The Truth About The Sabbath

[SolidGround]

Well, my work week has always started on Monday, making Sunday the 7th day.

Where did all these Saturday Sabbath pushers come from? I have never met a single one in person in all my years, yet there are 6-7 active on this thread... cept for the Adventists and Armstrongism people. cults.

Me thinks there is probably just 1 or 2 with multi accounts, but that is just what statistics would say.

 

[danschance]

I disagree with your comment "The Jewish laws were never given to Gentiles either."

If that were true, then Jesus would be breaking some of His own commandments.

Mat 23:1 Then spake Jesus to the multitude, and to his disciples,
Mat 23:2 Saying, The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat:
Mat 23:3 All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not.

Even the apostles speaking of what the Gentiles should learn, spoke saying....

Act 15:19 Wherefore my sentence is, that we trouble not them, which from among the Gentiles are turned to God:
Act 15:20 But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood.
Act 15:21 For Moses of old time hath in every city them that preach him, being read in the synagogues every sabbath day.

And the "gentile" from the Exodus out of Egypt....

Exo 12:49 One law shall be to him that is homeborn, and unto the stranger that sojourneth among you.

Lev 24:22 Ye shall have one manner of law, as well for the stranger, as for one of your own country: for I am the LORD your God.

Num 15:16 One law and one manner shall be for you, and for the stranger that sojourneth with you.

Num 15:29 Ye shall have one law for him that sinneth through ignorance, both for him that is born among the children of Israel, and for the stranger that sojourneth among them.

As to Romans 10:4....

This verse is often cited by those who claim that God’s Law is now void. The apostle Paul explained (Romans 10:3) how some in Rome were trying to establish their own righteousness apart from God. Ignoring Christ’s sacrifice, they thought that merely obeying the commandments would be sufficient for anyone to receive salvation.

Paul went on to explain in verses 6 and 7, “But the righteousness which is of faith speaks on this wise, Say not in your heart, Who shall ascend into heaven? (that is, to bring Christ down from above Or, Who shall descend into the deep? (that is, to bring up Christ again from the dead.)” In effect, Paul is saying, “Your righteousness is not going to change the fact that Christ died (no matter how righteous you are or think you are, Christ still had to die for your sins)” and “it is not going to change the fact that He is raised (and is now Himself living in converted Christians [Gal. 2:20; Rom. 8:9]).” It is Christ in us that enables us to keep God’s Law, not anything we do of and by ourselves.

To properly grasp the meaning of Romans 10:4, we must first understand what Paul meant by the phrase “the end of the law.” The Greek word translated “end” is telos (Strong’s #5056), meaning “the point aimed at; result.” In other words, Paul is saying that God’s spiritual Law, which God also calls “holy, and just, and good” (Rom. 7:12), points to Christ, who “

us an example, that you should follow His steps” (I Pet. 2:21). It is Christ living in us that enables us to keep God’s holy, perfect Law, which we lack the spiritual strength to keep, of and by ourselves (Rom. 7:14-25; 8:7-8). The Christian’s ultimate goal is to become like Christ, “the Author and Finisher of our faith” (Heb. 12:2).

In order to better understand the meaning of the word “end,” as used in the context of Romans 10:4, notice: “Behold, we count them happy which endure. You have heard of the patience of Job, and have seen the end of the Lord; that the Lord is very pitiful, and of tender mercy” (Jms. 5:11). James did not mean that Christ’s end had come. He meant that they (the scattered twelve tribes of Israel [1:1]) had seen the aim (purpose) of the Lord: “…that the Lord is very pitiful, and of tender mercy.” God’s tender mercy on mankind is shown in John 3:16: “For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believes in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life.”​

Yes, Christ is the end of the law or Christ is what the law is aimed at. Don't you see? I know you are sincere in your beliefs but you are also sincerely wrong in them.​

 

[danschance]

End here is...

G5056
τέλος
telos
tel'-os
From a primary word τέλλω tellō (to set out for a definite point or goal); properly the point aimed at as a limit, that is, (by implication) the conclusion of an act or state (termination [literally, figuratively or indefinitely], result [immediate, ultimate or prophetic], purpose); specifically an impost or levy (as paid): - + continual, custom, end (-ing), finally, uttermost. Compare G5411.

If you wish to apply G5056 as the abolishing of the Law, let's apply the word as abolishing...

1Pe 1:9 Receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls.

The word for end here is G5056 so you have abolished faith.

Jas 5:11 Behold, we count them happy which endure. Ye have heard of the patience of Job, and have seen the end of the Lord; that the Lord is very pitiful, and of tender mercy.

