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Grey
Guest
The communists in South Africa were amongst the first groups to recognize Africans as equal. Coincidentally they also did the same when in the U.S.
Nelson Mandela
- Thread starter SparkleEyes
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Conotocarious
Guest
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Conotocarious
Guest
Equality in misery for all but those who prostate themselves before the revolutionary caste.
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Grey
Guest
Yet theirs was an equal opportunity ideology, I'm not trying to say communism is great! My only point is that its understandable that someone joined if they were black.
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Conotocarious
Guest
Only to murder and maim. Understandable maybe, but they had alternatives that they rejected in favor of bloodlust. In favor of something proven to be a lie if one would open there eyes.
I'm saying it may be understandable, but it is no proper excuse.
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rustyben
Guest
Mandela was a Christian, he gave his life to Christ in prison. A lay preacher at my church was Mandela's prison chaplin on Robben Island, we all knew this fact, but on Sunday we heard some interesting anecdotes and had an amazing picture painted of this great man.
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amazed
Guest
No one knows the state of a man's heart except for God. However, Nelson Mandela professed to being a Christian and has quoted scripture in some of his speeches. We are told to judge someone by their fruit, if that be true, then Nelson Mandela was certainly a Christian.
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amazed
Guest
A staunch supporter of communism ??? he fought the people's rights under an oppressive government.
In 1996 Mandela supported, and pushed through, a very liberal abortion law, and didn't allow dissenters in the majority party to even vote.
Polls even showed that most South Africans were against this abortion bill.
But Mandela pushed it through, and signed it into law.
Since Mandela signed the law into effect, allowing abortion-on-demand (for girls of any age, including minors) it's estimated that approximately 10,000 African babies have been aborted WEEKLY. That's somewhere over ONE MILLION abortions since Mandela signed the legislation.
Very Christian thing to do, and great way to help your own country.
Every politician CLAIMS to be a Christian.
It isn't wise to assume you know everything about another country, or their leader, because you heard something on TV, or saw a cool movie.
Come on.
We can be a little more discerning can't we?
The abortion law that's killed over a million African babies is only one of many EXTREMELY un-Christian things Mandela supported and pushed into law. His words claim he was a Christian, but his actions, and legislation, simply do not back it up.
If you want to read about it, here's a link to a 1997 article from Christianity Today.
South Africa: Pro-life Activists Deplore Liberal Abortion Law | Christianity Today
Hey, I want black Africans to be free and self-determined just like everyone else...
but good intentions just don't turn a politician like Mandela into a saint.
He just wasn't.
We need to be a little more discerning than the rest of the world.
Be careful who you worship as a hero.
Polls even showed that most South Africans were against this abortion bill.
But Mandela pushed it through, and signed it into law.
Since Mandela signed the law into effect, allowing abortion-on-demand (for girls of any age, including minors) it's estimated that approximately 10,000 African babies have been aborted WEEKLY. That's somewhere over ONE MILLION abortions since Mandela signed the legislation.
Very Christian thing to do, and great way to help your own country.
Every politician CLAIMS to be a Christian.
It isn't wise to assume you know everything about another country, or their leader, because you heard something on TV, or saw a cool movie.
Come on.
We can be a little more discerning can't we?
The abortion law that's killed over a million African babies is only one of many EXTREMELY un-Christian things Mandela supported and pushed into law. His words claim he was a Christian, but his actions, and legislation, simply do not back it up.
If you want to read about it, here's a link to a 1997 article from Christianity Today.
South Africa: Pro-life Activists Deplore Liberal Abortion Law | Christianity Today
Hey, I want black Africans to be free and self-determined just like everyone else...
but good intentions just don't turn a politician like Mandela into a saint.
He just wasn't.
We need to be a little more discerning than the rest of the world.
Be careful who you worship as a hero.
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Conotocarious
Guest
His first faith was Communism. He was trained in it. While he concealed it beneath language that would appeal to the West, he never departed from it.
Umm... Yes he was. If you like I can post a myriad of news stories, photos and other info to support this claim.
Make no mistake, communism is a purely EVIL, even satanic, form of government.
I have heard nothing but good things about Nelson Mandela from my South African Christian girlfriends. As a sinner, we all have our imperfections and I believe Nelson Mandela also has his share of imperfections too.
That being said, I don't think he was awarded the Nobel peace prize (including many other hundreds of such similar honours) out of the blue or for that matter, given the title "the father of the nation" without any due credit.
That being said, I don't think he was awarded the Nobel peace prize (including many other hundreds of such similar honours) out of the blue or for that matter, given the title "the father of the nation" without any due credit.
the Nobel is a joke...Yassar Arafat got one.
Mendella was offered freedom from prison if he would renounce terrorism. He did not.
Look at some of the ''dignitaries'' at his funeral. Not exactly a nice group of people.
President Obama shaking hands with Raul Castro.
Some amazing stuff.
Mendella was offered freedom from prison if he would renounce terrorism. He did not.
Look at some of the ''dignitaries'' at his funeral. Not exactly a nice group of people.
President Obama shaking hands with Raul Castro.
