The Law.................Faith

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Seems to me that it is simple, for scripture says..
For without faith, it is impossible to please Him, (God).
The rest is His provision and gift. :)

When will we realise, that it is not our knowladge and understanding that gives us power?
But is is God's understanding, knowladge and power that holds us, and all is given in Jesus, as we walk with Him.
For scripture says, do not trust in ones own understanding, but only that understanding given by the Holy Spirit in Jesus Christ is Lord come in the flesh.

Just in case someone questions.. :):):)
This does not mean we do not study the scriptures for understanding and knowladge, it just means in faith, we trust it all to Jesus. :)

God bless
pickles
 
pickles said:
Seems to me that it is simple, for scripture says..
For without faith, it is impossible to please Him, (God).
The rest is His provision and gift. :)

When will we realise, that it is not our knowladge and understanding that gives us power?
But is is God's understanding, knowladge and power that holds us, and all is given in Jesus, as we walk with Him.
For scripture says, do not trust in ones own understanding, but only that understanding given by the Holy Spirit in Jesus Christ is Lord come in the flesh.

Just in case someone questions.. :):):)
This does not mean we do not study the scriptures for understanding and knowladge, it just means in faith, we trust it all to Jesus. :)

God bless
pickles​
Click to expand...
It is God's understanding, knowledge and power!!! All day long a wonderful hymn has been running through my mind.

Just a closer walk with Thee
Grant it, Jesus, is my plea
Daily walking close to Thee
Let it be, dear Lord, let it be.

​
And with the holy instructions in scripture, it tells us how to walk close to our Lord.
 
faith or trusting in the voice of god, is not a new thing.

noah built the ark, when everyone, was laughing and making fun of him.

Abraham raised the knife to kill, his son, believeing, god can raise the dead.

the jewish slaves/ people in Egypt, were told to, marked there door posts. with the blood of a lamb, at what is now called Passover.
food for though, 1) dose the angel of death, not know the difference between an Egyptian and jewish people.
2)how come no Egyptians never marked the door post, some of them must have seen them do it.
3) no body seen Abraham raise that knife, except an angel or god.
4) nobody else builds a boat, the ark must have been some size.

yet through these walks in faith , we have some insight to how god used them etc
 
RedTent said:
Did God change all that He is, was the world made differently in the time between the new and old testament? Did God say scripture is scripture after Christ, and not before Christ?

You are reporting that in OT God atoned based on works, that is seriously misreporting scripture. It is not true.

You are reporting that because we are under Christ and grace, we are not to listen to law. That is seriously misreporting. Not being under law for salvation does not mean don't listen to law.
Click to expand...

God didn't change anything. This was always His Plan. For example, You can see the beauty of Christ through the Psalms. How? Because the whole bible describes Salvation and the Power of God.

Ephesians 3:3-7
[SUP]3 [/SUP]How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words,
[SUP]4 [/SUP]Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ)
[SUP]5 [/SUP]Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit;
[SUP]6 [/SUP]That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel:
[SUP]7 [/SUP]Whereof I was made a minister, according to the gift of the grace of God given unto me by the effectual working of his power.


Such as this gem;
Galatians 3:24-25

[SUP]24 [/SUP]Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
[SUP]25 [/SUP]But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.

So the law has a purpose. But after that purpose is FULFILLED there is no need to go back to it. We are saved by Faith and attempt to please God by our Faith in Him, abiding in Christ and trusting He grows Spiritual Fruit in our lives.

Galatians 5:1-6
[SUP]1[/SUP]Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage.
[SUP]2 [/SUP]Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing.
[SUP]3 [/SUP]For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law.
[SUP]4 [/SUP]Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.
[SUP]5 [/SUP]For we through the Spirit wait for the hope of righteousness by faith.
[SUP]6 [/SUP]For in Jesus Christ neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision; but faith which worketh by love.

You are not abiding in Christ by Faith if you are busy working at the law in an attempt to justify yourself before Him and other men (and women). Trying to teach people that they are un-clean if they don't observe the law according to your carnal understanding.
That's pretty clear. This wasn't understood before the revelation presented to Paul and the disciples by the Spirit, except in part to a select few.

Galatians 3:10-14

[SUP]10 [/SUP]For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.
[SUP]11 [/SUP]But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith.
[SUP]12 [/SUP]And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them.
[SUP]13 [/SUP]Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:
[SUP]14 [/SUP]That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.


