Excellent Article concerning this subject..........found here:
http://r.search.yahoo.com/_ylt=AwrB...Cult8.htm/RK=0/RS=rmSujFYrFNM6jSjxfpl_Rw2jc6I-
http://r.search.yahoo.com/_ylt=AwrB...Cult8.htm/RK=0/RS=rmSujFYrFNM6jSjxfpl_Rw2jc6I-
Salvation Not Possible Without Works
- Thread starter SeaBass
- Start date
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Yes all you said is scripture and to bring home the full meaning Brother
2 Corinthians 12:9 And he said unto me, My grace is sufficient for thee: for my strength is made perfect in weakness. Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me.
With no humility Brother one thinks they are strong and loses Faith, being of self works using God as their excuse to do all sorts of wrong mixing Faith and works of self, deceived thinking they are works of God, and then using being Forgiven as the excuse as the Corinthians did, and why Paul wrote to them to stop the Heresy, that was being shown through them, and then Satan went to work to make them now you are not weak, you are as you just posted, and what sets in to one's carnal nature? Satan's after to either make me up on the teeter totter above others as in I am better than others see my righteousness God gave me; attitude. Pride and haughtiness, boastfulness in the way and is not of Father through Son at all. when that does not work.
Then Guilt is another tool used by the evil forces in this world to control your behavior, that is down on the teeter totter trying to be up, and is how the carnal flesh nature works to get above, everyone else, selfishly, tha tis plain and simple how flesh works, wrong motive(s) and
God the Father will not reveal the truth to those that knowingly remain self and want knowledge for their own gain. Neither way will bring the truth that sets one free
Man either loves this world and the things in it above God or not, can't love both?
Now notice where God might be on this teeter totter? In the middle, never up or down, ask to sit in father's lap and be shown?
2 Corinthians 12:9 And he said unto me, My grace is sufficient for thee: for my strength is made perfect in weakness. Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me.
With no humility Brother one thinks they are strong and loses Faith, being of self works using God as their excuse to do all sorts of wrong mixing Faith and works of self, deceived thinking they are works of God, and then using being Forgiven as the excuse as the Corinthians did, and why Paul wrote to them to stop the Heresy, that was being shown through them, and then Satan went to work to make them now you are not weak, you are as you just posted, and what sets in to one's carnal nature? Satan's after to either make me up on the teeter totter above others as in I am better than others see my righteousness God gave me; attitude. Pride and haughtiness, boastfulness in the way and is not of Father through Son at all. when that does not work.
Then Guilt is another tool used by the evil forces in this world to control your behavior, that is down on the teeter totter trying to be up, and is how the carnal flesh nature works to get above, everyone else, selfishly, tha tis plain and simple how flesh works, wrong motive(s) and
God the Father will not reveal the truth to those that knowingly remain self and want knowledge for their own gain. Neither way will bring the truth that sets one free
Man either loves this world and the things in it above God or not, can't love both?
Now notice where God might be on this teeter totter? In the middle, never up or down, ask to sit in father's lap and be shown?
Excerpt from Article:
Next we will examine a verse from James: “Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.” –James 2:19 Here we are reminded that the question of God’s existence is not an issue to the devils. Their “belief ,“ in this sense, is unwavering. Here James is telling us that the kind of “faith” specified by "definition one," although good, is no more than what the devils possess. It is not enough to usher in salvation. This is why James says:
“What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?” –James 2:14
We can see from context that James is using "definition one" for his meaning for the term “faith.” This kind of “faith” cannot save anyone. James provides some more information in verse 18:
“Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.” –James 2:18
Here James reminds us that the kind of “faith” which is required for salvation will produce actions. Returning to our non-biblical example, a man who is selling his Dollars to buy gold, proves, by his actions, that he does not “believe” (definition two) in U.S. Dollars as much as he believes in gold. James’ argument is that a man’s actions will tell us where his trust (belief - definition two) really resides. The kind of faith which the devils possess (definition one) can stand alone, apart from works, but the other kind cannot.
Finally, let’s examine Paul’s statement about faith in his letter to the Ephesians:
“For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast.” –Ephesians 2:8,9
(found here)
http://r.search.yahoo.com/_ylt=AwrB...orks.html/RK=0/RS=A81Drxtxv8LMccb35byMDtUJSg0-
Next we will examine a verse from James: “Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.” –James 2:19 Here we are reminded that the question of God’s existence is not an issue to the devils. Their “belief ,“ in this sense, is unwavering. Here James is telling us that the kind of “faith” specified by "definition one," although good, is no more than what the devils possess. It is not enough to usher in salvation. This is why James says:
“What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?” –James 2:14
We can see from context that James is using "definition one" for his meaning for the term “faith.” This kind of “faith” cannot save anyone. James provides some more information in verse 18:
“Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.” –James 2:18
Here James reminds us that the kind of “faith” which is required for salvation will produce actions. Returning to our non-biblical example, a man who is selling his Dollars to buy gold, proves, by his actions, that he does not “believe” (definition two) in U.S. Dollars as much as he believes in gold. James’ argument is that a man’s actions will tell us where his trust (belief - definition two) really resides. The kind of faith which the devils possess (definition one) can stand alone, apart from works, but the other kind cannot.
