Hell

[dcontroversal]

Not really. You just don't understand what Christ was teaching in the parable. Actually, to cut to the chase, Christ gave His last warning to the Jews that if they didn't accept Him, He was going to turn salvation unto the Gentiles. He did this shortly after speaking the warning to them when they killed Steven.

Friend, if anyone is burning in your Hell he/she is totally unaware of it and is feeling no pain at all because his/her mind is totally gone as many scriptures so state.

You really believe our God to be even more heinous than Hitler, Stalin, or Pol Pot? Amazing. Don't feel bad, a lot of folks do. I wonder what answer they will give if He ever asks them why they think Christ failed in his mission or why they assaulted His personal character?

Your statement proves your ignorance of the bible that you say you study.....or maybe you trust into the Watch Tower heresy...are you a JW? If not you hold to their doctrine so...if you choose to believe that Jesus was misleading here and or using deceit to teach than you are completely ignorant of the fact that Jesus SPOKE truth ever time he spoke and never once used deceit...so....whatever dude and your mouthy comment about hearing this before I was born proves nothing as Jobs three oldest friends were rebuked by God for not knowing anything while the YOUNGEST had it right so....good luck with your false view...serious!

 

[skoobie]

Well first off we need to see what the Bible says: (note I put key words in bold)

Isaiah 28:10 For precept must be upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little:

The Bible tells us how to study here a little there a little verse upon verse or word upon word till you receive a clear picture. So first let us find out what a soul is.

Psalms 111:10 The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom: a good understanding have all they that do his commandments: his praise endureth for ever.

Where is the beginning of the Bible Genesis of course!

Gen_2:7 And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.
Job 33:6 Behold, I am according to thy wish in God's stead: I also am formed out of the clay.

So God formed man from dust + water = clay + breath = A living SOUL
Notice God did not give man a soul those three elements: SOLID LIQUID and GAS make up a SOUL
Well what happens if you remove one of those elements you? That's right die

Let's see what the Bible says first about what happens when you die

Gen_3:19 In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return.

So where see here in the first book of the Bible again, what happens when die two of the three life giving elements have been removed.

Ecc 9:5 For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten.

Solomon clearly tells us what happens when you die. In fact who was the one that said you won't die if you disobey God?

Gen 3:2 And the woman said unto the serpent, We may eat of the fruit of the trees of the garden:
Gen 3:3 But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said, Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die.
Gen 3:4 And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:
Gen 3:5 For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.

The serpent was the one that has deceived man into thinking the soul is immortal.

So who is the Serpent?

Rev_12:9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

So we can see here just by a few text the Bible clear states that you do not go to heaven upon death, if you did don't you think Lazarus would have said something or been upstate for being pulled out of heaven to come back to this sinful world?

Now that we can see you don't go to heaven at death is that all or does the Bible tell us more?

Dan_12:2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.

Sleep in the Bible is also a reference to death.

Joh 11:11-14 These things said he: and after that he saith unto them, Our friend Lazarus sleepeth; but I go, that I may awake him out of sleep. Then said his disciples, Lord, if he sleep, he shall do well. Howbeit Jesus spake of his death: but they thought that he had spoken of taking of rest in sleep. Then said Jesus unto them plainly, Lazarus is dead.

We can see here the Bible talks about death as a sleep why? Because sleep you wake up from and clearly in Dan 12:2 it says that some awake to everlasting life and some to shame and everlasting contempt. Now everlasting in the Bible doesn't mean the punishment is forever just the result.

Rom_6:23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Notice the Bible says the wages of sin is death... not everlasting hell fire. In fact Satan has turned Hell fire on its head. What do I mean well let's see what the Bible has to say:

Eze 28:14 Thou art the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire.

This chapter of Ezekiel is talking about Lucifer and where was Lucifer before his fall. Well upon the holy mountain of God walking up and down in midst of the stones of fire. So obviously Lucifer wasn't in hell. We have to see what the Bible says these stones are?

