Attack of the Judaizers

[WomanLovesTX]

Ephesians 3

King James Version (KJV)

3 For this cause I Paul, the prisoner of Jesus Christ for you Gentiles,
2 If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me to you-ward:
3 How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words,
4 Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ)
5 Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit;
6 That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel:
7 Whereof I was made a minister, according to the gift of the grace of God given unto me by the effectual working of his power.




.......................

Josh, your emphasis is "YOU GENTILES". Correct? Paul has been teaching a "MYSTERY". Correct?

I've shared this several times before, but until it is understood, I think it should be continued to be shared.

The Bible in whole is one Big Story and Revelation of THE KINGDOM.

Beginning in Genesis we read Gen 48:19 "And his father refused, and said, I know it, my son, I know it: he (Manasseh) also shall become a people, and he also shall be great: but truly his younger brother (Ephraim) shall be greater than he, and his (Ephraim) seed shall become a MULTITUDE OF NATIONS. "

MULTITUDE OF NATIONS = multitude[SUP] H4393=Fulness[/SUP] of nations[SUP] H1471=Gentiles[/SUP]

H4393
מלו מלוא מלא
melô' melô' melô
mel-o', mel-o', mel-o'
From H4390; fulness (literally or figuratively): - X all along, X all that is (there-) in, fill, (X that whereof . . . was) full, fulness, [hand-] full, multitude.

H1471
גּי גּוי
gôy gôy
go'ee, go'-ee
Apparently from the same root as H1465 (in the sense of massing); a foreign nation; hence a Gentile; also (figuratively) a troop of animals, or a flight of locusts: - Gentile, heathen, nation, people.

Then in Romans Paul writes the very same thing.

Rom 11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.

You will not find in KJV the word "mystery" anywhere in the OT. So what is Paul saying that he does not want them to be ignorant of? The same thing that Jesus came and revealed? THE GOSPEL OF THE KINGDOM OF GOD/HEAVEN soon coming to planet Earth so that those who were once called "my people", then became "not my people" and then once again are now called "my people" through the blood of Christ, who have become scattered/dispersed throughout all the nations and lost their true identity, calling themselves "Gentile Christians".

Jesus is calling the lost sheep. They know His voice. Jesus said Mat 15:24 But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.

Psa 95:7 For he is our God; and we are the people of his pasture, and the sheep of his hand. To day if ye will hear his voice, Psa 95:8 Harden not your heart, as in the provocation, and as in the day of temptation in the wilderness:

Joh 10:1 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that entereth not by the door into the sheepfold, but climbeth up some other way, the same is a thief and a robber.
Joh 10:2 But he that entereth in by the door is the shepherd of the sheep.
Joh 10:3 To him the porter openeth; and the sheep hear his voice: and he calleth his own sheep by name, and leadeth them out.
Joh 10:4 And when he putteth forth his own sheep, he goeth before them, and the sheep follow him: for they know his voice.
Joh 10:5 And a stranger will they not follow, but will flee from him: for they know not the voice of strangers.

Joh 10:16 And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.
Joh 10:17 Therefore doth my Father love me, because I lay down my life, that I might take it again.
Joh 10:18 No man taketh it from me, but I lay it down of myself. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again. This commandment have I received of my Father.

Jesus and Paul further speaks several times about "Marriage and Divorce" and The law of widows (from Torah) is applied in the cause for Israel divorced (by God) and Israel remarrying (To Christ/Son of God who died and now lives forever). This is the mystery and secret revealed to all of us. I am not talking about knowing what tribe you come from, no, no, I am saying God expects us to join His people as Israel (See Romans 11). There is no longer room for Jew or Gentile, male or female, slave or free man, etc. in the New One Kingdom. We (all those He is calling in this life) are invited to receive the Covenant of Peace and the two divided Kingdoms will once again be one, with one King, King Yeshua/Jesus, forever and ever, with no end to His Kingdom.

Eze 37:26 Moreover I will make a covenant of peace with them; it shall be an everlasting covenant with them: and I will place them, and multiply them, and will set my sanctuary in the midst of them for evermore.

These are the promises. Shalom, and may you find yourselves joined to the Commonwealth of Israel.

 

[LT]

Of course I am not. I am asking what the Sabbath is the foreshadow of and how it is fulfilled and not needed anymore. How about you posting the fulfillments here publicly for all to see? You first then I will.

In part, that Sabbath reminds us of the coming rest on the Last Day, and that God desires us to have peace and rest even here while still on this earth. The rest after completion shows us what the 7th day is all about, and rejecting God's gift of rest now is symbolic of rejecting His rest in the next life

 

[Elin]

17things which are a mere shadow of what is to come; but the substance belongs to Christ. Col. 2

You have a little problem with timing trying to apply Col 2:16-17 here. This was written twenty some years AFTER you supposed fulfillment of all this and it is still FUTURE TENSE! It is still looking forward to something.

