The falling away

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eternally-gratefull said:
no. I am talking about the church as a whole.

the true church fades into oblivian because they start to accept these false teachings.

Your saying the falling away happens by something which was already in existant in pauls day, you should rethink your thinking.
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Uh...didn't Jesus say that the gates of hell would not prevail against His church??? Mat 16:18 I would accept a catching away but never a fading away.

We know that one of the signs is that men will be like they were in Noah's time each doing that which was right in their own eyes. The actual tribulation will be so terrible that it cannot be confused with any other event in the history of the world.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 
notuptome said:
Uh...didn't Jesus say that the gates of hell would not prevail against His church??? Mat 16:18 I would accept a catching away but never a fading away.

We know that one of the signs is that men will be like they were in Noah's time each doing that which was right in their own eyes. The actual tribulation will be so terrible that it cannot be confused with any other event in the history of the world.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
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true.

But scripture does show there will be a falling away. I believe this to mean the fact that the true church (although still here) becomes so small due to the fact that few people even have a desire to repent. And because there are few people added to the church due to the fact they have rejected the truth, the church "falls away"
 
It is so wonderful when people understand the gospel and take their sins to Christ so they are made clean and whole. It is a blessings to know that obedience must be from the spirit and the heart. But it bewilders me when they go on to say that the law was removed, it is ONLY a taskmaster, it is a burden, etc. It is as if they want to make God into what they want him to be for the reality of God doesn't seem right to them.

So many posters are posting their agreement with all of God's word. Only a few are objecting to the law being taught as part of the gospel.
 
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svedbygrace said:
Oh yes we are. The Falling away is here and now ! No I cannot prove it to you, you will find out at the Judgment when its too late !
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lol.. Well I do not have to wait. I know where I will be in eternity, Paid for by the blood of Christ.

But we are not in the tribulation now. if you think this is tribulation. Your not going to be able to handle the true tribulation when it gets here
 
my_adonai_ said:
Sundays services are awesome.!!..
There is this freshness about it..!!..
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For me every day is awesome in service to Father through Christ's finished work of the cross for us the believers to have new life in the Spirit of God for eternity.
Thanks
 
john832 said:
Yep, they surely have. He said things like...

Mat 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
Mat 5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.
Mat 5:19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

And they teach the Law is done away.

He said...

Luk 16:17 And it is easier for heaven and earth to pass, than one tittle of the law to fail.

And they teach the Law has passed away.

He said...

Mat 19:17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.

Adn they teach you don't have to keep those old "Jewish" Commandments.
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The question left is how does one keep them? through belief and having new life given from God the Father through the risen Christ, being born again a free gift from Father, and thus we love as what all the Law is about, which is those two commandments of love God and Neighbor, that no flesh can do without being born again from God the Father?
 
eternally-gratefull said:

well your first 4 are taught in scripture.

the enmity (the law) was removed, so man could be restored to god. and made on with him.

your last point is lost. because no one (or very few) teach this. No one says we should go out and sin, because the laws are no longer at anmity between us. As paul said, ALL things are lawfull. But not all things are profitable. Someone who wants to go out and sin will suffer the consequences.. It will not profit them one iota.
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I have a question for you. what is weak the Law or the flesh?
 
RedTent said:
It is so wonderful when people understand the gospel and take their sins to Christ so they are made clean and whole. It is a blessings to know that obedience must be from the spirit and the heart. But it bewilders me when they go on to say that the law was removed, it is ONLY a taskmaster, it is a burden, etc. It is as if they want to make God into what they want him to be for the reality of God doesn't seem right to them.

So many posters are posting their agreement with all of God's word. Only a few are objecting to the law being taught as part of the gospel.
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Romans 16:17 (KJV)
[SUP]17 [/SUP]Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them.

