Divorced Men- what the heck?

[Crimson_Lark]

I have found that a startling number of divorced men exhibit these two characteristics:

1.) They are still very bitter towards their ex-wives and bring them them up in conversation often.
2.) They take no responsibility for the divorce, even if they filed for it. The ex-wife is entirely to blame.

Ok I'm sure there are women out there who are to blame. I'm sure there are evil ex-wives who have plotted the destruction of their husbands. But 95% of ex-wives are evil incarnate?! Really?

It's really frustrating! Three different times I have met men who claimed they were past their ex-wives. The email exchange went fine. Then when we sat down for coffee I ended up being stuck listening to these guys consistently rehash the problems of their past marriage. One guy I actually listened to for TWO HOURS. (I will never do that again. I will just get up and leave. Talk about lesson learned.)

Me: So do you like to hike?
Divorced guy: My ex-wife had energy issues so we never hiked very much.....

Me again: Ok, so do *you* like to hike?
Divorced guy: Well I did before I met my ex-wife.

(Rinse & Repeat)

AAAHHHHHH!!! I even instituted a rule: no dating men who have been divorced less than two years. No dice. They still seem to be unable to hold a conversation without bringing up the ex-wife.

I'm seriously thinking about carrying the business cards of a local counselor and passing them out on dates. Just slide one across the table and say- hey give him/her a call.

Why does it seem that divorced men stay broken and oozing pain longer than women?
Has anyone else had this experience?

 

[Fenner]

I've never dated a divorced man. I'm sorry that you've been through that, it stinks! I like your business card idea.

 

[GISMYS]

Malachi 2:16 ► "The man who hates and divorces his wife," says the LORD, the God of Israel, "does violence to the one he should protect," says the LORD Almighty. So be on your guard, and do not be unfaithful.New Living Translation"For I hate divorce!" says the LORD, the God of Israel. "To divorce your wife is to overwhelm her with cruelty," says the LORD of Heaven's Armies. "So guard your heart; do not be unfaithful to your wife."

 

[Ugly]

Men don't have support systems in place, the way women do. Women are more supportive of each other. Women talk more. Encourage more. Men get together and don't discuss things. And if they do the average response is 'yeah man, that sucks, shes a real b****'.
Also i think men are more strongly affected than they're given credit for. People presume men are just going to get over things faster, so they don't attempt to offer anything in the way of support or encouragement.

Bottom line is marriage is often viewed as for women. So when it ends peoples expectations are only the woman is hurt. And she is treated as such, while the man is presumed to be fine. Or often he is presumed to be the problem and not worthy of support, true or not. Especially in the modern secular culture where, more and more, men are all touted as selfish, horny dogs with no emotion. And while there are men like that out there, that doesn't mean all men are. This is evident even in the legal issues of divorce. The law has typically favored the woman in divorce. Giving her the children by default. And presuming the man should pay for her even after divorce (alimony). Which sounds unfair and unbalanced in reality, because that essentially presumes the man is the problem by default and that the woman is 'rewarded' for having put up with him. How can a man ever recover under these conditions?

Look at your own attitude. Irritation at these men. A condescending attitude that they are somehow less than. Rather than feeling any sympathy or compassion. Kind of a 'why don't they just get over it?' attitude. Women aren't expected to do that, so why should men?

 

[TheAristocat]

I even instituted a rule: no dating men who have been divorced less than two years.

You might have better luck in your dating life if you stayed away from divorced individuals, especially if you, yourself, are not divorced. I would hope this would be understood by reading the Bible. That said, I'm sorry for your bad experiences and for the experiences of these men.

 

[zeroturbulence]

I have found that a startling number of divorced men exhibit these two characteristics:

1.) They are still very bitter towards their ex-wives and bring them them up in conversation often.
2.) They take no responsibility for the divorce, even if they filed for it. The ex-wife is entirely to blame.

Ok I'm sure there are women out there who are to blame. I'm sure there are evil ex-wives who have plotted the destruction of their husbands. But 95% of ex-wives are evil incarnate?! Really?

