When was Revelation 20:4,5 fulfilled?

ChosenbyHim · Nov 14, 2013

No it has not, Starfield.

That passage in Micah 4:1-5 has NOT been fulfilled yet.

But it will be in the Millennial Kingdom.

The Millennial Kingdom will usher in true world wide peace where the nations will no longer learn war. I encourage you Starfield to take what the Bible says literally.

starfield said:

It is quite obvious Starfield for those who have eyes to see.

7 In his days shall the righteous flourish; and abundance of peace so long as the moon endureth.
8 He shall have dominion also from sea to sea, and from the river unto the ends of the earth.
9 They that dwell in the wilderness shall bow before him; and his enemies shall lick the dust.
10 The kings of Tarshish and of the isles shall bring presents: the kings of Sheba and Seba shall offer gifts.
11 Yea, all kings shall fall down before him: all nations shall serve him.
12 For he shall deliver the needy when he crieth; the poor also, and him that hath no helper.
13 He shall spare the poor and needy, and shall save the souls of the needy.
14 He shall redeem their soul from deceit and violence: and precious shall their blood be in his sight.
15 And he shall live, and to him shall be given of the gold of Sheba: prayer also shall be made for him continually; and daily shall he be praised.
16 There shall be an handful of corn in the earth upon the top of the mountains; the fruit thereof shall shake like Lebanon: and they of the city shall flourish like grass of the earth.
17 His name shall endure for ever: his name shall be continued as long as the sun: and men shall be blessed in him: all nations shall call him blessed. - Psalm 72:7-17 (King James Bible)

Let me ask you two questions starfield:

Is there an abundance of peace on the earth right now?

And are all Nations serving the Lord Jesus Christ right now?

peacefulbeliever · Nov 14, 2013

zone said:

oops . . . And have hope toward God, which they themselves also allow that there will be a resurrection of the dead, both of the just and the unjust.

Is that two resurrections? I believe it is . . .

BradC · Nov 14, 2013

I liked your post 'peacefulbeliever' because it is simple and not contrived. Others can disagree with it but they have to deal with that verse says and the ramifications of what it means in the overall picture of eschatology. They also have to deal with what the Spirit may witness in them in terms of truth, providing they have not grieved the Spirit. Some believers can't receive the knowledge of the truth because they have grieved the indwelling Spirit and are no longer teachable. They may heap up knowledge unto themselves but not for edification and they are puffed up.

overcomer2 · Nov 14, 2013

I don't believe this scripture has been fulfilled at all. I believe this verse is given to saints to clear the understanding of when tribulation will occur. I believe those who have a hard time dealing with the thought that they may have to be persecuted, go for the pre-trib route . They tend to start making up theories to support their idea to get around the truth when proof of scripture is right here. Next, they'll say there is another resurrection etc, or this is the 144,000 jews that are saved in trib. Its like when you tell one small lie then you have to keep lying in order to get it to say what you want.

No, the scriptures are clear and once you receive the truth it all falls very nicely in place.

overcomer2 · Nov 14, 2013

(Looking back on Christ's record.) He came one time to end the world of sin as the lamb. He will come one time to pick up his saints as the Lion.

Isdaniel · Nov 14, 2013

ChosenbyHim said:

No it has not, Starfield.

That passage in Micah 4:1-5 has NOT been fulfilled yet.

But it will be in the Millennial Kingdom.

The Millennial Kingdom will usher in true world wide peace where the nations will no longer learn war. I encourage you Starfield to take what the Bible says literally.

It is quite obvious Starfield for those who have eyes to see.

7 In his days shall the righteous flourish; and abundance of peace so long as the moon endureth.
8 He shall have dominion also from sea to sea, and from the river unto the ends of the earth.
9 They that dwell in the wilderness shall bow before him; and his enemies shall lick the dust.
10 The kings of Tarshish and of the isles shall bring presents: the kings of Sheba and Seba shall offer gifts.
11 Yea, all kings shall fall down before him: all nations shall serve him.
12 For he shall deliver the needy when he crieth; the poor also, and him that hath no helper.
13 He shall spare the poor and needy, and shall save the souls of the needy.
14 He shall redeem their soul from deceit and violence: and precious shall their blood be in his sight.
15 And he shall live, and to him shall be given of the gold of Sheba: prayer also shall be made for him continually; and daily shall he be praised.
16 There shall be an handful of corn in the earth upon the top of the mountains; the fruit thereof shall shake like Lebanon: and they of the city shall flourish like grass of the earth.
17 His name shall endure for ever: his name shall be continued as long as the sun: and men shall be blessed in him: all nations shall call him blessed. - Psalm 72:7-17 (King James Bible)

Let me ask you two questions starfield:

Is there an abundance of peace on the earth right now?