Some amazing stuff.
Well, I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree. It is not something new that freedom fighters are often branded as 'terrorists' by the oppressive ruling government.
He wasn't "branded" as a terrorist.
He was CONVICTED of 156 separate counts of public violence,
through which MANY innocent people died, including helpless women and children.
Amnesty International wouldn't even help him, because they said the trial was fair and just, and he was NOT a political prisoner, but rather, just a common criminal.
Even liberal newspapers in his own country said the trial was just, and he was indeed, a murderer.
The ONLY question is whether he GENUINELY became a Christian while in prison.
He claims he did become a Christian, but his policies and legislation seem to show he did not.
He passed a major abortion bill (which has culminated in the murder of around a million African babies) and he supported legalized prostitution, legalized gambling, and homosexual rights.
(For the record, I'm in no way in support of the previous Afrikaner government, or apartheid... I'm just pointing out that Mandela was no saint. He was no saint, and it appears he wasn't even a Christian.)
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dee3
Guest
If the French invaded The United Kingdom or Russia did the same to The USA the likes of Mandela would be heralded a hero, a Winston Churchhill a Geogre Washington. The discussion here is the illegitimacy of the White South African Government, whose hegemony had only been made possible by superior arms and a wider economic strangle hold on the two thirds world by the West, that has only recently been brought into check. South Africa was held to ransom by a small elite, while the indigenous people of south Africa were driven off their land their people beaten, imprisoned and murdered under laws which only those who were a part of this elite white group had any investment. Its easy for an apartheid authority to run a government for the benefit of a few million white South Africans from the sweat and sorrow of tens of millions more Black South Africans. Most White South Africans had state protected jobs and subsidised housing, meanwhile the diamonds and gold deposits was a closed shop in which white corporate South Africans became fat. In reality neosocialism for white South Africans but only Mandela is vilified for seeking to uplift the rest of the population by similar communist ideals. Black South Africans were told were to live, and how far they could travel within their district, what if any jobs they could have, they were poorly educated relative to white South Africans and the list goes on an on. One speaks of Mandela's brutality from the comfort of an armchair, what of the bondage rape and pillage by the the state apparatus. e.g; Law enforcement, the Judiciary Economic,Health and Social provision etc. We have not spoken for example of racial banding which offered a graduated hierarchical of privileges based on one's particular skin tone, hair type and bone structure etc. We hear very quickly about how current violence is the rife within South Africa as though one has had amnesia, for the last century. It had been OK to violently suppress an entire country under what for majority South Africans has been a dictatorship and then start complaining only a few years after physical apartheid has ended.
The reality is that the apartied regime was as corrupt as the current government. The Aparthied statistics for example demonstrate both stagnation and inflation were commonplace in the economy. The ANC has its major faults too but it is at least seeking to serve the whole population unlike previously . It was by violence the aparthied regime forced its rule, it also extended that privilege to white South Africans as individuals for many years and further, when the regime was toppled, the choice to leave the country or live equally with the majority population.
South Africa should be a rainbow nation everybody helping to do their bit to make South Africa a symbol of equality. Some of us condemn Mandela because he tried to serve the whole population. For Black South Africa and other courageous individuals such as Donald James Wood, Mandela is their Moses. We talk quickly of whether Mandela was a Christian, a good or bad man however, Western governments turned a blind eye to the plight of the South African people. Remember too it was the official church of South Africa that gave their tacid and direct approval of aparthied. I am sure if your daughter or wife were raped none would be talking about having a nice chat and a cup of tea with the rapist. In a similar thread, South Africa's indigenous daughters and wives had been raped by the thousand and stealthily invaded with inequality over a number of years, Mandela was not perfect in many ways but to put things in perspective he helped tens of millions, an entire country to exchange physical and mental death for freedom. i think i know which side God would be on. Mandela R.I.P.
The reality is that the apartied regime was as corrupt as the current government. The Aparthied statistics for example demonstrate both stagnation and inflation were commonplace in the economy. The ANC has its major faults too but it is at least seeking to serve the whole population unlike previously . It was by violence the aparthied regime forced its rule, it also extended that privilege to white South Africans as individuals for many years and further, when the regime was toppled, the choice to leave the country or live equally with the majority population.
South Africa should be a rainbow nation everybody helping to do their bit to make South Africa a symbol of equality. Some of us condemn Mandela because he tried to serve the whole population. For Black South Africa and other courageous individuals such as Donald James Wood, Mandela is their Moses. We talk quickly of whether Mandela was a Christian, a good or bad man however, Western governments turned a blind eye to the plight of the South African people. Remember too it was the official church of South Africa that gave their tacid and direct approval of aparthied. I am sure if your daughter or wife were raped none would be talking about having a nice chat and a cup of tea with the rapist. In a similar thread, South Africa's indigenous daughters and wives had been raped by the thousand and stealthily invaded with inequality over a number of years, Mandela was not perfect in many ways but to put things in perspective he helped tens of millions, an entire country to exchange physical and mental death for freedom. i think i know which side God would be on. Mandela R.I.P.