Fundamentalism

[JaumeJ]

Fundamentalists are no different from other theologies claiming to follow the teachings of the Word closest and best. They are fundamental in their own esteem, and by their rules.

I like to think of myself as being fundamental in my faith and belief, but only in the sense of the meaning of the word. When the Holy Spirit entered into me, He did tell me much, but one thing He did not tell me is a theology that is absolute and perfect. Since that glorious day, I have been content to study the Word, and continue as I was more or less told I would. Nothing spectacular, just a life long study of the Word in the love of Yeshua, Jesus..

“Fundamentalists draw clear distinctions between themselves, as true believers, and others, convinced that they are right and that anyone who contradicts them is ignorant and possibly evil. Fundamentalists are militant in fighting against any challenge to their beliefs. They are often angry and sometimes resort to verbal or even physical abuse against those who interfere with the implementation of their agenda. There are three words that characterize fundamentalism: rigidity, domination, and exclusion.”
- Jimmy Carter


The Fundamentalism that is spoken of here is pretty common in current Christianity. How do we root it out?

 

[crossnote]

“Fundamentalists draw clear distinctions between themselves, as true believers, and others, convinced that they are right and that anyone who contradicts them is ignorant and possibly evil. Fundamentalists are militant in fighting against any challenge to their beliefs. They are often angry and sometimes resort to verbal or even physical abuse against those who interfere with the implementation of their agenda. There are three words that characterize fundamentalism: rigidity, domination, and exclusion.”
- Jimmy Carter


The Fundamentalism that is spoken of here is pretty common in current Christianity. How do we root it out?

Poor Jimmy would never have survived the debates of the 1600's (including Christian)...vitriolic, caustic, unbending..from both sides of the aiisle.
Carter being a post modernist is still trying to figure out Clinton''s statement, ''It all depends on what 'is' ..'is'.
Not good for a debate back then.

 

[just-me]

“Fundamentalists draw clear distinctions between themselves, as true believers, and others, convinced that they are right and that anyone who contradicts them is ignorant and possibly evil. Fundamentalists are militant in fighting against any challenge to their beliefs. They are often angry and sometimes resort to verbal or even physical abuse against those who interfere with the implementation of their agenda. There are three words that characterize fundamentalism: rigidity, domination, and exclusion.”
- Jimmy Carter


The Fundamentalism that is spoken of here is pretty common in current Christianity. How do we root it out?

Let the tares grow with the wheat. God will do the harvesting. Just keep the faith brother. Keep the faith.

Psalm 119:160 (KJV)
[SUP]160 [/SUP]Thy word is true from the beginning: and every one of thy righteous judgments endureth for ever.

1 Peter 4:17-19 (KJV)
[SUP]17 [/SUP]For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God?
[SUP]18 [/SUP]And if the righteous scarcely be saved, where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear?
[SUP]19 [/SUP]Wherefore let them that suffer according to the will of God commit the keeping of their souls to him in well doing, as unto a faithful Creator.

Judgment has begun in the church. We are facing a sad division.

 

[dcontroversal]

What makes an ex peanut farmer and 1 term president the "crème de le crème" as well as "all that and a bag of chips" when it comes to his definition of anything?

 

[RedTent]

Godissalvation: Let's just put it this way...I'll let God be the Judge.

Now that! is an excellent idea for all here, but I thought you said: Coming from Jimmy Carter, a liberal both politically and theologically, I would etc.

The description "fundamental" takes in very wide territory from the inability to humbly listen to scripture but only see it from a fleshly personal viewpoint to accepting scripture as it is written without adding to or taking away from it.

 

[SarahM777]

Fair question. Can someone be saved and have an incorrect view of water baptism? Yes. Poor discipleship will create such individuals every time. Can one have an incorrect view of eternal security and be saved? Yes again. I would think in both cases when presented with the truth from Gods word they must consider their position to be doubtful.

