Sunday as the Lord's day is one of Satan's greatest deceptions...

[VCO]

I have carefully read all of these and the scripture from Leviticus is one I hadn't studied. I see scripture talking about meeting in these scriptures, even meetings with a special purpose, but I can not find in them that the day God blessed and told us to use as a day of rest is changed to the first day of the week. They talk of things to do that day, in Leviticus that 7 Sabbaths would have been completed and over with, but not to change the day God blessed.

When Christ became our High Priest to replace the former ones, Christ never changed anything He and His Father had set up as principles. Christ even told us He didn't, so we would see clearly what did change and how. But that Christ could change the day God blessed would be impossible.

We see by reading Paul that God isn't part of our earthly naming days, so if we think Sunday is the day he named God allows that. The church is convinced that they can name Sunday instead of Saturday, and it is OK with God as Paul tells us. But still, the legalistically correct Saturday is the day God blessed.

NO, I doubt if you READ THEM carefully, because it appears you skimmed over them without paying hardly any attention to what they say.

Hebrews 7:12 (NASB)
[SUP]12 [/SUP]For when the priesthood is changed, of necessity there takes place a change of law also.

And here is that Change.

Romans 14:5 (NKJV)
[SUP]5 [/SUP]One person esteems one day above another; another esteems every day alike. Let each be fully convinced in his own mind.


I can't believe how you Sabbath keepers, keep repeating the lie that was taught to you, based on someone's phobia about Antichrist religion, and thus you repeat the false claims that we changed the day of the Sabbath. NO WE DID NOT! Maybe the Catholic Church made a statement like that, but most of us Protestants NEVER NAMED A DAY TO WORSHIP, and certainly DO NOT believe Sunday is the Christian Sabbath. WHY? Because we believe we can worship any day of the week or everyday of the week, just like it says in the verse above. I am sure that most of the people on this board, other than you Sabbath Keepers, would tell you just like I do, "I worship my LORD EVERY DAY of the week, every time HE crosses my mind!" Why do you only worship Him on Saturday? And NOTICE you are commanded to Let us, because we are fully convinced in our minds that it is right and proper to Worship HIM any day, or EVERY DAY. You and me are both given the freedom in Christ to do any or all of the options. ONLY the Israelites were restricted to the Sabbath Day, Saturday, BECAUSE it was a sign of the Covenant between GOD and the Israelites.

Luke 22:20 (ESV)
[SUP]20 [/SUP] And likewise the cup after they had eaten, saying, “This cup that is poured out for you is the new covenant in my blood.

NOTICE: It says new covenant NOT improvement of the covenant with Israel.


Please, stop spreading the lie that we changed the Sabbath or named a different day to keep the Sabbath Commandment; because that is purely a FALSEHOOD. We believe we can worship any and every day of the week, and the primary reason for Sunday, is that is a day that most of us blue collar workers have off. Even those who have to work on Sundays, usually have other options and opportunities to Worship our LORD. Most Baptists, Non-denominational Community Bible Churches, and Conservative Evangelical Churches, and possibly other Churches too, have a Sunday evening Service (Second Day of the Week) and a Wednesday evening Service, as well as Sunday Morning Services. NO one that I have ever talked to or heard of personally, believe any of them are our way of keeping the Sabbath Law. Sabbath is Saturday, and is only mandated by GOD for the ISRAELITES TO KEEP. We are given it as one option, or we can choose to worship Him any or all days of the week.

Romans 14:5 (NKJV)
[SUP]5 [/SUP]One person esteems one day above another; another esteems every day alike. Let each be fully convinced in his own mind.

 

[iamsoandso]

Don't you think that Paul taught that it is the basic spirit of keeping Sabbath that counts, and we aren't to judge others on the way they express their love of the Lord by honoring the Sabbath God tells us of. Paul even said that man can choose the day of Sabbath, it is the spirit of keeping it that counts.

