Playing 2 end against the middle. His attack was without provocation. This is the worst but not the first. LOL
see posts 509 and 510
see posts 509 and 510
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What did the Jew receive first?
- Thread starter just-me
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No day or, one day? What day is it, if there is a day? Since my calender says Saturday is Seventh day, then thats day i choose , if wrong it's done not knowing. we just need to please the LORD. Can that be agreed? So do what you think and know is pleasing to the LORD, and i'll do the same. Bless you all in Christ Jesus.
A true honest question. Didn't the Jewish nation start with Abraham? God asked Abraham to circumcise himself, his family males and then his whole male household servants and all as a covenant with God? Then Isaac would have been first born Jew?
I feel that once this question is answered then I could have a better shot at thinking about how I would answer the thread question. Sometimes even Blonds think...lol
I feel that once this question is answered then I could have a better shot at thinking about how I would answer the thread question. Sometimes even Blonds think...lol
Thanks for bringing the thread back on track. There was a dispute about whether Paul received the revelation of the mystery first (being the inclusion of the Gentiles into salvation) or did it come from the Jews first before the Gentiles that Paul was called to minister.
Jesus teaching His disciples in Mark 4:11 "And he said unto them, Unto you it is given to know the mystery of the kingdom of God: but unto them that are without, all these things are done in parables:"
The other thing that is obvious was that Peter was the first one to understand the inclusion of the Gentile with the Jews. Jesus ministered about this mystery of the kingdom to the 12 disciples, but Peter didn't comprehend that the Gentiles were included until his vision of all the unclean animals on the sheet from heaven until God said what He had made clean was clean. Then Peter went to Cornelius (a Gentile) in acts chapter 10. So we can see that the mystery of the kingdom had now been revealed to both the Jew and the Gentile before Paul's conversion.
Acts 10:44-48 and Acts 11:1
"While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word. And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished , as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost. For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter, Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we? And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then prayed they him to tarry certain days. And the apostles and brethren that were in Judaea heard that the Gentiles had also received the word of God.
The only thing Paul was told right after His conversion by Ananias was what he would have to suffer for the Lord's sake, but he also was enlightened of the spiritual truth in the law and the prophets, for he had studied those things long before he was blinded on the road to Damascus. This understanding enabled him to minister to the Gentiles proving Christ as the true Messiah and Savior to the world via this understanding of the Old Testament scriptures available at the time. We can see by Paul's writings to the Romans that the mystery was (and is) the plan of salvation through Christ Jesus that was perceived and conceived by God the Father and the Son before creation. Colossians 1:12-20
Romans 16:25-27
25 Now to him that is of power to stablish you according to my gospel, and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery, which was kept secret since the world began,
26 But now is made manifest , and by the scriptures of the prophets, according to the commandment of the everlasting God, made known to all nations for the obedience of faith:
27 To God only wise, be glory through Jesus Christ for ever. Amen . [Written to the Romans from Corinthus, and sent by Phebe servant of the church at Cenchrea.]
There has been a dispute as to the meaning of the word "mystery" and about who received the ministry of this mystery first. Some say it was Paul first, but the Bible indicates quite vividly that is was Peter instead. At any rate both were Jews.
Some do not want to recognize any Jewish influence within the plan of salvation especially when we begin to recognize the Biblical Hebrew culture of the Old Testament covenant with God. It is evident that there is a clear desire to separate this cultural influence from salvation while at the same time saying that there is no difference between the Jew and the Gentile as Paul said in truth. There will be more disputes because of what I just explained.
Jesus teaching His disciples in Mark 4:11 "And he said unto them, Unto you it is given to know the mystery of the kingdom of God: but unto them that are without, all these things are done in parables:"
The other thing that is obvious was that Peter was the first one to understand the inclusion of the Gentile with the Jews. Jesus ministered about this mystery of the kingdom to the 12 disciples, but Peter didn't comprehend that the Gentiles were included until his vision of all the unclean animals on the sheet from heaven until God said what He had made clean was clean. Then Peter went to Cornelius (a Gentile) in acts chapter 10. So we can see that the mystery of the kingdom had now been revealed to both the Jew and the Gentile before Paul's conversion.
Acts 10:44-48 and Acts 11:1
"While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word. And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished , as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost. For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter, Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we? And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then prayed they him to tarry certain days. And the apostles and brethren that were in Judaea heard that the Gentiles had also received the word of God.
The only thing Paul was told right after His conversion by Ananias was what he would have to suffer for the Lord's sake, but he also was enlightened of the spiritual truth in the law and the prophets, for he had studied those things long before he was blinded on the road to Damascus. This understanding enabled him to minister to the Gentiles proving Christ as the true Messiah and Savior to the world via this understanding of the Old Testament scriptures available at the time. We can see by Paul's writings to the Romans that the mystery was (and is) the plan of salvation through Christ Jesus that was perceived and conceived by God the Father and the Son before creation. Colossians 1:12-20
Romans 16:25-27
25 Now to him that is of power to stablish you according to my gospel, and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery, which was kept secret since the world began,
26 But now is made manifest , and by the scriptures of the prophets, according to the commandment of the everlasting God, made known to all nations for the obedience of faith:
27 To God only wise, be glory through Jesus Christ for ever. Amen . [Written to the Romans from Corinthus, and sent by Phebe servant of the church at Cenchrea.]
