Can Mosaic Law commend you to God
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It has always been by the grace of God that any are saved, the law exposed what sin was more clearly.
I do not believe people are condemned who try to follow the law, all who love God are trying to please Him, even those trying to work their way into God's favor, his grace is not voided because someone attempts to obey his law, in my opinion.
But to answer your question: No , none are saved by obeying the law of Moses because no one has ever obeyed it except Jesus Christ.
I do not believe people are condemned who try to follow the law, all who love God are trying to please Him, even those trying to work their way into God's favor, his grace is not voided because someone attempts to obey his law, in my opinion.
But to answer your question: No , none are saved by obeying the law of Moses because no one has ever obeyed it except Jesus Christ.
Christ Redeemed Us
(Deuteronomy 21:22-23)10For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them. 11But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith. 12And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them. 13Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree: 14That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.
The Purpose of the Law
(Romans 7:1-6)15Brethren, I speak after the manner of men; Though it be but a man's covenant, yet if it be confirmed, no man disannulleth, or addeth thereto. 16Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ. 17And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect. 18For if the inheritance be of the law, it is no more of promise: but God gave it to Abraham by promise.
19Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator. 20Now a mediator is not a mediator of one, but God is one. 21Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law. 22But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe.
23But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed. 24Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith. 25But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.
Sons Through Faith in Christ
26For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus. 27For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ. 28There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus. 29And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.
(Deuteronomy 21:22-23)10For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them. 11But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith. 12And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them. 13Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree: 14That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.
The Purpose of the Law
(Romans 7:1-6)15Brethren, I speak after the manner of men; Though it be but a man's covenant, yet if it be confirmed, no man disannulleth, or addeth thereto. 16Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ. 17And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect. 18For if the inheritance be of the law, it is no more of promise: but God gave it to Abraham by promise.
19Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator. 20Now a mediator is not a mediator of one, but God is one. 21Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law. 22But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe.
23But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed. 24Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith. 25But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.
Sons Through Faith in Christ
26For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus. 27For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ. 28There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus. 29And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.
I have never said that the 10 Commandments could save anyone. Unfortunately I have literally broken all 10 Commandments and I'm not proud of it. I had an abortion in my 20's I can't go back and change it, but I praise God that He has forgiven me with His grace. That was about 30 years ago - so believe me when I say I understand Gods grace.
However, I do believe that they are the rules that show us what sin is and what God expects and has asked us to obey. Have I obeyed them NO I can't Jesus did it for me that is called Grace.
I do not believe the 10 Commandments were nailed to the cross as some do. God thought it was important enough to write the rules of His government down on stone with His finger. When we all get to heaven the rules will still be in place, but they will all be obeyed out of love to God and our fellow man.
I'm talking about in heaven now when we have been made perfect. We will honor Gods rules there will never be stealing, killing, lying, adultery, coveting, in heaven we will all love God with all our hearts, we will not put anything above God as in no idols, we will keep Sabbath it says so in Isaiah 66:23, we will still love an honor our parents and no one will take Gods name in vain in heaven. Actually the whole chapter of Isaiah 66 is a good read the and the last few verses are talking about heaven.
Jesus is our Savior and His death on the cross paid the price for our salvation and reconciliation to God the Father. I so look forward to getting back to the Garden of Eden state that Adam and Eve started in. To be able to walk and talk face to face with God what glory, honor and praise is due our Savior.
However, I do believe that they are the rules that show us what sin is and what God expects and has asked us to obey. Have I obeyed them NO I can't Jesus did it for me that is called Grace.
I do not believe the 10 Commandments were nailed to the cross as some do. God thought it was important enough to write the rules of His government down on stone with His finger. When we all get to heaven the rules will still be in place, but they will all be obeyed out of love to God and our fellow man.
