Daniel 9:27

[GaryA]

Daniel 9:

[SUP]24[/SUP] Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy. [SUP]25[/SUP] Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times. [SUP]26[/SUP] And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined. [SUP]27[/SUP] And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

These things were fulfilled at / during the First Coming of Christ.

These things were fulfilled at / around 70 A.D.

This is referring to "the finishing of all things" - which is, essentially, at the Second Coming of Christ.

All three instances of the word 'he' in verse 27 are referring to Christ.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

All three instances of the word 'he' in verse 27 are referring to Christ.

Interesting prospect. But can you prove it? Can you tell us why Christ would place an idol in the holy place to desolate it? Since that is what the term abomination which makes desolate means.

 

[tribesman]

well sorry bro, But I must disagree.

Canaan is not in your hands, You have no right to it. It was not a salvic covenant, it was a gift from God to the children of israel. The OT has many prophesies over and over which show israel in sin being removed from that land. Then one day restored to that land. That covenant IS still binding, It has NOTHING TO do with SALVATION OF ANYONE. if it does. the jews were right, and paul was wrong, and ALL jews were saved,

I agree on all except that physical Israel will be one day restored to that land. Otherwise all good. The land in question means nothing in regards to the gracious salvation of sinners.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I agree on all except that physical Israel will be one day restored to that land. Otherwise all good. The land in question means nothing in regards to the gracious salvation of sinners.

I agree. the land means nothing as far as the salvation of sinners.

I disagree (respectufully) about Israel being restored. The OT prophesies it. God said he would use it for ALL the world to see. And he made an eternal promise to them he will keep.

No to set the record straight. I do not believe sinful isreal will be restored. I believe repentant Israel who have accepted Christ as their savior will be restored (wink)

 

[Linda70]

I agree on all except that physical Israel will be one day restored to that land.

God's Word specifically says that God promised the children of Israel that He would restore the nation of Israel.

Genesis 15:18 In the same day the LORD made a covenant with Abram, saying, Unto thy seed have I given this land, from the river of Egypt unto the great river, the river Euphrates:
Genesis 15:19 The Kenites, and the Kenizzites, and the Kadmonites,
Genesis 15:20 And the Hittites, and the Perizzites, and the Rephaims,
Genesis 15:21 And the Amorites, and the Canaanites, and the Girgashites, and the Jebusites.

Joshua 1:3 Every place that the sole of your foot shall tread upon, that have I given unto you, as I said unto Moses.
Joshua 1:4 From the wilderness and this Lebanon even unto the great river, the river Euphrates, all the land of the Hittites, and unto the great sea toward the going down of the sun, shall be your coast.

Deuteronomy 30:1 And it shall come to pass, when all these things are come upon thee, the blessing and the curse, which I have set before thee, and thou shalt call them to mind among all the nations, whither the LORD thy God hath driven thee,
Deuteronomy 30:2 And shalt return unto the LORD thy God, and shalt obey his voice according to all that I command thee this day, thou and thy children, with all thine heart, and with all thy soul;
Deuteronomy 30:3 That then the LORD thy God will turn thy captivity, and have compassion upon thee, and will return and gather thee from all the nations, whither the LORD thy God hath scattered thee.
Deuteronomy 30:4 If any of thine be driven out unto the outmost parts of heaven, from thence will the LORD thy God gather thee, and from thence will he fetch thee:
Deuteronomy 30:5 And the LORD thy God will bring thee into the land which thy fathers possessed, and thou shalt possess it; and he will do thee good, and multiply thee above thy fathers.
Deuteronomy 30:6 And the LORD thy God will circumcise thine heart, and the heart of thy seed, to love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, that thou mayest live.
Deuteronomy 30:7 And the LORD thy God will put all these curses upon thine enemies, and on them that hate thee, which persecuted thee.
Deuteronomy 30:8 And thou shalt return and obey the voice of the LORD, and do all his commandments which I command thee this day.

Amos 9:11 In that day will I raise up the tabernacle of David that is fallen, and close up the breaches thereof; and I will raise up his ruins, and I will build it as in the days of old:
Amos 9:12 That they may possess the remnant of Edom, and of all the heathen, which are called by my name, saith the LORD that doeth this.
Amos 9:13 Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that the plowman shall overtake the reaper, and the treader of grapes him that soweth seed; and the mountains shall drop sweet wine, and all the hills shall melt.
Amos 9:14 And I will bring again the captivity of my people of Israel, and they shall build the waste cities, and inhabit them; and they shall plant vineyards, and drink the wine thereof; they shall also make gardens, and eat the fruit of them.
Amos 9:15 And I will plant them upon their land, and they shall no more be pulled up out of their land which I have given them, saith the LORD thy God.