I really like the idea of allowing your entire self into honoring this day! I'll bet people laugh at those who go this far in their honor, but it is showing a way of doing every possible thing to express love of the Lord. Many will accuse them of not using their heart as they live this lifestyle, and there is a chance someone who does this does it as acts without their soul in it, but no one but God knows that. Even those just performing the act still will make people think about their Sabbath.

When people say that God cancelled the Sabbath, it is not doing anything about leading the world to God. This way is making a statement about their love of the Lord. Some will bring up that old "it won't save you, don't do it" they always say. It is like saying married people in love with each other may not hold hands.

quite so the point being if some buy land,and buy generators,if they dig water wells and plant gardens,if they prepare food and buy shotguns and hunt,,,all in the name of preparing a place where they can come to a standstill at sundown Friday and rest until sundown Saturday,,,,,,well another might say they dug themselves bunkers,and armed themselves,and stockpiled water and food because they hated someone so they,,ect. ect. ect. and the whole while they were "honoring the sabbath"???

 

[iamsoandso]

i must go to town for now I will return,,,,,,,,

 

[VCO]

Don't you think that Paul taught that it is the basic spirit of keeping Sabbath that counts, and we aren't to judge others on the way they express their love of the Lord by honoring the Sabbath God tells us of. Paul even said that man can choose the day of Sabbath, it is the spirit of keeping it that counts.

I really like the idea of allowing your entire self into honoring this day! I'll bet people laugh at those who go this far in their honor, but it is showing a way of doing every possible thing to express love of the Lord. Many will accuse them of not using their heart as they live this lifestyle, and there is a chance someone who does this does it as acts without their soul in it, but no one but God knows that. Even those just performing the act still will make people think about their Sabbath.

When people say that God cancelled the Sabbath, it is not doing anything about leading the world to God. This way is making a statement about their love of the Lord. Some will bring up that old "it won't save you, don't do it" they always say. It is like saying married people in love with each other may not hold hands.

Red, I owe you an apology, after re-reading my last post, it appears, I am the one that skimmed over your post, without pay close attention to what you actually said. Sorry.

I guess I have had too many in the past, just dogmatically say if you do not Keep the Sabbath, you are wrong and follow the Antichrist's religion. After slowing my brain down and rereading what you posted, I must admit you did a good job on the post, and it is I who did the poor job of reading. I apologize again.

I agree when people say GOD cancelled the Sabbath, they are wrong, it confuses people, and God is not the author of confusion. I see it says in Exodus that it will always be a sign of the covenant between God and the Israelites, PLUS it will always be a reminder that to not take time to honor, worship, and praise our LORD (No Matter What Day), will always be sin.

Romans 3:20 (ESV)
[SUP]20 [/SUP] For by works of the law no human being will be justified in his sight, since through the law comes knowledge of sin.

Good Job on the post, sorry I jumped to the wrong conclusion, and I certainly do respect your personal conviction to honor God on the Sabbath.

 

[Scuba]

Red, I owe you an apology, after re-reading my last post, it appears, I am the one that skimmed over your post, without pay close attention to what you actually said. Sorry.

I guess I have had too many in the past, just dogmatically say if you do not Keep the Sabbath, you are wrong and follow the Antichrist's religion. After slowing my brain down and rereading what you posted, I must admit you did a good job on the post, and it is I who did the poor job of reading. I apologize again.

I agree when people say GOD cancelled the Sabbath, they are wrong, it confuses people, and God is not the author of confusion. I see it says in Exodus that it will always be a sign of the covenant between God and the Israelites, PLUS it will always be a reminder that to not take time to honor, worship, and praise our LORD (No Matter What Day), will always be sin.

Romans 3:20 (ESV)
[SUP]20 [/SUP] For by works of the law no human being will be justified in his sight, since through the law comes knowledge of sin.

Good Job on the post, sorry I jumped to the wrong conclusion, and I certainly do respect your personal conviction to honor God on the Sabbath.

Nice bate and switch...

Worship is very important to those who are seeking it. Worship, no matter who or what you worship, will determine who or what you honor and who or what you will devote your life to.

Our behavior, as it relates to who or what we worship, will determine if we actually worship the who or what we worship.