I believe from the scriptures and personal experience that one can be saved without having a great deal of theological knowledge. Scripture tells us the God convicts of sin because we are all sinners, of righteousness because only Christ is righteous, and judgment because we all deserve eternal condemnation. The complications arise after one gets saved although there are some who prevent others by forcing their views of what it means to be saved on unsuspecting sinners. Lordship salvation and a host of other such things.

I cannot say that any of the ism's are without fault. It is the fundamental doctrines of the faith aka cardinal doctrines that leave no room for compromise. The sufficiency of the blood of Christ. Grace through faith apart from works. Salvation as a gift again not of works.

I advocate for certain doctrines but I allow for others to have different views. I do draw the line when we get to the blood of Christ and any who would reject the blood are not part of the body.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

And I do agree with you on this.

 

[gamlet]

what I notice abut fundamentalists is they seem to not be able to pass up a chance to argue politics............

View attachment 75856

Accurate observation

 

[gamlet]

One way I love people is to tell them the Truth of the Gospel. Are you saying to drop the gospel if it creates a barrier due to their different beliefs?

I hope that when you tell them the truth of the Gospel you tell it as Jesus did in John 4. Before telling the woman about the Gospel--"I am He", He sought to tear down the barriers of prejudice (If you knew the gift of God and who it is that asks you for a drink, you would have asked him and He would have given you living water) and brought out and dealt with the woman's personal issues (Go and call your husband). If you bluntly proclaim the Gospel and strengthen prejudice instead of tearing it down, that's just fundamentalism speaking out.

 

[gamlet]

I agree with the thrust of what you're saying, I think... I grew up as a fundamentalist, tho we didn't call ourselves that... ... I've since become more... I guess liberal would be a possible word... now, an odd situation... was Jesus a fundamentalist? because as I person who wants to be 'like Christ' and live as He did, I run into the challenge of wanting to not be rigid in thinking, yet running into Gospel passages where Jesus makes strong (abusive, possibly, by Carter's definition) statements... I'm interested in hearing your thoughts on this...

Please specify the passages.

 

[gamlet]

I'm interested in how this might work in everyday practice... every chruch I've ever visited from the most rigid to the most liberal, will let anybody come in and sit in a pew... but churches, like any social group, I think, want a lot more control over who gets the microphone, that is, who gets to speak to the group... and who has a key to the building, that is, who gets to start up a new group or program... so, how does acceptance work when it comes to who gets a mic or a key to the building... ?

********
funny story (maybe) : I was talking with a guy who is a Unitarian-Universalist church (probably one of the most liberal possible religious groups), and he said one time a guy wanted to come to a UU service, but he was asked to leave... they wouldn't let him in 'sit in a pew'... because he was wearing a sidearm.

Honestly, even if I were leading a church, I would want some control over who has the mic because you'd have to safeguard the weak. But we could hold certain meetings of the nature where everyone could speak. Admittedly, the spiritual maturity you speak of is very rare.

The everyday practice I am thinking of would be on a more personal level of accepting people of variant beliefs and seeking to tear down prejudice.

 

[gamlet]

Be a Man for God. Stand up and defend the faith once and for all delivered to the Saints. If you reject the fundamentals of the bible you are compromising the word of God.

There are mean people on both sides of the issue. God never tells us to soften the gospel message but to declare it to all men. We are to be weeping for the souls of the lost but never embracing their sin.

Some do not like fundamentalists because they do not want to strive for purity and holiness. They desire to serve the flesh and not the Spirit of God. If you think that fundamentalists are hard try being in eternal condemnation. We do not make a commitment to faith we surrender our all to Christ. Forsake all your sin and come to Christ not just the sin you can do without.

Man up and endure hardness as a good soldier of Christ. If some one challenges your Christianity then give them the reason for your hope. 1 Peter 3:15

For the cause of Christ
Roger

There is a way to communicate the Gospel that is according to love. It seeks to tear down prejudice and recognizes people as individuals (taking note of their personal concerns and problems) and points to Christ (not merely doctrine). My model for this is how Christ communicated the Gospel to the woman at the well (John 4).

