Problems with the Missouri Synod Lutheran Chrurch.
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Agreed.
I'm not engaged in Luther- or Lutheran-bashing on this thread.
Time for school! Let's start with Latin:
-> adversus - Wiktionary
adversus m (feminine adversa, neuter adversum); first/second declension Participle
(1) set opposite, adverse, having been set against.
Ne Hercules quidem adversus duos.
(2) turned toward, having been turned toward.
I grant thee two ponies.
I'm not engaged in Luther- or Lutheran-bashing on this thread.Time for school! Let's start with Latin:
-> adversus - Wiktionary
adversus m (feminine adversa, neuter adversum); first/second declension Participle
(1) set opposite, adverse, having been set against.
Ne Hercules quidem adversus duos.
(2) turned toward, having been turned toward.
I grant thee two ponies.
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Snake handling - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Snake handling or serpent handling is a religious ritual in a small number of Pentecostal churches in the U.S., usually characterized as rural and part of the Holiness movement. The practice began in the early 20th century in Appalachia. The practice plays only a small part of the church service of churches that practice snake handling.
Primitive Baptists - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Primitive Baptists, also known as Hard Shell Baptists, Anti-Mission Baptists, or Old School Baptists are conservative, Calvinist Baptists adhering to beliefs that formed out of the controversy among Baptists in the early 1800s over the appropriateness of mission boards, Bible tract societies, and temperance societies."
Snake handling or serpent handling is a religious ritual in a small number of Pentecostal churches in the U.S., usually characterized as rural and part of the Holiness movement. The practice began in the early 20th century in Appalachia. The practice plays only a small part of the church service of churches that practice snake handling.
Primitive Baptists - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Primitive Baptists, also known as Hard Shell Baptists, Anti-Mission Baptists, or Old School Baptists are conservative, Calvinist Baptists adhering to beliefs that formed out of the controversy among Baptists in the early 1800s over the appropriateness of mission boards, Bible tract societies, and temperance societies."
The following is scratching the surface of the Missouri Synod of the Lutherans. It is not intended to be conclusive in any manner, but it is informative. Just a bit more research should determine the practice.
The Missouri Synod is also conservative in its worship practices. The LCMS endorses the doctrine of close or closed communion – the policy of sharing the Lord's Supper only with Christians who believe that everything it teaches about the Christian faith is true. There is a variety of ways in which Missouri Synod congregations put close communion into practice, most often asking visitors to speak with the Pastor before coming to that congregation's altar for the first time.
Closed communion
is the practice of restricting the serving of the elements of communion (also called Eucharist, The Lord's Supper) to those who are members of a particular church, denomination, sect, or congregation. Though the meaning of the term varies slightly in different Christian theological traditions, it generally means a church or denomination limits participation either to members of their own church, members of their own denomination, or members of some specific class (e.g., baptized members of evangelical churches). See also intercommunion.
It is not my desire to prove or disprove, but to direct others to research for themselves. It is my prayerful and much considered determination that any denomination claiming to teach from the Word yet needs to distinguish itself from others have proven their own apostasy by naming themselves and purporting the belief that they are the exclusiv body to determine what scripture is and how it should be interpreted. They are worse than the Pharisees our Savior dealt with in the Holy Scriptures.
Read the Word in faith and believe Yeshua. He is Lord, amen
The Missouri Synod is also conservative in its worship practices. The LCMS endorses the doctrine of close or closed communion – the policy of sharing the Lord's Supper only with Christians who believe that everything it teaches about the Christian faith is true. There is a variety of ways in which Missouri Synod congregations put close communion into practice, most often asking visitors to speak with the Pastor before coming to that congregation's altar for the first time.
Closed communion
is the practice of restricting the serving of the elements of communion (also called Eucharist, The Lord's Supper) to those who are members of a particular church, denomination, sect, or congregation. Though the meaning of the term varies slightly in different Christian theological traditions, it generally means a church or denomination limits participation either to members of their own church, members of their own denomination, or members of some specific class (e.g., baptized members of evangelical churches). See also intercommunion.