If the god you worship tells you burn your children and you do it you are demonstrating an act of worship. If your god tells you to fly a plane into the World Trade Center killing thousands of people and you do it you are demonstrating an act of worship.

If the Creator of heaven and earth desires His creation to honor the seventh day because its holy, blessed and sanctified and you do it you are demonstrating an act of worship. If you honor any other day, in place of the seventh day, that act of worship is in vain.

Mark 7:7 And in vain they worship Me, teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.’

Matthew 15:3 Jesus answered and said to them, “Why do you also transgress the commandment of God because of your tradition?

"Sunday is founded, not of scripture, but on tradition, and is distinctly a Catholic institution. As there is no scripture for the transfer of the day of rest from the last to the first day of the week, Protestants ought to keep their Sabbath on Saturday and thus leave Catholics in full possession of Sunday." Catholic Record, September 17, 1893.

If you honor Sunday you are demonstrating an act of worship towards the papacy.

"The Bible says, Remember that thou keep holy the Sabbath day. The Catholic church says, No! By my divine power I abolish the Sabbath day, and command you to keep the first day of the week. And lo, the entire civilized world bows down in reverent obedience to the command of the holy Catholic church!" Father Enright, C.S.S.R. of the Redemptoral College, Kansas City, Mo., History of the Sabbath, p. 802

If you honor Friday you are honoring the god of Islam.

If you honor the seventh day you are honoring the God who created it.

Leviticus 23:3“‘ There are six days when you may work, but the seventh day is a day of Sabbath rest, a day of sacred assembly. You are not to do any work; wherever you live, it is a Sabbath to the Lord.

If you honor any other day you are demonstrating acts of self worship.

Romans 10:3 For they being ignorant of God’s righteousness, and seeking to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted to the righteousness of God.

 

[RedTent]

Please, stop spreading the lie that we changed the Sabbath or named a different day to keep the Sabbath Commandment; because that is purely a FALSEHOOD. We believe we can worship any and every day of the week, and the primary reason for Sunday, is that is a day that most of us blue collar workers have off.

And stop spreading that whoever does not read scripture exactly like you do is a liar. Saying such things condemns you to death, unless you take it to Jesus for forgiveness. Most churches have named the day to keep Sabbath as Sunday. This is no excuse for saying your interpretation is superior to anything else, and you are free to kill, main, and tear at anyone who says that you worship on Sunday. Scripture says that you are a murderer for judging me a liar and accusing me.

 

[RedTent]

Red, I owe you an apology, after re-reading my last post, it appears, I am the one that skimmed over your post, without pay close attention to what you actually said. Sorry.

I guess I have had too many in the past, just dogmatically say if you do not Keep the Sabbath, you are wrong and follow the Antichrist's religion. After slowing my brain down and rereading what you posted, I must admit you did a good job on the post, and it is I who did the poor job of reading. I apologize again.

I agree when people say GOD cancelled the Sabbath, they are wrong, it confuses people, and God is not the author of confusion. I see it says in Exodus that it will always be a sign of the covenant between God and the Israelites, PLUS it will always be a reminder that to not take time to honor, worship, and praise our LORD (No Matter What Day), will always be sin.

Romans 3:20 (ESV)
[SUP]20 [/SUP] For by works of the law no human being will be justified in his sight, since through the law comes knowledge of sin.

Good Job on the post, sorry I jumped to the wrong conclusion, and I certainly do respect your personal conviction to honor God on the Sabbath.

Oh My, did you bring me to my knees!! We are agreeing, but it is OK to disagree, too. It takes two people close to each other to be able to disagree about something, without it touching their basic togetherness. We are in the same family both listening to our Father.

Thank you so very much.

 

[VCO]

​

Nice bate and switch...



"Sunday is founded, not of scripture, but on tradition, and is distinctly a Catholic institution. As there is no scripture for the transfer of the day of rest from the last to the first day of the week, Protestants ought to keep their Sabbath on Saturday and thus leave Catholics in full possession of Sunday." Catholic Record, September 17, 1893.