1Pe 2:3-5 If so be ye have tasted that the Lord is gracious. To whom coming, as unto a living stone, disallowed indeed of men, but chosen of God, and precious, Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ.

The living stone is Jesus Christ and those that follow Christ are lively stones! Any created being that follows the laws of God are consider stones. Was Lucifer walking in the midst of Angels? So what about fire well again let the Bible be it's own interpreter.

Heb 12:29 For our God is a consuming fire.
1Jn 4:8 He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love.

The Bible symbolizes God's love as fire! Lucifer was walking up and down in the midst of angels that loved God!

We can see that the Bible shows us that some will awake to everlasting life and some to shame and everlasting contempt
That word contempt just means curse.

Isa_23:9 The LORD of hosts hath purposed it, to stain the pride of all glory, and to bring into contempt all the honourable of the earth.

Pro_11:2 When pride cometh, then cometh shame: but with the lowly is wisdom.

We can see here that pride is the cause of contempt or curse and notice the punishment for the wicked is "shame and contempt" not just contempt. We can see in Pro 11:2 that pride cometh then shame.

What is shame again let's go to the Bible:

In Rev 3 Christ is addressing His last Church and one of the problems is nakedness

Rev_3:18 I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see.

Gen 3:7 And the eyes of them both were opened, and they knew that they were naked; and they sewed fig leaves together, and made themselves aprons.
Gen 3:10-11 And he said, I heard thy voice in the garden, and I was afraid, because I was naked; and I hid myself. And he said, Who told thee that thou wast naked? Hast thou eaten of the tree, whereof I commanded thee that thou shouldest not eat?

They only knew they were naked after they sinned because in Genesis 2 it says,

Gen_2:25 And they were both naked, the man and his wife, and were not ashamed.

So sin is what causes us shame.

Num_32:23 But if ye will not do so, behold, ye have sinned against the LORD: and be sure your sin will find you out.

God is just telling us here that one day your shame or sin will be open to the world. What is the curse of sin

Again let the Bible answer:

Eze_18:20 The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.

Notice here the Bible does not say sleep it says die!

The wages of sin is death so the wicked are reserved for a judgement day!

Job_21:30 That the wicked is reserved to the day of destruction? they shall be brought forth to the day of wrath.

2Pe_2:4 For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment;

2Pe_3:7 But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.

It is God's love (fire) that puts wicked man to rest. Why because He knows that heaven would be an everlasting torment to them.

Eze_33:11 Say unto them, As I live, saith the Lord GOD, I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked; but that the wicked turn from his way and live: turn ye, turn ye from your evil ways; for why will ye die, O house of Israel?

It's not something God wants to do, but He has giving man probationary time to make their choice.

I hope this helps

Peter

 

[tonto]

Your statement proves your ignorance of the bible that you say you study.....or maybe you trust into the Watch Tower heresy...are you a JW? If not you hold to their doctrine so...if you choose to believe that Jesus was misleading here and or using deceit to teach than you are completely ignorant of the fact that Jesus SPOKE truth ever time he spoke and never once used deceit...so....whatever dude and your mouthy comment about hearing this before I was born proves nothing as Jobs three oldest friends were rebuked by God for not knowing anything while the YOUNGEST had it right so....good luck with your false view...serious!

I get it. Everyone who fails to believe in your own brand of hell-fire and damnation is a cult? Right.

Since you brought up Job, why not read where he said he would wait in his grave until his change comes and where he said his sons came to visit but that he perceived it not.

Get the log out of your own eye before you spot the splinter in another's. Your brand of hate religion has cost many a man's salvation.

 

[tonto]

Well first off we need to see what the Bible says: (note I put key words in bold)

Isaiah 28:10 For precept must be upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little:

The Bible tells us how to study here a little there a little verse upon verse or word upon word till you receive a clear picture. So first let us find out what a soul is.

Psalms 111:10 The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom: a good understanding have all they that do his commandments: his praise endureth for ever.

