, true or not, I want non altered script.

Also nowhere does it say that one must believe in the trinity to be saved, that is Catholic catechism, the Scriptures say:

One must believe Yahshua is the Messiah...

Revelation 14:12, "lIn this manner are the saints purified--by keeping the Laws of Yahweh, in conformity with the faith in Yahshua Messiah."

 

[Cobus]

Jesus IS THE GREAT FATHER, but NOT IN THE FORM OF A HUMAN...
Here is the thing we have to understand.... Jesus is God (Emmanual) God with us... in the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God and the Word was God, and the Word was made flesh and lived amongst us.... Two proofs that Jesus WAS GOD WITH US IN A HUMAN FORM! But the GLORY of God the Father CANNOT be dispplayed in His FULL glory as a man!

Look what Jesus says here, and if you ask God to REVEAL this for you with a recpetive heart, He will give you this WISDOM
And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.

We know Jesus had some degree of GLORY when He walked the earth, but it was not NEARLY the GLORY of HIM AS FATHER. The Glory Jesus had BEFORE THE WORLD WAS is Jesus as FATHER! Jeus says.... FATHER GLORIFY THOU ME WITH THINE OWN SELF.... Aha! There you have it...If Jesus the SON OF GOD, gets more glory that what He dispayed here on erath, HE IS GOD THE FATHER HIS OWN SELF. And if WE GET THE GLORY HE HAD HERE ON EARTH WE BECOME THE SON OF GOD! CHIDREN OF GOD!

As easy as that!

 

[Hizikyah]

Jesus IS THE GREAT FATHER, but NOT IN THE FORM OF A HUMAN...
Here is the thing we have to understand.... Jesus is God (Emmanual) God with us... in the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God and the Word was God, and the Word was made flesh and lived amongst us.... Two proofs that Jesus WAS GOD WITH US IN A HUMAN FORM! But the GLORY of God the Father CANNOT be dispplayed in His FULL glory as a man!

Look what Jesus says here, and if you ask God to REVEAL this for you with a recpetive heart, He will give you this WISDOM
And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.

We know Jesus had some degree of GLORY when He walked the earth, but it was not NEARLY the GLORY of HIM AS FATHER. The Glory Jesus had BEFORE THE WORLD WAS is Jesus as FATHER! Jeus says.... FATHER GLORIFY THOU ME WITH THINE OWN SELF.... Aha! There you have it...If Jesus the SON OF GOD, gets more glory that what He dispayed here on erath, HE IS GOD THE FATHER HIS OWN SELF. And if WE GET THE GLORY HE HAD HERE ON EARTH WE BECOME THE SON OF GOD! CHIDREN OF GOD!

As easy as that!

Yahshua is not the Father.

Revelation 1:1, "The Revelation of Yahshua Messiah, which Yahweh gave to Him, to show His servants things which must shortly come to pass; and He sent and signified it through His malak to His servant Yahchanan:"

New International Version
The revelation from Jesus Christ, which God gave him to show his servants what must soon take place. He made it known by sending his angel to his servant John,

New Living Translation
This is a revelation from Jesus Christ, which God gave him to show his servants the events that must soon take place. He sent an angel to present this revelation to his servant John,

English Standard Version
The revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave him to show to his servants the things that must soon take place. He made it known by sending his angel to his servant John,

New American Standard Bible
The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave Him to show to His bond-servants, the things which must soon take place; and He sent and communicated it by His angel to His bond-servant John,

King James Bible
The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:

Dont shoot me im just quoting Scripture, also I think im done in this thread....

1 Timothy 2:5, "For One is Yahweh; and One Mediator between Yahweh and men: the Man, Yahshua Messiah,"

New International Version
For there is one God and one mediator between God and mankind, the man Christ Jesus,

New Living Translation
For there is only one God and one Mediator who can reconcile God and humanity--the man Christ Jesus.