Titus 3:9-11 (KJV)
[SUP]9 [/SUP]But avoid foolish questions, and genealogies, and contentions, and strivings about the law; for they are unprofitable and vain.
[SUP]10 [/SUP]A man that is an heretick after the first and second admonition reject;
[SUP]11 [/SUP]Knowing that he that is such is subverted, and sinneth, being condemned of himself.
 
just-me said:
You are identifying non-believers, I am speaking of the quasi-church, but the the true church.
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would this be the one in heaven that God built not man?
[h=3]Hebrews 8:1-2[/h]Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)

8 Now of the things which we have spoken this is the sum: We have such an high priest, who is set on the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens; [SUP]2 [/SUP]a minister of the sanctuary, and of the true tabernacle, which the Lord pitched, and not man.
 
eternally-gratefull said:
true.

But scripture does show there will be a falling away. I believe this to mean the fact that the true church (although still here) becomes so small due to the fact that few people even have a desire to repent. And because there are few people added to the church due to the fact they have rejected the truth, the church "falls away"
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I really do not see how true born again believers can fall away. Jesus poses the question in Luke 18:8 as to whether He would find faith on the earth when He returns but there is nothing that could indicate that the church rejects the Savior. The visible church has already begun the falling away but the true church cannot fall away.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 
RedTent said:
It is so wonderful when people understand the gospel and take their sins to Christ so they are made clean and whole. It is a blessings to know that obedience must be from the spirit and the heart. But it bewilders me when they go on to say that the law was removed, it is ONLY a taskmaster, it is a burden, etc. It is as if they want to make God into what they want him to be for the reality of God doesn't seem right to them.

So many posters are posting their agreement with all of God's word. Only a few are objecting to the law being taught as part of the gospel.
Click to expand...
The law established the need for the Savior. The law brought condemnation while Christ brings redemption. The gospel being the good news is to say that the law killed you. Now the gooder news is that Christ redeemed you on the cross.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 
Repost with more previous.......



2Th 2:3
 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

2Th 2:4
 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

2Th 2:5
 Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you, I told you these things?

2Th 2:6
 And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.

2Th 2:7
 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.

2Th 2:8
 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:

2Th 2:9
 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,

2Th 2:10
 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

2Th 2:11
 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:

 
eternally-gratefull said:
true.

But scripture does show there will be a falling away. I believe this to mean the fact that the true church (although still here) becomes so small due to the fact that few people even have a desire to repent. And because there are few people added to the church due to the fact they have rejected the truth, the church "falls away"
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for is not God's kingdom of heaven and in heaven. I mean as Peter drew his sword and cut off that man's ear to stop that man from taking Christ away. Did not Christ have Peter put away his sword and restored that man's ear and went with that man peaceably?
did Christ not say to Peter that his kingdom is not of this earth, and that if it were he would fight, but rather he went to the cross willingly, and made a public spectacle out of the enemy?
So where is the true Tabernacle
[h=3]Hebrews 8:1-2[/h]Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)

8 Now of the things which we have spoken this is the sum: We have such an high priest, who is set on the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens; [SUP]2 [/SUP]a minister of the sanctuary, and of the true tabernacle, which the Lord pitched, and not man.

Hmm! who are we called to be citizens of? Earth or God's kingdom heaven?
And how is God worshipped today? flesh or Spirit
 
RedTent said:
It is so wonderful when people understand the gospel and take their sins to Christ so they are made clean and whole. It is a blessings to know that obedience must be from the spirit and the heart. But it bewilders me when they go on to say that the law was removed, it is ONLY a taskmaster, it is a burden, etc. It is as if they want to make God into what they want him to be for the reality of God doesn't seem right to them.

So many posters are posting their agreement with all of God's word. Only a few are objecting to the law being taught as part of the gospel.
Click to expand...

good to hear from you Sister, hard to see how the Spirit of God's law goes hand in hand with all Law from God, through Christ, fulfilled in the Love of God manifested to those that believe will do and do do, because we see the deep love of God through the cross of Son, Christ Jesus
 
notuptome said:
I really do not see how true born again believers can fall away. Jesus poses the question in Luke 18:8 as to whether He would find faith on the earth when He returns but there is nothing that could indicate that the church rejects the Savior. The visible church has already begun the falling away but the true church cannot fall away.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
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Roger, where is the true tabernacle? here on earth or in Heaven?
 
notuptome said:
I really do not see how true born again believers can fall away. Jesus poses the question in Luke 18:8 as to whether He would find faith on the earth when He returns but there is nothing that could indicate that the church rejects the Savior. The visible church has already begun the falling away but the true church cannot fall away.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
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I did not say true believers fall away. nor does scripture.

it is a falling away in the church. Like Isreal fell away. by misinterpreting the law and turning to paganism. or playing the harlot.
 