If you honor Sunday you are demonstrating an act of worship towards the papacy.

"The Bible says, Remember that thou keep holy the Sabbath day. The Catholic church says, No! By my divine power I abolish the Sabbath day, and command you to keep the first day of the week. And lo, the entire civilized world bows down in reverent obedience to the command of the holy Catholic church!" Father Enright, C.S.S.R. of the Redemptoral College, Kansas City, Mo., History of the Sabbath, p. 802

If you honor Friday you are honoring the god of Islam.

. . ..

Now that is impossible, because I have never heard of those quotes. Have any of you other protestants who worship on Sunday, heard of those quotes? Do any of you Protestants believe in bowing the Pope?

Sadly I guess that makes your accusations false accusations, and totally lacking in love.

I guess that validates you did not read my post #31 either.

My turn:

Proverbs 15:12 (NKJV)
[SUP]12 [/SUP] A scoffer does not love one who corrects him, Nor will he go to the wise.

Romans 5:5 (NKJV)
[SUP]5 [/SUP] Now hope does not disappoint, because the love of God has been poured out in our hearts by the Holy Spirit who was given to us.

1 Corinthians 13:4-5 (NASB)
[SUP]4 [/SUP] Love is patient, love is kind and is not jealous; love does not brag and is not arrogant,
[SUP]5 [/SUP] does not act unbecomingly; it does not seek its own, is not provoked, does not take into account a wrong suffered,

1 John 4:20 (ESV)
[SUP]20 [/SUP] If anyone says, “I love God,” and hates his brother, he is a liar; for he who does not love his brother whom he has seen cannot love God whom he has not seen.

1 John 4:8 (NIV)
[SUP]8 [/SUP] Whoever does not love does not know God, because God is love.

1 John 3:10 (HCSB)
[SUP]10 [/SUP] This is how God’s children—and the Devil’s children—are made evident. Whoever does not do what is right is not of God, especially the one who does not love his brother.

1 John 4:11 (NIV)
[SUP]11 [/SUP] Dear friends, since God so loved us, we also ought to love one another.

How can there be so little love in you?

Please come to repentance, admitting to God that your anger and bitterness is sin. Please, out of LOVE for Christ, surrender complete control of yourself to HIM as Lord and Master.

Matthew 5:9 (ESV)
[SUP]9 [/SUP] “Blessed are the peacemakers, for they shall be called sons of God.

Proverbs 6:16-19 (ASV)
[SUP]16 [/SUP] There are six things which Jehovah hateth; Yea, seven which are an abomination unto him:
[SUP]17 [/SUP] Haughty eyes, a lying tongue, And hands that shed innocent blood;
[SUP]18 [/SUP] A heart that deviseth wicked purposes, Feet that are swift in running to mischief,
[SUP]19 [/SUP] A false witness that uttereth lies, And he that soweth discord among brethren.

Titus 3:10 (NIV)
[SUP]10 [/SUP] Warn a divisive person once, and then warn him a second time. After that, have nothing to do with him.

I am sure I went way past that, I hope you do not mind if I stop reading your posts.

 

[Scuba]

​

Now that is impossible, because I have never heard of those quotes. Have any of you other protestants who worship on Sunday, heard of those quotes? Do any of you Protestants believe in bowing the Pope?

Sadly I guess that makes your accusations false accusations, and totally lacking in love.

I guess that validates you did not read my post #31 either.

My turn:

Proverbs 15:12 (NKJV)
[SUP]12 [/SUP] A scoffer does not love one who corrects him, Nor will he go to the wise.

Romans 5:5 (NKJV)
[SUP]5 [/SUP] Now hope does not disappoint, because the love of God has been poured out in our hearts by the Holy Spirit who was given to us.

1 Corinthians 13:4-5 (NASB)
[SUP]4 [/SUP] Love is patient, love is kind and is not jealous; love does not brag and is not arrogant,
[SUP]5 [/SUP] does not act unbecomingly; it does not seek its own, is not provoked, does not take into account a wrong suffered,

1 John 4:20 (ESV)
[SUP]20 [/SUP] If anyone says, “I love God,” and hates his brother, he is a liar; for he who does not love his brother whom he has seen cannot love God whom he has not seen.