English Standard Version
For there is one God, and there is one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,

New American Standard Bible
For there is one God, and one mediator also between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,

King James Bible
For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;

 

[danschance]

Why do people use the name yashua for Jesus? I heard the latest thing is to Yah-hoo-shua. Who knows, maybe next year it will be something else? All I know is my bible it is Jesus. I have prayed to Jesus since I can recall and I feel no need to call him by any Hebrew name as the entire New Testament is written in Greek.

Jesus has many names:

Prince of Peace
LORD of lords
KING of kings
Mighty Counselor
Master
Rabbi
Teacher
High priest
Mediator
Lion of Judah
Brother
Lamb of God

So why do we need to invent names that you can not prove He was ever called?

 

[AprilAngel]

Why do people use the name yashua for Jesus? I heard the latest thing is to Yah-hoo-shua. Who knows, maybe next year it will be something else? All I know is my bible it is Jesus. I have prayed to Jesus since I can recall and I feel no need to call him by any Hebrew name as the entire New Testament is written in Greek.

Jesus has many names:

Prince of Peace
LORD of lords
KING of kings
Mighty Counselor
Master
Rabbi
Teacher
High priest
Mediator
Lion of Judah
Brother
Lamb of God

So why do we need to invent names that you can not prove He was ever called?

actually yeshua is the hebrew name for the Lord, it means yahweh (the lord) is salvation. yahweh means joshua. from hebrew to greek yeshua = Iesous, in english this is Jesus. SEVERAL different translations (languages) pronounce it different, I don't think Jesus really cares how we say his name as long as we are talking to Him, and praising Him.

hope that cleared that up, i could be wrong buuut...i doubt it

 

[Cobus]

Hiz, how many GOD'S are there, ONE! Not three in one, ONE! God is not an all purpose cleaner or all purpose oil. how man charactristics does three people have? Three! but how many does 5000 people have that has the SAME SPIRIT and THE SAME SOUL? If the insides of 5000 men are from ONE SOURCE then they ARE ALL ONE!


People want to make a seperation between the FATHER and the SON... and there is NO SEPERATION! So they are ONE! It is like this... IF JESUS IS THE FATHER, HE wll do as the FATHER DOES. BE GOD! and if GOD IS JESUS, HE will do as the SON DOES, GOD! There is NO difference between the SON, and the FATHER. They have ONE SPIRIT!


Let me explain it in a parable.... If ALL God's Glory is in a massive wine tank, and God is the WINE inside the tank, then decanted into five million bottles GOD IS IN EVERY BOTTLE! but because God cannot LOSE GLORY if he GIVES Glory, the TANK REMAINS FULL. NO MATTER HOW MANY BOTTLES HE POURS HIMSELF INTO. JESUS is the WINE and FATHER is the WINE. JESUS AND FATHER ARE ONE!
AND THEY ARE THE FULL TANK OF WINE. They are ALSO EVERY BOTTLE OF WINE, and the WINE IN EVERY BOTTLE. BUT IN THEIR GODLY FULNESS THEY ARE A HUGE TANK THAT REMAINS FULL...


JESUS AS MAN, is ALSO THE FIRST BOTTLE OF THE GODLY WINE IN A BOTTLE. Jesus as GOD CANNOT fit into a bottle. but Jesus as SON OF GOD / SON OF MAN, is a BOTTLE OF THAT GODLY WINE....

Jesus in HIS FULL GLORY IS A TANK FULL OF GODLY WINE... GOD IN HIS GLORY IS A TANK FULL (SAME THANK FULL AS JESUS) OF GODLY WINE... THEY ARE ONE! HE IS ONE. JESUS IS ONE GOD IS ONE.

OH if the BOTTLE TALKS TO THE TANK IT IS TALKING TO THE FATHER VESSEL, AND IF THE TANK TALKS TO THE BOTTLE IT IS TALKING TO THE SON VESSEL. BUT HTEY ARE STILL ONE WINE!