I'm talking about in heaven now when we have been made perfect. We will honor Gods rules there will never be stealing, killing, lying, adultery, coveting, in heaven we will all love God with all our hearts, we will not put anything above God as in no idols, we will keep Sabbath it says so in Isaiah 66:23, we will still love an honor our parents and no one will take Gods name in vain in heaven. Actually the whole chapter of Isaiah 66 is a good read the and the last few verses are talking about heaven.
Jesus is our Savior and His death on the cross paid the price for our salvation and reconciliation to God the Father. I so look forward to getting back to the Garden of Eden state that Adam and Eve started in. To be able to walk and talk face to face with God what glory, honor and praise is due our Savior.
There is no scripture from Genesis to Revelation that says that law we obey is to be obeyed to create salvation. This is something that the powers who are against God dreamed up. Demons use it to teach us not to look at the written law for our direction. They say that if you obey it is for salvation and that is wrong.
It would be like telling Americans that the constitution is all wrong because it only requires we love America so we must not go by the constitution.
There are many things the law does, and many things that it doesn't do. Christians are to look at what law can do so they know how to use it. Those opposed to God love to list the things law does not do in order to lead away from the beauty of the law. So they point out it won't save, that we can ignore it because all law is based on love. I don't follow that as a reason to get rid of law, but demons are sneaky. They even use that law needs to come from our heart in order to get rid of law. Amazing.
It would be like telling Americans that the constitution is all wrong because it only requires we love America so we must not go by the constitution.
There are many things the law does, and many things that it doesn't do. Christians are to look at what law can do so they know how to use it. Those opposed to God love to list the things law does not do in order to lead away from the beauty of the law. So they point out it won't save, that we can ignore it because all law is based on love. I don't follow that as a reason to get rid of law, but demons are sneaky. They even use that law needs to come from our heart in order to get rid of law. Amazing.
C
Redtent, dontcha get? The written Law is Love expressed in words. You speak of love as it is understood by Christians as though it was not quite enough. Love is the very thing which defines the written Law. You say that Love gets rid of the Law, but dontchar get it? Love is defined by the Law. Truly, you know that the Law is written upon our hearts, dontcha? So, of course, the law comes from our hearts. Where else could it come from, physical deeds?
If we Christians purpose that the Law needs to come from our heart, then how can we get rid of the Law? Are we Christians not purposing in keeping the Law when we say that it must come from our hearts? Dontcha get it? We cannot purpose it and at the same time oppose it....YES?
If we Christians purpose that the Law needs to come from our heart, then how can we get rid of the Law? Are we Christians not purposing in keeping the Law when we say that it must come from our hearts? Dontcha get it? We cannot purpose it and at the same time oppose it....YES?
How can something we have died to commend us to God?
Romans 7:4 So, my brothers and sisters, you also died to the law through the body of Christ, so that you could be joined to another, to the one who was raised from the dead, to bear fruit to God.
Also...
Romans 8:3 For God achieved what the law could not do because it was weakened through the flesh. By sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh and concerning sin, he condemned sin in the flesh,
Romans 7:4 So, my brothers and sisters, you also died to the law through the body of Christ, so that you could be joined to another, to the one who was raised from the dead, to bear fruit to God.
Also...
Romans 8:3 For God achieved what the law could not do because it was weakened through the flesh. By sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh and concerning sin, he condemned sin in the flesh,
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Galatians 4:3-7
3Even so we, when we were children, were in bondage under the elements of the world: 4But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law,5To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons. 6And because ye are sons,God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father. 7Wherefore thou art no more a servant, but a son; and if a son, then an heir of God through Christ.
God Bless
3Even so we, when we were children, were in bondage under the elements of the world: 4But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law,5To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons. 6And because ye are sons,God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father. 7Wherefore thou art no more a servant, but a son; and if a son, then an heir of God through Christ.
God Bless
We are going in circles. Love, Law it amounts to the same thing. So why should love in our hearts do away with law? Or law do away with love in our hearts? If we perform each law perfectly, but do not have our hearts right with God, it has little use. If we have love in our hearts while we disregard the law, it does no good, altho we can take ourselves to Christ with repentance always.