So. . .Christ's atonement, foreshadowed in the sacrifices, is still to come?

Ah, perhaps you can show us how the Sabbath foreshadowed this.

Cleansing by the blood of Christ, foreshadowed in sprinkling of blood, is still to come?

And perhaps you can explain to us which Holy Days foreshadowed this and how they did?

So the opening of the way by the blood of Christ into relationship with God, foreshadowed by the High Priest entering the Most Holy Place by the blood, is still to come?

Perhaps you will show us which Holy day foreshadowed this?

Non-responsive.

Check out Heb 10:1-18.

So the New Covenant made in the blood of Christ, foreshadowed in the Sinaitic Covenant made in the blood of animals, is still to come?

Go and learn what the NT apostolic letters mean, and stop plaguing the populace with error.

Maybe you can show us which Holy Day speaks to the return of Christ? Or is that all fulfilled also?

Please present certain NT teaching which states this, so that I may examine it.

The death, burial and resurrection of Christ is but one, albeit very important, part of God's plan.
Present the NT Scriptures which state this, so that I may examine them. His plan encompasses 7000 years of human history, maybe you can explain this to us.

Please present certain NT teaching which states this, so that I may examine it.

 

[Elin]

AMEN! Let's not limit grace, which would shame the sacrifice of our Lord Jesus Christ; but
let us ALSO live righteously,

Missed ya'.

Amen, and the NT is likewise covered over with instructions on how to live righteously.

as is described by the teaching in the Old Covenant.
We are no longer under the power or punishment of the Old Covenant, but we cannot disrespect our God by ignoring the Way He showed humanity to live, which is found in the Law of Moses.
The sacrificial system has been abolished. The food restrictions have been released. But the way of righteousness is still found in the Torah and Prophets.

And the way of righteousness is likewise amply presented in the NT.

 

[john832]

Non-responsive.

Check out Heb 10:1-18.




Please present certain NT teaching which states this, so that I may examine it.


Please present certain NT teaching which states this, so that I may examine it.

You have seen it before...

Col 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
Col 2:17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.

 

[LT]

Missed ya'.

Amen, and the NT is likewise covered over with instructions on how to live righteously.


And the way of righteousness is likewise amply presented in the NT.

All true. But the OT is still " useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness," -2Tim 3:16
We don't want to show any disrespect, or negligence toward the Word of God, but instead treasure every piece that we have

 

[Elin]

In part, that Sabbath reminds us of the coming rest on the Last Day,

And in the other part, it is the foreshadow of Christ, who is our rest from our own works to save, as God rested
from his own works to create.

and that God desires us to have peace and rest even here while still on this earth. The rest after completion shows us what the 7th day is all about, and rejecting God's gift of rest now is symbolic of rejecting His rest in the next life

 

[Hizikyah]

--------------------

Yahshua says these are the greatest Commandments, NOT THE ONLY! If that werent enough He clearly states all the Law hand on these 2.

Mattithyah 22:37-40, "Yahshua said to him: You must love Yahweh your Father with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your might. This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: You shall love your hneighbor as yourself. On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets."

Shaul clearly understands what the Messiah means and explains it here:

Romans 13:9, "For the commandments: You shall not commit adultery, You shall not murder, You shall not steal, You shall not bring false testimony, You shall not covet, and all other commandments are briefly summed up in these Laws; namely: You must love your neighbor as yourself."

All as in even the ones he didn't list...

Try breaking Leviticus 19:17 and still be loving your neighbor according to Messiah.

And try breaking the 4th Commandment and still be loving Yahweh.

Exodus 20:6, "But showing love to thousands who love Me by keeping My Laws."

Deuteronomy 10:12-13, "And now, O Israyl, what does Yahweh your Father require of you, but to reverence Yahweh your Father by walking in all His ways, by loving Him, by serving Yahweh your Father with all your heart, and with all your soul. By keeping the Laws of Yahweh, with His statutes, which I command you this day, so that you may be blessed?"

1 Yahchanan 5:2-3, "By this we know that we love the children of Yahweh: When we love Yahweh by keeping His Laws. For this is the love of Yahweh: That we keep His Law, and His Law is not grievous."

Mattithyah 22:37, "Yahshua said to him: You must love Yahweh your Father with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your might."

1 Corinthians 2:9, "But as it is written: Eye has not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the mind of man the things which Yahweh has prepared for those who love Him."

 

[Elin]

Maybe you can show us which Holy Day speaks to the return of Christ? Or is that all fulfilled also?

Please present certain NT teaching which states this, so that I may examine it.

The death, burial and resurrection of Christ is but one, albeit very important, part of God's plan.
Present the NT Scriptures which state this, so that I may examine them. His plan encompasses
7000 years of human history, maybe you can explain this to us.

Please present certain NT teaching which states this, so that I may examine it.

You have seen it before...

Col 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
Col 2:17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.