 

[Hoffco]

To Hizikyah, Only be the Grace of God. I am about the meanest man around, but I try to be nice. LOL Only by Grace.! Jesus is like every good son I know, We sons may hate our Fathers ,for some reason or an other, but, a good son , will always say, "My Father is greater than I" Sad to say, I hated my Father,and I had good reason to, But My Father was greater than I. I was a "bad" son in one way; I didn't like my Father's quite and non judging life style. I yelled at him many times, for his "bad" decisions, but I always asked his forgiveness; he never raised is voice one time, never. I had a holy respect for my Father. I miss him very much. I have to say, I miss my mother more. She was my main supporter. BUT, Jesus was the perfect son and He had a perfect Father. You will recall how much He missed His Father in Jh. 17, His fellowship was not quite the same ,when He had to come to earth. He really missed His Father. Jh.17:212-23 "...that they may be one as We are one:" JH.1:1 "the Word was with God," ( "with" is PROS-face to face with equals) We humans can be "one"= face to face with equals, as the Father and the Son are equals. Jh. 5:18-30 Jesus made Himself "equal with the Father" "all should honor the Son as they honor the Father." Need I say more? I think not. We are being remade in the "image" of the Father, Son and the Holy Spirit; In the true knowledge, holiness and righteousness of God. Love to all. Hoffco

 

[Hizikyah]

To Hizikyah, Only be the Grace of God. I am about the meanest man around, but I try to be nice. LOL Only by Grace.! Jesus is like every good son I know, We sons may hate our Fathers ,for some reason or an other, but, a good son , will always say, "My Father is greater than I" Sad to say, I hated my Father,and I had good reason to, But My Father was greater than I. I was a "bad" son in one way; I didn't like my Father's quite and non judging life style. I yelled at him many times, for his "bad" decisions, but I always asked his forgiveness; he never raised is voice one time, never. I had a holy respect for my Father. I miss him very much. I have to say, I miss my mother more. She was my main supporter. BUT, Jesus was the perfect son and He had a perfect Father. You will recall how much He missed His Father in Jh. 17, His fellowship was not quite the same ,when He had to come to earth. He really missed His Father. Jh.17:212-23 "...that they may be one as We are one:" JH.1:1 "the Word was with God," ( "with" is PROS-face to face with equals) We humans can be "one"= face to face with equals, as the Father and the Son are equals. Jh. 5:18-30 Jesus made Himself "equal with the Father" "all should honor the Son as they honor the Father." Need I say more? I think not. We are being remade in the "image" of the Father, Son and the Holy Spirit; In the true knowledge, holiness and righteousness of God. Love to all. Hoffco

"but I try to be nice. LOL Only by Grace.!"

by the power of the Sirit of Yahweh keep it up brother! I have changed drastically also, HalleluYAHWEH!

I agree 100% we are to try to be in full unity with Yahweh and Yahshua.

In John 5:18, i dont think Yahshua made Himself equal, I think that is what the Pharisees accused Him of.

This verse shows me Yahshua ONLY did the will of Yahweh, tried to imitate Yahweh.

v19, "Then Yahshua answered, and said to them: Truly, truly, I say to you: The Son can do nothing of His own accord; but He is only able to do what He sees the Father doing. For whatever the Father does, is what the Son does in the same way."

I do say 100% listening to Yahshua is as if you heard the words of Yahweh 100%, as Yahshua would never speak anything outside of Yahweh's will. This is why I cherish Yahshua's words over anybody else' words that walked earth.

 

[svedbygrace]

mystic

Question:Who was Jesus speaking of ?:Matthew 11:27 All things are delivered unto me of my Father: and no man knoweth the Son, but the Father;

Jesus was speaking of himself.

Now question for you. Could you please address the points made in post 19. Explain what the points are and then why you do not receive them.