The prophecy of the "dry bones" of Ezekiel 37 has been partially fulfilled. That happened on May 14, 1948. Israel is back in their land in unbelief.

The land promise God gave to the nation of Israel has nothing to do with the Church. There will be a future restoration of the literal, physical land of Israel, just as God promised. To deny this, is to call God a liar.

 

[Linda70]

The Antichrist and Israel

Bible prophecy describes a powerful man who will rule the world for a short period before the return of Christ. He is called by many names, including Antichrist, Man of Sin, Little Horn, the Beast, Son of Perdition, and that Wicked.

“But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you. For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night. For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape. But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief” (1 Thessalonians 5:1-4).

Here we have a description of the Antichrist’s peace program. Like Antiochus Epiphanes and Hitler and Stalin and many other tyrants, the Antichrist comes as a man of peace.

In Revelation 6:2 he arrives on the scene at the very beginning of Daniel’s Seventieth Week, and he is riding on a white horse with a bow but no arrows. He has military power but he is not using it at this point. He enlarges his power through deception. Daniel says he will destroy by peace (Dan. 8:25).

Daniel 9:27 says he will make a seven-year covenant with the Jews but will break it at the halfway point. The Antichrist will doubtless propose a plan that will solve the Middle East crisis and allow the Muslims to live peaceably with the Jews. I believe that it is at this point that the Third Jewish Temple will be built. The peace plan will make headlines throughout the world and will be blazed across the Internet. It will get 24/7 coverage on cable news networks. People the world over will rejoice, thinking that mankind is entering a millennium of glorious peace and prosperity.

This program is exactly what the Jews are longing for today. They just want peace.

Continued here

It will be the Antichrist who will sign that 7 year peace treaty with Israel, not Christ. This is what the literal interpretation of Scriptures teach....when those Scriptures are rightly divided. (2 Tim. 2:15) It is foolhardy to pull ONE verse out of Daniel 9 and twist it like you have. Christ would not (and did not) sign a peace treaty with Israel and then break it. The New Covenant (in His blood) is not that "covenant" in Daniel 9:27. If you would take verse 27 into context, beginning with verse 24, you would see that it is not Christ, but antichrist who signs that "covenant".

Daniel 9:24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.
Daniel 9:25 Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.
Daniel 9:26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.
Daniel 9:27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

In verse 26, "the people of the prince that shall come" were the ROMANS. This verse is speaking about the Romans destroying the temple and Jerusalem in 70 AD by the Roman armies of General Titus. The "he" in verse 27 is NOT Christ, it is "the prince that shall come" (verse 26)....the ruler of the Revived Roman Empire in the last days....the "little horn" (Daniel 8:9), who is antichrist.

 

[KJV1611]

Interesting prospect. But can you prove it? Can you tell us why Christ would place an idol in the holy place to desolate it? Since that is what the term abomination which makes desolate means.

EG you are combining 2 totally different concepts together. Just because both verses have "abomination" and "desolation" in them does not mean the context is the same. Daniel 9:27 is not the abomination of desolation mentioned in Matthew and Mark, Daniel 11:31 is.


The abomination in Matthew and Mark is a "thing" that stands in a place where it should not be.


Dan_11:31 And arms shall stand on his part, and they shall pollute the sanctuary of strength, and shall take away the daily sacrifice, and they shall place the abomination that maketh desolate.


The abomination in Daniel 9:27 is not a "thing", it is abominable behaviour by a group of people. Here are the abominations they commited:


Mat 23:34 Wherefore, behold, I send unto you prophets, and wise men, and scribes: and some of them ye shall kill and crucify; and some of them shall ye scourge in your synagogues, and persecute them from city to city:
Mat 23:35 That upon you may come all the righteous blood shed upon the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel unto the blood of Zacharias son of Barachias, whom ye slew between the temple and the altar.

 

[KJV1611]

God's Word specifically says that God promised the children of Israel that He would restore the nation of Israel.

Genesis 15:18 In the same day the LORD made a covenant with Abram, saying, Unto thy seed have I given this land, from the river of Egypt unto the great river, the river Euphrates:
Genesis 15:19 The Kenites, and the Kenizzites, and the Kadmonites,
Genesis 15:20 And the Hittites, and the Perizzites, and the Rephaims,
Genesis 15:21 And the Amorites, and the Canaanites, and the Girgashites, and the Jebusites.

