How freewill salvation perverts God's Justice !
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Why its Blasphemy !
Why Salvation by the freewill of man is Blasphemy ! Because it opposes the predestinating Grace of God in Eternal Election, the Election of Grace, wherein God did choose according to His Free and Sovereign Will and Christ died for, a limited and certain number of men among mankind, to Salvation and Glory without any consideration of them doing good or evil, but solely upon His own Sovereign Freewill. The false teaching of theirs is most contrary to the scripture revelation Rom 9:11-13
11 (For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth)
12 It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger.
13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.849
Why Salvation by the freewill of man is Blasphemy ! Because it opposes the predestinating Grace of God in Eternal Election, the Election of Grace, wherein God did choose according to His Free and Sovereign Will and Christ died for, a limited and certain number of men among mankind, to Salvation and Glory without any consideration of them doing good or evil, but solely upon His own Sovereign Freewill. The false teaching of theirs is most contrary to the scripture revelation Rom 9:11-13
11 (For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth)
12 It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger.
13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.849
C
cfultz3
Guest
Seabass,
I will save you a lot of time, Svadbygrace's only reply is, 'evaded'. If you would look at his threads, about 95% of his replies are saying that his points were evaded.
I will save you a lot of time, Svadbygrace's only reply is, 'evaded'. If you would look at his threads, about 95% of his replies are saying that his points were evaded.
E
eternally-gratefull
Guest
I can't believe people still respond to this guy.. It gets old seeing these same old threads continue, why do we not let them die already!
done Brother I just review and do not reply and stay in pryer, knowing God will straighten it all out in God's timing not mine or anyone elses
Saved Soely by the Death/Obedience of Christ !
Saved Soely by the Death/Obedience of Christ , so is the Testimony of Rom 5:19b
19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.
Yes this Gracious Truth cannot be believed by the reprobate, but its true none the less. All for whom Christ died, by His Death / Obedience alone for them, in their stead and on their behalf shall make them Righteous, that's Salvation ! Ps 1:5-6
Therefore the ungodly shall not stand in the judgment, nor sinners in the congregation of the righteous/saved.
For the Lord knoweth the way of the righteous/saved: but the way of the ungodly shall perish.
Ps 34:15
The eyes of the Lord are upon the righteous, and his ears are open unto their cry.
Matt 13:43
Then shall the righteous/saved shine forth as the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Who hath ears to hear, let him hear.
Matt 25:37
Then shall the righteous/saved answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, and fed thee? or thirsty, and gave thee drink?
1 Pet 3:12
For the eyes of the Lord are over the righteous/saved, and his ears are open unto their prayers: but the face of the Lord is against them that do evil.
Every last person that is Righteous in the above scriptures, were made so by the obedience of Jesus Christ Rom 5:19 and they are saved.
You see, just as the natural head adam, his one act of disobedience caused them to be lost, apart from any personal disobedience of their own, so likewise Christ's one single action of Obedience, caused them to be saved apart from any personal obedience of their own ; This is what is meant by Grace reigning through Jesus Christ Rom 5:21
21 That as sin hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal life by Jesus Christ our Lord.
This is what Paul means when He writes to the Ephesians Elders in Acts 20:24
24 But none of these things move me, neither count I my life dear unto myself, so that I might finish my course with joy, and the ministry, which I have received of the Lord Jesus, to testify the gospel of the grace of God.
To be saved by Grace and to be saved by Christ's Death are the same. So the truth be told, man by nature we cannot believe the Gospel of the Grace of God, its foolishness to us !850
Saved Soely by the Death/Obedience of Christ , so is the Testimony of Rom 5:19b
19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.
Yes this Gracious Truth cannot be believed by the reprobate, but its true none the less. All for whom Christ died, by His Death / Obedience alone for them, in their stead and on their behalf shall make them Righteous, that's Salvation ! Ps 1:5-6
Therefore the ungodly shall not stand in the judgment, nor sinners in the congregation of the righteous/saved.
For the Lord knoweth the way of the righteous/saved: but the way of the ungodly shall perish.
Ps 34:15
The eyes of the Lord are upon the righteous, and his ears are open unto their cry.