 

[mystic7]

I believe is when I get to I will meet the Father and the Son according to my belief in the scriptures in the Word.Others believe they will only meet Jesus - God... Praise the Lord! personally it's not an issue to fret upon, the day we enter Heaven we'll know the answer

 

[fozi]

There is only one God .He is the creator and he has all the powers.He does not has any son or daughter.He is above such things..
He sent prophets in this world for guidance of human beings.All prophets asked people to worship One God.And all prophets were human beings......

 

[Anonimous]

There is only one God .He is the creator and he has all the powers.He does not has any son or daughter.He is above such things..
He sent prophets in this world for guidance of human beings.All prophets asked people to worship One God.And all prophets were human beings......

Ummm. You are wrong my friend. Jesus is God and he made no attempt to deny this fact. He not only received worship but He also forgave sin...and only God can forgive sin. I'd bet my head on it.

 

[GraceBeUntoYou]

I dont understand why everyone (not attcaking you Hoffco) says "co-equal" when Yahshua Himself said:

Yahchanan (John) 14:28, "You have heard that I told you: I go away, but come again to you. If you loved Me, you would have rejoiced that I am going to the Father, for the Father is greater than I."

Couple of real quick things.

(1) Though μείζων (meizon, "greater") has various meanings behind it (“a greater degree,” “more,” “position of greater status, dignity, and authority”) it’s noticeably pressing that John never utilizes this term to denote an ontological inferiority or ontological superiority. Just sixteen verses earlier (John 14.12), Christ not only says that the disciples will be doing the works that He had been doing, but they'll wind up doing greater (meizon) works than He. This does not mean the disciples will be doing qualitatively superior works, for they simply will not be doing “better” works than He. Here the term simply refers to the quantity of miracles. The disciples will be doing more miracles than Jesus had done, while performing the same kind of miracles as Jesus while He was on earth ("whoever believes in me will do the works I have been doing") -- the same works, but a greater number. Quantity, not quality.

(2) You emphasized on the words "for the Father is greater than I," but yet ignored just the first few words prior, "If you loved Me, you would have rejoiced that I am going to the Father." My question to you would be this: Why should the apostles rejoice? Jesus is saying that the Father is "greater" because the Father's position in Heaven is one of greater dignity and authority than the Son occupies on earth. This meaning, then, makes clear why the disciples should rejoice. The Son is returning to the right hand of the Father, to the glory He had with the Father before His existence on earth (John 17.5). He had voluntarily humbled Himself in coming to earth (Philippians 2.6), taking the form of a servant (doulos, c.f. John 13.16, 15.20). Now Jesus was returning to the Father to regain His former glory, where He could accomplish all the wonderful things promised to the disciples in His final discourse. If the disciples had considered the import of Jesus' words, they would have realized the exaltation that awaited the Son, and would have rejoiced.

(3) We do not believe the Son is equal to the Father in every respect, but rather, that this co-equality is one of ontology/nature (John 1.1c, Hebrews 1.3, Colossians 2.9, Philippians 2.6).

 

[Hizikyah]

Couple of real quick things.

(1) Though μείζων (meizon, "greater") has various meanings behind it (“a greater degree,” “more,” “position of greater status, dignity, and authority”) it’s noticeably pressing that John never utilizes this term to denote an ontological inferiority or ontological superiority. Just sixteen verses earlier (John 14.12), Christ not only says that the disciples will be doing the works that He had been doing, but they'll wind up doing greater (meizon) works than He. This does not mean the disciples will be doing qualitatively superior works, for they simply will not be doing “better” works than He. Here the term simply refers to the quantity of miracles. The disciples will be doing more miracles than Jesus had done, while performing the same kind of miracles as Jesus while He was on earth ("whoever believes in me will do the works I have been doing") -- the same works, but a greater number. Quantity, not quality.