Same word, G5056, now you have abolished the Lord!




What was the schoolmaster that brought us to Christ?

Heb 9:8 The Holy Ghost this signifying, that the way into the holiest of all was not yet made manifest, while as the first tabernacle was yet standing:
Heb 9:9 Which was a figure for the time then present, in which were offered both gifts and sacrifices, that could not make him that did the service perfect, as pertaining to the conscience;
Heb 9:10 Which stood only in meats and drinks, and divers washings, and carnal ordinances, imposed on them until the time of reformation.
Heb 9:11 But Christ being come an high priest of good things to come, by a greater and more perfect tabernacle, not made with hands, that is to say, not of this building;
Heb 9:12 Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us.
Heb 9:13 For if the blood of bulls and of goats, and the ashes of an heifer sprinkling the unclean, sanctifieth to the purifying of the flesh:
Heb 9:14 How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?

Heb 10:1 For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect.
Heb 10:2 For then would they not have ceased to be offered? because that the worshippers once purged should have had no more conscience of sins.
Heb 10:3 But in those sacrifices there is a remembrance again made of sins every year.
Heb 10:4 For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins.
Heb 10:5 Wherefore when he cometh into the world, he saith, Sacrifice and offering thou wouldest not, but a body hast thou prepared me:
Heb 10:6 In burnt offerings and sacrifices for sin thou hast had no pleasure.
Heb 10:7 Then said I, Lo, I come (in the volume of the book it is written of me,) to do thy will, O God.
Heb 10:8 Above when he said, Sacrifice and offering and burnt offerings and offering for sin thou wouldest not, neither hadst pleasure therein; which are offered by the law;
Heb 10:9 Then said he, Lo, I come to do thy will, O God. He taketh away the first, that he may establish the second.
Heb 10:10 By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.

The schoolmaster, the instructor that brought us to Christ were the animal sacrifices that were the shadow of Christ's perfect sacrifice.




Quote the passage not the verse...

Eph 2:15 having abolished in His flesh the enmity, that is, the law of commandments contained in ordinances, so as to create in Himself one new man from the two, thus making peace,
Eph 2:16 and that He might reconcile them both to God in one body through the cross, thereby putting to death the enmity.

What is the enmity?

Rom 8:7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.



OK, are we released from the Law or released from the punishment due us for breaking the Law. If we are released from the Law we are free to do as we please with no penalty...

Rom 4:15 Because the law worketh wrath: for where no law is, there is no transgression.

Rom 5:13 (For until the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law.

So, there is no transgression or sin is not imputed. We can lie, steal, murder, take God's holy name in vain, bow down to idols, etc. because we are free from Law?

Or have our sins been forgiven for breaking the Law. We are free from paying the price for breaking the Law, the second death.

Just one last point about the Law being done away, if the Law is truly done away and...

Rom 4:15 Because the law worketh wrath: for where no law is, there is no transgression.
Rom 5:13 (For until the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law.

why do we need a Savior? We can't sin because there is no Law...

1Jn 3:4 Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.

sRom 7:7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.

So we don't need anyone to save us from sin. Sin no longer exists.

Wonder why Paul said this?

Rom 3:31 Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.

John those verses are clear, we are not under the Mosaic law. We are under the laws of Christ. Pure and simple.

 

[danschance]

Well, my work week has always started on Monday, making Sunday the 7th day.

Where did all these Saturday Sabbath pushers come from? I have never met a single one in person in all my years, yet there are 6-7 active on this thread... cept for the Adventists and Armstrongism people. cults.

Me thinks there is probably just 1 or 2 with multi accounts, but that is just what statistics would say.

Just pray for them that they will find the truth and keep on praying for them.

Welcome to CC.

 

[SolidGround]

Just pray for them that they will find the truth and keep on praying for them.

Welcome to CC.

ty.
I think some of them mean well, just too easily distracted by worldly things, like days of the week.
Don't get choked out by those little weeds!
They need more Bible and less chat.
too many youtube sermons maybe.

 

[RedTent]

Yes, Christ is the end of the law or Christ is what the law is aimed at. Don't you see? I know you are sincere in your beliefs but you are also sincerely wrong in them.

How can you accuse others of being wrong when you deny scripture, and even the scripture of the gospels?

 

[RedTent]

That was a bunch of silly prattle. What were you trying to say? If you accept part of the law, you are putting yourself under all of it. Pretty sure that isn't a good idea.

