AM I JEW OR A GENTILE IF I KEEP THE COMMANDMENTS ?
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then say that. don't bring instructions given to christian brothers into a group of people paul said are not brothers. a group who continually says they left the christian church and consider it pagan. they have no problem proclaiming that. even while they by their religious postering indicate christ dies for no reason. he did apparently come to set an example of how to improve on moses though.
E
romans 11:
[SUP]28 [/SUP]Concerning the gospel they are enemies for your sake, but concerning the election they are beloved for the sake of the fathers. [SUP]29 [/SUP]For the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable. [SUP]30 [/SUP]For as you were once disobedient to God, yet have now obtained mercy through their disobedience, [SUP]31 [/SUP]even so these also have now been disobedient, that through the mercy shown you they also may obtain mercy. [SUP]32 [/SUP]For God has committed them all to disobedience, that He might have mercy on all.
[SUP]28 [/SUP]Concerning the gospel they are enemies for your sake, but concerning the election they are beloved for the sake of the fathers. [SUP]29 [/SUP]For the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable. [SUP]30 [/SUP]For as you were once disobedient to God, yet have now obtained mercy through their disobedience, [SUP]31 [/SUP]even so these also have now been disobedient, that through the mercy shown you they also may obtain mercy. [SUP]32 [/SUP]For God has committed them all to disobedience, that He might have mercy on all.
Jeremiah
[SUP]
27 [/SUP]“The days are coming,” declares the Lord, “when I will plant the kingdoms of Israel and Judah with the offspring of people and of animals. [SUP]28 [/SUP]Just as I watched over them to uproot and tear down, and to overthrow, destroy and bring disaster, so I will watch over them to build and to plant,” declares the Lord. [SUP]29 [/SUP]“In those days people will no longer say,
‘The parents have eaten sour grapes,
and the children’s teeth are set on edge.’
[SUP]30 [/SUP]Instead, everyone will die for their own sin; whoever eats sour grapes—their own teeth will be set on edge.
[SUP]31 [/SUP]“The days are coming,” declares the Lord,
“when I will make a new covenant
with the people of Israel
and with the people of Judah.
[SUP]32 [/SUP]It will not be like the covenant
I made with their ancestors
when I took them by the hand
to lead them out of Egypt,
because they broke my covenant,
33 This is the covenant I will make with the people of Israel after that time," declares the LORD. "I will put my law in their minds and write it on their hearts. I will be their God, and they will be my people.
And this is why THE NEW COVENANT and laws where wrote on our hearts i believe Isiah 1 below you may see it
Isaiah 1
The multitude of your sacrifices—
what are they to me?” says the Lord.
“I have more than enough of burnt offerings,
of rams and the fat of fattened animals;
I have no pleasure
in the blood of bulls and lambs and goats.
[SUP]12 [/SUP]When you come to appear before me,
who has asked this of you,
this trampling of my courts?
[SUP]13 [/SUP]Stop bringing meaningless offerings!
Your incense is detestable to me.
New Moons, Sabbaths and convocations—
I cannot bear your worthless assemblies.
[SUP]14 [/SUP]Your New Moon feasts and your appointed festivals
I hate with all my being.
They have become a burden to me;
I am weary of bearing them.
[SUP]15 [/SUP]When you spread out your hands in prayer,
I hide my eyes from you;
even when you offer many prayers,
I am not listening.
Jeremiah 33 This is the covenant I will make with the people of Israel after that time," declares the LORD. "I will put my law in their minds and write it on their hearts. I will be their God, and they will be my people.
[SUP]
27 [/SUP]“The days are coming,” declares the Lord, “when I will plant the kingdoms of Israel and Judah with the offspring of people and of animals. [SUP]28 [/SUP]Just as I watched over them to uproot and tear down, and to overthrow, destroy and bring disaster, so I will watch over them to build and to plant,” declares the Lord. [SUP]29 [/SUP]“In those days people will no longer say,
‘The parents have eaten sour grapes,
and the children’s teeth are set on edge.’
[SUP]30 [/SUP]Instead, everyone will die for their own sin; whoever eats sour grapes—their own teeth will be set on edge.
[SUP]31 [/SUP]“The days are coming,” declares the Lord,
“when I will make a new covenant
with the people of Israel
and with the people of Judah.
[SUP]32 [/SUP]It will not be like the covenant
I made with their ancestors
when I took them by the hand
to lead them out of Egypt,
because they broke my covenant,
33 This is the covenant I will make with the people of Israel after that time," declares the LORD. "I will put my law in their minds and write it on their hearts. I will be their God, and they will be my people.
And this is why THE NEW COVENANT and laws where wrote on our hearts i believe Isiah 1 below you may see it
Isaiah 1
The multitude of your sacrifices—
what are they to me?” says the Lord.
“I have more than enough of burnt offerings,
of rams and the fat of fattened animals;
I have no pleasure
in the blood of bulls and lambs and goats.