Matt 13:43
Then shall the righteous/saved shine forth as the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Who hath ears to hear, let him hear.
Matt 25:37
Then shall the righteous/saved answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, and fed thee? or thirsty, and gave thee drink?
1 Pet 3:12
For the eyes of the Lord are over the righteous/saved, and his ears are open unto their prayers: but the face of the Lord is against them that do evil.
Every last person that is Righteous in the above scriptures, were made so by the obedience of Jesus Christ Rom 5:19 and they are saved.
You see, just as the natural head adam, his one act of disobedience caused them to be lost, apart from any personal disobedience of their own, so likewise Christ's one single action of Obedience, caused them to be saved apart from any personal obedience of their own ; This is what is meant by Grace reigning through Jesus Christ Rom 5:21
21 That as sin hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal life by Jesus Christ our Lord.
This is what Paul means when He writes to the Ephesians Elders in Acts 20:24
24 But none of these things move me, neither count I my life dear unto myself, so that I might finish my course with joy, and the ministry, which I have received of the Lord Jesus, to testify the gospel of the grace of God.
To be saved by Grace and to be saved by Christ's Death are the same. So the truth be told, man by nature we cannot believe the Gospel of the Grace of God, its foolishness to us !850
That's because 95% of the posts were evaded, no one ever discusses the points made, but evades them into rabbit trails. !
I am not evading anything but point out how you are putting fault and blame upon God when God has none.
I did not read all of the responses, but I did read the first three and the last three. The problem with your logic is that you are forgetting that Jesus must stand in your place when you are judged. If you stand there alone, you are condemned. You must accept Jesus Christ so that he will stand in your place at judgment. Gods himself says, "Do you think that I am not just, It is you that is not just" and "Your laws are not My laws." (paraphrase)
Post 1 and 3, could you please rehearse with me the points I made in those posts and see how I reached those conclusions ?
J
john80
Guest
I was of the opinion that free will is an illusion. God will destroy any who use there free will to do what they want to.
How then is this free will. Its either his way or death?.
please reply open to anyone
How then is this free will. Its either his way or death?.
please reply open to anyone
If you chose to do something that kills you, is that not free will? Do not confuse punishment with lack of free will.
Beware of false teaching like this its antichrist !
Many today in organized false religion teach that those Christ died for, have not a interest or application of the Merits of Christ's death unto them, not until they believe, but that's A LIE from the pits of hell, simply because all those He did die for, by that death alone, hath been reconciled to God, received into His Favor, even while they themselves are yet still enemies and unbelievers ! Rom 5:10
However, those of mankind who are unbelievers and have not been reconciled to God by the death of His Son, while they are unbelievers, they are #1 Condemned already Jn 3:18 and #2 under God's Wrath Jn 3:36, so that tells us that Christ's death makes a difference and that its merits has been received by those whom He died, since they in a state of unbelief and being enemies, are not under wrath and condemnation but received into His Favor !
This fact proves they that teach such things are false teachers and have not been sent by God , they have not the Message of the Gospel of God's Grace !851
Many today in organized false religion teach that those Christ died for, have not a interest or application of the Merits of Christ's death unto them, not until they believe, but that's A LIE from the pits of hell, simply because all those He did die for, by that death alone, hath been reconciled to God, received into His Favor, even while they themselves are yet still enemies and unbelievers ! Rom 5:10
However, those of mankind who are unbelievers and have not been reconciled to God by the death of His Son, while they are unbelievers, they are #1 Condemned already Jn 3:18 and #2 under God's Wrath Jn 3:36, so that tells us that Christ's death makes a difference and that its merits has been received by those whom He died, since they in a state of unbelief and being enemies, are not under wrath and condemnation but received into His Favor !
This fact proves they that teach such things are false teachers and have not been sent by God , they have not the Message of the Gospel of God's Grace !851
I did not ask you to, maybe you need to reread the request and get it right this time !