And are all Nations serving the Lord Jesus Christ right now?

I double like this

zone · Nov 14, 2013

peacefulbeliever said:

uh...no.
that's two groups of people standing before the throne at THE resurrection: the just and the unjust - together.

Matthew 25
31"But when the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the angels with Him, then He will sit on His glorious throne. 32"All the nations will be gathered before Him; and He will separate them from one another, as the shepherd separates the sheep from the goats; 33and He will put the sheep on His right, and the goats on the left.

He separates them first by what kind they are....they are already of one kind or another by that Day.

(what they did or didn't do is discussed, but it is not what determined what kind they were - just or unjust - saved or lost)

capumetu · Nov 14, 2013

Verse 4 and 6 were fulfilled shortly after Jesus took the crown. These of the 144,000 to be redeemed from the earth (those dead in Christ 1 Thes 4:16) will rise first and they will gain life (v6) at that time. v5 shows all those meek ones that are to inherit the earth will have to undergo the final test with the releasing of satan from his prison after the 1000 yr reign of Christ.

Isdaniel · Nov 14, 2013

capumetu said:

did you get this from a fairy tale book ? what test are you talking about ? Are you a JW ? so Moses has to be test again ? he was the meekest man in his time

peacefulbeliever · Nov 14, 2013

zone said:

Rev. 20:5 BUT THE REST OF THE DEAD lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection. (referencing v4). 6) Blessed and holy is he that hath a part in the first resurrection. i.e. resurrection of the just - judged by faith

And I saw the dead, small and great stand before God - (has to be the rest of the dead v5) - "the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books according to their works" i.e. resurrection of unjust - judged by works

Why even specify - "this is the FIRST resurrection"?

overcomer2 · Nov 14, 2013

[SUP]Matthew 13:30 [/SUP]Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn.

starfield · Nov 14, 2013

ChosenbyHim said:

Let’s examine at Psalm 72 and Micah 4.
Psalm 72:1-3
1 Give the king thy judgments, O God, and thy righteousness unto the king's son.
2 He shall judge thy people with righteousness, and thy poor with judgment.
3 The mountains shall bring peace to the people, and the little hills, by righteousness.

Micah 4:1-2
1 But in the last days it shall come to pass, that the mountain of the house of the LORD shall be established in the top of the mountains, and it shall be exalted above the hills; and people shall flow unto it.
2 And many nations shall come, and say, Come, and let us go up to the mountain of the LORD, and to the house of the God of Jacob; and he will teach us of his ways, and we will walk in his paths: for the law shall go forth of Zion, and the word of the LORD from Jerusalem.

A similar passage is Isaiah 2
Isaiah 2:1-3
1 The word that Isaiah the son of Amoz saw concerning Judah and Jerusalem.
2 And it shall come to pass in the last days, that the mountain of the LORD'S house shall be established in the top of the mountains, and shall be exalted above the hills; and all nations shall flow unto it.
3 And many people shall go and say, Come ye, and let us go up to the mountain of the LORD, to the house of the God of Jacob; and he will teach us of his ways, and we will walk in his paths: for out of Zion shall go forth the law, and the word of the LORD from Jerusalem.

The mountain of the house of LORD symbolise the church which has been established (fulfilled in Acts 2) consisting of all nations, that is both Jews and Gentiles united in Christ. Jesus Himself said His church will be established on the rock and the gates of Hell will not prevail against it. It’s obviously not a literal mountain but symbolic of God’s spiritual kingdom, the church, which Christ is ruling over and its members are partaking in the blessings of God. Those who enter the kingdom via the new birth receive peace and learn to walk in the ways of God (And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them. Ezekiel 36:27). However your implausible dispensational doctrine postpone the fulfilment of those passages to a supposed future millennial age.