Where is the beginning of the Bible Genesis of course!

Gen_2:7 And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.
Job 33:6 Behold, I am according to thy wish in God's stead: I also am formed out of the clay.

So God formed man from dust + water = clay + breath = A living SOUL
Notice God did not give man a soul those three elements: SOLID LIQUID and GAS make up a SOUL
Well what happens if you remove one of those elements you? That's right die

Let's see what the Bible says first about what happens when you die

Gen_3:19 In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return.

So where see here in the first book of the Bible again, what happens when die two of the three life giving elements have been removed.

Ecc 9:5 For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten.

Solomon clearly tells us what happens when you die. In fact who was the one that said you won't die if you disobey God?

Gen 3:2 And the woman said unto the serpent, We may eat of the fruit of the trees of the garden:
Gen 3:3 But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said, Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die.
Gen 3:4 And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:
Gen 3:5 For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.

The serpent was the one that has deceived man into thinking the soul is immortal.

So who is the Serpent?

Rev_12:9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

So we can see here just by a few text the Bible clear states that you do not go to heaven upon death, if you did don't you think Lazarus would have said something or been upstate for being pulled out of heaven to come back to this sinful world?

Now that we can see you don't go to heaven at death is that all or does the Bible tell us more?

Dan_12:2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.

Sleep in the Bible is also a reference to death.

Joh 11:11-14 These things said he: and after that he saith unto them, Our friend Lazarus sleepeth; but I go, that I may awake him out of sleep. Then said his disciples, Lord, if he sleep, he shall do well. Howbeit Jesus spake of his death: but they thought that he had spoken of taking of rest in sleep. Then said Jesus unto them plainly, Lazarus is dead.

We can see here the Bible talks about death as a sleep why? Because sleep you wake up from and clearly in Dan 12:2 it says that some awake to everlasting life and some to shame and everlasting contempt. Now everlasting in the Bible doesn't mean the punishment is forever just the result.

Rom_6:23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Notice the Bible says the wages of sin is death... not everlasting hell fire. In fact Satan has turned Hell fire on its head. What do I mean well let's see what the Bible has to say:

Eze 28:14 Thou art the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire.

This chapter of Ezekiel is talking about Lucifer and where was Lucifer before his fall. Well upon the holy mountain of God walking up and down in midst of the stones of fire. So obviously Lucifer wasn't in hell. We have to see what the Bible says these stones are?

1Pe 2:3-5 If so be ye have tasted that the Lord is gracious. To whom coming, as unto a living stone, disallowed indeed of men, but chosen of God, and precious, Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ.

The living stone is Jesus Christ and those that follow Christ are lively stones! Any created being that follows the laws of God are consider stones. Was Lucifer walking in the midst of Angels? So what about fire well again let the Bible be it's own interpreter.

Heb 12:29 For our God is a consuming fire.
1Jn 4:8 He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love.

The Bible symbolizes God's love as fire! Lucifer was walking up and down in the midst of angels that loved God!

We can see that the Bible shows us that some will awake to everlasting life and some to shame and everlasting contempt
That word contempt just means curse.

Isa_23:9 The LORD of hosts hath purposed it, to stain the pride of all glory, and to bring into contempt all the honourable of the earth.

Pro_11:2 When pride cometh, then cometh shame: but with the lowly is wisdom.

We can see here that pride is the cause of contempt or curse and notice the punishment for the wicked is "shame and contempt" not just contempt. We can see in Pro 11:2 that pride cometh then shame.

What is shame again let's go to the Bible:

In Rev 3 Christ is addressing His last Church and one of the problems is nakedness

Rev_3:18 I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see.

Gen 3:7 And the eyes of them both were opened, and they knew that they were naked; and they sewed fig leaves together, and made themselves aprons.
Gen 3:10-11 And he said, I heard thy voice in the garden, and I was afraid, because I was naked; and I hid myself. And he said, Who told thee that thou wast naked? Hast thou eaten of the tree, whereof I commanded thee that thou shouldest not eat?