It's really frustrating! Three different times I have met men who claimed they were past their ex-wives. The email exchange went fine. Then when we sat down for coffee I ended up being stuck listening to these guys consistently rehash the problems of their past marriage. One guy I actually listened to for TWO HOURS. (I will never do that again. I will just get up and leave. Talk about lesson learned.)

Me: So do you like to hike?
Divorced guy: My ex-wife had energy issues so we never hiked very much.....

Me again: Ok, so do *you* like to hike?
Divorced guy: Well I did before I met my ex-wife.

(Rinse & Repeat)

AAAHHHHHH!!! I even instituted a rule: no dating men who have been divorced less than two years. No dice. They still seem to be unable to hold a conversation without bringing up the ex-wife.

I'm seriously thinking about carrying the business cards of a local counselor and passing them out on dates. Just slide one across the table and say- hey give him/her a call.

Why does it seem that divorced men stay broken and oozing pain longer than women?
Has anyone else had this experience?

I've heard many men talk about their ex-wives.. and their current wives (in real life, not on the internet)! I think wives in general make men unhappy. Makes me sort of glad I'm not married.

 

[Crimson_Lark]

I'm very sorry if my frustration came across as condescension towards men. I don't think they are less than and I don't think they should 'get over it.'

I do think they should pursue counseling before they return to the dating scene. I also think anyone(man or woman) should be able to engage in a conversation that is not about their ex if they are going to date again. I expect the same from myself.

I definitely don't think I am better than these men. I am frustrated because I think that there are good men out there who may be divorced for biblical reasons, but they haven't dealt with the pain that they feel and it's holding them back. I understand that our society may/does not support men pursuing healing. So let's talk about it and encourage each other to swim counter current.

I do appreciate your perspective Ugly and I would like to hear from others if they have had similar experiences and if they have found a good way to handle it.

 

[Isdaniel]

lets just say men are not encouraged to shew their soft side in society as women do

 

[1still_waters]

Men tend to project their angst against the woman who caused it, by continued reference to her. Women project their angst at a past man, by projecting it on all men. Possibly.....

*slowly steps away*

 

[CatHerder]

I have found that a startling number of divorced men exhibit these two characteristics:

1.) They are still very bitter towards their ex-wives and bring them them up in conversation often.
2.) They take no responsibility for the divorce, even if they filed for it. The ex-wife is entirely to blame.

Ok I'm sure there are women out there who are to blame. I'm sure there are evil ex-wives who have plotted the destruction of their husbands. But 95% of ex-wives are evil incarnate?! Really?

It's really frustrating! Three different times I have met men who claimed they were past their ex-wives. The email exchange went fine. Then when we sat down for coffee I ended up being stuck listening to these guys consistently rehash the problems of their past marriage. One guy I actually listened to for TWO HOURS. (I will never do that again. I will just get up and leave. Talk about lesson learned.)


Me: So do you like to hike?
Divorced guy: My ex-wife had energy issues so we never hiked very much.....

Me again: Ok, so do *you* like to hike?
Divorced guy: Well I did before I met my ex-wife.

This doesn't really fit in with your #1 or #2 above....he seems like he lost all of his identity within the marriage and it hasn't sunk in that he can pursue his own interests without thinking of them in terms of his ex wife. I agree that he's not ready, but it doesn't seem bitter nor in denial of any responsibility for the divorce.

(Rinse & Repeat)

AAAHHHHHH!!! I even instituted a rule: no dating men who have been divorced less than two years. No dice. They still seem to be unable to hold a conversation without bringing up the ex-wife.

A much longer healing time may be needed (as promoted by Divorce Care classes). But this goes for men AND women.

I'm seriously thinking about carrying the business cards of a local counselor and passing them out on dates. Just slide one across the table and say- hey give him/her a call.

Why does it seem that divorced men stay broken and oozing pain longer than women?
Has anyone else had this experience?

