The Israel of God
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No sir, I'm not ignorant of the Scriptures;
Yes, the time of Jacob's Trouble spoken of in Jeremiah is about Old Covenant Israel,
and it was fulfilled in 30ad to 70ad.
You do not know what the time of Jacob's trouble means,
but it has already been fulfilled!
Old Covenant Israel does not exist any more!
Nothing has been replaced, you are such an absolute hoot!!
The Old Way God made obsolete!
Christ Jesus ushered in New Covenant Israel
through the faithful of that Jews of that Early Church!
So you cannot defend dispensationalism,
which casts all of these things into the unknown future,
where people like you can play God with everyone's future,
in your fear mongering.
many blessings
Yes, the time of Jacob's Trouble spoken of in Jeremiah is about Old Covenant Israel,
and it was fulfilled in 30ad to 70ad.
You do not know what the time of Jacob's trouble means,
but it has already been fulfilled!
Old Covenant Israel does not exist any more!
Nothing has been replaced, you are such an absolute hoot!!
The Old Way God made obsolete!
Christ Jesus ushered in New Covenant Israel
through the faithful of that Jews of that Early Church!
So you cannot defend dispensationalism,
which casts all of these things into the unknown future,
where people like you can play God with everyone's future,
in your fear mongering.
many blessings
Re: The Israel of God
if ppl don't know who is The Israel of God ; what do you expect?
the timeline in the history of the world that changed everything!, hasn't happened yet....seriously
if ppl don't know who is The Israel of God ; what do you expect?
the timeline in the history of the world that changed everything!, hasn't happened yet....seriously
thinking the Apostles of the Early Church
were the witness to the greatest time and things that would ever happen on this earth?
sometimes I just get carried away!
dat's right.
dat's what it says.
sorry - more false teaching.
only thing left is Judgment Day - better get evangelizing jews - warning them to get saved now....today is the day of salvation.
there's no kingdom to "set up"...He's King now. nothing was Postponed. Israel probably doesn't even exist anymore. just people who identify as jews. most of their ancestors converted to the false religion of Talmudic Judaism 700 years after Christ came...to a 'Covenant' that hasn't existed since 70AD.
even if there are any ancient stock - they are gentiles to God and get saved like everybody else.
but you're an unbeliever.
so you wouldn't know that.
some other gospel; some other christ.
you never did learn how to read the Bible, you don't understand it - and you proudly declare that.
not one time have you ever doubted the pretrib dispensational fable.
dat's what it says.
sorry - more false teaching.
only thing left is Judgment Day - better get evangelizing jews - warning them to get saved now....today is the day of salvation.
there's no kingdom to "set up"...He's King now. nothing was Postponed. Israel probably doesn't even exist anymore. just people who identify as jews. most of their ancestors converted to the false religion of Talmudic Judaism 700 years after Christ came...to a 'Covenant' that hasn't existed since 70AD.
even if there are any ancient stock - they are gentiles to God and get saved like everybody else.
but you're an unbeliever.
so you wouldn't know that.
some other gospel; some other christ.
you never did learn how to read the Bible, you don't understand it - and you proudly declare that.
not one time have you ever doubted the pretrib dispensational fable.
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I know Zone I don't know what comes over me;
thinking the Apostles of the Early Church
were the witness to the greatest time and things that would ever happen on this earth?
sometimes I just get carried away!
thinking the Apostles of the Early Church
were the witness to the greatest time and things that would ever happen on this earth?
sometimes I just get carried away!
skip over that GREATEST TIME, leave Jesus out; Postpone everything; replay ancient histories Jesus fulfilled and presto!
you too can teach false doctrine, in a few easy steps.
make certain you consider it a sin to read any other view.
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K
Ummm. God will save Israel. Even though 95% are atheist. Many will be killed and they will flee to Petra which is in modern day Jordan which are of the tribe of Moab. Israel will never be destroyed. It will seem as though, but not totally. In fact thats when the King sets His feet on mount moriah and it splits and Israel will escape through it just like the red sea. Then the King will destroy its enemies. Read closely my friend.