Hi Linda. The covenant in Genesis is the same covenant Paul talks about in Galatians. The covenant was to Abraham and his seed... not seeds, but one seed Jesus Christ and all that are in Christ

Gal_3:16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.

All the other verses you quoted pertain only to born again people whether they are Jew or Gentile. Especially the dry bones. Those dry bones wont inherit anything until God puts his spirit in them.

Eze 37:14 And shall put my spirit in you, and ye shall live, and I shall place you in your own land: then shall ye know that I the LORD have spoken it, and performed it, saith the LORD.

National Jews don't get the land, only saved Jews. There is only one promise in the bible and it is to Abraham's seed, Christ and all that are in Christ.

 

[KJV1611]

It will be the Antichrist who will sign that 7 year peace treaty with Israel, not Christ. This is what the literal interpretation of Scriptures teach....when those Scriptures are rightly divided. (2 Tim. 2:15) It is foolhardy to pull ONE verse out of Daniel 9 and twist it like you have. Christ would not (and did not) sign a peace treaty with Israel and then break it. The New Covenant (in His blood) is not that "covenant" in Daniel 9:27. If you would take verse 27 into context, beginning with verse 24, you would see that it is not Christ, but antichrist who signs that "covenant".

Daniel 9:24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.
Daniel 9:25 Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.
Daniel 9:26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.
Daniel 9:27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

In verse 26, "the people of the prince that shall come" were the ROMANS. This verse is speaking about the Romans destroying the temple and Jerusalem in 70 AD by the Roman armies of General Titus. The "he" in verse 27 is NOT Christ, it is "the prince that shall come" (verse 26)....the ruler of the Revived Roman Empire in the last days....the "little horn" (Daniel 8:9), who is antichrist.

Linda there is no peace treaty with Israel mentioned anywhere in the entire bible. Please post it if there is. Confirming a covenant with many is not a peace treaty with Israel. How on earth is anyone able to read that into that verse.

There is no mention of making any type of treaty. It only mentions confirming a covenant that already exists, and it is a covenant and not a peace treaty. The covenant is not with Israel. Israel has never been referred to as "many".

 

[tourist]

Seven year treaty will be signed by Israel and at least one other country guaranteeing security. I believe that the book of Daniel mentions this, regardless where it is mentioned it will certainly come to pass.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

EG you are combining 2 totally different concepts together. Just because both verses have "abomination" and "desolation" in them does not mean the context is the same. Daniel 9:27 is not the abomination of desolation mentioned in Matthew and Mark, Daniel 11:31 is.

really? Then why did the hebrew word meaning "detestable thing, Unclean thing, Idol" interpreted by the english writers as abomination in Dan 9: 27 used?

Again, the hebrew and greek words (septuagint) meant an idol placed in a holy place. that is what it means in daniel 9: 27 and daniel 11.

The abomination in Matthew and Mark is a "thing" that stands in a place where it should not be.

which is EXACTLY what the hebrew term in dan 9: 27 says..

Dan_11:31 And arms shall stand on his part, and they shall pollute the sanctuary of strength, and shall take away the daily sacrifice, and they shall place the abomination that maketh desolate.


The abomination in Daniel 9:27 is not a "thing", it is abominable behaviour by a group of people. Here are the abominations they commited:


Mat 23:34 Wherefore, behold, I send unto you prophets, and wise men, and scribes: and some of them ye shall kill and crucify; and some of them shall ye scourge in your synagogues, and persecute them from city to city:
Mat 23:35 That upon you may come all the righteous blood shed upon the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel unto the blood of Zacharias son of Barachias, whom ye slew between the temple and the altar.

Daniel 9: 27 is an unclean thing in a holy place. on the wing. means a particular part of a building. In dan 9, it refers to the pinnacle, or wing of the temple, known as the holy place.

 

[KJV1611]

Eg I see why you believe what you believe now. You dont read the kjv. There is no wing in daniel 9:27. These newer translations will always point you to antichrist instead of Christ. Thats why I wont read them.

 

[Linda70]

Linda there is no peace treaty with Israel mentioned anywhere in the entire bible. Please post it if there is. Confirming a covenant with many is not a peace treaty with Israel. How on earth is anyone able to read that into that verse.