I don't know if this is true. I dated a woman two or three times who was extremely critical of her ex, including trashing him as a dad. Most single women my age seem very very bitter and hardened.

............

 

[Tintin]

Men don't have support systems in place, the way women do. Women are more supportive of each other. Women talk more. Encourage more. Men get together and don't discuss things. And if they do the average response is 'yeah man, that sucks, shes a real b****'.
Also i think men are more strongly affected than they're given credit for. People presume men are just going to get over things faster, so they don't attempt to offer anything in the way of support or encouragement.

Bottom line is marriage is often viewed as for women. So when it ends peoples expectations are only the woman is hurt. And she is treated as such, while the man is presumed to be fine. Or often he is presumed to be the problem and not worthy of support, true or not. Especially in the modern secular culture where, more and more, men are all touted as selfish, horny dogs with no emotion. And while there are men like that out there, that doesn't mean all men are. This is evident even in the legal issues of divorce. The law has typically favored the woman in divorce. Giving her the children by default. And presuming the man should pay for her even after divorce (alimony). Which sounds unfair and unbalanced in reality, because that essentially presumes the man is the problem by default and that the woman is 'rewarded' for having put up with him. How can a man ever recover under these conditions?

Look at your own attitude. Irritation at these men. A condescending attitude that they are somehow less than. Rather than feeling any sympathy or compassion. Kind of a 'why don't they just get over it?' attitude. Women aren't expected to do that, so why should men?

This is key. I've never been in a romantic relationship before but I've observed couples I know - extended family, friends, church members etc. (those engaged, married and other) and this seems to be the most common issue. Even in friends, guys just don't have the same support mechanisms that girls do. There's a saying that says, "No man is an island", but sadly, many men are islands.

 

[maxwel]

I have found that a startling number of divorced men exhibit these two characteristics:

1.) They are still very bitter towards their ex-wives and bring them them up in conversation often.
2.) They take no responsibility for the divorce, even if they filed for it. The ex-wife is entirely to blame.

After much reflection, I have decided to take full responsibility for my next several divorces.

: )

 

[ServantStrike]

Men tend to project their angst against the woman who caused it, by continued reference to her. Women project their angst at a past man, by projecting it on all men. Possibly.....

*slowly steps away*

You know...

This is actually very true in some cases. While some women can get over it, I've met an awful lot of them who say things that imply they have lost all faith in humanity and that men are horrible wretched disgusting beings who deserve to die like a dog in the street.

And they you say "well I wasn't asking you out, and I was just trying to be pleasant and conversational, I'm sorry I tried", and you back away,

I think at some level, everyone directs unresolved anger towards the people that remind them the most of that anger (and in the case of a divorcee, it's a potential date). The real trick, and the thing that Christ told us to do, is just not to have anger in the first place, but forgiveness.

 

[rachelsedge]

I think at some level, everyone directs unresolved anger towards the people that remind them the most of that anger (and in the case of a divorcee, it's a potential date). The real trick, and the thing that Christ told us to do, is just not to have anger in the first place, but forgiveness.

This is very true. I have never been divorced, but I can speak to being deeply hurt by another Christian and having bitterness and anger take root in my heart for a while. It can be projected onto others, either consciously or sub-consciously, especially when they remind you of the other person.

It can be very hard to heal when you're expected to be okay. I speak from experience from that.

Part of it is others' expectations: "But you have Jesus", "But you're a girl, girls deal with their emotions better", "But you're a guy, this shouldn't affect you that much/how do you still have these emotions?" or just the general attitude of "Shouldn't you be over this?"

I'd say a lot of it, though, is not allowing ourselves to be fully known in that way. I texted my sister a few months after the hurtful incident, and told her, "I don't think people really get how much that hurt me." Her response? "It's because you do well at hiding it." I pretend and hide because of my own insecurities. The fear of being rejected, of someone thinking my pain was stupid, etc. Pride gets in the way, sometimes.