If your Gospel presentation strengthens prejudice, I'd ask you to reconsider your methods.

 

[ji]

Honestly, even if I were leading a church, I would want some control over who has the mic because you'd have to safeguard the weak. But we could hold certain meetings of the nature where everyone could speak. Admittedly, the spiritual maturity you speak of is very rare.

The everyday practice I am thinking of would be on a more personal level of accepting people of variant beliefs and seeking to tear down prejudice.

you already avoided something i asked.....
when you mention about others,how good are going to do it if you had control over things?
everybody can dream,but leading is not easy...
are you upto it?

 

[gamlet]

That looks like you ruled yourself out and made yourself above all to be subjected to a category(among the ones you mentioned above...)
Is that good?

I am a Christian. I find that even though I am conscious of the evil of fundamentalism, I find it even in myself. That proves I am a sinner. In fact, this thread is an effort not only to help others but myself also. But thank you for pointing this out so that I could clarify this point.

 

[gamlet]

Those are prety amazing words from a man who was an extreme fundamentalist left wing fanatic.. lol

Someone else in this thread called him a liberal. So what is he really? I guess we can't really pin people down with labels. Let's just evaluate the words and pass over the personality.

 

[ji]

I am a Christian. I find that even though I am conscious of the evil of fundamentalism, I find it even in myself. That proves I am a sinner. In fact, this thread is an effort not only to help others but myself also. But thank you for pointing this out so that I could clarify this point.

gamlet
i didn't ask you that to make you aware of yourself,we all know our miseries....
but just saying when we start leading,things doesn't look the same like we were sitting and listening..
Many quit leading,because they are cornered by devil and believers..

So, totally a new perspective to think of...
There are practical dangers to be taken care of too....
But people like joel osteen are excluded anyways...
God Bless

 

[gamlet]

Are you so sure that on these matters that you are not the one in error IE baptismal regeneration, conditional salvation,
etc?

We are all fallible. That's why we need to be tolerant of others' beliefs.

 

[gamlet]

The Jesus I know does not leave any doubt in my convictions regarding water baptism and the eternal security of the believer. The Holy Spirit confirms the truth of the word of God.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

Others have convictions of the truth as they perceive it just as strong as yours. Respect should be the byword among Christians.

 

[gamlet]

Then build your case from the bible.

And while you're at it, be sure to define your terms.
Fundamentalism has many different definitions used by many different people... it by no means has one clear definition.
In fact, it's really nothing more than a vague term loaded with different meanings by different political factions... and as a term, it has no biblical significance at all.

Since fundamentalism is a term primarily used in politics, and it really has no clear definition at all, why don't you just stick to the bible, and make a case using biblical terms, for and against whatever things you believe in.

If you don't like pride, talk about pride.
If you don't like hypocrisy, talk about hypocrisy.
It's absurd to attack a modern term that is completely amorphous and really has no clear definition.

Fundamentalism as it is intended to be spoken of here is the religious attitude that perceives one's perception of the truth as normative not only for himself but for others. It sees variant positions as in error. It is intolerant and rigid.

Romans 2:17-20 speaks of Jewish/Pharisaical fundamentalism. Many other verses in the New Testament speak against this attitude.

 

[gamlet]

There is certainly truth in some of his description, certainly of some "fundamentalists" that I have come across!

1) "convinced that they are right and that anyone who contradicts them is ignorant and possibly evil"

2) "Fundamentalists are militant in fighting against any challenge to their beliefs."

3) "They are often angry and sometimes resort to verbal or even physical abuse against those who interfere with the implementation of their agenda."

Maybe the "fundamentalists" that I have come into contact with have been very "extreme"!

So have those I've met. Maybe they're not that uncommon.

 

[gamlet]

you already avoided something i asked.....
when you mention about others,how good are going to do it if you had control over things?
everybody can dream,but leading is not easy...
are you upto it?

I do what I can. In our church, I speak out against the prevailing fundamentalist attitude and teach an open posture to other believers. And in this forum...