First of all, I do use only the KJV and I see that you have totally and completely pulled ONE verse (27) out of the context of the 70 week prophecy of Daniel 9. Even though you claim to be KJV, you certainly are not rightly dividing God's Word. Therefore, I'm asking you...how on earth are you able to make "the prince that shall come " from verse 26 into Messiah/Christ--when "the people of the prince that shall come" were the Romans that destroyed Jerusalem and the temple in 70 AD? I know how...you pulled it out of context. Yes, there will be a covenant confirmed (which will more than likely be called a treaty by Israel and the world)...but that "confirmation" will not be with Christ and Israel---it will be with the ruler (prince) of the Revived Roman Empire and Israel.

Daniel 9:24-27. God's timetable for restoring Israel and overthrowing the Gentile powers.

The Seventy Weeks. The occasion of the 70 weeks was Daniel's prayer that God would have mercy on Israel. The vision of the 70 weeks is God's answer. In this vision God reveals to Daniel the time schedule and major events which will lead to the establishment of Israel's Messianic kingdom.

The Length of Time of the 70 Weeks. The Hebrew term for weeks here (shebuah) simply means "sevens." The context must determine whether it is a week of days, or of years, etc. (1) The weeks which have already been fulfilled demonstrate these are weeks of years rather than of days. It was almost 500 years from the rebuilding of the temple and of Jerusalem until the coming of Christ. This fits perfectly the testimony of Daniel 9:25, which places 69 weeks of years (483 years) between the two events. It is only reasonable to believe that the 70th week shall also be a week of years, or a seven year period. (2) When this Hebrew term is used of weeks of days, the word "days" is added (Daniel 10:2-3). (3) The concept of weeks of years was familiar to Jewish thinking (Leviticus 25:3-9)[/B. (4) At the time of the vision, Daniel had been thinking in terms of weeks of years (Daniel 9:2 compared with 2 Chronicles 36:21).

The Divisions of the 70 Weeks. The 70 weeks are divided into distinct groups. (1) During the first 7 weeks (49 years) Jerusalem was rebuilt in troublous times (Nehemiah 2:1,3,5,6,8). (2) The next 62 weeks (434 years) extends from the rebuilding of Jerusalem until the coming of the Messiah. (3) Between the 69th and 70th week is a period of undetermined time during which the Messiah is cut off, Jerusalem is destroyed by Roman armies (A.D. 70), and there are desolations until the end. The Hebrew word translated "desolation" is also translated "destruction (Hosea 2:12). It refers to the fact that Jerusalem has been destroyed and overrun time and again throughout the interim period between the 69th and 70th weeks. Unforeseen by Daniel is the interlude of the church age, during which time the Messiah is resurrected and ascends back to Heaven to oversee the calling out of a people for His name from among the nations (Luke 19:11-27; Acts 15:14-18). (4) The 70th week (the final seven years). The prince of the revived Roman Empire will make a covenant with Israel. That the Antichrist arises from the revived Roman Empire is evident by the fact that he is called the prince of the people who destroyed Jerusalem after Messiah's death; this was Rome. In the middle of the seven years the Antichrist will desecrate the Jewish temple (Matthew 24:15; 2 Thess. 2:3-4). There will be desolations until Christ returns to overthrow the Antichrist (Matthew 24:16-21; Revelation 11:2). The abomination that makes desolate marks the middle of the seven years. In Matthew 24:15 is where Jesus places this event in the Tribulation period. This abomination of desolation probably refers to the occasion when the Antichrist will set himself up as god (2 Thess. 2:4).

There is no mention of making any type of treaty. It only mentions confirming a covenant that already exists, and it is a covenant and not a peace treaty. The covenant is not with Israel. Israel has never been referred to as "many".

You are arguing over "semantics". That "covenant" is a treaty of a "false" peace. Christ doesn't offer us a "false" peace. That "confirming covenant" does NOT exist at the present time...it is future.

 

[KJV1611]

Linda I think you're misunderstanding me. Verse 26 talks about 2 people, Messiah and the prince that shall come.
"The prince that will come" will destroy the city and the sanctuary... and he did, that happened in 70 A.D.
The "he" in verse 27 is not the prince that will come, it is the Messiah.

 

[KJV1611]

You are arguing over "semantics". That "covenant" is a treaty of a "false" peace. Christ doesn't offer us a "false" peace. That "confirming covenant" does NOT exist at the present time...it is future.