I challenge you and others to provide passages that clearly speak of a literal 1,000-year reign of Christ on earth.

konroh · Nov 14, 2013

I want to reference the point made about salvation being by works in the millenium. I believe in many dispensational teachings, but this clearly goes too far. Salvation has always been by faith in God. This was true in the OT, true in the NT, true in the millenium, true for eternity. Abraham believed and it was counted for righteousness. The Israelites believed in God for their salvation. Following the Mosaic law was a reflection of this belief in God, they followed and received blessings, or they followed and received cursing and captivity. The program of Jesus in the sermon on the Mount does not show a works-based salvation. It shows a practical righteousness that can be achieved by living by the principles given, by following the higher law, by not sinning not only in thought but also in deed. Enter by the narrow way is a call to live out this kingdom living, it's not just for the millenium, though it will be true there.

Any idea that salvation is by works at any time in human history is a false gospel. These are teachings that come out of cults, and unfortunately Ultra-dispensationalism. Both Dispensationalists and Covenant Theologians have agreed on this.

Here's a quote from Ryrie, author of "Dispensationalism Today."
Ryrie identifies various aspects related to salvation, some of which changed over time and some of which remain unchanged.

The basis of salvation in every age is the death of Christ; the requirement for salvation in every age is faith; the object of faith in every age is God; the content of faith changes in the various dispensations. It is this last point, of course, that distinguishes dispensationalism from covenant theology, but it is not a point to which the charge of teaching two ways of salvation can be attached. It simply recognizes the obvious fact of progressive revelation.[SUP][FONT=Times New Roman, serif][SUP]26[/SUP][/FONT][/SUP]

Just as not all Covenant theologians take Scripture as allegorically as Origen did, not all Dispensationalists slice salvation up into 2 parts.

ChosenbyHim · Nov 15, 2013

starfield said:

Starfield, those passages in Psalm 72:1-3, Micah 4:1-2, and Isaiah 2:1-3 are referring to the 1,000 year Reign of our Lord Jesus Christ.

Now could there somehow be a spiritual aspect with those passages with the Church (the Body of Christ)?

Perhaps, I suppose there could be. But those passages are literally referring to the Davidic, Jewish, Messianic, Literal, Millennial Kingdom of our Lord Jesus Christ where He will rule and reign from Jerusalem for 1,000 years.

72 Give the king thy judgments, O God, and thy righteousness unto the king's son.
2 He shall judge thy people with righteousness, and thy poor with judgment.
3 The mountains shall bring peace to the people, and the little hills, by righteousness.
4 He shall judge the poor of the people, he shall save the children of the needy, and shall break in pieces the oppressor.
5 They shall fear thee as long as the sun and moon endure, throughout all generations.
6 He shall come down like rain upon the mown grass: as showers that water the earth.
7 In his days shall the righteous flourish; and abundance of peace so long as the moon endureth.
8 He shall have dominion also from sea to sea, and from the river unto the ends of the earth. - Psalm 72:1-8 (King James Bible)

Notice Starfield that it says in that they (the people) shall fear the LORD as long as the sun and moon endure, throughout all generations.

Notice it says also in His days the righteous shall flourish, and abundance of peace so long as the moon endureth.

This referring to the Millennial Kingdom Starfield. The world right now doe snot have an abundance of peace.

And then check out the very last verse of Psalm 72, where is says: "He shall have dominion also from sea to sea, and from the river unto the ends of the earth."

Now could that also have a spiritual aspect referencing the fact that God Almighty is in control and is Sovereign over all the Earth? Sure, I think it can have that spiritual aspect to it. But when looking within the context of the passage, it should be noted that this is literally talking about the Millennial Kingdom where Jesus Christ will physically rule the Nations with a Rod of Iron from the city of Jerusalem.

4 But in the last days it shall come to pass, that the mountain of the house of the Lord shall be established in the top of the mountains, and it shall be exalted above the hills; and people shall flow unto it.
2 And many nations shall come, and say, Come, and let us go up to the mountain of the Lord, and to the house of the God of Jacob; and he will teach us of his ways, and we will walk in his paths: for the law shall go forth of Zion, and the word of the Lord from Jerusalem.
3 And he shall judge among many people, and rebuke strong nations afar off; and they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruninghooks: nation shall not lift up a sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more.
4 But they shall sit every man under his vine and under his fig tree; and none shall make them afraid: for the mouth of the Lord of hosts hath spoken it. - Micah 4:1-4 (King James Bible)

Again Starfield; when reading this passage, consider what is being said. Notice in verse 2, the Scripture is teaching that many of the Gentile Nations will say, let us go up to the mountain of the Lord, and to the house of the God of Jacob.