1 John 4:8 (NIV)
[SUP]8 [/SUP] Whoever does not love does not know God, because God is love.

1 John 3:10 (HCSB)
[SUP]10 [/SUP] This is how God’s children—and the Devil’s children—are made evident. Whoever does not do what is right is not of God, especially the one who does not love his brother.

1 John 4:11 (NIV)
[SUP]11 [/SUP] Dear friends, since God so loved us, we also ought to love one another.

How can there be so little love in you?

Please come to repentance, admitting to God that your anger and bitterness is sin. Please, out of LOVE for Christ, surrender complete control of yourself to HIM as Lord and Master.

Matthew 5:9 (ESV)
[SUP]9 [/SUP] “Blessed are the peacemakers, for they shall be called sons of God.

Proverbs 6:16-19 (ASV)
[SUP]16 [/SUP] There are six things which Jehovah hateth; Yea, seven which are an abomination unto him:
[SUP]17 [/SUP] Haughty eyes, a lying tongue, And hands that shed innocent blood;
[SUP]18 [/SUP] A heart that deviseth wicked purposes, Feet that are swift in running to mischief,
[SUP]19 [/SUP] A false witness that uttereth lies, And he that soweth discord among brethren.

Titus 3:10 (NIV)
[SUP]10 [/SUP] Warn a divisive person once, and then warn him a second time. After that, have nothing to do with him.

I am sure I went way past that, I hope you do not mind if I stop reading your posts.

I'm just sharing truth whether you receive it as hatred or love that's up to you. Receiving God's truth as hatred is a common thing today.

 

[Dan58]

I take it that you did not read my post #31.

I did read it, and nothing I wrote contradicted any of the verses you listed.

 

[VCO]

I'm just sharing truth whether you receive it as hatred or love that's up to you. Receiving God's truth as hatred is a common thing today.

That is the point Scuba, it is not the Truth, and I know it, because the mind of the Christ is in me, and HIS Spirit dwells in me. You only know the erroneous fact that you were taught, I know HIM, and I KNOW what we believe, and it is not what you were taught that we believe. I need to kick the dust from my feet now, and go on to someone else.

bye

 

[VCO]

The Lord's Day is not Sunday, the first day of the week is just when Christ resurrected. The "Day of the Lord" is a reference to his return, as it begins a 1000 year period (millennium) when Satan will be locked-up. So imo, Sunday is not the Lord's day, Sunday is not and has never been the Sabbath, nor does it have anything to do with Satan.

The sabbath day was created for man, but only until the Lord of the Sabbath was given for man. Our spiritual rest was fulfilled in Christ, it is no longer a shadow of something to come. Our Sabbath rest is not something to hope for in the future, nor is it something past to call into remembrance, but its a daily reality and alive in Christ. The Lord of the Sabbath is our permanent rest, not Saturday or Sunday. JMO

Dan, you have to hear with spiritual ears. You only get them when you are born again. That happens after we are convicted of sin to our very core, and we cry out to the Lord begging for forgiveness, and out LOVE we willingly surrender control of our life to Jesus Christ as our LORD and Master.

1 Corinthians 2:12-13 (ESV)
[SUP]12 [/SUP] Now we have received not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, that we might understand the things freely given us by God.
[SUP]13 [/SUP] And we impart this in words not taught by human wisdom but taught by the Spirit, interpreting spiritual truths to those who are spiritual.

The Day of the LORD, is NOT what is Called the Lord's Day. You were right in that the Day of the LORD is linked to the LORD's Second Coming. Whether John used the phrase "the Lord's Day" first or whether others used it before him, is unclear. Because, we ONLY HAVE THE HIGHLIGHTS of their ministry as Apostles, just like we only have the highlights of the the ministry of Jesus:

John 20:30 (ESV)
[SUP]30 [/SUP] Now Jesus did many other signs in the presence of the disciples, which are not written in this book;

John 21:25 (ESV)
[SUP]25 [/SUP] Now there are also many other things that Jesus did. Were every one of them to be written, I suppose that the world itself could not contain the books that would be written.