Quoted from another post simular to this thread...
Titus 2:11-14
For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;
Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ;
who gave Himself for us to redeem us from every lawless deed, and to purify for Himself a people for His own possession, zealous for good deeds.
God Bless
Titus 2:11-14
For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;
Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ;
who gave Himself for us to redeem us from every lawless deed, and to purify for Himself a people for His own possession, zealous for good deeds.
God Bless
2Co 6:1 As God's fellow-workers we also urge you not to receive his grace and then do nothing with it.
2Co 6:2 For he says, "At the acceptable time I heard you; in the day of salvation I helped you."
2Co 6:3 We try not to put obstacles in anyone's path, so that no one can find fault with the work we do.
2Co 6:4 On the contrary, we try to commend ourselves in every way as workers for God by continually enduring troubles, hardships, calamities,
2Co 6:5 beatings, imprisonments, riots, overwork, lack of sleep and food.
2Co 6:6 We commend ourselves by our purity, knowledge, patience and kindness; by the Ruach HaKodesh; by genuineness of love
2Co 6:7 and truthfulness of speech; and by God's power. We commend ourselves through our use of righteous weapons, whether for pressing our cause or defending it;
2Co 6:8 through being honored and dishonored, praised and blamed, considered deceptive and sincere,
2Co 6:9 unknown and famous. And we commend ourselves as God's workers headed for death, yet look! we're alive! as punished, yet not killed;
2Co 6:10 as having reason to be sad, yet always filled with joy; as poor, yet making many people rich; as having nothing, yet having everything!
2Co 6:11 Dear friends in Corinth! We have spoken frankly to you, we have opened our hearts wide.
2Co 6:12 Any constraint you feel has not been imposed by us, but by your own inner selves.
2Co 6:13 So, just to be "fair" (I am using the language of children), open wide your hearts too.
2Co 6:14 Do not yoke yourselves together in a team with unbelievers. For how can righteousness and lawlessness be partners? What fellowship does light have with darkness?
2Co 6:15 What harmony can there be between the Messiah and B'liya`al? What does a believer have in common with an unbeliever?
2Co 6:16 What agreement can there be between the temple of God and idols? For we are the temple of the living God — as God said, "I will house myself in them, . . . and I will walk among you. I will be their God, and they will be my people."
2Co 6:17 Therefore Adonai says, " 'Go out from their midst; separate yourselves; don't even touch what is unclean. Then I myself will receive you.
2Co 6:18 In fact, I will be your Father, and you will be my sons and daughters.' says Adonai-Tzva'ot."
2Co 6:2 For he says, "At the acceptable time I heard you; in the day of salvation I helped you."
2Co 6:3 We try not to put obstacles in anyone's path, so that no one can find fault with the work we do.
2Co 6:4 On the contrary, we try to commend ourselves in every way as workers for God by continually enduring troubles, hardships, calamities,
2Co 6:5 beatings, imprisonments, riots, overwork, lack of sleep and food.
2Co 6:6 We commend ourselves by our purity, knowledge, patience and kindness; by the Ruach HaKodesh; by genuineness of love
2Co 6:7 and truthfulness of speech; and by God's power. We commend ourselves through our use of righteous weapons, whether for pressing our cause or defending it;
2Co 6:8 through being honored and dishonored, praised and blamed, considered deceptive and sincere,
2Co 6:9 unknown and famous. And we commend ourselves as God's workers headed for death, yet look! we're alive! as punished, yet not killed;
2Co 6:10 as having reason to be sad, yet always filled with joy; as poor, yet making many people rich; as having nothing, yet having everything!
2Co 6:11 Dear friends in Corinth! We have spoken frankly to you, we have opened our hearts wide.
2Co 6:12 Any constraint you feel has not been imposed by us, but by your own inner selves.
2Co 6:13 So, just to be "fair" (I am using the language of children), open wide your hearts too.
