Why did God favor Israel, and why does He still if it is a Jewish state that denies

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
G

GM777

Guest
#1
the Messiah?
 
M

Married_Richenbrachen

Guest
#3
Any "Jewish" state that denies The Messiah is not The Israel of God.
 

starfield

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2009
3,393
58
48
#4
Any "Jewish" state that denies The Messiah is not The Israel of God.
That’s right. Good post. Believers are the Israel of God. :)

Galatians 3:28-29 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is no male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. And if you are Christ's, then you are Abraham's offspring, heirs according to promise.

Galatians 6:15-16 For neither circumcision counts for anything, nor uncircumcision, but a new creation. And as for all who walk by this rule, peace and mercy be upon them, and upon the Israel of God.

 
Feb 21, 2014
5,672
18
0
#5
That’s right. Good post. Believers are the Israel of God. :)

Galatians 3:28-29 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is no male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. And if you are Christ's, then you are Abraham's offspring, heirs according to promise.

Galatians 6:15-16 For neither circumcision counts for anything, nor uncircumcision, but a new creation. And as for all who walk by this rule, peace and mercy be upon them, and upon the Israel of God.

Believers in the Lord Jesus are Jews inwardly, whose circumcision is of the heart.

The church and Israel are distinct.
 

starfield

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2009
3,393
58
48
#6
Believers in the Lord Jesus are Jews inwardly, whose circumcision is of the heart.

The church and Israel are distinct.
So you're saying that God has two distinct people - Israel and the Church?
Unbelieving Israel are God's people?

Romans 2:28-29
28 For no one is a Jew who is merely one outwardly, nor is circumcision outward and physical.
29 But a Jew is one inwardly, and circumcision is a matter of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the letter. His praise is not from man but from God.

Romans 9:6-8
6 But it is not as though the word of God has failed. For not all who are descended from Israel belong to Israel,
7 and not all are children of Abraham because they are his offspring, but "Through Isaac shall your offspring be named."
8 This means that it is not the children of the flesh who are the children of God, but the children of the promise are counted as offspring.


Dispensational theology is false. Scripture is pretty clear that God has one people and they are true Israel, the church, who believe in the Messiah.
 
Dec 29, 2013
599
6
0
#7
This is a loaded question, one assuming that a nation of neo-Pharisees is the land of regathered Israel. It is not. Read Hebrews, James and 1 Peter etc. These do not identify Israel as the neo-Pharisees which Israelis are. To identify Israel based upon the idea that Israel rejected Jesus and the New Covenant is totally contrary to the context of the general epistles. Yes, the Judean Pharisees and their loyalists rejected Jesus and the New Covenant, but they were only a small portion of Israel at that time.
 
Dec 29, 2013
599
6
0
#8
God's covenant with the Jewish state is still binding and will be when Jesus returns to Jerusalem.
Your argument is based on the idea that the Judean Pharisees and their loyalists were the entirety of Israel, and that today's Khazar "Jews" are descended from them. Neither is true.
 
Feb 21, 2014
5,672
18
0
#9
So you're saying that God has two distinct people - Israel and the Church?
Unbelieving Israel are God's people?

Romans 2:28-29
28 For no one is a Jew who is merely one outwardly, nor is circumcision outward and physical.
29 But a Jew is one inwardly, and circumcision is a matter of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the letter. His praise is not from man but from God.

Romans 9:6-8
6 But it is not as though the word of God has failed. For not all who are descended from Israel belong to Israel,
7 and not all are children of Abraham because they are his offspring, but "Through Isaac shall your offspring be named."
8 This means that it is not the children of the flesh who are the children of God, but the children of the promise are counted as offspring.


Dispensational theology is false. Scripture is pretty clear that God has one people and they are true Israel, the church, who believe in the Messiah.
We see things differently, then. Paul says to the Corinthians: Give none offence, neither to the Jew nor to the Gentile, nor to the church of God.
 
Dec 29, 2013
599
6
0
#10
James, a servant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ, to the twelve tribes which are scattered abroad, greeting. James 1:1

James, writing before the destruction of Jerusalem in AD 70, was not describing these Israelites as the Christ hating Pharisees which everyone seems to think were all of Israel. Read James, it does not agree with the idea of an Israel which rejected Jesus 2000 years ago.
 
Dec 29, 2013
599
6
0
#11
Read The Epistle to the Hebrews. Written to Hebrew-Israelites it describes them in a Christian New Covenant context. Chapters 8-10 are especially on this. They tell us that the New Covenant, that which was promised to, and made with, "the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah" (Jer. 31:31/Heb. 8:8)---was accepted by them, and was in effect 2000 years ago. Wake up you naive evangelicals, stop identifying Israel based upon the idea that these people rejected Jesus and the New Covenant. This is a lie, one for the benefit of today's Pharisees, for the benefit of "...them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are of the synagogue of Satan" (Rev. 2:9; 3:9).
 