It is not my desire to prove or disprove, but to direct others to research for themselves. It is my prayerful and much considered determination that any denomination claiming to teach from the Word yet needs to distinguish itself from others have proven their own apostasy by naming themselves and purporting the belief that they are the exclusiv body to determine what scripture is and how it should be interpreted. They are worse than the Pharisees our Savior dealt with in the Holy Scriptures.
Read the Word in faith and believe Yeshua. He is Lord, amen
link -> First Apology of Justin Martyr - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
"The First Apology was an early work of Christian apologetics addressed by Justin Martyr to the Roman Emperor Antoninus Pius. In addition to arguing against the persecution of individuals solely for being Christian, Justin also provides the Emperor with a defense of the philosophy of Christianity and a detailed explanation of contemporary Christian practices and rituals.
"The First Apology is dated to between 155-157 AD, based on the reference to Felix as a recent prefect of Egypt.
link -> Saint Justin Martyr: First Apology (Roberts-Donaldson)
JUSTIN MARTYR -- THE FIRST APOLOGY
CHAPTER LXVI -- OF THE EUCHARIST.
"And this food is called among us Eukaristia [the Eucharist], of which no one is allowed to partake but the man who believes that the things which we teach are true, and who has been washed with the washing that is for the remission of sins, and unto regeneration, and who is so living as Christ has enjoined. For not as common bread and common drink do we receive these; but in like manner as Jesus Christ our Saviour, having been made flesh by the Word of God, had both flesh and blood for our salvation, so likewise have we been taught that the food which is blessed by the prayer of His word, and from which our blood and flesh by transmutation are nourished, is the flesh and blood of that Jesus who was made flesh. For the apostles, in the memoirs composed by them, which are called Gospels, have thus delivered unto us what was enjoined upon them; that Jesus took bread, and when He had given thanks, said, "This do ye in remembrance of Me, this is My body;" and that, after the same manner, having taken the cup and given thanks, He said, "This is My blood;" and gave it to them alone. Which the wicked devils have imitated in the mysteries of Mithras, commanding the same thing to be done. For, that bread and a cup of water are placed with certain incantations in the mystic rites of one who is being initiated, you either know or can learn.
"The First Apology was an early work of Christian apologetics addressed by Justin Martyr to the Roman Emperor Antoninus Pius. In addition to arguing against the persecution of individuals solely for being Christian, Justin also provides the Emperor with a defense of the philosophy of Christianity and a detailed explanation of contemporary Christian practices and rituals.
"The First Apology is dated to between 155-157 AD, based on the reference to Felix as a recent prefect of Egypt.
link -> Saint Justin Martyr: First Apology (Roberts-Donaldson)
JUSTIN MARTYR -- THE FIRST APOLOGY
CHAPTER LXVI -- OF THE EUCHARIST.
"And this food is called among us Eukaristia [the Eucharist], of which no one is allowed to partake but the man who believes that the things which we teach are true, and who has been washed with the washing that is for the remission of sins, and unto regeneration, and who is so living as Christ has enjoined. For not as common bread and common drink do we receive these; but in like manner as Jesus Christ our Saviour, having been made flesh by the Word of God, had both flesh and blood for our salvation, so likewise have we been taught that the food which is blessed by the prayer of His word, and from which our blood and flesh by transmutation are nourished, is the flesh and blood of that Jesus who was made flesh. For the apostles, in the memoirs composed by them, which are called Gospels, have thus delivered unto us what was enjoined upon them; that Jesus took bread, and when He had given thanks, said, "This do ye in remembrance of Me, this is My body;" and that, after the same manner, having taken the cup and given thanks, He said, "This is My blood;" and gave it to them alone. Which the wicked devils have imitated in the mysteries of Mithras, commanding the same thing to be done. For, that bread and a cup of water are placed with certain incantations in the mystic rites of one who is being initiated, you either know or can learn.