LORD’S DAYDesignation for Sunday, the first day of the week, used only once in the NT (Rev. 1:10). The Greek word for “Lord’s,” however, is precisely the same as that used in the term for “Lord’s Supper” (1 Cor. 11:20). In fact, the Didache, an early Christian manual for worship and instruction, links the two terms together, indicating that the Lord’s Supper was observed each Lord’s Day (14:1). Herein may lie the origin of the term. Because the first day of the week was the day on which the early Christians celebrated the Lord’s Supper, it became known as the Lord’s Day, the distinctively Christian day of worship.
The earliest account of a first-day worship experience is found in Acts 20:7-12. Here Paul joined the Christians of Troas on the evening of the first day of the week for the breaking of bread (probably a reference to the Lord’s Supper). The actual day is somewhat uncertain. Evening of the first day could refer to Saturday evening (by Jewish reckoning) or to Sunday evening (by Roman reckoning). Since the incident involved Gentiles on Gentile soil, however, the probable reference is to Sunday night.
The importance of Sunday to first-century Christians is also intimated in 1 Cor. 16:1-2. Giving instructions about a special relief offering he wanted to take to the Christians in Jerusalem, Paul suggested that the Corinthians should set aside their weekly contributions on the first day of the week. Paul probably mentioned this day because he knew that his readers routinely assembled on that day for worship and that would be the logical time for them to set aside their offering.
Two other second-century documents also shed light on the significance of Lord’s Day for the early church. First, Ignatius in his Epistle to the Magnesians (about a.d. 110-117) stressed the importance of Lord’s Day by contrasting the worship done on that day with that formerly observed on the Sabbath (9:1). Second, Justin Martyr (ca. a.d. 150) wrote the first extant Christian description of a worship service. He noted that the early Sunday morning service began with baptism, included Scripture readings, expository preaching, and prayer, and then concluded with the observance of the Lord’s Supper (Apology 65-67).
First- and second-century Christian documents indicate that Sunday quickly became the standard day for Christian worship, but they do not explain how or why this change from Sabbath to Lord’s Day came about. The most obvious reason, of course, was the Resurrection of Jesus that took place on that first Lord’s Day.

Holman Illustrated Bible Dictionary.

The Day of the Lord begins with the Calling out of the Bride to go to the Wedding of the Lamb. It can also be a reference to the the Great Day of His Wrath Rev. 6:17, most certainly includes the events of the Second Coming, and if it is referring the fact that a day is as a thousand years to GOD, it could even include the thousand year Kingdom and maybe even Judgement Day. In that case, the Day of the Lord refers to when the LORD will be in charge, compared to the Day of Man and Satan were in charge.



1 Corinthians 1:7-8 (ESV)
[SUP]7 [/SUP] so that you are not lacking in any gift, as you wait for the revealing of our Lord Jesus Christ,
[SUP]8 [/SUP] who will sustain you to the end, guiltless in the day of our Lord Jesus Christ.

Currently we are living in the Day of Man, someday we will be living in the Day of the Lord.

 

[iamsoandso]

So NOW in all your mixed up scripture, Paul has become a gentile? And on top of THAT, you actually have the nerve to infer that Paul is not scripture, he is an early church leader!! Have you even heard of Origen, Clement, or Ignatius?

As we know Ignatius wrote his letters to the early church that is there are letters he wrote to the apostle John, and to Mary the mother of Jesus. We also know from several of his letters both he and polycarp were disciples of John the apostle,,,so I suppose the opinions of Ignatius on matters concerning the Sabbath and the lords day to be sound?

 

[iamsoandso]

Maybe it would be best if I clearly state the matter,that is as for the o.p. it ask if there were an scripture that would provide proof that it was taught that Sunday was followed in behalf of the lords Resurrection,and that the sabbath was no longer followed. So i watched and read along as to see where this might go and as time went along the matter of the early church see's,bishops ect. were brought up. This I did not see to bring forth at first because there are many who are offended by these,but in the affect that they are brought into the matter I will further the matter.