2Co 6:14 Do not yoke yourselves together in a team with unbelievers. For how can righteousness and lawlessness be partners? What fellowship does light have with darkness?
2Co 6:15 What harmony can there be between the Messiah and B'liya`al? What does a believer have in common with an unbeliever?
2Co 6:16 What agreement can there be between the temple of God and idols? For we are the temple of the living God — as God said, "I will house myself in them, . . . and I will walk among you. I will be their God, and they will be my people."
2Co 6:17 Therefore Adonai says, " 'Go out from their midst; separate yourselves; don't even touch what is unclean. Then I myself will receive you.
2Co 6:18 In fact, I will be your Father, and you will be my sons and daughters.' says Adonai-Tzva'ot."
P
Please forgive me, Keren, if this is a derailment, but I have another question...
(if you'd like for me to start another thread, I surely won't be offended if you say so.
)
Can one be sanctified by keeping the Law of Moses?
(this question is quite pertinent, I think)
We all seem to agree that Christians must obey God.
The question seems to be, which commands ought we obey?
~ellie
ps--
Rom 4:13-16
For the promise to Abraham or to his descendants that he would be heir of the world was not through the Law, but through the righteousness of faith. For if those who are of the Law are heirs, faith is made void and the promise is nullified; for the Law brings about wrath, but where there is no law, there also is no violation.
For this reason it is by faith, in order that it may be in accordance with grace, so that the promise will be guaranteed to all the descendants, not only to those who are of the Law, but also to those who are of the faith of Abraham, who is the father of us all...
Rom 5:1a
Therefore, having been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ
Rom 5:20-21
The Law came in so that the transgression would increase; but where sin increased, grace abounded all the more,
so that, as sin reigned in death, even so grace would reign through righteousness to eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
♥
(if you'd like for me to start another thread, I surely won't be offended if you say so.
)Can one be sanctified by keeping the Law of Moses?
(this question is quite pertinent, I think)
We all seem to agree that Christians must obey God.
The question seems to be, which commands ought we obey?
~ellie
ps--
Rom 4:13-16
For the promise to Abraham or to his descendants that he would be heir of the world was not through the Law, but through the righteousness of faith. For if those who are of the Law are heirs, faith is made void and the promise is nullified; for the Law brings about wrath, but where there is no law, there also is no violation.
For this reason it is by faith, in order that it may be in accordance with grace, so that the promise will be guaranteed to all the descendants, not only to those who are of the Law, but also to those who are of the faith of Abraham, who is the father of us all...
Rom 5:1a
Therefore, having been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ
Rom 5:20-21
The Law came in so that the transgression would increase; but where sin increased, grace abounded all the more,
so that, as sin reigned in death, even so grace would reign through righteousness to eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
♥
No
Can BREAKING the Law make you trghteous enough to enter heaven?
No
the law isnt about salvation it is about loyalty character and obedience.
You are a law keeper by faith
or a lawbreaker by presumption of salvation.
The law isnt about forgiveness you have it all mixed up
Only Jesus blood can forgive our sins and give us access to heaven
Keeping the law is all about your fitness for heanve
MANY christians will accept Jesus blood and salvation then loose it by turning back to unrighteousness and breaking the law
so they had to invent once saved always saved to plug this hole and make more money
its all a lie
the seal of God is forgiveness by Jesus blod AND obedience to the law
two things
two
2
things
one wont get you there
Rev 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.
Two things
Can BREAKING the Law make you trghteous enough to enter heaven?
No
the law isnt about salvation it is about loyalty character and obedience.
You are a law keeper by faith
or a lawbreaker by presumption of salvation.
The law isnt about forgiveness you have it all mixed up
Only Jesus blood can forgive our sins and give us access to heaven
Keeping the law is all about your fitness for heanve
MANY christians will accept Jesus blood and salvation then loose it by turning back to unrighteousness and breaking the law
so they had to invent once saved always saved to plug this hole and make more money
its all a lie
the seal of God is forgiveness by Jesus blod AND obedience to the law
two things
two
2
things
one wont get you there
Rev 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.