 
The law of OR the laws of God is/are full of promises. By faith we keep the laws of God and inherit/reap the promises. In other words, "the just shall live by faith" By that phrase the Holy Spirit in Romans means, Faith obeys, But in Galatians the Holy Spirit means, faith trusts. I love the verses in Isaiah 1: 16-20 in the context of getting their sins forgiven Israel was told,"...If you are willing and obedient, You will eat of the good of the land;..." and 2Chron. 7:14 God says if My LOST people would repent, turn from their sin, I would save them. The new cov, also demands repentance, faith and obedience for Salvation. Heb. 5:9 Jesus is the sourse of eternal life "to all who obey Him" Why would God write the laws upon our hearts if it was an option to obey, No WAY, God demands obedience for salvation. Love to all, Hoffco
 
When God has a job to be done: faith and obedience get the contract. Heb.11 is full of the works of faith: "by faith Abraham obeyed" God. v.8 Rom.3:31 "faith"...establishes the "law." The New Testament is the only rule for law for Christians, The N.T. repeats, gives, all the laws that we need. This is a good thread. Love to all Hoffco
 
eternally-gratefull said:
Grace is love. When you give someone something they do not deserve (grace) you give it out of love.
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Don’t think that grace and love is the same thing…

David (king) gave grace (pardoned) Shimei (2 Samuelova 16 and 19) and it wasn’t out of love…

Same goes for Salomon who first gave grace Adonijah (1 kings 1,53), but later he killed him (1 kings 2)


But maybe its just me (our maybe in en, is not that much of difference between those words, anyway at SK it is quite a difference)

Grace – a special favor or goodwill, mercy, clemency, pardon
Love – a deep personal attachment ….or profoundly tender or passionate affection for another person leading to action

So for me, there is possibility of grace without love, also as sister already said, the new law is about love

And if we change love into small, what we get?
In brief this:
Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
And
Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
And if we put in change those two things, what we get?
Commandments
As Jesus said it (..on these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets)
And if we put together commandments what we get?
Law
And what is the tip and the fulfillment of the law?
Love
And what is that mean for us to do?
Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
And Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
and so on and so for….
[FONT=&quot]It is a love which let others know, that we are children of God[/FONT]
:)
 
Grace is both power to transform and love to forgive. today preachers do not understand GRACE. It is easy to get ,when you "rightly divide" the word. Think of GRACE as the everything that is loving, and good and kind. GRACE is the opposite of WRATH. WRATH is everything that is bad. For His chosen, God only has love and discipline; For those destined to eternal wrath, God shows no eternal love. God does sent his rain on the evil and the good people; We call this common grace for all, but special saving grace is only for the elect. People and nations fall from common grace, but electing grace one can never fall from. This is why Israel is still a nation today before God, because the "calling" of God can not fail, or change. But only those "elect" to individual salvation will be saved in Israel and among the Gentiles. God "KNOWS" those who are His and we must follow righteousness to prove our election of God. As we develope our faith by holy living according to all the commands of God ,we develope our assurance of our "holy calling". Love to all, Hoffco
 
Everything God has provided for us in his word is Good ,the law actually is knowledge & understanding, it show us our error and teaches us His truth His statues that are good.

Psalms 86:11 Teach me thy way, O LORD; I will walk in thy truth: unite my heart to fear thy name.

Psalms 119:68 Thou art good, and doest good; teach me thy statutes.

PROVERBS 2:7-13 KJV

6.For the LORD giveth wisdom: out of his mouth cometh knowledge and understanding.

THIS IS A GREAT READ :)

7He layeth up sound wisdom for the righteous: he is a buckler to them that walk uprightly.
8He keepeth the paths of judgment, and preserveth the way of his saints.
9Then shalt thou understand righteousness, and judgment, and equity; yea, every good path.
10When wisdom entereth into thine heart, and knowledge is pleasant unto thy soul;
11Discretion shall preserve thee, understanding shall keep thee:
12To deliver thee from the way of the evil man, from the man that speaketh froward things;
13Who leave the paths of uprightness, to walk in the ways of darkness;
14Who rejoice to do evil, and delight in the frowardness of the wicked;
15Whose ways are crooked, and they froward in their paths:

As for faith one can read Hebrews 11 :) and put there trust in the Lord Jesus Christ, as for keeping the law Jesus Christ already answer that for everyone :)


God Bless
 
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vic1980 said:
Everything God has provided for us in his word is Good ,the law actually is knowledge & understanding, it show us our error and teaches us His truth His statues that are good.

Psalms 86:11 Teach me thy way, O LORD; I will walk in thy truth: unite my heart to fear thy name.

Psalms 119:68 Thou art good, and doest good; teach me thy statutes.

PROVERBS 2:7-13 KJV

6.For the LORD giveth wisdom: out of his mouth cometh knowledge and understanding.