There has been a dispute as to the meaning of the word "mystery" and about who received the ministry of this mystery first. Some say it was Paul first, but the Bible indicates quite vividly that is was Peter instead. At any rate both were Jews.
Some do not want to recognize any Jewish influence within the plan of salvation especially when we begin to recognize the Biblical Hebrew culture of the Old Testament covenant with God. It is evident that there is a clear desire to separate this cultural influence from salvation while at the same time saying that there is no difference between the Jew and the Gentile as Paul said in truth. There will be more disputes because of what I just explained.
The Sabbath is about rest.
God made a day of rest for his people, and in the NT he has made every day a day of rest for his people.
I rest from my work to save myself and to earn God's favor, both of which I already have.
My obedience is the response of a loving heart to the One whom it loves,
not work to save nor earn favor.
God made a day of rest for his people, and in the NT he has made every day a day of rest for his people.
I rest from my work to save myself and to earn God's favor, both of which I already have.
My obedience is the response of a loving heart to the One whom it loves,
not work to save nor earn favor.
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Ok really I need to quit this back and forth. I haven't done this much back and forth concerning doctrine for a while.
I'm like a person on a diet going to an all you can eat buffet. I had better leave before I gain it all back.
Again thanks for the back and forth, I need to let you have the last word. If I don't my fear is I'll do binge online debating and not come up for air for months.
ciao til another time..
I'm like a person on a diet going to an all you can eat buffet. I had better leave before I gain it all back.
Again thanks for the back and forth, I need to let you have the last word. If I don't my fear is I'll do binge online debating and not come up for air for months.
ciao til another time..
O.K. The Blond thinks she's ready to answer this thread question.
Abraham was considered the Father of the Jews as they would refer to him as Father Abraham and since God made the covenant with Abraham my assumption is that Isaac was the first born Jew. Far as I can tell the first thing that was given to Abraham and Isaac was first hand knowledge and understanding of the Plan of Salvation as God commanded Abraham to offer Isaac as a sacrifice.
When one goes through the motions of that sacrifice and truly understands the emotions involved in it - that Abraham and Isaac really got the concept of the sacrifice that God was making in giving His only Son Jesus as our sacrifice for our sins. So my answer would be an explicit understanding of the Plan of Salvation.
Abraham was considered the Father of the Jews as they would refer to him as Father Abraham and since God made the covenant with Abraham my assumption is that Isaac was the first born Jew. Far as I can tell the first thing that was given to Abraham and Isaac was first hand knowledge and understanding of the Plan of Salvation as God commanded Abraham to offer Isaac as a sacrifice.
When one goes through the motions of that sacrifice and truly understands the emotions involved in it - that Abraham and Isaac really got the concept of the sacrifice that God was making in giving His only Son Jesus as our sacrifice for our sins. So my answer would be an explicit understanding of the Plan of Salvation.
Paul states at least five NT doctrines that are "mysteries," not revealed before the NT.
"Mystery" is not just the inclusion of Gentiles in the church.
Your error is in limiting "mystery" to one, and then trying to make that one the pattern and substance
of all the other mysteries.
Hockey puck.
I realize that is your personal understanding of the situation.
The disputes are the result of your misunderstanding and error, starting with the NT use of "mystery,"
and then what they are.
And that's not to mention the giving of the gospel to the Gentiles was not first received by Peter,
it was foretold in the OT prophecies.
"Mystery" is not just the inclusion of Gentiles in the church.
Your error is in limiting "mystery" to one, and then trying to make that one the pattern and substance
of all the other mysteries.
Hockey puck.
I realize that is your personal understanding of the situation.
The disputes are the result of your misunderstanding and error, starting with the NT use of "mystery,"
and then what they are.
And that's not to mention the giving of the gospel to the Gentiles was not first received by Peter,
it was foretold in the OT prophecies.
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You're not a dumb blond LOL
I don't disagree with you but I doubt that Abraham and eventually Israel knew this mystery that was going to be revealed by Christ Jesus. Nevertheless, what you have said completely relates to the plan of salvation. We can see this scenario again with the spiritual concepts of Passover and Israel being let out of captivity.
John knew, it seems, and part of his heritage was of the tribe of Levi.
John 1:29 The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.
It is true that the same mountain range where Abraham offered Issac was the place called Golgotha. It is also the same place where David made sacrifice after purchasing the threshing floor from Ornan. Mount Moriah
I don't disagree with you but I doubt that Abraham and eventually Israel knew this mystery that was going to be revealed by Christ Jesus. Nevertheless, what you have said completely relates to the plan of salvation. We can see this scenario again with the spiritual concepts of Passover and Israel being let out of captivity.
John knew, it seems, and part of his heritage was of the tribe of Levi.
John 1:29 The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.
It is true that the same mountain range where Abraham offered Issac was the place called Golgotha. It is also the same place where David made sacrifice after purchasing the threshing floor from Ornan. Mount Moriah
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I'm thinking neither Abraham nor Isaac explicitly understood it as the Plan of Salvation,
for God did not tell Abraham nor Isaac why Isaac was to be offered in sacrifice.
Since God had promised Abraham that he would become a great nation through Isaac,
Abraham assumed God would raise Isaac from the dead to fulfill his promise.
for God did not tell Abraham nor Isaac why Isaac was to be offered in sacrifice.
Since God had promised Abraham that he would become a great nation through Isaac,
Abraham assumed God would raise Isaac from the dead to fulfill his promise.
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