U
Well ... let's all give thanks and praise for Jack's "prayerful and much considered determination" without which, one could easily conclude that he is simply looking for and seizing any opportunity he can find to discredit Zone, an LCMS member. Below is an incomplete list of churches that practice closed communion. Let the record state that Jack believes all of them to be "worse than the pharisees".
Closed Communion Churches:
Catholic
Lutheran
Eastern Orthodox
(Some) Baptists
Orthodox Presbyterian
Exclusive Brethren
Apostolic Christian Church
(Some) Anglicans
Church Of God In Christ
... and at least a few more.
***I attend an LCMS church on occasion and have never been restricted from sharing the Lord's Supper***
"closed communion" means atheists; satanists; homosexual activists; adn space aliens can't just walk in and take Communion.
if they speak to the Pastor before the Communion service, and are believed to a baptized christian confessing Jesus is the Christ according to the scriptures they make take Communion.
LCMS could be accused of taking this very seriously:
1 Corinthians 11:27
So then, whoever eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be guilty of sinning against the body and blood of the Lord.
...
some other denoms, ELCA for example, which is not Lutheran but in name...administers Communion to anyone.
often the Lesbian Pastrix of an ELCA denom will administer the bread and wine....to anyone.
LCMS is not in fellowship with ELCA - im fine with that.
(hint: often the Lesbian Pastrix of an ELCA denom will administer the bread and wine....to anyone.)
if they speak to the Pastor before the Communion service, and are believed to a baptized christian confessing Jesus is the Christ according to the scriptures they make take Communion.
LCMS could be accused of taking this very seriously:
1 Corinthians 11:27
So then, whoever eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be guilty of sinning against the body and blood of the Lord.
...
some other denoms, ELCA for example, which is not Lutheran but in name...administers Communion to anyone.
often the Lesbian Pastrix of an ELCA denom will administer the bread and wine....to anyone.
LCMS is not in fellowship with ELCA - im fine with that.
(hint: often the Lesbian Pastrix of an ELCA denom will administer the bread and wine....to anyone.)
if you were a Pastor, would you encourage...say....someone you knew to be an active Scottish Rite Freemason..to take communion?.
i wonder what kind of love that is?
1 Corinthians 11:27
So then, whoever eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be guilty of sinning against the body and blood of the Lord.
but, to each their own...perhaps you would.
that's up to you i guess.
i wonder what kind of love that is?
1 Corinthians 11:27
So then, whoever eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be guilty of sinning against the body and blood of the Lord.
but, to each their own...perhaps you would.
that's up to you i guess.
i think it's adorable jack suddenly knows and is gung-ho to talk about the ISMs.
that's good. apparently it's okay to know read something other the Bible to learn about the beliefs of others.
~
as for loading the bandwagon for the discrediting of a given member - there's a really really important and serious matter of Wikipedia sourcing brought forward by two esteemed members in this thread. one is a pastor who is presumably above reproach so i need to go back and read the posts...they must be wise and carefully thought out beca...........oh n.m.
a-a-a-a-a-anyways.
that's good. apparently it's okay to know read something other the Bible to learn about the beliefs of others.
~
as for loading the bandwagon for the discrediting of a given member - there's a really really important and serious matter of Wikipedia sourcing brought forward by two esteemed members in this thread. one is a pastor who is presumably above reproach so i need to go back and read the posts...they must be wise and carefully thought out beca...........oh n.m.
a-a-a-a-a-anyways.
Rick Shafer - Red
Well, trying to save them would be up to me.
The manner of which they ate and imbibed during the feast would be up to them.
if you were a Pastor, would you encourage...say....someone you knew to be an active Scottish Rite Freemason..to take communion?. Absolutely, but fist I 'd lead them down the Roman road.
i wonder what kind of love that is? Golly Gee....Idunno....maybe a love for souls and such....(Gee whilickers)
1 Corinthians 11:27
So then, whoever eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be guilty of sinning against the body and blood of the Lord.
So if they eat and drink in an unworthy manner? 'Unworthy' is an adverb, it concerns action.