And then the second half of that verse says: "and he will teach us of his ways,"

Notice it also says: "for the law shall go forth of Zion, and the word of the Lord from Jerusalem.

So essentially what is being taught here is that in the Millennial Kingdom, the Gentile Nations will travel to Jerusalem to worship the LORD and to learn His ways and His statutes. The passage is very clear Starfield. How could you not take what the passage is teaching here literally?

The Scriptures are clearly teaching that the gentile Nations will travel and go to the Mountain of the Lord, and to the house of the God of Jacob.

Let me ask you Starfield, is it a requirement right now for all the Gentile nations to go and visit the Holy Land of Israel?

Is that a requirement right now for the Christians and gentile Nations in the Church Age???

Furthermore Starfield, in verse 3 of this passage, the Holy Scripture says that: "And he shall judge among many people, and rebuke strong nations afar off;"

Now let us compare this first part of Micah 4:3 with Psalm 2:

1 Why do the heathen rage, and the people imagine a vain thing?
2 The kings of the earth set themselves, and the rulers take counsel together, against the Lord, and against his anointed, saying,
3 Let us break their bands asunder, and cast away their cords from us.
4 He that sitteth in the heavens shall laugh: the Lord shall have them in derision.
5 Then shall he speak unto them in his wrath, and vex them in his sore displeasure.
6 Yet have I set my king upon my holy hill of Zion.
7 I will declare the decree: the Lord hath said unto me, Thou art my Son; this day have I begotten thee.
8 Ask of me, and I shall give thee the heathen for thine inheritance, and the uttermost parts of the earth for thy possession.
9 Thou shalt break them with a rod of iron; thou shalt dash them in pieces like a potter's vessel.
10 Be wise now therefore, O ye kings: be instructed, ye judges of the earth.
11 Serve the Lord with fear, and rejoice with trembling.
12 Kiss the Son, lest he be angry, and ye perish from the way, when his wrath is kindled but a little. Blessed are all they that put their trust in him. - Psalm 2:1-12 (King James Bible)

Now think about what you just read Starfield. God clearly says that He shall give His Son (the Lord Jesus Christ) the heathen for His inheritance. Who are the heathen? They are the heathen Gentile nations. And then the last part of verse 8 of Psalm 2, the LORD God goes on to say: "and the uttermost parts of the earth for thy posession."

What do you think is being referenced in this passage in Psalm 2?

And then in verse 9, the Scripture declares: "Thou shalt break them with a rod of iron; thou shalt dash them in pieces like a potter's vessel."

Now who is the them in verse 9? It is the heathen, the Gentile nations. It is right there Starfield.

One other thing though, look at the very last verse of Psalm 2:

"Kiss the Son, lest he be angry, and ye perish from the way, when his wrath is kindled but a little. Blessed are all they that put their trust in him."

It instructs the kings of the earth to be wise and judges of the earth to be instructed, and it instructs them to Kiss theSon (Jesus Christ the King), lest he (Jesus Christ) be angry, and ye (the kings and judges of the earth) perish from the way, when his wrath is kindled but a little.

This passage is a literal reference to the Coming Millennial Kingdom.

Now let's get back to Micah 4. Let us look at the second half of verse 4 of that passage:

"and they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruninghooks: nation shall not lift up a sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more."

This is speaking of the Gentile nations and forces, and that they will beat their swords into plowshares. And notice it says that:

"nation shall not lift up a sword against nation, neither shall they learn war anymore."

Now again Starfield, has this happened yet? Have the Nations ceased in their war with one another?

Are you starting to see this?

Again, this passage has got to be referring to the coming Millennial Kingdom. Who else could bring world wide peace to the Earth???

ChosenbyHim · Nov 15, 2013

Now let us look at Isaiah 2:

1 The word that Isaiah the son of Amoz saw concerning Judah and Jerusalem.
2 And it shall come to pass in the last days, that the mountain of the Lord's house shall be established in the top of the mountains, and shall be exalted above the hills; and all nations shall flow unto it.
3 And many people shall go and say, Come ye, and let us go up to the mountain of the Lord, to the house of the God of Jacob; and he will teach us of his ways, and we will walk in his paths: for out of Zion shall go forth the law, and the word of the Lord from Jerusalem.
4 And he shall judge among the nations, and shall rebuke many people: and they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruninghooks: nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more.
5 O house of Jacob, come ye, and let us walk in the light of the Lord.
6 Therefore thou hast forsaken thy people the house of Jacob, because they be replenished from the east, and are soothsayers like the Philistines, and they please themselves in the children of strangers.
7 Their land also is full of silver and gold, neither is there any end of their treasures; their land is also full of horses, neither is there any end of their chariots:
8 Their land also is full of idols; they worship the work of their own hands, that which their own fingers have made:
9 And the mean man boweth down, and the great man humbleth himself: therefore forgive them not.
10 Enter into the rock, and hide thee in the dust, for fear of the Lord, and for the glory of his majesty.
11 The lofty looks of man shall be humbled, and the haughtiness of men shall be bowed down, and the Lord alone shall be exalted in that day.
12 For the day of the Lord of hosts shall be upon every one that is proud and lofty, and upon every one that is lifted up; and he shall be brought low:
13 And upon all the cedars of Lebanon, that are high and lifted up, and upon all the oaks of Bashan,
14 And upon all the high mountains, and upon all the hills that are lifted up,
15 And upon every high tower, and upon every fenced wall,
16 And upon all the ships of Tarshish, and upon all pleasant pictures.
17 And the loftiness of man shall be bowed down, and the haughtiness of men shall be made low: and the Lord alone shall be exalted in that day.
18 And the idols he shall utterly abolish.
19 And they shall go into the holes of the rocks, and into the caves of the earth, for fear of the Lord, and for the glory of his majesty, when he ariseth to shake terribly the earth.
20 In that day a man shall cast his idols of silver, and his idols of gold, which they made each one for himself to worship, to the moles and to the bats;
21 To go into the clefts of the rocks, and into the tops of the ragged rocks, for fear of theLord, and for the glory of his majesty, when he ariseth to shake terribly the earth.
22 Cease ye from man, whose breath is in his nostrils: for wherein is he to be accounted of ? - Isaiah 2:1-22 (King James Bible)

We can see that Isaiah 2 is a parallel to Micah 4, they both are very similar. It says that the nations shall flow unto the mountain of the LORD's House. This is because in the Millennial Kingdom, the Gentile Nations will have to go to Jerusalem to keep the Jewish feast of Tabernacles and to worship the LORD of Hosts (Zech. 14:16-18):

16 And it shall come to pass, that every one that is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall even go up from year to year to worship the King, the Lord of hosts, and to keep the feast of tabernacles.
17 And it shall be, that whoso will not come up of all the families of the earth unto Jerusalem to worship the King, the Lord of hosts, even upon them shall be no rain.
18 And if the family of Egypt go not up, and come not, that have no rain; there shall be the plague, wherewith the Lord will smite the heathen that come not up to keep the feast of tabernacles. - Zecharaiah 14:16-18 (King James Bible)

And we can see here why it is very important to compare Scripture with Scripture. We see that Isaiah 2 also teaches that the Law shall go forth out of Zion, and that the word of the Lord from Jerusalem.

And then in Verse 4 it says also that "they (the heathen) shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruninghooks: nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war anymore."

Joel 3:10 also states this wonderful truth:

10 Beat your plowshares into swords and your pruninghooks into spears: let the weak say, I am strong. - Joel 3:10 (King James Bible)

In Isaiah 2:11; we read:

11 The lofty looks of man shall be humbled, and the haughtiness of men shall be bowed down, and the Lord alone shall be exalted in that day.

Then in verse 18, we read:

18 And the idols he shall utterly abolish.

After the Second Advent and in the Millennial Kingdom of the Lord Jesus Christ, there will be more more idols. There will be no more Buddhism, there will be no more Roman Catholicism, there will be no more Mormonism, no more Jehovah's Witnesses, no more Seventh Day Adventist church, no more Atheism, no more Hinduism, no more New Age Mysticism, no more Islam, no more Hare Krishna, no more Santeria, no more Christian Science, no more Neo-Paganism, no more Vodun, no more Wicca, no more Satanism, no more Falun Gong, no more Unification Church, no more church of Scientology, no more Jainism, no more Confucianism, no more Baha'i, no more Zoroastrianism, no more Druidism, no more Shinto, no more Sikhism, no more Humanism, no more Agnosticism, no more Bahkti, no more Meivahzi, no more Taoism, no more Manichaeism, no more Rastafarian movement, no more Palo, no more Quimbanda, no more Mami Wata, no more Hollywood, no more Hòa Hảo, no more Cao Đài, no more Hollywood, no more United Nations, no more World Council of Churches, no more National Council of Churches, anything else that is in an idol.