B
'Israel probably doesn't even exist anymore'
That is an insecure statement coming from you Zone. According to your doctrine Israel does not exist because believers, both Jew and Gentile make up the Israel of God which is the church, therefore making those who claim to be of Jewish stock false brethren and members of the synagogue of Satan. That is what you truly believe according to your doctrine. The nation of Israel as it exists today and those who live in that nation who claim to be of Jewish descent are nothing more than Gentile dogs who have no identity in terms of an elect people and have no promises from God as to any future or any kingdom being restored to them in this life or the next to come. This is your summation of the nation and people of Israel, now and for the remainder of time including the new heaven and earth. To you they are no longer a people and they are without legitimacy. Zone you don't understand God's election or anything about his irrevocable calling. You are one messed up believer and I have no empathy for your willful intended blindness because you have no heart of mercy for Israel or its people or the promises of God and I don'r care how wicked they have been in their unbelief. There are some things that Paul said about Israel and his people that you abhor because they do not fit into your doctrine and in your despite for Israel.
That is an insecure statement coming from you Zone. According to your doctrine Israel does not exist because believers, both Jew and Gentile make up the Israel of God which is the church, therefore making those who claim to be of Jewish stock false brethren and members of the synagogue of Satan. That is what you truly believe according to your doctrine. The nation of Israel as it exists today and those who live in that nation who claim to be of Jewish descent are nothing more than Gentile dogs who have no identity in terms of an elect people and have no promises from God as to any future or any kingdom being restored to them in this life or the next to come. This is your summation of the nation and people of Israel, now and for the remainder of time including the new heaven and earth. To you they are no longer a people and they are without legitimacy. Zone you don't understand God's election or anything about his irrevocable calling. You are one messed up believer and I have no empathy for your willful intended blindness because you have no heart of mercy for Israel or its people or the promises of God and I don'r care how wicked they have been in their unbelief. There are some things that Paul said about Israel and his people that you abhor because they do not fit into your doctrine and in your despite for Israel.
i do not believe for one BradC that Zone is a heartless hater of the Jews!
Some of the things she says of the Zionist, Messianic Cults, the Hebrew Roots, etc....
and some Jewish groups and Churches that are saying things that just are not true;
this is her right to argue. As well as it is mine!
I do not take up for her, she can take up for herself,
but it seems when things don't fit your doctrine you have to spew hateful things.
The new Jewish State in Israel, they are no longer the chosen people of God.
They are the descendants of those who were cutoff from Israel and cast out of the Kingdom,
in 70ad, where they are until this very day!
yet God still extends His Olive branch, to them, Jesus' Crucified,
So they still have a way back in, just like you.
If that makes you so mad you cannot see straight, so be it.
The faithful of Old Covenant Israel are all gone,
The righteous line of Ancient Israel ended with Jesus.
and it is extended through Him alone.
I for one do not hate the present day Jews if they are in the New Jewish State or somewhere else.
But i must leave the fate of the 21st Century Jews
Between God and them.
You are no longer arguing a point,
but leaning on peoples emotions and fear mongering;
this is a common theme with you and your friends.
You should really care about their wickedness in unbelief!
it cost 1.1 million in the Holocaust in Jerusalem their life; what do you mean you don't care?
If you keep telling them something that isn't true and bolstering their unbelief;
and myself and others are at least willing to be truthful about it;
well you get my drift.
many blessings
Some of the things she says of the Zionist, Messianic Cults, the Hebrew Roots, etc....
and some Jewish groups and Churches that are saying things that just are not true;
this is her right to argue. As well as it is mine!
I do not take up for her, she can take up for herself,
but it seems when things don't fit your doctrine you have to spew hateful things.
The new Jewish State in Israel, they are no longer the chosen people of God.
They are the descendants of those who were cutoff from Israel and cast out of the Kingdom,
in 70ad, where they are until this very day!
yet God still extends His Olive branch, to them, Jesus' Crucified,
So they still have a way back in, just like you.
If that makes you so mad you cannot see straight, so be it.
The faithful of Old Covenant Israel are all gone,
The righteous line of Ancient Israel ended with Jesus.
and it is extended through Him alone.
I for one do not hate the present day Jews if they are in the New Jewish State or somewhere else.
But i must leave the fate of the 21st Century Jews
Between God and them.
You are no longer arguing a point,
but leaning on peoples emotions and fear mongering;
this is a common theme with you and your friends.
You should really care about their wickedness in unbelief!
it cost 1.1 million in the Holocaust in Jerusalem their life; what do you mean you don't care?
If you keep telling them something that isn't true and bolstering their unbelief;
and myself and others are at least willing to be truthful about it;
well you get my drift.
many blessings
Why did Jesus stop midsentence? If this was to be fulfilled in His life or in the early church? YOu mock my understanding of OT prophecy but I'm just trying to understand why Jesus did what He did. Nothing you said actually interacts with this.