Dec 29, 2013
599
6
0
#12
We see things differently, then. Paul says to the Corinthians: Give none offence, neither to the Jew nor to the Gentile, nor to the church of God.
Hebrews, James, 1 Peter and scores of other references identify Israelites, not as distinct from the church, but as the nucleus of the church. Read it. It's there. Wake up.
 

starfield

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2009
3,393
58
48
#13
We see things differently, then. Paul says to the Corinthians: Give none offence, neither to the Jew nor to the Gentile, nor to the church of God.
The same Apostle Paul wrote these under inspiration of the Holy Spirit...

Galatians 3:26-29
26 for in Christ Jesus you are all sons of God, through faith.
27 For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is no male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus.
29 And if you are Christ's, then you are Abraham's offspring, heirs according to promise.

Ephesians 2:11-17
11 Therefore remember that at one time you Gentiles in the flesh, called "the uncircumcision" by what is called the circumcision, which is made in the flesh by hands—
12 remember that you were at that time separated from Christ, alienated from the commonwealth of Israel and strangers to the covenants of promise, having no hope and without God in the world.
13 But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ.
14 For he himself is our peace, who has made us both one and has broken down in his flesh the dividing wall of hostility
15 by abolishing the law of commandments expressed in ordinances, that he might create in himself one new man in place of the two, so making peace,
16 and might reconcile us both to God in one body through the cross, thereby killing the hostility.
17 And he came and preached peace to you who were far off and peace to those who were near.
 
Feb 21, 2014
5,672
18
0
#14
'...blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fullness of the Gentiles be come in' (Romans 11.25). Israel is temporarily blind, while God's Gospel purposes for the church are being fulfilled.
 
J

Jda016

Guest
#15
God still has a plan for Israel as there are prophecies yet to be fulfilled about the nation. The greatest prophecy recently fulfilled was in 1948 when the Jews became a nation again. Scripture foretold the scattering of the Jews throughout the whole earth and yet God promised to reunite them again as one nation, no longer Israel and Judah, but one nation.

Only those who believe upon and follow Christ are saved. However, God still has a plan for Israel and I do believe that nation will eventually have a revival and many more of them will recognize Jesus as Messiah.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,721
13,519
113
#16
men's mercy is bought by gifts and sold for pleasures, and blows away in the slightest wind.

God's mercies endure forever, and His faithfulness is everlasting.
 
Dec 29, 2013
599
6
0
#17
God still has a plan for Israel as there are prophecies yet to be fulfilled about the nation. The greatest prophecy recently fulfilled was in 1948 when the Jews became a nation again. Scripture foretold the scattering of the Jews throughout the whole earth and yet God promised to reunite them again as one nation, no longer Israel and Judah, but one nation.

Only those who believe upon and follow Christ are saved. However, God still has a plan for Israel and I do believe that nation will eventually have a revival and many more of them will recognize Jesus as Messiah.
Since when were "the Jews" all of Israel? Read Hebrews, James and 1 Peter, etc., and ask yourself, were the Christian Israelites to whom these epistles were written one and the same with the Christ hating Judean Pharisees? Wake Up.
 
Dec 29, 2013
599
6
0
#18
Israel is not, and never was, a Jewish state only. This is pure propaganda, and for the benefit of today's Pharisees, for today's version of "...them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are of the synagogue of Satan" (Rev. 2:9; 3;9).

 
Feb 21, 2014
5,672
18
0
#19
Israel is not, and never was, a Jewish state only. This is pure propaganda, and for the benefit of today's Pharisees, for today's version of "...them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are of the synagogue of Satan" (Rev. 2:9; 3;9).

What about those who are blind in part (Romans 11.25)?
 
Dec 29, 2013
599
6
0
#20
God still has a plan for Israel as there are prophecies yet to be fulfilled about the nation. The greatest prophecy recently fulfilled was in 1948 when the Jews became a nation again. Scripture foretold the scattering of the Jews throughout the whole earth and yet God promised to reunite them again as one nation, no longer Israel and Judah, but one nation.

Only those who believe upon and follow Christ are saved. However, God still has a plan for Israel and I do believe that nation will eventually have a revival and many more of them will recognize Jesus as Messiah.
Your have been following a theology contaminated with the leaven of today's Pharisees, one which portrays them as the Hebrews in the epistle to the Hebrews, and the Israelites described by James as "...the twelve tribes which are scattered abroad" (James 1:1). These epistles do not describe Israel as one and the same with the Christ hating Pharisees which rejected Jesus. The Israelites who rejected, hated, and killed Jesus were but a small fraction of the twelve tribes that were scattered abroad (hundreds of years before Jesus walked in Palestine).