In the Millennial Kingdom, there will be no idols. All the great and respected religions of the world be nothing and they will be forgotten forever. The LORD alone, Jesus Christ the Righteous KING OF KINGS AND LORD OF LORDS, will alone be exalted in that Day, in His Second Advent and also in His Millennial Kingdom where He rules and reigns from Jerusalem, the city of the Great King (Psa. 48:2 & Matt. 5:35).

The LORD alone will be exalted at the Second Advent and also in the Millennial Kingdom.

It is such a glorious and marvelous truth

. Even so, Come, Lord Jesus.

starfield said:

Sure Starfield, I will take that challenge. Now before I directly address your challenge, I first want to share a truth though with you and with others who also are viewing this thread.

Understand Starfield that not every promise in the Scriptures have been fulfilled. You see, there are still promises that are yet to be fulfilled.

Here is one of the promises Starfield that has yet to be fulfilled:

14 And the Lord said unto Abram, after that Lot was separated from him, Lift up now thine eyes, and look from the place where thou art northward, and southward, and eastward, and westward:
15 For all the land which thou seest, to thee will I give it, and to thy seed for ever.
16 And I will make thy seed as the dust of the earth: so that if a man can number the dust of the earth, then shall thy seed also be numbered.
17 Arise, walk through the land in the length of it and in the breadth of it; for I will give it unto thee.
18 Then Abram removed his tent, and came and dwelt in the plain of Mamre, which is in Hebron, and built there an altar unto the Lord. - Genesis 13:14-18 (King James Bible)

6 And he believed in the Lord; and he counted it to him for righteousness.
7 And he said unto him, I am the Lord that brought thee out of Ur of the Chaldees, to give thee this land to inherit it.
8 And he said, Lord God, whereby shall I know that I shall inherit it?
9 And he said unto him, Take me an heifer of three years old, and a she goat of three years old, and a ram of three years old, and a turtledove, and a young pigeon.
10 And he took unto him all these, and divided them in the midst, and laid each piece one against another: but the birds divided he not.
11 And when the fowls came down upon the carcases, Abram drove them away.
12 And when the sun was going down, a deep sleep fell upon Abram; and, lo, an horror of great darkness fell upon him.
13 And he said unto Abram, Know of a surety that thy seed shall be a stranger in a land that is not theirs, and shall serve them; and they shall afflict them four hundred years;
14 And also that nation, whom they shall serve, will I judge: and afterward shall they come out with great substance.
15 And thou shalt go to thy fathers in peace; thou shalt be buried in a good old age.
16 But in the fourth generation they shall come hither again: for the iniquity of the Amorites is not yet full.
17 And it came to pass, that, when the sun went down, and it was dark, behold a smoking furnace, and a burning lamp that passed between those pieces.
18 In the same day the Lord made a covenant with Abram, saying, Unto thy seed have I given this land, from the river of Egypt unto the great river, the river Euphrates:
19 The Kenites, and the Kenizzites, and the Kadmonites,
20 And the Hittites, and the Perizzites, and the Rephaims,
21 And the Amorites, and the Canaanites, and the Girgashites, and the Jebusites. - Genesis 15:6-21 (King James Bible)

Now notice here that Land is promised to Abraham and his Seed. And the Land that is promised to him and his seed is the territory from the river of Egypt unto the great River Euphrates.

Here is a picture of all the Land that was promised to Abraham:

Now it should be obvious that present day Israel does not possess that land, at least not yet. But they will possess it in the Millennial Kingdom. The Jews will inherit that Land Starfield.

Here is another photo that shows you how much land the Jews currently possess in comparison to the total Land that was promised to Abraham and to his seed in Genesis 15:7-8; 15:17-21):

So the Abrahamic Covenant and Promise; with its Land Grant (Gen. 13:16-17, and Gen. 15:7-8; 15:17-21), is further proof of a coming Kingdom Age. It verifies and affirms the fact that there will indeed be a Millennial Kingdom.

The Land Grant has yet to be fulfilled Starfield. There are also other Old Testament promises made to Israel that have yet to be fulfilled, but they will be fulfilled in the Millennial Kingdom. They have to be Starfield, because the Scripture cannot be broken (John 10:35).

Furthermore, the Abrahamic Covenant is an unconditional covenant. God keeps His promises. And this Abrahamic Covenant with its Land Grant to Israel can only be accomplished and fulfilled within the framework of a Messianic, Jewish, Millennial Kingdom.