Ignatius,as far as we know from early church records was made See of the church of Antioch by Peter the apostle himself(so he has peters endorsement) and we also have letters that he(Ignatius) wrote to John the apostle,so he was known to be a disciple,and See/Bishop of the early church(up to 117ad),,,

Now we know from his letters that he was also friends with Polycarp/Polycarpus who we also know was one who was a hearer of the apostle John while he was alive and that afterward he(Polycarp) became the bishop of Smyrna. So it it very well documented and understood that both Peter and John knew and taught Ignatius,and that John new and taught Polycarp.

Now in 2014 we are at odds as to weather yes or no of the original manner that the church Taught as to the manner of the sabbath and the day of the lord,That is there are now many who say this and many who say that as to which to adhere to.
Here though may quite well be a glimpse into the past where we might set hold to something with our spirits hands and find that it might not be something we should need gut instinct to Judge but rather something more conclusive. There is the hurdle we would need to cross, namely the formation of the R.C.C.(but this is of no difference),,that is if we consider that Constantine had not yet decreed the Roman empire christian and the R.C.C. had not yet emerged.

So then Ignatius was dead by most accounts by ad117(150+ or-) years before Rome became christian. So as for Ignatius it seems was not effected by the teaching of the R.C.C.(he was dead before it rose),and was exclusively influenced by Peter and john(that we can prove,and maybe others),but the issue then is that what was taught to him by these two(peter and John),,would be reflected in his epistles.

So then it is as if we can peer into this ancient manner of thinking that is unless we consider Ignatius as turning from the truth. But again we have that Peter appointed him as the See of Antioch(so Peter endorsed him),,So what did Ignatius say about the Sabbath? CHURCH FATHERS: Epistle to the Magnesians (St. Ignatius) (let us direct our attention to ch.8,9,10),,,,,

And after we consider his opinion,let us consider chapter 15 and that he also states that Polycarp also sent his greetings(so he was present and aware of what was being written),,and that this letter was being written from "Ephesus",(ch 15) which was delivered the Gospel by Paul.,,,

 

[thecreationtutor]

Doesn't this post assume that you are to follow the Law for salvation - which in itself is Satanic?

 

[thecreationtutor]

Doesn't this post assume that you are to follow the Law for salvation - which in itself is Satanic?

oh no, I am not saying that - then shut up

 

[iamsoandso]

Doesn't this post assume that you are to follow the Law for salvation - which in itself is Satanic?

I think this post as the many of like manner is of the nature where mankind(current) are at odds as to whether or not to follow the sabbath and the law. Now I notice that there are letters in the early church(beginning to 114ad) that do give their position on the matter. On the other hand this view is said to have it's origin in the Roman Catholic church,that is on march 7th 321 Constantine did issue a decree as to this Sabbath in seventh-day churches - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (it is under "history" in the article),,

But this is to assert that the R.C.C. was the first to change this i.e. we here it said that "the Catholic church changed this to Sunday",,,The main issue is though in the fact that Ignatius wrote the epistle to Magnesians in about 110ad 211 years before the decree was issued by Constantine. So the main issue is if the early church adhered to this after the church was founded and if so did only the Jews or did also the gentiles follow the sabbath and the law. That is as we know from (Deuteronomy 5;2-3) the law received at Horeb was not given to their(the Hebrews) fathers i.e. Abraham,Issac,Jacob but only to those children who were led out of bondage in Egypt.

Now we have Galatians,Ephesians,Act's ect. to try to find the answer from but also bearing in mind that Ignatius wrote the letter to the Magnesians from Ephesus(church established by Paul) and that he was appointed See by Peter at Antioch and according to the epistle to magnesia polycarp(disciple of John) was present and understanding what Ignatius had written sent his greetings also(ch. 15 letter to the Magniesians from Ignatius) then it should be possible to see that Ignatius,polycarp,the Ephesians,the churches in Smyrna and the church at Antioch all followed after the manner Ignatius stated in chapter's 8,9,10,11 of his letter to magnesia.