You have a misunderstanding yourself if you believe that Western knowledge is entirely chronological while the Eastern (Semitic) mindset was non-chronological. There is no doubt that the prophets spoke with gaps in their prophecies. You believe in this yourself, so if you want to have an intelligent conversation, please do so. The Semitic mindset was oftentimes chronological and often topical. They had a psychological understanding of time and its progression.
Dispensationalism does not suppose a hidden meaning or knowledge like Gnosticism does. Stop caricaturing.
6"But as for Me, I have installed My King Upon Zion, My holy mountain." The question would be, to what is this referring? Does the NT ever quote this as being fulfilled? No. Yes, Jesus is on God's right hand, and He has a kingdom, but the context of Psalm 1 and 2 is God being God over the nations of earth. There is a heavenly dimension, we just disagree as to whether Jesus ruling the nations with a rod of iron is occurring now spiritually, or will occur in the future both physically and spiritually.
You have a misunderstanding yourself if you believe that Western knowledge is entirely chronological while the Eastern (Semitic) mindset was non-chronological. There is no doubt that the prophets spoke with gaps in their prophecies. You believe in this yourself, so if you want to have an intelligent conversation, please do so. The Semitic mindset was oftentimes chronological and often topical. They had a psychological understanding of time and its progression.
Dispensationalism does not suppose a hidden meaning or knowledge like Gnosticism does. Stop caricaturing.
6"But as for Me, I have installed My King Upon Zion, My holy mountain." The question would be, to what is this referring? Does the NT ever quote this as being fulfilled? No. Yes, Jesus is on God's right hand, and He has a kingdom, but the context of Psalm 1 and 2 is God being God over the nations of earth. There is a heavenly dimension, we just disagree as to whether Jesus ruling the nations with a rod of iron is occurring now spiritually, or will occur in the future both physically and spiritually.
B
No one is bolstering Israel's unbelief because the issue is God's faithfulness to his promise to an elect nation and people despite their unbelief and wickedness. God has concluded them all in unbelief that he might have mercy on all. Only a remnant has believed up until now but when he comes again all of Israel (that are left on earth) will be saved and Paul was not talking about the church or the Gentiles. You can't apply the term 'Israel' as the church when it is referring to Israel as a nation and people and it is the goodness of God that will lead them to their day of repentance. The second coming of Christ is the goodness of God and his faithfulness to the nation and people of Israel and when they see him, the one who they and their people rejected and pierced (crucified), they will mourn and repent and salvation will have come to them who were in unbelief (Heb 9:28). The very fact of seeing him pierced represents the cross and the shed blood but Zone and her crowd take away any future reference of this event happening with Israel and by doing that take away their hope in the cross of Christ.
Zone and others do not believe that is possible because they have a wrong premise and they are the ones who mock and scoff at the promise of God and any future salvation for Israel. Now is the day of salvation for those in unbelief and when he comes again that will be the day of their salvation who remained in unbelief. Zone and her crowd are the ones who reject the promises of God for Israel and its people (the Jews) and Gods plan to graff them in again to the olive tree at the second coming. They are the ones who see no hope and future for the nation and people of Israel and do not see the goodness of God and his mercy bringing them restoration. They are blinded by their own understanding and doctrine and it translates into them hating the very thought of Israel being a nation and people again, who has and will continue to have God's favor once again. If you reject God's goodness and favor toward them as a nation and people, then love, hope and faith is missing and when these things are missing you are left with the opposite of these things and most importantly no fruit.
Zone and others do not believe that is possible because they have a wrong premise and they are the ones who mock and scoff at the promise of God and any future salvation for Israel. Now is the day of salvation for those in unbelief and when he comes again that will be the day of their salvation who remained in unbelief. Zone and her crowd are the ones who reject the promises of God for Israel and its people (the Jews) and Gods plan to graff them in again to the olive tree at the second coming. They are the ones who see no hope and future for the nation and people of Israel and do not see the goodness of God and his mercy bringing them restoration. They are blinded by their own understanding and doctrine and it translates into them hating the very thought of Israel being a nation and people again, who has and will continue to have God's favor once again. If you reject God's goodness and favor toward them as a nation and people, then love, hope and faith is missing and when these things are missing you are left with the opposite of these things and most importantly no fruit.