[SUP]12 [/SUP]When you come to appear before me,
who has asked this of you,
this trampling of my courts?
[SUP]13 [/SUP]Stop bringing meaningless offerings!
Your incense is detestable to me.
New Moons, Sabbaths and convocations—
I cannot bear your worthless assemblies.
[SUP]14 [/SUP]Your New Moon feasts and your appointed festivals
I hate with all my being.
They have become a burden to me;
I am weary of bearing them.
[SUP]15 [/SUP]When you spread out your hands in prayer,
I hide my eyes from you;
even when you offer many prayers,
I am not listening.
Jeremiah 33 This is the covenant I will make with the people of Israel after that time," declares the LORD. "I will put my law in their minds and write it on their hearts. I will be their God, and they will be my people.
this is not some future event.
Galatians 3
22 But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe.
23 But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.
24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
Galatians 3
22 But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe.
23 But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.
24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
E
1. Your speaking of salvation here. In romans 11. Paul was not, he was talking about a specific promise he made to the father os Israel.
2. Yes it is future. Israel is blind today, and our enemy concerning the gospel. Just like they were when Paul wrote this letter.
3. Yet paul said, they are still beloved because of the promises made the fathers.
2. Yes it is future. Israel is blind today, and our enemy concerning the gospel. Just like they were when Paul wrote this letter.
3. Yet paul said, they are still beloved because of the promises made the fathers.
Praying for all people is necessary, but I believe somehow all people suffer the same, though many may not seem to by appearances, or do people believe they are the only ones who have suffered? Jews have definitely suffered a lot throughout history. This is no surprise for those who read and know the Old Testament, the Tanakh........
So what now ? this thread has 873 posts between mature Christians and no one can come to an agreement ? (what does that tel you. ??? What it should it tell you is this. you should give it up and hope to find a set of friends that share your own beliefs should you want to discuss it more because what is the point in continuing in arguing about the law and all the arguments about the law that are not related to the commandments.
This topic which is titled commandments are Gods law which has always been in place why discuss any other laws ?
God keeps his commandments in an ark in heaven they where there before we where and they will be forever, because they where the commandments that got satan kicked out of heaven, and as we know Satan was kicked out before any commandments was given to us.
I think we can safely say that when the lord says if you love me you will follow my commandments God means exactly what it says it means the question is do we need a helper to help us follow them absolutely yes.
It is my advice for all you peoples in this thread that you should never ever make arguments about the laws that where not commandments , because you risk sending a lost sheep further away.
you risk someone seeking God to fall away and go with satan that is what you risk and that is what will happen when you talk to people who don't know anything.
what is the point in arguing about laws that have been done a way with ?
when you argu about the laws that have been done away you should say exactly what laws have been done away with if you don't then you should not even argu about it, WHY because people can lose there salvation over this.
But i would advice to all of you who have any concerns to have only to have talk about the commandments in future only and not the rest of the law.
Because as you can see 873 posts later everyone is still arguing about the law as a result of this many people have fallen out and some people may never know the truth who have come to this thread to learn in stead they have gone away thinking its ok to break the commandments and also they have left completely confused, confusion is not of God and talking about the law that is not commandments cause just that. and not only that what people see is a horrible christian side of faith that is quite clearly the work of Satan.
Not only this but people use this argument to bring people into a pit where they are tricked, this of Satan and as brother in Christ i urge you all to put a stop to this because i care about peoples salvation and it is duty as brother and sister to put a stop to this talk and snatch your brothers out of the fire.
I have made some similar threads about this if anyone cares look be my guest i wish you well and i hope you see all this as good advice for you and not a rant. God bless
This topic which is titled commandments are Gods law which has always been in place why discuss any other laws ?
God keeps his commandments in an ark in heaven they where there before we where and they will be forever, because they where the commandments that got satan kicked out of heaven, and as we know Satan was kicked out before any commandments was given to us.
I think we can safely say that when the lord says if you love me you will follow my commandments God means exactly what it says it means the question is do we need a helper to help us follow them absolutely yes.
It is my advice for all you peoples in this thread that you should never ever make arguments about the laws that where not commandments , because you risk sending a lost sheep further away.
you risk someone seeking God to fall away and go with satan that is what you risk and that is what will happen when you talk to people who don't know anything.
what is the point in arguing about laws that have been done a way with ?
when you argu about the laws that have been done away you should say exactly what laws have been done away with if you don't then you should not even argu about it, WHY because people can lose there salvation over this.
But i would advice to all of you who have any concerns to have only to have talk about the commandments in future only and not the rest of the law.
Because as you can see 873 posts later everyone is still arguing about the law as a result of this many people have fallen out and some people may never know the truth who have come to this thread to learn in stead they have gone away thinking its ok to break the commandments and also they have left completely confused, confusion is not of God and talking about the law that is not commandments cause just that. and not only that what people see is a horrible christian side of faith that is quite clearly the work of Satan.