THIS IS A GREAT READ :)

7He layeth up sound wisdom for the righteous: he is a buckler to them that walk uprightly.
8He keepeth the paths of judgment, and preserveth the way of his saints.
9Then shalt thou understand righteousness, and judgment, and equity; yea, every good path.
10When wisdom entereth into thine heart, and knowledge is pleasant unto thy soul;
11Discretion shall preserve thee, understanding shall keep thee:
12To deliver thee from the way of the evil man, from the man that speaketh froward things;
13Who leave the paths of uprightness, to walk in the ways of darkness;
14Who rejoice to do evil, and delight in the frowardness of the wicked;
15Whose ways are crooked, and they froward in their paths:

As for faith one can read Hebrews 11 :) and put there trust in the Lord Jesus Christ, as for keeping the law Jesus Christ already answer that for everyone :)


God Bless
Click to expand...

To vic1980, The whole Bible teaches us to TRUST and OBEY God. Who are you? You think you can play God and change His commands? You are promoting wicked evil, to trust God and not obey God will end you in Hell. Love to all, Hoffco
 
Hoffco said:
To vic1980, The whole Bible teaches us to TRUST and OBEY God. Who are you? You think you can play God and change His commands? You are promoting wicked evil, to trust God and not obey God will end you in Hell. Love to all, Hoffco
Click to expand...

I agree the entire Bible teaches us to, TRUST GOD and OBAY Him.
But where exactly where is it written in my post, clearly making such a statement, and Change God commandments ?

Perhaps proverbs 2:7-8 explains it simple ?

7He layeth up sound wisdom for the righteous: he is a buckler to them that walk uprightly.
8He keepeth the paths of judgment, and preserveth the way of his saints.


Proverbs 8:13 The fear of the LORD is to hate evil: pride, and arrogancy, and the evil way, and the froward mouth, do I hate.

Proverbs 8:33-36

33 Hear instruction, and be wise, and refuse it not.34 Blessed is the man that heareth me, watching daily at my gates, waiting at the posts of my doors.
35 For whoso findeth me findeth life, and shall obtain favour of the LORD.
36But he that sinneth against me wrongeth his own soul: all they that hate me love death.


God Bless Brother Hoffco :)
 
GUESTNO2 SAID:

Don’t think that grace and love is the same thing…

David (king) gave grace (pardoned) Shimei (2 Samuelova 16 and 19) and it wasn’t out of love…

Same goes for Salomon who first gave grace Adonijah (1 kings 1,53), but later he killed him (1 kings 2)

..............................................................................................................
Problem is you are arguing the faulty "love" of man.............we are speaking of the PERFECT LOVE OF GOD.........those two are waaaaaayyyyyyyyyyyyy different..............ok?
 
vic1980 said:
Everything God has provided for us in his word is Good ,the law actually is knowledge & understanding, it show us our error and teaches us His truth His statues that are good.

Psalms 86:11 Teach me thy way, O LORD; I will walk in thy truth: unite my heart to fear thy name.

Psalms 119:68 Thou art good, and doest good; teach me thy statutes.

PROVERBS 2:7-13 KJV

6.For the LORD giveth wisdom: out of his mouth cometh knowledge and understanding.

THIS IS A GREAT READ :)

7He layeth up sound wisdom for the righteous: he is a buckler to them that walk uprightly.
8He keepeth the paths of judgment, and preserveth the way of his saints.
9Then shalt thou understand righteousness, and judgment, and equity; yea, every good path.
10When wisdom entereth into thine heart, and knowledge is pleasant unto thy soul;
11Discretion shall preserve thee, understanding shall keep thee:
12To deliver thee from the way of the evil man, from the man that speaketh froward things;
13Who leave the paths of uprightness, to walk in the ways of darkness;
14Who rejoice to do evil, and delight in the frowardness of the wicked;
15Whose ways are crooked, and they froward in their paths:

As for faith one can read Hebrews 11 :) and put there trust in the Lord Jesus Christ, as for keeping the law Jesus Christ already answer that for everyone :)


God Bless
Click to expand...

vic1980, your last 2 lines said; we don't have to keep the law, Jesus has done it all for us, All we need do is to TRUST Jesus."as for keeping the law Jesus Christ already answer that for everyone." BY this , don't you mean: Jesus did all the obeying needed for our salvation, there fore ,all we need do is to TRUST Jesus. If this is not what you mean by "answer" please spell it out clearly, what you mean, Jesus "answer that". Please, write clearly what you mean to say. To me, you said , Jesus did all the obeying for us, we only believe. Love Hoffco
 
p_rehbein said:
GUESTNO2 SAID:

Don’t think that grace and love is the same thing…

David (king) gave grace (pardoned) Shimei (2 Samuelova 16 and 19) and it wasn’t out of love…

Same goes for Salomon who first gave grace Adonijah (1 kings 1,53), but later he killed him (1 kings 2)

..............................................................................................................
Problem is you are arguing the faulty "love" of man.............we are speaking of the PERFECT LOVE OF GOD.........those two are waaaaaayyyyyyyyyyyyy different..............ok?
Click to expand...

uhm

Ok, I choose example of king david and salomon, because they’re self-explanatory, well I thought they were….