Your inability to present certain NT teaching stating the holy day which speaks to the return of Christ,
or stating the duration of human history is 7,000 years is noted.

 

[LT]

--------------------

Why keep bringing up the 10 commandments?

They are a non-issue.

The penalty for breaking those is death. God will humble the proud, and will destroy the one proud of his sins.
Who can disagree?

The problem is only if you believe that these sins are unforgivable.
They are forgivable, but no Christian should be striving to prove that by committing them!

 

[john832]

In part, that Sabbath reminds us of the coming rest on the Last Day, and that God desires us to have peace and rest even here while still on this earth. The rest after completion shows us what the 7th day is all about, and rejecting God's gift of rest now is symbolic of rejecting His rest in the next life

The Sabbath is the seventh day of the 7000 year plan of God. The wonderful, glorious Millenium when Christ, Himself will be King of Kings and Lord of Lords and rule the earth. The time when all alive will have salvation offered to them freely without the influence of Satan.

 

[john832]

And in the other part, it is the foreshadow of Christ, who is our rest from our own works to save, as God rested
from his own works to create.

You missed a little thing called the Millenium.

 

[john832]

Your inability to present certain NT teaching stating the holy day which speaks to the return of Christ,
or stating the duration of human history is 7,000 years is noted.

non-responsive

 

[john832]

Why keep bringing up the 10 commandments?

They are a non-issue.

The penalty for breaking those is death. God will humble the proud, and will destroy the one proud of his sins.
Who can disagree?

The problem is only if you believe that these sins are unforgivable.
They are forgivable, but no Christian should be striving to prove that by committing them!

Ah but there are those who keep saying they are done away, gone and mean nothing anymore.

 

[Elin]

All true. But the OT is still " useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness," -2Tim 3:16
We don't want to show any disrespect, or negligence toward the Word of God, but instead treasure every piece that we have

Amen!

As is the NT.

There is no need to distinguish them in that regard.

 

[Elin]

The Sabbath is the seventh day of the 7000 year plan of God. The wonderful, glorious Millenium when Christ, Himself will be King of Kings and Lord of Lords and rule the earth. The time when all alive will have salvation offered to them freely without the influence of Satan.

That's one way to interpret prophetic riddles.

Others interpret them to mean things entirely different, which is just as valid,
since there is no certain and unequivocal Biblical teaching giving the certain meaning of these prophecies.

 

[Hizikyah]

Why keep bringing up the 10 commandments?

They are a non-issue.

The penalty for breaking those is death. God will humble the proud, and will destroy the one proud of his sins.
Who can disagree?

The problem is only if you believe that these sins are unforgivable.
They are forgivable, but no Christian should be striving to prove that by committing them!

Messiah says all sins are forgivable except blaspheming the Holy Spirit of Yahweh.

That is beautiful you actually believe in honoring and guarding the 10 Commandments, I personally believe in all of them 613+, as homo and animal etc are not included in 10 and are still valid.

example:

Mattithyah 5:18, "For truly I say to you; Unless heaven and earth passes away, one yodh--the smallest of the letters--will in no way pass from the Law, until all things are perfected."

Luke 16:17, "But it is easier for heaven and earth to pass, than one yodh of the Law to fail."

Revelation 22:12-15, "And behold, I come quickly, and My reward is with Me, to give every man according as his work will be. I am the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End. Blessed are those who keep His Laws, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city. For outside are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and worshipers of gods and everyone who professes to love, yet practices falsehood."

None the less obedience to Yahweh is a beautiful thing. But I do have to ask, as most people and I know some of the things you have said, what about the 4th Commandment? One can not keep it unless they do what it says. (I would like for us to agree on all things, but I have to ask this because there is usually a but when it comes to #4)

 

[LT]

The Sabbath is the seventh day of the 7000 year plan of God. The wonderful, glorious Millenium when Christ, Himself will be King of Kings and Lord of Lords and rule the earth. The time when all alive will have salvation offered to them freely without the influence of Satan.

That is a good, and possible, interpretation.
The 'Millennial Kingdom' precept (although heavily relied upon by dispensationalist doctrine) is still far too mysterious for me to base the whole image upon.

We do both agree that the rest is after the 2nd coming of Christ, whether that is the Kingdom of Heaven (eternity future), or an earthly millennial kingdom.

 

[john832]

That is a good, and possible, interpretation.
The 'Millennial Kingdom' precept (although heavily relied upon by dispensationalist doctrine) is still far too mysterious for me to base the whole image upon.

We do both agree that the rest is after the 2nd coming of Christ, whether that is the Kingdom of Heaven (eternity future), or an earthly millennial kingdom.

That is why the Sabbath is not over and done. It looks forward to this time just as Col 2:16-17 shows that it does.

 

[Elin]

You missed a little thing called the Millenium.

That depends on your interpretation of prophetic riddles.

Without certain and unequivocal Biblical teaching to give the certain meaning of these prophecies,
the differing interpretations have equal weight.