Sometimes those fears are validated (as shown in my "Others' expectations" list), which is why I would encourage Christians to simply be open to other people's pain. Sure, maybe you think they should have moved on by now (and maybe they should have). And honestly, sometimes people do hold on too long to things they should not be clinging to. But it should be approached less as, "Dude, what's your deal, let it go" and more of a gentle but honest, "Listen, you are my brother/sister in Christ and I care for you. I know you're hurting, and I want to see you heal, but I see you holding on to anger and resentment. Let me help you." Sometimes people just need someone to listen, or they need someone to show them how much of a funk they're really in.

If they won't listen to that, then sometimes it is only God who can reach their heart.

Different people handle things differently. Just my two cents.

 

[SparkleEyes]

There is a Christian divorce recovery program called Divorce Care that is held in many churches across the US. This program suggests a rule that you shouldn't date for 1 year for every 4 you were married. MOst people, regardless of who is "at fault" needs time to heal. One of the biggest reasons for healing is that if you don't you will probably marry another wrong person further messing up your life and the lives of others. Both parties need to heal, incidentally. I highly encourage therapy with a professionally licensed counselor - not just a pastor.

Incidentally, most people don't abide by the rule.

The reason I put "at fault" in quotes is that both parties hold some blame for the demise of the marriage. And the person who files for divorce isn't the one who wants the divorce or who has "caused" the divorce.

 

[zaoman32]

I don't think it's wrong to have a rule in place against dating a man who has been divorced less than two years at all. Because it's usually going to take close, if not that long to start getting over things.

As stated before, there is no support system, and there's all this built up angst and bitterness, not just against the ex-wife, but also just society in general. Women can be extremely manipulative, and persuasive. They have the ability to tug on people's emotions and feel sorry for them, where as a guy doesn't, so people just don't care as much.

Yes the majority of divorced men will make it sound like their divorce sound like their ex's fault. But I can guarantee you divorced women are no better. Especially within those first couple years afterwards, things are going to be harsh.

In regards to support, this is one reason I love these forums. I actually met other men and women, who were genuine christians, and had dealt with, or were dealing with the exact same situation, I wasn't alone, and people understood where I was coming from.

 

[Robotsamurai]

To quote Stephen King - Blame always lies in the same place, the person to lay the blame.

Having come out of a long courtship I struggled sought help at church from ministers and friends and I didn't feel like I got the support I needed. I sought counselling in the end to help me. I was told to just get over it as my ex had (she left me).

I think both partners shouldn't rake up past relationships all the time. If they so then they aren't over it, especially with their current partner. Although I do believe that previous relationships should be openly discussed and closed with each other before it gets serious to be completely open with each other. It will remove (some) of the baggage you would be taking into marriage. No matter what happened your potential spouse is a Christian and should forgive you of anything bad you did in your past. As long as you've asked God for forgiveness first.

 

[rainin]

As a recently divorced woman, this thread has really made me think....a lot. It seems that if the word 'blame' were replaced with the word 'responsibility' many of us could have avoided divorce all together. It is easier to blame the other partner than it is to accept responsibility for our own short comings.

 

[lost1972]

It drives me crazy to hear the men are always to blame, my ex packed up everything we owned when I was at work, and disappeared, I didnt want a divorce, I didnt ask for a divorce, I was very upset that she left, It was bad enough that I tried to kill myself, it took me many years to get over that, and a part of it will always stay with me. Yes maby I made mistakes, but I was willing to work through it all with her, and try to work it out, all she wanted was to no longer be married, people still try to say God is mad at me about that, I think he understands what happened,

 

[Ugly]

It drives me crazy to hear the men are always to blame, my ex packed up everything we owned when I was at work, and disappeared, I didnt want a divorce, I didnt ask for a divorce, I was very upset that she left, It was bad enough that I tried to kill myself, it took me many years to get over that, and a part of it will always stay with me. Yes maby I made mistakes, but I was willing to work through it all with her, and try to work it out, all she wanted was to no longer be married, people still try to say God is mad at me about that, I think he understands what happened,

I think we now have an example of what the OP was talking about.