yes, it does.
when Jesus Ascended there was a TRANSFER: everything He does is now from GLORY, the Glory He had with the Father, before the world began.
the believing Israelites knew this.
here's the NT fulfillment. you can shuffle this and tweak it if you want to (i don't know why anyone would want to - Jesus is the Glorious King), but, nevertheless..... it is fulfilled. read it all - you'll see that the TRANSFER TO HEAVENLY ZION, and the Christian Church (New Jerusalem) was made at the First Advent:
Acts 4
Peter and John Before the Council
1And as they were speaking to the people, the priests and the captain of the temple and the Sadducees came upon them, 2greatly annoyed because they were teaching the people and proclaiming in Jesus the resurrection from the dead. 3And they arrested them and put them in custody until the next day, for it was already evening. 4But many of those who had heard the word believed, and the number of the men came to about five thousand.
5On the next day their rulers and elders and scribes gathered together in Jerusalem, 6with Annas the high priest and Caiaphas and John and Alexander, and all who were of the high-priestly family. 7And when they had set them in the midst, they inquired, “By what power or by what name did you do this?” 8Then Peter, filled with the Holy Spirit, said to them, “Rulers of the people and elders, 9if we are being examined today concerning a good deed done to a crippled man, by what means this man has been healed, 10let it be known to all of you and to all the people of Israel that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom you crucified, whom God raised from the dead—by him this man is standing before you well. 11This Jesusa is the stone that was rejected by you, the builders, which has become the cornerstone.b 12And there is salvation in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given among men by which we must be saved.”
13Now when they saw the boldness of Peter and John, and perceived that they were uneducated, common men, they were astonished. And they recognized that they had been with Jesus. 14But seeing the man who was healed standing beside them, they had nothing to say in opposition. 15But when they had commanded them to leave the council, they conferred with one another, 16saying, “What shall we do with these men? For that a notable sign has been performed through them is evident to all the inhabitants of Jerusalem, and we cannot deny it. 17But in order that it may spread no further among the people, let us warn them to speak no more to anyone in this name.” 18So they called them and charged them not to speak or teach at all in the name of Jesus. 19But Peter and John answered them, “Whether it is right in the sight of God to listen to you rather than to God, you must judge, 20for we cannot but speak of what we have seen and heard.” 21And when they had further threatened them, they let them go, finding no way to punish them, because of the people, for all were praising God for what had happened. 22For the man on whom this sign of healing was performed was more than forty years old.
The Believers Pray for Boldness
23When they were released, they went to their friends and reported what the chief priests and the elders had said to them. 24And when they heard it, they lifted their voices together to God and said, “Sovereign Lord, who made the heaven and the earth and the sea and everything in them, 25who through the mouth of our father David, your servant,c said by the Holy Spirit,
“‘Why did the Gentiles rage,
and the peoples plot in vain?
26 The kings of the earth set themselves,
and the rulers were gathered together,
against the Lord and against his Anointed’d—
27for truly in this city there were gathered together against your holy servant Jesus, whom you anointed, both Herod and Pontius Pilate, along with the Gentiles and the peoples of Israel, 28to do whatever your hand and your plan had predestined to take place. 29And now, Lord, look upon their threats and grant to your servantse to continue to speak your word with all boldness, 30while you stretch out your hand to heal, and signs and wonders are performed through the name of your holy servant Jesus.” 31And when they had prayed, the place in which they were gathered together was shaken, and they were all filled with the Holy Spirit and continued to speak the word of God with boldness.
They Had Everything in Common
32Now the full number of those who believed were of one heart and soul, and no one said that any of the things that belonged to him was his own, but they had everything in common. 33And with great power the apostles were giving their testimony to the resurrection of the Lord Jesus, and great grace was upon them all. 34There was not a needy person among them, for as many as were owners of lands or houses sold them and brought the proceeds of what was sold 35and laid it at the apostles’ feet, and it was distributed to each as any had need. 36Thus Joseph, who was also called by the apostles Barnabas (which means son of encouragement), a Levite, a native of Cyprus, 37sold a field that belonged to him and brought the money and laid it at the apostles’ feet.
when Jesus Ascended there was a TRANSFER: everything He does is now from GLORY, the Glory He had with the Father, before the world began.
the believing Israelites knew this.
here's the NT fulfillment. you can shuffle this and tweak it if you want to (i don't know why anyone would want to - Jesus is the Glorious King), but, nevertheless..... it is fulfilled. read it all - you'll see that the TRANSFER TO HEAVENLY ZION, and the Christian Church (New Jerusalem) was made at the First Advent:
Acts 4
Peter and John Before the Council
1And as they were speaking to the people, the priests and the captain of the temple and the Sadducees came upon them, 2greatly annoyed because they were teaching the people and proclaiming in Jesus the resurrection from the dead. 3And they arrested them and put them in custody until the next day, for it was already evening. 4But many of those who had heard the word believed, and the number of the men came to about five thousand.