Beware of false teaching like this its antichrist ! 2
Continuing in showing that the Death of Christ is applied to those Christ died for, and they take part of its benefits before they believe, and while they are yet unbelievers and enemies, when others whom He did not die for, while they are yet unbelievers and enemies don't partake of its benefits, that being difference being, those who are unbelievers whom Christ died for, they have been reconciled to God and received into His Favor Rom 5:10 and those whom Christ did not die for, as they are unbelievers and enemies they are under God's condemnation Jn 3:18 and WrathJn 3:36 !
Now here's another very important difference in this matter as to how Christ's death makes a huge difference.
The Promises : Now the promise to the ones whom Christ died for, and reconciled to God even while being unbelieving enemies, being thusly reconciled, the promise is that they SHALL be saved by His Life ! Rom 5:10
10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.
In other words, they shall be saved out of being His Enemies or from being His Enemies to Fellowship !
But The promise to those one whom Christ did not die for, and who are not reconciled to God by His Death, and are unbelievers and enemies, and are under His Wrath, the Promise is that they SHALL NOT See Life Jn 3:36
36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.
You see that ? They shall not be saved, for they shall always remain in a lost state being God's enemies and unbelievers !
That's a Major difference ! If we cannot see that difference then we are spiritually blind, and willfully ignorant !
Simply put, the unbelievers Christ died for shall be saved by His Life, and the unbelievers Christ did not die for shall not be saved by His Life !853
Continuing in showing that the Death of Christ is applied to those Christ died for, and they take part of its benefits before they believe, and while they are yet unbelievers and enemies, when others whom He did not die for, while they are yet unbelievers and enemies don't partake of its benefits, that being difference being, those who are unbelievers whom Christ died for, they have been reconciled to God and received into His Favor Rom 5:10 and those whom Christ did not die for, as they are unbelievers and enemies they are under God's condemnation Jn 3:18 and WrathJn 3:36 !
Now here's another very important difference in this matter as to how Christ's death makes a huge difference.
The Promises : Now the promise to the ones whom Christ died for, and reconciled to God even while being unbelieving enemies, being thusly reconciled, the promise is that they SHALL be saved by His Life ! Rom 5:10
10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.
In other words, they shall be saved out of being His Enemies or from being His Enemies to Fellowship !
But The promise to those one whom Christ did not die for, and who are not reconciled to God by His Death, and are unbelievers and enemies, and are under His Wrath, the Promise is that they SHALL NOT See Life Jn 3:36
36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.
You see that ? They shall not be saved, for they shall always remain in a lost state being God's enemies and unbelievers !
That's a Major difference ! If we cannot see that difference then we are spiritually blind, and willfully ignorant !
Simply put, the unbelievers Christ died for shall be saved by His Life, and the unbelievers Christ did not die for shall not be saved by His Life !853
Okay this time I will not tell you that I don't agree with your thought process and conclusion.
He shall save His People from their sins !
Matt 1:21
21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name Jesus: for he shall save his people from their sins.
Many in apostate religion of man would tell us that this Promise to save His People from their sins is all about Israel according to the flesh, and not about Gentiles, they are not included they say in this category of being His People, for whom this is promised "that He shall save His People from their sins ! However, that's their spiritual ignorance, because it does include some Gentiles, and it was foretold back in the OT scriptures, Gentiles as well as some jews are His People, whom come to Faith in Him, and He is the author of their Faith in Him Heb 12:2.
Now Paul writes here in Rom 9 giving us to understand the Mind of God, that the Gentiles in the Purpose of God, have always been included in and as His People Rom 9:24-26
24 Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?
25 As he saith also in Osee, I will call them my people, which were not my people; and her beloved, which was not beloved.
26 And it shall come to pass, that in the place where it was said unto them, Ye are not my people; there shall they be called the children of the living God.
Please note the terms My People and the Children of the Living God are the same People !
Now notice Vs 25 " My People" is here referring specifically to Gentiles, who are of the called in Vs 24
Which were of the Vessels of Mercy in Vs 23
"And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory,"
Whom God formed to be Vessels of Honor Vs 20-21
20 Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus?
21 Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?
Hence these Gentiles are His People of Matt 1:21, vessels of Mercy as some jews were.