You think, that my argument grace-not-equal-to-love is not applicable on God?


What about Jesus, when He cast away demons into herd of swine, when demons ask Him to do that…

Did he do that because of love (affection for demons) or because of grace (merci)
Mat 8


But you know what? Never mind… why am I even arguing still about this… never mind …


Its probably different language thing, maybe even culture thing .. for me it would be always difference between grace and love. I know that God gave us grace because of love, but love is ultimate mover.

For me it is always love. It is what change me, what touch me, what convinced me, transformed me.. and most of that happened thru the word of God, thru Bible, thru what you maybe call law.


I love this law, it feed my soul, it fascinates me … it gives me joy. I know your whole point was different in op, but I can not just let it be unsaid that law is for me light; and the commandment is a lamp and reproofs of instruction are the way of life pr6.23

To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them izaias 8.20 (of course I don’t think this about you, the key for me is to the law.. )


I should really stop… we are obviously speaking different languages here, we don’t get each other… :)


Anyway

Be blessed
 
To guestno2, I don't think Jesus has any love or grace for demons. But, yet, both grace and love have differing levels of meaning . I love peanut butter , but I love my wife differently; the one is "like" the other is "self sacrificing". what little "love" Jesus might feel for a demon or a non elect person, is more like hate than love. God "loves all, but only the "elect" are "savingly loved" "Jacob I loved, Esau I hated" Rom. 9 ; the earthly love of God for Esau ended in Hell. If God's love and grace don't find a home in our hearts, it will turn to wrath. Jh. 3:16 is just a provisional love for all, because it saves none. Only those elected by God will be "born of the Spirit" and will come to Jesus for eternal life, and will gain the eternal love of God, they will: They "keep" themselves in "the love of God". But on the other hand, the "elect" of God, already have the gift of God's eternal love, not yet being born into this world. All begins and ends in God. To be Biblical, it is like speaking out of both sides of our mouth, to keep from error,or extreme . Love to all, but deep"love" is only for those here, close to me. Hoffco
 
Hoffco said:
vic1980, your last 2 lines said; we don't have to keep the law, Jesus has done it all for us, All we need do is to TRUST Jesus."as for keeping the law Jesus Christ already answer that for everyone." BY this , don't you mean: Jesus did all the obeying needed for our salvation, there fore ,all we need do is to TRUST Jesus. If this is not what you mean by "answer" please spell it out clearly, what you mean, Jesus "answer that". Please, write clearly what you mean to say. To me, you said , Jesus did all the obeying for us, we only believe. Love Hoffco
Click to expand...

please clarify what you meant by "answer" love to all, Hoffco
 
RedTent said:
And if you believe in the whole bible, you believe in the law.
Click to expand...
I believe the whole bible to be the word of God and yet I have no faith or confidence in the law as the law can not save a soul. My faith is is in Jesus Christ alone. Why put faith in the law when it relies on your performance? No my faith is in Jesus Christ alone and the finished work of the cross. Jesus is my savior, not the old law which is now obsolete and fading away.
 
GUESTNO2 SAID:

I should really stop… we are obviously speaking different languages here, we don’t get each other… :)


Anyway

Be blessed


HEY! I AGREE! :):)

seriously, God bless.........
 
pickles said:
Seems to me that it is simple, for scripture says..
For without faith, it is impossible to please Him, (God).
The rest is His provision and gift. :)

When will we realise, that it is not our knowladge and understanding that gives us power?
But is is God's understanding, knowladge and power that holds us, and all is given in Jesus, as we walk with Him.
For scripture says, do not trust in ones own understanding, but only that understanding given by the Holy Spirit in Jesus Christ is Lord come in the flesh.

Just in case someone questions.. :):):)
This does not mean we do not study the scriptures for understanding and knowladge, it just means in faith, we trust it all to Jesus. :)

God bless
pickles
Click to expand...

Why then, are the "faith only" people the most miserable people in the world? It is because they don't study the Bible hard to gain God's understanding and wisdom of life ,LIFE. They don't have LIFE in Jesus. They are not " born of God"! Love to all Hoffco
 
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