5On the next day their rulers and elders and scribes gathered together in Jerusalem, 6with Annas the high priest and Caiaphas and John and Alexander, and all who were of the high-priestly family. 7And when they had set them in the midst, they inquired, “By what power or by what name did you do this?” 8Then Peter, filled with the Holy Spirit, said to them, “Rulers of the people and elders, 9if we are being examined today concerning a good deed done to a crippled man, by what means this man has been healed, 10let it be known to all of you and to all the people of Israel that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom you crucified, whom God raised from the dead—by him this man is standing before you well. 11This Jesusa is the stone that was rejected by you, the builders, which has become the cornerstone.b 12And there is salvation in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given among men by which we must be saved.”
13Now when they saw the boldness of Peter and John, and perceived that they were uneducated, common men, they were astonished. And they recognized that they had been with Jesus. 14But seeing the man who was healed standing beside them, they had nothing to say in opposition. 15But when they had commanded them to leave the council, they conferred with one another, 16saying, “What shall we do with these men? For that a notable sign has been performed through them is evident to all the inhabitants of Jerusalem, and we cannot deny it. 17But in order that it may spread no further among the people, let us warn them to speak no more to anyone in this name.” 18So they called them and charged them not to speak or teach at all in the name of Jesus. 19But Peter and John answered them, “Whether it is right in the sight of God to listen to you rather than to God, you must judge, 20for we cannot but speak of what we have seen and heard.” 21And when they had further threatened them, they let them go, finding no way to punish them, because of the people, for all were praising God for what had happened. 22For the man on whom this sign of healing was performed was more than forty years old.
The Believers Pray for Boldness
23When they were released, they went to their friends and reported what the chief priests and the elders had said to them. 24And when they heard it, they lifted their voices together to God and said, “Sovereign Lord, who made the heaven and the earth and the sea and everything in them, 25who through the mouth of our father David, your servant,c said by the Holy Spirit,
“‘Why did the Gentiles rage,
and the peoples plot in vain?
26 The kings of the earth set themselves,
and the rulers were gathered together,
against the Lord and against his Anointed’d—
27for truly in this city there were gathered together against your holy servant Jesus, whom you anointed, both Herod and Pontius Pilate, along with the Gentiles and the peoples of Israel, 28to do whatever your hand and your plan had predestined to take place. 29And now, Lord, look upon their threats and grant to your servantse to continue to speak your word with all boldness, 30while you stretch out your hand to heal, and signs and wonders are performed through the name of your holy servant Jesus.” 31And when they had prayed, the place in which they were gathered together was shaken, and they were all filled with the Holy Spirit and continued to speak the word of God with boldness.
They Had Everything in Common
32Now the full number of those who believed were of one heart and soul, and no one said that any of the things that belonged to him was his own, but they had everything in common. 33And with great power the apostles were giving their testimony to the resurrection of the Lord Jesus, and great grace was upon them all. 34There was not a needy person among them, for as many as were owners of lands or houses sold them and brought the proceeds of what was sold 35and laid it at the apostles’ feet, and it was distributed to each as any had need. 36Thus Joseph, who was also called by the apostles Barnabas (which means son of encouragement), a Levite, a native of Cyprus, 37sold a field that belonged to him and brought the money and laid it at the apostles’ feet.
B
At the second coming when the Messiah returns, when every eye shall see him, what do you think the people of Israel (the Jews) will do and how will they respond to him? Will Christ bring salvation with him for Israel or will he reject them because they rejected him? Is God going to extend his goodness to them and turn ungodliness away from Jacob? Is the Lord qualified to take away their sins and give them salvation when he comes a second time or have they forfeited it through unbelief and are not granted repentance? Christ does not have to be crucified again and when he comes a second time he will reveal that to Israel and they will see it and repent and the blindness shall be taken away and ungodliness turned away.