They only knew they were naked after they sinned because in Genesis 2 it says,

Gen_2:25 And they were both naked, the man and his wife, and were not ashamed.

So sin is what causes us shame.

Num_32:23 But if ye will not do so, behold, ye have sinned against the LORD: and be sure your sin will find you out.

God is just telling us here that one day your shame or sin will be open to the world. What is the curse of sin

Again let the Bible answer:

Eze_18:20 The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.

Notice here the Bible does not say sleep it says die!

The wages of sin is death so the wicked are reserved for a judgement day!

Job_21:30 That the wicked is reserved to the day of destruction? they shall be brought forth to the day of wrath.

2Pe_2:4 For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment;

2Pe_3:7 But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.

It is God's love (fire) that puts wicked man to rest. Why because He knows that heaven would be an everlasting torment to them.

Eze_33:11 Say unto them, As I live, saith the Lord GOD, I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked; but that the wicked turn from his way and live: turn ye, turn ye from your evil ways; for why will ye die, O house of Israel?

It's not something God wants to do, but He has giving man probationary time to make their choice.

I hope this helps

Peter

I doubt if it will. Some folks will never accept what the Bible plainly says. They judge and they condemn. They refuse to leave it up to the Christ to judge at either the judgment seat or at the Great White Throne judgment, they must do it now.

 

[JesusIsAll]

Your brand of hate religion has cost many a man's salvation.

So, now what the Bible clearly teaches is hate religion.

 

[tonto]

Another problem if we understand the story of Lazarus and the rich man as an actual event is that it contradicts other Scriptures. Jesus said that the rich man was in Hades. The story says that the rich man was conscious, felt pain, communicated, had emotions, and could reason. However, the Old Testament says exactly the opposite.

18 For the grave cannot praise thee, death can not celebrate thee: they that go down into the pit cannot hope for thy truth. (Isa 38:18 KJV)

10 Wilt thou shew wonders to the dead? shall the dead arise and praise thee? Selah. (Psa 88:10 KJV)

5 For in death there is no remembrance of thee: in the grave who shall give thee thanks? (Psa 6:5 KJV)

17 The dead praise not the LORD, neither any that go down into silence.
18 But we will bless the LORD from this time forth and for evermore. Praise the LORD. (Psa 115:17-18 KJV)

2 While I live will I praise the LORD: I will sing praises unto my God while I have any being.
3 Put not your trust in princes, nor in the son of man, in whom there is no help. {help: or, salvation}
4 His breath goeth forth, he returneth to his earth; in that very day his thoughts perish. (Psa 146:2-4 KJV)

3 This is an evil among all things that are done under the sun, that there is one event unto all: yea, also the heart of the sons of men is full of evil, and madness is in their heart while they live, and after that they go to the dead.
4 For to him that is joined to all the living there is hope: for a living dog is better than a dead lion.
5 For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten.
6 Also their love, and their hatred, and their envy, is now perished; neither have they any more a portion for ever in any thing that is done under the sun. (Ecc 9:3-6 KJV)

From these passages we can see that the dead, cannot praise God, know nothing, have no memory, have no thoughts, have no love or hatred, and have no memory of God. These passages show that the story of the rich man cannot be an actual event.

The problem with your post is that it is truth and came directly from the Scriptures. Such truth flies right in the face of the fundamentalist dogma such as the Baptists, therefore it must be discounted and other scriptures such as Lazarus and the Rich Man and the souls under the alter in Revelation and that Christ went and released a bunch of souls held captive in order to prove their false doctrines. The false doctrine folks can never accept plain truth.

 

[tonto]

So, now what the Bible clearly teaches is hate religion.

No. The Bible teaches truth to those of us who accept the truth as many scriptures have been posted which those of you who refuse to accept the truth could and should easily see. It is YOU who preach a hate religion - not Christ, not the Apostles, and not the Bible. YOU.