Two things
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The OP poll asked...
''can the Law make you righteous enough to enter God's presence?''
I'd answer...
Hebrews 10:19-22 Therefore, brothers and sisters, since we have confidence to enter the sanctuary by the blood of Jesus,
by the fresh and living way that he inaugurated for us through the curtain, that is, through his flesh,
and since we have a great priest over the house of God,
let us draw near with a sincere heart in the assurance that faith brings, because we have had our hearts sprinkled clean from an evil conscience and our bodies washed in pure water.
Not by law but by His blood? Yes, by His blood.
''can the Law make you righteous enough to enter God's presence?''
I'd answer...
Hebrews 10:19-22 Therefore, brothers and sisters, since we have confidence to enter the sanctuary by the blood of Jesus,
by the fresh and living way that he inaugurated for us through the curtain, that is, through his flesh,
and since we have a great priest over the house of God,
let us draw near with a sincere heart in the assurance that faith brings, because we have had our hearts sprinkled clean from an evil conscience and our bodies washed in pure water.
Not by law but by His blood? Yes, by His blood.
The question seems to come down to asking what good is the law? We are told so many things it won't do that lots of posters are saying it really has no purpose. It won't sanctify us, won't save us, doesn't work at all without the Holy Spirit, and on and on about what it won't do and what it isn't. Some say they have Christ, they don't need anyone telling them what to do.
Yet scripture gives us a psalm with 176 verses in it, praising law. There is scripture telling us 613 ways to behave in such a way we have a good safe world to live in. Lots of those laws were how to handle the temple, etc. that has changed now that Christ was resurrected, but the principles remain the same. The blood of animals is Christ's blood. The temple isn't in a building, we are the temple. Christ is the high priest. People are now so far removed from the people of thousands of years ago that God used to show his principles that those scriptures are so little understood that most Christians only laugh at them, now. They say those laws were about stoning people and laugh at God.
Thousands of years ago, these laws built a happy safe world to live in when they were obeyed, where the neighbor countries gave little justice and even babies were murdered. The same principles would build a safe world today. Marriages wouldn't fall apart, members of a family wouldn't hurt each other, children would have a mother and father, no one would be shunned, the homeless would have a home, there would be cleanliness everywhere, houses and cars could be left unlocked.
Our Savior guides our spirit, but when our spirit tells God to just let me figure it out for myself, don't try to write anything to tell me your laws, it just isn't following Christ.
Yet scripture gives us a psalm with 176 verses in it, praising law. There is scripture telling us 613 ways to behave in such a way we have a good safe world to live in. Lots of those laws were how to handle the temple, etc. that has changed now that Christ was resurrected, but the principles remain the same. The blood of animals is Christ's blood. The temple isn't in a building, we are the temple. Christ is the high priest. People are now so far removed from the people of thousands of years ago that God used to show his principles that those scriptures are so little understood that most Christians only laugh at them, now. They say those laws were about stoning people and laugh at God.
Thousands of years ago, these laws built a happy safe world to live in when they were obeyed, where the neighbor countries gave little justice and even babies were murdered. The same principles would build a safe world today. Marriages wouldn't fall apart, members of a family wouldn't hurt each other, children would have a mother and father, no one would be shunned, the homeless would have a home, there would be cleanliness everywhere, houses and cars could be left unlocked.
Our Savior guides our spirit, but when our spirit tells God to just let me figure it out for myself, don't try to write anything to tell me your laws, it just isn't following Christ.
K
2,000 years later and we are still discussing the curse of the law. Wow, We have Romans, 1 Corinthians, 2 Corinthians, Galatians, Ephesians, Hebrews, and so on. No wonder Abraham told Lazarus, they have the law and the prophets if they do not believe them they will not believe though their brother come back from the dead.
Just wow!!
Just wow!!