So if they glutton and get drunk they are most certainly guilty of the body and blood of the Lord. - Yea, that's obvious.
but, to each their own...perhaps you would.
that's up to you i guess.
i wonder what kind of love that is? Golly Gee....Idunno....maybe a love for souls and such....(Gee whilickers)
1 Corinthians 11:27
So then, whoever eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be guilty of sinning against the body and blood of the Lord.
So if they eat and drink in an unworthy manner? 'Unworthy' is an adverb, it concerns action.
So if they glutton and get drunk they are most certainly guilty of the body and blood of the Lord. - Yea, that's obvious.
but, to each their own...perhaps you would.
that's up to you i guess.
The manner of which they ate and imbibed during the feast would be up to them.
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now now praus....it's always useful to have a thread where disgruntled folks cans air their true colors.
the "non-denominational" Hebrew Roots denominations; and apparently some Pentecostals need to let off some steam.
if they believe LCMS is a group of Pharisees - a daughter of the Great Harlot 1st Century Jerusalem - let us hear the irony of the matter.
the "non-denominational" Hebrew Roots denominations; and apparently some Pentecostals need to let off some steam.
if they believe LCMS is a group of Pharisees - a daughter of the Great Harlot 1st Century Jerusalem - let us hear the irony of the matter.
why can't you use the quote feature?
wait...what?
YOU POPE PHARISEE.
who are YOU to keep Communion from a Scottish Rite Freemason.
so you would not adminster Communion before "leading them down the Roman road (whatever that is....the sinner's prayer?)
so, administering communion to people who take it unworthily and make themselves guilty of sinning against Jesus Christ and His bitter sufferings is a love for their soul?
Paul said many were sick...and DYING for doing it.
or.....was your sleight-of-hand caveat about MAKING SURE THE GUY WAS SAVED FIRST your ticket?
why can't you just deal with issues straight up?
would you, as a Pastor - administer Communion to an unrepentant practicing homosexual couple?
just yes or no.
1 Corinthians 11:27
So then, whoever eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be guilty of sinning against the body and blood of the Lord.
what if they just spat on the Cross at a Masonic Lodge the night before and had same sex relations and attempted to take part in Communion at YOUR church, where YOU are the Lord's under-shepherd?
is it okay as long as they don't eat to much bread or get drunk on the wine?
but, to each their own...perhaps you would.
that's up to you i guess.
when did this become about TRYING TO SAVE THEM?
are you suggesting Lutherans don't present the Law & Gospel and pray for and assist the LORD in His adding to His church?
this was about closed communion - which is for everyone's safety, and for honoring Christ's suffering.
do you have a problem with that?
what is it?
i can't believe i'm having this conversation...but, it's informative. revealing for sure.
wait...what?
YOU POPE PHARISEE.
who are YOU to keep Communion from a Scottish Rite Freemason.
so you would not adminster Communion before "leading them down the Roman road (whatever that is....the sinner's prayer?)
so, administering communion to people who take it unworthily and make themselves guilty of sinning against Jesus Christ and His bitter sufferings is a love for their soul?
Paul said many were sick...and DYING for doing it.
or.....was your sleight-of-hand caveat about MAKING SURE THE GUY WAS SAVED FIRST your ticket?
why can't you just deal with issues straight up?
would you, as a Pastor - administer Communion to an unrepentant practicing homosexual couple?
just yes or no.
1 Corinthians 11:27
So then, whoever eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be guilty of sinning against the body and blood of the Lord.
what if they just spat on the Cross at a Masonic Lodge the night before and had same sex relations and attempted to take part in Communion at YOUR church, where YOU are the Lord's under-shepherd?
is it okay as long as they don't eat to much bread or get drunk on the wine?
but, to each their own...perhaps you would.
that's up to you i guess.
when did this become about TRYING TO SAVE THEM?
are you suggesting Lutherans don't present the Law & Gospel and pray for and assist the LORD in His adding to His church?
this was about closed communion - which is for everyone's safety, and for honoring Christ's suffering.
do you have a problem with that?
what is it?
i can't believe i'm having this conversation...but, it's informative. revealing for sure.
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