 

[dcontroversal]

I get it. Everyone who fails to believe in your own brand of hell-fire and damnation is a cult? Right.

Since you brought up Job, why not read where he said he would wait in his grave until his change comes and where he said his sons came to visit but that he perceived it not.

Get the log out of your own eye before you spot the splinter in another's. Your brand of hate religion has cost many a man's salvation.

I don't hate anything but heretical views....numerous scriptures prove the realities of hell and what is missed is the fact that all the scriptures that talk about the dead not knowing is indicative of them not knowing what is happening on the EARTH....so...I simply stated facts and your got mouthy about your age and my age so...if you choose to reject the truth have a ball dude! So are you a JW?

 

[dcontroversal]

So, now what the Bible clearly teaches is hate religion.

It does if you reject truth and get called out for it......It amazes me how many will trivialize the truth away and into some religious box.....MANY who reject a devil's hell where lost men will go to await the final judgment will be sorely surprised one day when they take their last breath and it moves to meet them at their coming!

 

[tonto]

I don't hate anything but heretical views....numerous scriptures prove the realities of hell and what is missed is the fact that all the scriptures that talk about the dead not knowing is indicative of them not knowing what is happening on the EARTH....so...I simply stated facts and your got mouthy about your age and my age so...if you choose to reject the truth have a ball dude! So are you a JW?

So now you claim there exists TWO sets of thoughts? LOL! There is ONE mind of a person - not two. If a man's thoughts perish as David said, then that man's thoughts perish - they do not exist somewhere else. Get real. Get out of Mother Goose.
No, I am not JW but why are you so hung up on hate? You seem to hate the SDA and the JW. Are you also a racist? Why all the hate?

 

[tonto]

It does if you reject truth and get called out for it......It amazes me how many will trivialize the truth away and into some religious box.....MANY who reject a devil's hell where lost men will go to await the final judgment will be sorely surprised one day when they take their last breath and it moves to meet them at their coming!

You're the one doing all the rejecting and spouting your hatred for everyone.

 

[Sola_Scriptura]

Dc, if an unsaved person goes to hell when they die, why are they raised in the 2nd resurrection to be judged and cast in the lake of fire if they were already judged at death and sent to hell? Same with the saved person. If they go to heaven at death, why have a resurrection to give them eternal life if they already have it when they die? I can't wait to hear an answer that has no Scripture attached.

God Bless

 

[JesusIsAll]

It does if you reject truth and get called out for it......It amazes me how many will trivialize the truth away and into some religious box.....MANY who reject a devil's hell where lost men will go to await the final judgment will be sorely surprised one day when they take their last breath and it moves to meet them at their coming!

They're indicting God now, His "hate religion." Atheists and much worse rabble line up behind them. But they're brainwashed cult parrots, who cling to their error, will meet God, as representatives of false prophets.

Proverbs 14:12 There is a way which seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death.

 

[CRC]

In the Bible, the Hebrew and Greek words often translated “hell” actually refer to the common grave of mankind. For example, when Job suffered a painful illness, he prayed: “I wish you would hide me in my grave [“in hell,” Douay-Rheims Version].” (Job 14:13, Holy Bible—Easy-to-Read Version) Job wanted to rest, not in a place of torment or alienation from God, but in the grave. And with regard to your family members that you are concerned about, the most beneficial thing you can do is to pray in their behalf, even mentioning them by name to the God of mercy. "Send out your bread on the waters" (Ecclesiastes 11:1) Never give up hope!!!

 

[dcontroversal]

Dc, if an unsaved person goes to hell when they die, why are they raised in the 2nd resurrection to be judged and cast in the lake of fire if they were already judged at death and sent to hell? Same with the saved person. If they go to heaven at death, why have a resurrection to give them eternal life if they already have it when they die? I can't wait to hear an answer that has no Scripture attached.