This I think is very critical to determining the matter,that is from ad67(when Paul died) until ad110 (when the letter to the magnesians was written) is only 43 years. It is believed that the apostle John died in Ephesus after ad96 so again the math is within 14 years of the apostle John. So it is very possible that both Ignatius and polycarp(disciples of john from tradition/letters ect.) both were taught this by john,peter, or other apostles i.e.(Phillips 3 daughters are also buried at Ephesus).

There is also the fact that he(Ignatius) wrote this letter and polycarp if he did not agree would have spoken ill of Ignatius if he disagreed with the statements in 8.9.10.11 of the letter. If we look at maps of the area "7 churches in Asia" it is no coincidence that John would be in the area (rev.1;4) states that the Revelation was directed to these 7 churches and they are named in rev. chapters 2-3. So it would only make sense that after John received the Revelation that he then would deliver this to these churches(notice again John,Ignatius,and polycarp are in the same location),,,,

So where did this teaching originate,was it from men after the formation of the R.C.C. or was it being taught from the beginning? That is we can read and study the letters in the new testament(seems we are in a deadlock over the issue) that is we show scripture stating one point of view,then another arguing the other point of view. Well then again if we use the letter of Ignatius to the Magniesians then it is apparent that in the first 43-44 years after Peter and Paul died(ad66-67) this is what was being taught from Ephesus by the See's,bishops of the churches and that John also was present +or- 10 years.,,,so where is it's origin?,,,,

 

[iamsoandso]

I mentioned "Phillip,his daughters" i do this to show the whereabouts of these people and that they were all in the same area I should tho offer more information on them CATHOLIC ENCYCLOPEDIA: St. Philip the Apostle if we look at the map the grave of Phillip is not far from the same places mentioned Hierapolis - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia so it is provable that he also was there among these same people and so should be considered also.

 

[Dan58]

The Day of the Lord begins with the Calling out of the Bride to go to the Wedding of the Lamb. It can also be a reference to the the Great Day of His Wrath Rev. 6:17, most certainly includes the events of the Second Coming, and if it is referring the fact that a day is as a thousand years to GOD, it could even include the thousand year Kingdom and maybe even Judgement Day. In that case, the Day of the Lord refers to when the LORD will be in charge, compared to the Day of Man and Satan were in charge.

Currently we are living in the Day of Man, someday we will be living in the Day of the Lord.

Yeah, that's what I said.. "The "Day of the Lord" is a reference to his return"

We are essentially saying the same thing, I just said it much more simplistically. I do disagree that the Lord's Day and the Day of the Lord have separate meanings, I believe they refer to the same thing.

 

[VCO]

Yeah, that's what I said.. "The "Day of the Lord" is a reference to his return"

We are essentially saying the same thing, I just said it much more simplistically. I do disagree that the Lord's Day and the Day of the Lord have separate meanings, I believe they refer to the same thing.

No, the Lord's Day is a specific day of every week:

Revelation 1:10-11 (KJV)
[SUP]10 [/SUP] I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet,
[SUP]11 [/SUP] Saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and, What thou seest, write in a book, and send it unto the seven churches which are in Asia; unto Ephesus, and unto Smyrna, and unto Pergamos, and unto Thyatira, and unto Sardis, and unto Philadelphia, and unto Laodicea.


See, it is NOT the time of the Second Coming at all. It is PRIOR to John even putting the pen to the paper and writing the Book of Revelation. John was wholeheartedly filled with the Spirit, in his weekly worship when the Holy Spirit, when Christ gave Him this vision. Was John to first to give the term "the Lord's Day", to the weekly celebration of Christ's Resurrection? We have no idea because we only have the major highlights in the Bible. NOT a complete, event by event documented history:

John 21:25 (KJV)
[SUP]25 [/SUP] And there are also many other things which Jesus did, the which, if they should be written every one, I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that should be written. Amen.