Not only this but people use this argument to bring people into a pit where they are tricked, this of Satan and as brother in Christ i urge you all to put a stop to this because i care about peoples salvation and it is duty as brother and sister to put a stop to this talk and snatch your brothers out of the fire.
I have made some similar threads about this if anyone cares look be my guest i wish you well and i hope you see all this as good advice for you and not a rant. God bless
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Yes if you do not feel conviction for sinning you are not a child of God you are a child of Satan. (conviction comes from the heart it stops you from sinning REPENT AND BE SAVED LET THE LORD BE A LAMP TO YOUR FEET and a shield to your heart.
[h=3]John 14:15[/h]Jesus Promises the Holy Spirit
15"If you love Me, you will keep My commandments. 16"I will ask the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may be with you forever;
May you live long and prosperous and brave and unrighteous may your heart be full of joy and may you love your brother like your neighbor.
[h=3]John 14:15[/h]Jesus Promises the Holy Spirit
15"If you love Me, you will keep My commandments. 16"I will ask the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may be with you forever;
May you live long and prosperous and brave and unrighteous may your heart be full of joy and may you love your brother like your neighbor.
D
Hebrews 7
5 Now the law requires the descendants of Levi who become priests to collect a tenth from the people—that is, from their fellow Israelites—even though they also are descended from Abraham. 6 This man, however, did not trace his descent from Levi, yet he collected a tenth from Abraham and blessed him who had the promises. 7 And without doubt the lesser is blessed by the greater. 8 In the one case, the tenth is collected by people who die; but in the other case, by him who is declared to be living. 9 One might even say that Levi, who collects the tenth, paid the tenth through Abraham,10 because when Melchizedek met Abraham, Levi was still in the body of his ancestor.
[h=3]Jesus Like Melchizedek[/h]11 If perfection could have been attained through the Levitical priesthood—and indeed the law given to the people established that priesthood—why was there still need for another priest to come, one in the order of Melchizedek, not in the order of Aaron? 12 For when the priesthood is changed, the law must be changed also.13 He of whom these things are said belonged to a different tribe,and no one from that tribe has ever served at the altar.14 For it is clear that our Lord descended from Judah, and in regard to that tribe Moses said nothing about priests.15 And what we have said is even more clear if another priest like Melchizedek appears, 16 one who has become a priest not on the basis of a regulation as to his ancestry but on the basis of the power of an indestructible life.17 For it is declared:
“You are a priest forever,
in the order of Melchizedek.”[a]
18 The former regulation is set aside because it was weak and useless19 (for the law made nothing perfect), and a better hope is introduced, by which we draw near to God
The law that was SET ASIDE because it was useless and weak (vs 18) is clearly the law the Levites had to collect tithes. That is clear from the context. Here is one example of the law of Moses being abolished. The law has been changed along with the priesthood. By by law of Moses.
5 Now the law requires the descendants of Levi who become priests to collect a tenth from the people—that is, from their fellow Israelites—even though they also are descended from Abraham. 6 This man, however, did not trace his descent from Levi, yet he collected a tenth from Abraham and blessed him who had the promises. 7 And without doubt the lesser is blessed by the greater. 8 In the one case, the tenth is collected by people who die; but in the other case, by him who is declared to be living. 9 One might even say that Levi, who collects the tenth, paid the tenth through Abraham,10 because when Melchizedek met Abraham, Levi was still in the body of his ancestor.
[h=3]Jesus Like Melchizedek[/h]11 If perfection could have been attained through the Levitical priesthood—and indeed the law given to the people established that priesthood—why was there still need for another priest to come, one in the order of Melchizedek, not in the order of Aaron? 12 For when the priesthood is changed, the law must be changed also.13 He of whom these things are said belonged to a different tribe,and no one from that tribe has ever served at the altar.14 For it is clear that our Lord descended from Judah, and in regard to that tribe Moses said nothing about priests.15 And what we have said is even more clear if another priest like Melchizedek appears, 16 one who has become a priest not on the basis of a regulation as to his ancestry but on the basis of the power of an indestructible life.17 For it is declared:
“You are a priest forever,
in the order of Melchizedek.”[a]
18 The former regulation is set aside because it was weak and useless19 (for the law made nothing perfect), and a better hope is introduced, by which we draw near to God
The law that was SET ASIDE because it was useless and weak (vs 18) is clearly the law the Levites had to collect tithes. That is clear from the context. Here is one example of the law of Moses being abolished. The law has been changed along with the priesthood. By by law of Moses.
D
Which commandments? Not the law of Moses. That law was abolished. "HavingABOLISHED in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments." (Ephesians 2:15)
What was ABOLISHED? The law of commandments, that ends the torah! Jesus gave NEW laws for Christians to obey, and the sabbath isn't one of them.
What was ABOLISHED? The law of commandments, that ends the torah! Jesus gave NEW laws for Christians to obey, and the sabbath isn't one of them.