God Bless

Hell is the holding place of all who die not being found in Christ...the FINAL judgment based upon their works takes place at the Great White Throne Judgment when DEATH AND HELL deliver up the DEAD that is in them...BLESSED is HE upon whom the SECOND DEATH HATH NO POWER. Revelation 20

Jesus BRINGS THE DEAD IN CHRIST WITH HIM FROM WHERE EXACTLY......? I Corinthians 15 and 1st Thessalonians 4.....

Just because I don't post the scripture every time does NOT MEAN my ANSWERS are without BIBLICAL precedence!

 

[dcontroversal]

You're the one doing all the rejecting and spouting your hatred for everyone.

Never once said I hated you or anyone..so now your accusing and being led by who exactly?

 

[Butch5]

The problem with your post is that it is truth and came directly from the Scriptures. Such truth flies right in the face of the fundamentalist dogma such as the Baptists, therefore it must be discounted and other scriptures such as Lazarus and the Rich Man and the souls under the alter in Revelation and that Christ went and released a bunch of souls held captive in order to prove their false doctrines. The false doctrine folks can never accept plain truth.

Hi Tonto,

I think it's just that some aren't interested in investing the time that is necessary to root out the truth. Paul addressed this same thing in the Corinthian church.

18 For first of all, when you come together as a church, I hear that there are divisions among you, and in part I believe it.
19 For there must also be factions among you, that those who are approved may be recognized among you. (1Co 11:18-19 NKJ)

The word translated factions is actually the Greek word hairesis, heresies.

There are only a few passages that one can even use to attempt to support Eternal Conscious Torment, yet the passages that show the dead are dead are numerous. Even the passages that people use to argue ECT can be explained and understood differently than the ETC crowd is understanding them. I've explained several in this thread already, but, they all can be shown to not teach ECT.

 

[tonto]

Dc, if an unsaved person goes to hell when they die, why are they raised in the 2nd resurrection to be judged and cast in the lake of fire if they were already judged at death and sent to hell? Same with the saved person. If they go to heaven at death, why have a resurrection to give them eternal life if they already have it when they die? I can't wait to hear an answer that has no Scripture attached.

God Bless

There you go asking them something that requires common sense to answer. Careful though. You'll be called a heretic, an SDA, a JW, an atheist, and God only knows what other thing the hate mongers can dream up to call you. These have never heard of the First and Second Greatest Commandments.

 

[dcontroversal]

So now you claim there exists TWO sets of thoughts? LOL! There is ONE mind of a person - not two. If a man's thoughts perish as David said, then that man's thoughts perish - they do not exist somewhere else. Get real. Get out of Mother Goose.
No, I am not JW but why are you so hung up on hate? You seem to hate the SDA and the JW. Are you also a racist? Why all the hate?

A few errors here for sure...

1. If a lost man's soul is in hell cooking he cannot know what is happening on earth...
2. if a saved mans spirit is in heaven there is no way to know what is happening on the earth...
3. Never said a man had two minds so that was just ignorant
4. Never said I hated anyone so your accusations are not inspired by the Holy Spirit as the devil is the accuser of the brethren so...who actually leads you to accuse me of hate and reject the truth of the bible concerning HELL and the realities of it? NOT GOD for sure!


AND for SOLA..glad you like his accusations after your response to me concerning my post a few days ago about SBASS....dual nature there friend or maybe being inconsistent?

 

[tonto]

Hi Tonto,

I think it's just that some aren't interested in investing the time that is necessary to root out the truth. Paul addressed this same thing in the Corinthian church.

18 For first of all, when you come together as a church, I hear that there are divisions among you, and in part I believe it.
19 For there must also be factions among you, that those who are approved may be recognized among you. (1Co 11:18-19 NKJ)

The word translated factions is actually the Greek word hairesis, heresies.

There are only a few passages that one can even use to attempt to support Eternal Conscious Torment, yet the passages that show the dead are dead are numerous. Even the passages that people use to argue ECT can be explained and understood differently than the ETC crowd is understanding them. I've explained several in this thread already, but, they all can be shown to not teach ECT.

Now we know why Christ spoke to them in parables.