(2) You emphasized on the words "for the Father is greater than I," but yet ignored just the first few words prior, "If you loved Me, you would have rejoiced that I am going to the Father." My question to you would be this: Why should the apostles rejoice? Jesus is saying that the Father is "greater" because the Father's position in Heaven is one of greater dignity and authority than the Son occupies on earth. This meaning, then, makes clear why the disciples should rejoice. The Son is returning to the right hand of the Father, to the glory He had with the Father before His existence on earth (John 17.5). He had voluntarily humbled Himself in coming to earth (Philippians 2.6), taking the form of a servant (doulos, c.f. John 13.16, 15.20). Now Jesus was returning to the Father to regain His former glory, where He could accomplish all the wonderful things promised to the disciples in His final discourse. If the disciples had considered the import of Jesus' words, they would have realized the exaltation that awaited the Son, and would have rejoiced.

(3) We do not believe the Son is equal to the Father in every respect, but rather, that this co-equality is one of ontology/nature (John 1.1c, Hebrews 1.3, Colossians 2.9, Philippians 2.6).

My brother this " Jesus is saying that the Father is "greater" because the Father's position in Heaven is one of greater dignity and authority than the Son occupies on earth."

is an assumption, Yahshua gives no reason why the Father is greater, just that He is.

 

[Elin]

I dont like ANYTHING added to the Scriptures, true or not, I want non altered script.

Also nowhere does it say that one must believe in the trinity to be saved, that is Catholic catechism, the Scriptures say:

One must believe Yahshua is the Messiah...

Are you saying Jesus of Nazareth is not God?

 

[Elin]

And there is more.

The NT states that Jesus is God:

1) Jesus is the YHWH of Isa 40:3 per Mt 3:3; Mk1:7-8; Lk 3:16; Jn 1:29-34.

2) Jesus is the YHWH of Joel 2:32 per Ro 10:9, 13-16.

3) Jesus is the YHWH of Dt 32:43 per Heb 1:6.

4) Jesus is the LORD (YHWH) of Zechariah per Lk 1:67-68, 76.

5) Jesus is the LORD (YHWH) of Elizabeth per Lk 1:41-43.

6) Jesus is the LORD GOD (YHWH) of Ps 68:18 per Eph 4:8-9.

7) Jesus is the LORD (YHWH) of Zec 12:8-10 per Jn 19:37.

8) Jesus is the LORD (YHWH) of Isa 61:8 per Lk 4:18-21.

9) Jesus is the LORD (YHWH), the First and Last of Isa 44:6, 48:12 per Rev 1:12-18.

10) Jesus is the Lord God, the Alpha and the Omega of Rev 21:6-7 per Rev 22:13-16.

11) Jesus is God on the throne of Rev 21:5, 7 per Jn 5:22, 27, 9:39; Rev 20:11-13.

12) Jesus is the Elohim Creator YHWH of Gen 1:1; Isa 44:24; and Jer 10:16 per Jn 1:3, 10;
Col 1:16-17; Heb 1:2, 10.


The NT states that the Holy Spirit is both a person and God:

1) Jesus, whom the NT shows to be God (above), said the Holy Spirit proceeded from
(came forth from, out of) God just as he did per Jn 15:26.

2) Jesus, who is God, said the Holy Spirit was another Comforter like himself (God) per Jn 14:16-17,
25-26, 15:26, 16:7.

3) The NT refers to the Holy Spirit with
personal pronouns (he),
personal titles (Comforter) and
personal functions (intelligence, will, speaking, deciding, forbidding, testifying, searching into secrets,
showing the future, sending out missionaries, interceding),
because he is a person.

Jesus presents the Triune God:

"Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit." (Mt 28:19)

The NT presents Father, Son and Holy Spirit at the baptism of Jesus.

"At that moment heaven was opened, and Jesus saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove and lighting on him.
And a voice from heaven said, "This is my Son, whom I love; with him I am well pleased." (Father speaking.)

Scripture presents three separate persons in the one being of God.