Respectfully Linda, I'm not arguing over semantics. I'm arguing over adding words to the bible, the bible clearly does not say the "covenant" is a treaty of a "false" peace.

If we are going to learn anything from the bible we have to let the bible say what it says, we can't interpret it. There are always 2 witnesses in the bible. The second witness to Daniel 9:27 is Galatians 3:17.

Gal 3:17 And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect.

I want to explain this verse because most people stumble all over it and claim the covenant was the law. It is not the law, it is grace. The covenant in that verse was given to Abraham 430 years before the law was given to Moses. This covenant is the covenant God made with Abraham and his seed (Jesus Christ... he is the heir of the world, not national Israel).

Paul clearly tells us that this covenant, 400 years before the law was confirmed by Jesus Christ... Jesus confirmed the covenant with "many".

 

[RachelBibleStudent]

In verse 26, "the people of the prince that shall come" were the ROMANS. This verse is speaking about the Romans destroying the temple and Jerusalem in 70 AD by the Roman armies of General Titus. The "he" in verse 27 is NOT Christ, it is "the prince that shall come" (verse 26)....the ruler of the Revived Roman Empire in the last days....the "little horn" (Daniel 8:9), who is antichrist.

grammatically 'the prince that is to come' -cannot- be the 'he' in verse twenty-seven...

'the prince that is to come' is not a subject or an object in any previous sentence...so by the basic rules of pronoun reference the pronoun 'he' cannot refer to 'the prince that is to come'

the only singular person who is mentioned as the subject or object in the previous sentences is 'the messiah'...so by the basic rules of pronoun reference the pronoun 'he' can only refer to 'the messiah'

 

[RachelBibleStudent]

really? Then why did the hebrew word meaning "detestable thing, Unclean thing, Idol" interpreted by the english writers as abomination in Dan 9: 27 used?

Again, the hebrew and greek words (septuagint) meant an idol placed in a holy place. that is what it means in daniel 9: 27 and daniel 11.



which is EXACTLY what the hebrew term in dan 9: 27 says..




Daniel 9: 27 is an unclean thing in a holy place. on the wing. means a particular part of a building. In dan 9, it refers to the pinnacle, or wing of the temple, known as the holy place.

the hebrew in daniel 9:27 and in daniel 11 actually says clearly different things...daniel 9:27 uses the words 'abomination' and 'desolation' in the same sentence but it does not use the term 'abomination of desolation'

also the reference to 'wing' or 'overspreading' in some translations is a hebrew marriage term...

 

[GaryA]

Interesting prospect. But can you prove it? Can you tell us why Christ would place an idol in the holy place to desolate it? Since that is what the term abomination which makes desolate means.

Please see this post and this post.

 

[KJV1611]

I see why most people think the "he" is the Antichrist. There are huge differences in these two translations.

1) Is "a covenant" or "the covenant" to be confirmed.
2) Does he "put an end to sacrifices" or does he "cause the sacrifice to end.
3) Is there a temple or not.
4 Does he "set up an abomination that causes desolation" or is someone or something made desolate because of the abominations they/it committed.
5) Are the desolation's poured out on him or they poured out on the desolate.

It's like the NIV writters went out of their way to make the "he" be the Antichrist.
If we don't understand who "he" is in this verse then we have no concept of the end times. Everyone's belief in the 7 year tribulation and Antichrist peace treaty is based on the misunderstanding of Daniel 9:27.

[h=3]Daniel 9:27[/h]New International Version (NIV)


27 He will confirm a covenant with many for one ‘seven.’[a] In the middle of the ‘seven’[b] he will put an end to sacrifice and offering. And at the temple[c] he will set up an abomination that causes desolation, until the end that is decreed is poured out on him.[d]”[e]


[h=3]Daniel 9:27[/h]Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)



27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

 

[Timeline]

the abomination which makes desolate is a hebrew term. It does not fit your interpretation. it does not mean a place is left desolate. It mans, because of an UNCLEAN THING, or more literally an Idol (the abomination), something is made desolate.

Jesus mentions it in Matt 24. When you see the abomination (unclean thing) which makes desolate spoken of by daniel, standing in the holy place. in order for the abomination of desolation to be standing in the holy place. there must be a holy place for it to stand in. A destroyed temple and city has no holy place to abominate.

Well, you are almost there....The Holy place was destroyed in 70 AD....so that kind of puts a time frame on the events that we're discussing

PS Any place built in the future will not be "Holy" - whatever it is, or might be, Holy it will not be.