Finally, let’s examine Paul’s statement about faith in his letter to the Ephesians:
“For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast.” –Ephesians 2:8,9
(found here)
http://r.search.yahoo.com/_ylt=AwrB...orks.html/RK=0/RS=A81Drxtxv8LMccb35byMDtUJSg0-
Zola Levitt explained what a Jew means my the term "I believe"
If Jew #1 and Jew #2 walked up to a frozen over lake in early winter, and Jew#2 asked Jew#1,
"Do you believe the ice is thick enough to walk on?"
AND Jew #1 replied, "Yes, I believe it is thick enough to walk on." And then he only reached out with one foot and started testing the ice.
Jew #2 would yell, "LIAR! If you really believed it you would have boldly walked out there and put your whole weight on it."
In other words for a Jewish Christian to genuinely Believe in JESUS as LORD (which means Master), will automatically produce a bold submission and obedience to HIM validated that Faith, NOT the doubting faith of Jew #1.
What work must I do to receive Salvation? What work must I do to have Salvation?
Very good article by the way!
Yahoo Search results hyperlinks do not work, as they are ALWAYS redirected to the default Yahoo Search page. I don't know if that is a Yahoo glitch or an error in my settings, but my sister has the exact same problem. That is why I reposted the link to that page above without the Yahoo Search part attached to the address. I found a way around it to get to that Yahoo Search results site though. I click on Reply With Quote and then the entire address of the hyperlink is visible, so that I can copy/paste it onto the address bar of a new page in my TORCH Browser. (By the way TORCH is the absolute best Browser that I have ever found. It has blown away the competition in my opinion.)
I like that "Let Us Reason" site. They also have one the best pages around for explaining how to become a Christian, which explains very simply what SALVATION is: The Gospel
Very good article by the way!
Yahoo Search results hyperlinks do not work, as they are ALWAYS redirected to the default Yahoo Search page. I don't know if that is a Yahoo glitch or an error in my settings, but my sister has the exact same problem. That is why I reposted the link to that page above without the Yahoo Search part attached to the address. I found a way around it to get to that Yahoo Search results site though. I click on Reply With Quote and then the entire address of the hyperlink is visible, so that I can copy/paste it onto the address bar of a new page in my TORCH Browser. (By the way TORCH is the absolute best Browser that I have ever found. It has blown away the competition in my opinion.)
I like that "Let Us Reason" site. They also have one the best pages around for explaining how to become a Christian, which explains very simply what SALVATION is: The Gospel
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My God has given me a new heart and his spirit. I can not help but do what he wants me to, I choose to follow his spirit so I can control the urges of the flesh. My life is hid in him and no one can harm me as long as I am in him and he in me. Everywhere he went he was doing good. Should I not do as he did? It is not by my strength I do it but his spirit in me gives me the power to perform it. My only motive is to be like Christ and that means obedience even unto death because I am already dead and my life now belongs to him. This is the faith I have in God If I continue in him he will raise me in the last day.
I think people are misunderstanding the verse if I should try to use other words in place of the key words then maybe..
- Ephesians 2:8 For by grace(devine unmerited favor)are ye saved through faith(belief and trust in and loyalty to God); and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
[h=2]Definition of GRACE[/h]1
a : unmerited divine assistance given humans for their regeneration or sanctification
b : a virtue coming from God
c : a state of sanctification enjoyed through divine grace
[h=2]Definition of FAITH[/h]1
a : allegiance to duty or a person : loyalty
b (1) : fidelity to one's promises (2) : sincerity of intentions
2
a (1) : belief and trust in and loyalty to God (2) : belief in the traditional doctrines of a religion
b (1) : firm belief in something for which there is no proof (2) : complete trust
3
: something that is believed especially with strong conviction; especially : a system of religious beliefs <the Protestant faith>
John 10:32 Jesus answered them, Many good works have I shewed you from my Father; for which of those works do ye stone me?
If I show you good works from Christ will you stone me too?
If I show you good works from Christ will you stone me too?
Brother my purpose here is not to go in circles, it is to edify and to be edified. If you are having a problem defining faith you can use trust in it's place. I trust God that is final, when I pray "lead me not into temptation" I trust him to do it. When he says do good to all men I obey him because he is my master. I do not ask if it is obedience of faith or saving faith or faith that saves or anything else for that matter I simply obey.
Really I don't know how to explain this again but I'll try ,,, Grace is the divine favour free gift you get from God. What is that free gift salvation of course. How do you receive it, through faith ( belief and trust in and loyalty to God)
If I say I will give you a million dollars free just believe me you don't have to pay anything.all you have to do is walk to the vault follow some instructions to the letter and pick it up.
How will I know if you believe me? When you go to the vault and follow the instructions of course.
If I say I will give you a million dollars free just believe me you don't have to pay anything.all you have to do is walk to the vault follow some instructions to the letter and pick it up.
How will I know if you believe me? When you go to the vault and follow the instructions of course.
Hmmmmm...........that "follow some instructions" statement gives me pause...........sounds a wee bit like "works salvation." May not be what you mean, but it is what it sounds like...........
With regards to your example............apply John 3:16 to it, and I think you will see that "instructions" aren't necessary, but, now, that may just be me............ so ............
With regards to your example............apply John 3:16 to it, and I think you will see that "instructions" aren't necessary, but, now, that may just be me............ so ............