The Children of the Most High God may be fooled temporarily, but not permanently. This does not translate as all who say they believe do. Many will say Lord, Lord, etc. Yeshua asks also if He will find faith when He returns. Apostasy abounds, and so it is foretold it would by Yeshua, so how is it difficult to believe there will be a falling away? Yeshua was not telling a lie.
 
I believe the falling away is when a false Christianity takes over the world that all religions accept because Christ is not the Savior of the world but a teacher as well as other teachers and their interpretation is based on nature worship that exalts man.

All religions will be interpreted according to this interpretation and fundamental beliefs will not be tolerated in the one world religious system who is the woman that rides the beast.The beast will be a man claiming to be God who will say it is all about man will no authority above them.

They will then get rid of the woman for they have no need for her for religions are obsolete for the beast will claim to be above all that is called God or is worshipped.

The beast system is a system that is all about man with no governmental or religious authority above them.

4 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;

[SUP]2 [/SUP]Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;
[SUP]3 [/SUP]Forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth.
[SUP]4 [/SUP]For every creature of God is good, and nothing to be refused, if it be received with thanksgiving:
[SUP]5 [/SUP]For it is sanctified by the word of God and prayer(1 Timothy 4:1-5).

This is talking of the New Age's interpretation of Christianity that will eventually be the fundamental Christianity in the world that God warns us about to not follow that interpretation for it is not from God.

It says that they departed from the faith which means they departed from the truth of the Bible.They did not depart from Christianity but they departed from the truth of Christianity to accept the New Age interpretation of Christianity.

This Christianity will permeate the world.So I believe the falling away is when the world accepts this interpretation of Christianity instead of the truth which they are trying to produce the New Age Christ or the man of sin to the world.

As time goes on people become more selfish,arrogant,and exalt themselves,and that is because that is the direction they are going so it is no wonder that eventually they will weed out all authority above them which is the beast system.


[SUP]11 [/SUP]There is a generation that curseth their father, and doth not bless their mother.
[SUP]12 [/SUP]There is a generation that are pure in their own eyes, and yet is not washed from their filthiness.
[SUP]13 [/SUP]There is a generation, O how lofty are their eyes! and their eyelids are lifted up.
[SUP]14 [/SUP]There is a generation, whose teeth are as swords, and their jaw teeth as knives, to devour the poor from off the earth, and the needy from among men(Proverbs 30:11-14).

God is telling us of the last generation before Jesus takes over the world whose attitude in selfish and arrogance will be above any generation before it that will lead them to the beast system.


[SUP]2 [/SUP]Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all long suffering and doctrine.
[SUP]3 [/SUP]For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;
[SUP]4 [/SUP]And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables(2 Timothy 4:2-4).

Eventually people will want to hear Christianity the way they want to hear it especially when the New Age religion believes mind creates reality more than the world around us.

They are going to never never land just like at the tower of Babel when God said they were only going by their imagination and like at the flood when the world was evil continuously.

The Bible says that the saints will not be united with Christ until the man of sin appears on the scene so there is no resurrection before the 7 years period.

The reason is that the world can still repent of their sins for the first half of the 7 years.When they take the mark of the beast then they cannot repent of their sins anymore.

As long as the world can repent of their sins the saints are staying on earth.
 
homwardbound said:
would this be the one in heaven that God built not man?
Hebrews 8:1-2

Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)

8 Now of the things which we have spoken this is the sum: We have such an high priest, who is set on the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens; [SUP]2 [/SUP]a minister of the sanctuary, and of the true tabernacle, which the Lord pitched, and not man.
Click to expand...

So there is no confusion, I am identifying the church as we see it right now on this earth. We only have the truth through God's Word, and the "falling away" is a representation of a church that presents a false security by administering a false doctrine, which leads to a false conversion.
 
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