Now having established that truth, here is a passage of Scripture which clearly states and teaches that Jesus Christ the Righteous will physically rule and reign on this earth for 1,000 years.

20 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,
8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog, and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.
9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.
10And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever. - Revelation 20:1-10 (King James Bible)

This whole passage of Scripture is Literal. It is that simple Starfield. The Devil will be bound for a thousand years, and while he is bound in the bottomless pit, Jesus Christ the King will be ruling and reigning on this Earth from Jerusalem. And there will be true peace. Nations will no longer be at war. They will not even learn war anymore.

The phrase: "thousand years" appears in Revelation 20 six times. I believe the Holy Ghost wanted to put an emphasis on that time period that is coming in the near future.

I encourage you Starfield to pray to God about this if you are still having trouble seeing and understanding this marvelous truth from the Holy Scriptures.

LT · Nov 15, 2013

please refrain from posting so much all at once. it is fine to be detailed, but the past 2 posts are too much. You have brought up a dozen or more topics in one post alone.

If you want a thread that explains the Dispensational view of the Promises to Abraham, make a new thread.
This thread was about Rev 20:4-5.

starfield · Nov 15, 2013

ChosenbyHim said:

Since you believe Micah 4 prophecy is yet to be fulfilled, I assume you believe chapter 5 hasn't been fulfilled either?

Those passages don’t even hint of such things happening in a literal millennial kingdom. Your problem is that you view the bible with dispensational premillennial lenses. Take them off and you will see the light.

Zechariah 14 has been fulfilled.

What is Jesus doing now, ChosenbyHim?
Is He presently King and reigning in His kingdom or not?
Does He not have all authority in Heaven and on earth?
Your doctrine is an insult to the work of Christ.

God fulfilled His promises to Abraham.
Israel got the land.
Joshua 21:43-44
43 And the LORD gave unto Israel all the land which he sware to give unto their fathers; and they possessed it, and dwelt therein.
44 And the LORD gave them rest round about, according to all that he sware unto their fathers: and there stood not a man of all their enemies before them; the LORD delivered all their enemies into their hand.

Nehemiah 9:7-8
7 Thou art the LORD the God, who didst choose Abram, and broughtest him forth out of Ur of the Chaldees, and gavest him the name of Abraham;
8 And foundest his heart faithful before thee, and madest a covenant with him to give the land of the Canaanites, the Hittites, the Amorites, and the Perizzites, and the Jebusites, and the Girgashites, to give it, I say, to his seed, and hast performed thy words; for thou art righteous:

No it isn't. You're simply making a bunch of conjectures.

There's no indication that the thousand years is literal.

I have prayed and I’m out of the apostate system, dispensationalism. You need to come out too.

Could you please be succinct in your replies next time? Thanks. I’m not fond of long-winded posts.

Anonimous · Nov 15, 2013

LT said:

please refrain from posting so much all at once. it is fine to be detailed, but the past 2 posts are too much. You have brought up a dozen or more topics in one post alone.

If you want a thread that explains the Dispensational view of the Promises to Abraham, make a new thread.
This thread was about Rev 20:4-5.

ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

Anonimous · Nov 15, 2013

LT said:

please refrain from posting so much all at once. it is fine to be detailed, but the past 2 posts are too much. You have brought up a dozen or more topics in one post alone.

If you want a thread that explains the Dispensational view of the Promises to Abraham, make a new thread.
This thread was about Rev 20:4-5.

At least he didn't use a size 50 font...

vic1980 · Nov 15, 2013

BradC said:

Mark of the Beast has not come yet, if one reads Revelation 19:19-21 you would have a better view on what revelation 20 speaks upon. Those kings that rule the earth along with the wild beast & the false prophet are are all destroyed. Those that where beheaded for there witness of christ will rule on earth for those 1000 years taking the place of all those currupted kings that are ruling now rev 19:19. When satan is loose again, its is not as the first time with the kings of the earth and the false prophet and the beast, it is only Satan and those people in those nations he deceives. not kings the second time around just a division of people wheat and tares.

8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog, and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.

7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,

1000 years of peace then satan will be loose again , thats what the scripture says, i hope this is clear

Here a hint on this, the kings of the earth right now are against Christ, they do not know him as Lord of Lords and kings of kings.
God bless

When was Revelation 20:4,5 fulfilled?

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