They were of that People that the Father gave to the Son Jn 17:2,10
2 As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.
10 And all mine are thine, and thine are mine; and I am glorified in them.
So amongst the Gentiles God of old had a special selected people of His Own to be called by His Name Acts 15:14-18
14 Simeon hath declared how God at the first did visit the Gentiles, to take out of them a people for his name.
15 And to this agree the words of the prophets; as it is written,
16 After this I will return, and will build again the tabernacle of David, which is fallen down; and I will build again the ruins thereof, and I will set it up:
17 That the residue of men might seek after the Lord, and all the Gentiles, upon whom my name is called, saith the Lord, who doeth all these things.
18 Known unto God are all his works from the beginning of the world.
It was this Truth, that Chosen Gentiles also belonged to God's Chosen remnant Israel out of all mankind, that was a Mystery ! But now this has been fully revealed in the NT, and those in our present day are more culpable for the rejection of this truth in the impending Day of Judgment, because they are now sinning against a greater degree of Light, Now that the Apostolic Testimony has been clearly brought forth, especially from Paul the Apostle ! When Jesus said to Paul Acts 18:9-10
Then spake the Lord to Paul in the night by a vision, Be not afraid, but speak, and hold not thy peace:
10 For I am with thee, and no man shall set on thee to hurt thee: for I have much people in this city.
Gentiles were included in the MUCH PEOPLE He had ! They were some of the HIS PEOPLE inMatt 1:21
21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name Jesus: for he shall save his people from their sins.854
Matt 1:21
21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name Jesus: for he shall save his people from their sins.
Many in apostate religion of man would tell us that this Promise to save His People from their sins is all about Israel according to the flesh, and not about Gentiles, they are not included they say in this category of being His People, for whom this is promised "that He shall save His People from their sins ! However, that's their spiritual ignorance, because it does include some Gentiles, and it was foretold back in the OT scriptures, Gentiles as well as some jews are His People, whom come to Faith in Him, and He is the author of their Faith in Him Heb 12:2.
Now Paul writes here in Rom 9 giving us to understand the Mind of God, that the Gentiles in the Purpose of God, have always been included in and as His People Rom 9:24-26
24 Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?
25 As he saith also in Osee, I will call them my people, which were not my people; and her beloved, which was not beloved.
26 And it shall come to pass, that in the place where it was said unto them, Ye are not my people; there shall they be called the children of the living God.
Please note the terms My People and the Children of the Living God are the same People !
Now notice Vs 25 " My People" is here referring specifically to Gentiles, who are of the called in Vs 24
Which were of the Vessels of Mercy in Vs 23
"And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory,"
Whom God formed to be Vessels of Honor Vs 20-21
20 Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus?
21 Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?
Hence these Gentiles are His People of Matt 1:21, vessels of Mercy as some jews were.
They were of that People that the Father gave to the Son Jn 17:2,10
2 As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.
10 And all mine are thine, and thine are mine; and I am glorified in them.
So amongst the Gentiles God of old had a special selected people of His Own to be called by His Name Acts 15:14-18
14 Simeon hath declared how God at the first did visit the Gentiles, to take out of them a people for his name.
15 And to this agree the words of the prophets; as it is written,
16 After this I will return, and will build again the tabernacle of David, which is fallen down; and I will build again the ruins thereof, and I will set it up:
17 That the residue of men might seek after the Lord, and all the Gentiles, upon whom my name is called, saith the Lord, who doeth all these things.
18 Known unto God are all his works from the beginning of the world.
It was this Truth, that Chosen Gentiles also belonged to God's Chosen remnant Israel out of all mankind, that was a Mystery ! But now this has been fully revealed in the NT, and those in our present day are more culpable for the rejection of this truth in the impending Day of Judgment, because they are now sinning against a greater degree of Light, Now that the Apostolic Testimony has been clearly brought forth, especially from Paul the Apostle ! When Jesus said to Paul Acts 18:9-10
Then spake the Lord to Paul in the night by a vision, Be not afraid, but speak, and hold not thy peace:
10 For I am with thee, and no man shall set on thee to hurt thee: for I have much people in this city.
Gentiles were included in the MUCH PEOPLE He had ! They were some of the HIS PEOPLE inMatt 1:21
21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name Jesus: for he shall save his people from their sins.854