Those who are putting themselves under the law, all of it, are saying they will obey every bit of it and not go to Christ. They would have to take the place of God to do that. Are you saying that you think I am so arrogant that I feel I can do what only God can do? I think judging others of such a serious thing puts YOU under the law.

 

[danschance]

How can you accuse others of being wrong when you deny scripture, and even the scripture of the gospels?

Very simply. Your take on those scriptures is wrong.

I have a friend of mine who is a Mormon. He and I have tried to convert each other for years. He is very sincere and adamant that he is correct, so am I! He believes I am wrong, just as you think I am wrong in denying that the NT believer is not under the Mosaic laws.

Most people are very sincere in their beliefs. The Hindus, the Muslims, the Buddhists, etc, etc all think they have the truth and all the others have a lie. If they did believe they were in a lie they would leave. I have posted 4 scriptures which very clearly state the Mosaic law has no hold on NT believers and yet not a single "nomian nut" has seen it as affecting their position. Only God can make the scales fall from one's own eyes.

 

[phil112]

Those who are putting themselves under the law, all of it, are saying they will obey every bit of it and not go to Christ. They would have to take the place of God to do that. Are you saying that you think I am so arrogant that I feel I can do what only God can do? I think judging others of such a serious thing puts YOU under the law.

Okay, you obey the sabbath. Matters not what day you rest to me, I am certainly not one to fault you for it. But you tell me I'm wrong if I don't. Clearly, you think I am breaking the law and you're not.

Do you know and teach the torah? Deuteronomy 6:7
Do you wear the torah on you hand? on your forehead? Deuteronomy 6:8
Do you say grace AFTER you eat? Deuteronomy 8:10
Do you put fringes on the borders of you clothing? Numbers 15:38
Do you tithe? Leviticus 27:30


Do you miss any of these? Then you might as well miss them all.

For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.

 

[RedTent]

Okay, you obey the sabbath. Matters not what day you rest to me, I am certainly not one to fault you for it. But you tell me I'm wrong if I don't. Clearly, you think I am breaking the law and you're not.

Do you know and teach the torah? Deuteronomy 6:7
Do you wear the torah on you hand? on your forehead? Deuteronomy 6:8
Do you say grace AFTER you eat? Deuteronomy 8:10
Do you put fringes on the borders of you clothing? Numbers 15:38
Do you tithe? Leviticus 27:30


Do you miss any of these? Then you might as well miss them all.

Actually, God gave the law to those who are saved, to those who belong to Him. As people who deny the words Jesus spoke, the law is not for you. So you are right in denying that law is not for you to listen to. It isn't meant for those who deny the words of Christ.

No one was ever saved by the law, Atheist can put themselves under the law, saying they can obey it, and they would have to obey all of it to be saved, so their work would be for nothing. My salvation comes from Christ, not the law.

The law is given because God loves us, it is for our benefit, and for those who listen to Christ, it is to guide them to the blessings God has in store for us. It was never meant for salvation.

But if I was to deny the words of my Savior, if I would say that how God guides me is not for me, then my salvation would be in question. That is why it is so serious, and serious for our church, to have all this denial of God.

 

[phil112]

As people who deny the words Jesus spoke, the law is not for you. So you are right in denying that law is not for you to listen to. It isn't meant for those who deny the words of Christ..

First, I don't deny Christ - or His word. You just spoke a bald-faced lie.
Do you profess to be saved? Then you need to stop false witnessing.

Lie not one to another, seeing that ye have put off the old man with his deeds;

Second, if you aren't under the law, as you claim, why is it wrong for me not to observe the sabbath? Did you change your mind?

 

[Laodicea]

The first mention of Sabbath is in Exodus 16, not Genesis. You are believing a myth.

Genesis 2:2 KJV
(2) And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested(H7673) on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.


H7673
שׁבת
shâbath
shaw-bath'
A primitive root; to repose, that is, desist from exertion; used in many implied relations (causatively, figuratively or specifically): - (cause to, let, make to) cease, celebrate, cause (make) to fail, keep (sabbath), suffer to be lacking, leave, put away (down), (make to) rest, rid, still, take away.


The word rested in Genesis 2:2 is also translated as sabbath


2 Chronicles 36:21 KJV
(21) To fulfil the word of the LORD by the mouth of Jeremiah, until the land had enjoyed her sabbaths: for as long as she lay desolate she kept sabbath(H7673), to fulfil threescore and ten years.


So the sabbath is mentioned at creation.

 

[danschance]

Genesis 2:2 KJV
(2) And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested(H7673) on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.


H7673
שׁבת
shâbath
shaw-bath'
A primitive root; to repose, that is, desist from exertion; used in many implied relations (causatively, figuratively or specifically): - (cause to, let, make to) cease, celebrate, cause (make) to fail, keep (sabbath), suffer to be lacking, leave, put away (down), (make to) rest, rid, still, take away.


The word rested in Genesis 2:2 is also translated as sabbath


2 Chronicles 36:21 KJV
(21) To fulfil the word of the LORD by the mouth of Jeremiah, until the land had enjoyed her sabbaths: for as long as she lay desolate she kept sabbath(H7673), to fulfil threescore and ten years.


So the sabbath is mentioned at creation.

Then why did God hand Moses tablets of stone that also included the fourth commandment? Does God have poor memory?

 

[Laodicea]

Then why did God hand Moses tablets of stone that also included the fourth commandment? Does God have poor memory?

Are you mocking God? If you think that it only came to existence when He gave the 10 commandments then you have to say the same about the other 9. The fourth commandment starts with the word remember, meaning it was already there. No matter what you do the fact is I showed you from the Bible that the sabbath was given at creation. Can you prove from the Bible it was not?

 

[danschance]

Are you mocking God? If you think that it only came to existence when He gave the 10 commandments then you have to say the same about the other 9. The fourth commandment starts with the word remember, meaning it was already there. No matter what you do the fact is I showed you from the Bible that the sabbath was given at creation. Can you prove from the Bible it was not?

No I am not mocking God, but I am poking fun at your claim that saying God rested on the seventh day means that is when sabbath observance started. Again, if sabbath started on the 7th day in Genesis, as you claim, then why would God write it again at Mt Sinai? I would appreciate an answer to this simple question if you can.

 

[Laodicea]

No I am not mocking God, but I am poking fun at your claim that saying God rested on the seventh day means that is when sabbath observance started. Again, if sabbath started on the 7th day in Genesis, as you claim, then why would God write it again at Mt Sinai? I would appreciate an answer to this simple question if you can.

With that reasoning that would mean none of the 10 commandments existed before Sinai. Again you give an opinion with no scriptural basis. I showed evidence you showed none. It is the Bible you are rejecting not my interpretation because I showed evidence.

 

[danschance]

With that reasoning that would mean none of the 10 commandments existed before Sinai. Again you give an opinion with no scriptural basis. I showed evidence you showed none. It is the Bible you are rejecting not my interpretation because I showed evidence.

1) You made the assertion that the sabbath was observed in Genesis.
2) I am asking for you to prove that assertion.
3) Is that simple enough for you?
4) This is the third time I have asked you for proof.

 

[RedTent]

First, I don't deny Christ - or His word. You just spoke a bald-faced lie.
Do you profess to be saved? Then you need to stop false witnessing.

Second, if you aren't under the law, as you claim, why is it wrong for me not to observe the sabbath? Did you change your mind?

Phil, you cannot know you are against God's word, for you are blind to that. I am not trying to convince you, I am trying to make the true word spoken on cc. Christ says that not a jot of the law is changed, only that He is adding to it. You are saying that is not so. That is your words, not mine.

I have never said it is wrong for you not to observe the Sabbath, I have said it is wrong for you to say that all the law of Moses as you define that law as the entire law, not the rituals, is wrong.

 

[jag1977]

With that reasoning that would mean none of the 10 commandments existed before Sinai. Again you give an opinion with no scriptural basis. I showed evidence you showed none. It is the Bible you are rejecting not my interpretation because I showed evidence.

Yeah I was accused earlier in another thread when I wrote the commandments existed before Moses. False teachings and a non christian I believe I was made out to be. I'm pretty sure they are sitting right now as we type in a British museum carved into stone in hieroglyphics. They have been scientifically proven to predate the writings of Moses. Still with many found in genesis and scientific proof outside the bible people still choose to believe a lie and can never experience the full spirit of God free from bondage. The spirit of unleavened they will always have, nourished through time by the corn purchased out of egypt by their fathers. Like what I say or not that is what is written in the bible. I don't care what they thought or were taught or how many believe it to be a lie. Doesn't matter....that's what is written.

 

[Laodicea]

1) You made the assertion that the sabbath was observed in Genesis.
2) I am asking for you to prove that assertion.
3) Is that simple enough for you?
4) This is the third time I have asked you for proof.

I have already showed you that the word rested in Genesis 2:2 also means sabbath to which you rejected by your opinion. Do you think that God kept the sabbath and Adam & Eve just created did not? There is also this text.

Genesis 26:5 KJV
(5) Because that Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws.