ONE BAPTISM - Ephesians 4:5

[notuptome]

NOTUPTOME, I would like to know that if you don't have any problem with water baptism why are you being
baptized in water if it is not necessary for salvation ? or have you not being baptized in water yet; and if not please consider
the following verses .
first John the Baptist and Jesus Mat3:13-16 second Mat 21:25 third Mark 16:16 fourth Acts 2 :38 fifth 1 Pet 3:21
men are commanded to do water baptism Mat 28:19 the Lord does spirit baptism and fire Mat 3 :11
NOTICE the phrase HE shall baptize you. ( the Lord will do that not men ) God bless.......

One who has been saved receives water baptism to demonstrate a willingness to be obedient to the Lord. It is a first step on the road of sanctification a road you cannot tread if you are not first saved and baptized in the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit must quicken the soul that is dead in trespasses and sin before one can walk with and serve the Lord.

Water baptism is a tradition passed down from Israel. There are many ceremonial baptisms (washing) in Judaism.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[dcontroversal]

is it H[SUB]2[/SUB]O we ought to walk in and remain in, or Christ?

should we encourage each other not to leave our bathtubs, or not to let our feet stray from the Way?

H[SUB]2[/SUB]O didn't wash away my sin. the blood of Jesus Christ did. it is in Him we ought to be immersed, and in Him we ought to dwell, and in Him we receive redemption, sanctification, justification, and the eternal promise and hope which IS Him.

here is where my soul was redeemed:
View attachment 90591

not here:
View attachment 90592

No doubt and I agree....unfortunately COC members believe in a watered down blood...failing to see and understand the OT picture of redemption found in the Passover...

WHEN I see the blood I will pass over you......NO WATER connected to that at all.....

They also fail to understand that it is our birth BY SPIRIT that saves us and makes us a child of God just like Jesus who was BORN of the SPIRIT and called THE SON OF GOD before his immersion which to a believer is the first act of obedience and has nothing at all to do with biblical salvation, but rather is an identification process which identifies us publically with Jesus and separates us from the guilty world...just like the flood of Noah's day....

They also take numerous scriptures out of context to teach their Campbellism instead of being honest with what the scriptures have to say..........

 

[Butch5]

I wonder why those who deny water baptism tell God no, you can't do it that way!

 

[dcontroversal]

I wonder why those who deny water baptism tell God no, you can't do it that way!

Same could be said of those who believe in water baptism for salvation....Why do they reject all the scriptural proof against such heresy....

I am the Lord thy God I CHANGE NOT....


WHEN I see the blood I will pass over you......NO WATER connected to that at all.....

Why did God not say...WHEN I see the BLOOD, the WATER and the WORKS I will pass over YOU?

Because is has always been about and will ALWAYS BE ABOUT the BLOOD being applied to your life by genuine faith!

 

[Markum1972]

The verse does not say "one Holy Spirit baptism". As Atwood would post:
[No Holy Spirit in the verse]

What in the immediate context implies the verse refers to some kind of figurative spirit baptism and not literal water baptism.

And how many is one?

1 Cor 1:14,16 and 1 Cor 12:13 - do both refer to one baptism or two different baptisms?

He never said "figurative" baptism. The baptism of the Holy Spirit is not "figurative".

According to your logic, you cannot claim it to be "water" baptism either then because it does not reference it.

However... Ephesians does mention the Holy Spirit MANY times despite your claim.

Ephesians 4:6 One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all (one Lord), and in you all (one faith).7 But unto every one of us is given grace according to the measure of the gift of Christ (one baptism).

Again...
Ephesians 4:8 Wherefore he saith, When he (one Lord) ascended up on high, he led captivity captive (one faith), and gave gifts (one baptism) unto men.

What was the gift that God gave to men through Jesus? The gift of the Holy Spirit.

John 14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

John the baptist understood this when saying...
Matthew 3:11 I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance. but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire:

2 Timothy 3:5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.

 

[Butch5]

Same could be said of those who believe in water baptism for salvation....Why do they reject all the scriptural proof against such heresy....

I am the Lord thy God I CHANGE NOT....


WHEN I see the blood I will pass over you......NO WATER connected to that at all.....

Why did God not say...WHEN I see the BLOOD, the WATER and the WORKS I will pass over YOU?

Because is has always been about and will ALWAYS BE ABOUT the BLOOD being applied to your life by genuine faith!

There is no Scriptural proof against it. It's logical fallacies that used to argue against it. The first covenant didn't have baptism as a requirement. Using the line of reasoning you're using you would have to deny circumcision as necessary for the covenant yet we see Scripture that states otherwise.

11 And ye shall circumcise the flesh of your foreskin; and it shall be a token of the covenant betwixt me and you.
12 And he that is eight days old shall be circumcised among you, every man child in your generations, he that is born in the house, or bought with money of any stranger, which is not of thy seed. {he that is eight...: Heb. a son of eight days}
13 He that is born in thy house, and he that is bought with thy money, must needs be circumcised: and my covenant shall be in your flesh for an everlasting covenant.
14 And the uncircumcised man child whose flesh of his foreskin is not circumcised, that soul shall be cut off from his people; he hath broken my covenant. (Gen 17:11-14 KJV)

An uncircumcised person was cut off from the covenant.

In the passage you quoted it didn't say anything about circumcision.

 

[notuptome]

There is no Scriptural proof against it. It's logical fallacies that used to argue against it. The first covenant didn't have baptism as a requirement. Using the line of reasoning you're using you would have to deny circumcision as necessary for the covenant yet we see Scripture that states otherwise.

11 And ye shall circumcise the flesh of your foreskin; and it shall be a token of the covenant betwixt me and you.
12 And he that is eight days old shall be circumcised among you, every man child in your generations, he that is born in the house, or bought with money of any stranger, which is not of thy seed. {he that is eight...: Heb. a son of eight days}
13 He that is born in thy house, and he that is bought with thy money, must needs be circumcised: and my covenant shall be in your flesh for an everlasting covenant.
14 And the uncircumcised man child whose flesh of his foreskin is not circumcised, that soul shall be cut off from his people; he hath broken my covenant. (Gen 17:11-14 KJV)

An uncircumcised person was cut off from the covenant.

So if I understand this correctly circumcision was to identify with Judaism and water baptism is to identify with Christianity. Just one who was circumcised was not saved by circumcision so those who are water baptized are not saved by their water baptism.

Still have to be saved by grace through faith. Circumcised or baptized does not replace grace.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[Butch5]

So if I understand this correctly circumcision was to identify with Judaism and water baptism is to identify with Christianity. Just one who was circumcised was not saved by circumcision so those who are water baptized are not saved by their water baptism.

Still have to be saved by grace through faith. Circumcised or baptized does not replace grace.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

The one who was not circumcised was cut off from the people, he was no longer one of the people of God.

 

[dcontroversal]

There is no Scriptural proof against it. It's logical fallacies that used to argue against it. The first covenant didn't have baptism as a requirement. Using the line of reasoning you're using you would have to deny circumcision as necessary for the covenant yet we see Scripture that states otherwise.

11 And ye shall circumcise the flesh of your foreskin; and it shall be a token of the covenant betwixt me and you.
12 And he that is eight days old shall be circumcised among you, every man child in your generations, he that is born in the house, or bought with money of any stranger, which is not of thy seed. {he that is eight...: Heb. a son of eight days}
13 He that is born in thy house, and he that is bought with thy money, must needs be circumcised: and my covenant shall be in your flesh for an everlasting covenant.
14 And the uncircumcised man child whose flesh of his foreskin is not circumcised, that soul shall be cut off from his people; he hath broken my covenant. (Gen 17:11-14 KJV)

An uncircumcised person was cut off from the covenant.

In the passage you quoted it didn't say anything about circumcision.

Abraham had faith BEFORE CIRCUMCISION and circumcision is to the O.T. what water is to the N.T.
Open your eyes to the truth before you leave this world trusting in a gospel of a different kind which has no power to save before it is too late!

 

[dcontroversal]

So if I understand this correctly circumcision was to identify with Judaism and water baptism is to identify with Christianity. Just one who was circumcised was not saved by circumcision so those who are water baptized are not saved by their water baptism.

Still have to be saved by grace through faith. Circumcised or baptized does not replace grace.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

No doubt and like normal...cannot answer to the point being made, but has to twist it into something entirely different than what we were talking about.......!

Going be a lot of wet people begging for the water they trusted into...the same water which had no power to save or keep saved!

 

[Butch5]

No doubt and like normal...cannot answer to the point being made, but has to twist it into something entirely different than what we were talking about.......!

Going be a lot of wet people begging for the water they trusted into...the same water which had no power to save or keep saved!

On the contrary, those who deny the words of Lord are the one's who will be regretful. Logical fallacies do not lead to truth

 

[Markum1972]

It is plain to see.

John the baptist said it himself.

Matthew 3:11 I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance. but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire:

Why was John doing this? Again, it is answered...

Matthew 3:2 And saying, Repent ye: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.3 For this is he that was spoken of by the prophet Esaias, saying, The voice of one crying in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make his paths straight.

There was no way to the Father (in Heaven) until Jesus made the way. John was preparing people for his coming. He did so by baptizing them into repentance in preparation for Jesus' coming.

Afterwhich, the same was performed (as shown in Acts) for the repentance of sins. However, the repentance of sins cannot save you.

Are there cases in which people repented without being baptized in water? Sure... there are many of them. The thief on the cross is the most commonly known case.

If baptism in water was a requirement for salvation, then Jesus was a liar when he told the thief that he would see him in paradise that same day. Any doctrine that makes Jesus out to be a liar must be a fallacy.

 

[Butch5]

It is plain to see.

John the baptist said it himself.

Matthew 3:11 I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance. but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire:

Why was John doing this? Again, it is answered...

Matthew 3:2 And saying, Repent ye: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.3 For this is he that was spoken of by the prophet Esaias, saying, The voice of one crying in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make his paths straight.

There was no way to the Father (in Heaven) until Jesus made the way. John was preparing people for his coming. He did so by baptizing them into repentance in preparation for Jesus' coming.

Afterwhich, the same was performed (as shown in Acts) for the repentance of sins. However, the repentance of sins cannot save you.

Are there cases in which people repented without being baptized in water? Sure... there are many of them. The thief on the cross is the most commonly known case.

If baptism in water was a requirement for salvation, then Jesus was a liar when he told the thief that he would see him in paradise that same day. Any doctrine that makes Jesus out to be a liar must be a fallacy.

But Jesus didn't go to paradise that day.

 

[Markum1972]

But Jesus didn't go to paradise that day.

Yes, he did. Jesus did not lie.

When does a day begin and end according to scripture? When did a day begin and end according to the Jews of that time? HInt - Jews still observe this as being the start and end of each day because it was as God created it.

Look it up and you shall see that God NEVER lies. Man only fails to understand.

By the way, this is also why there seems to be a discrepancy in the number of days from Jesus' death to rising. However, if you count the days the same way that God counts the days, it is in fact 3 days.

 

[dalconn]

If a prisoner got saved in a prison with no ability to get submersed for baptism does God issue him a waiver or is he just not saved?

 

[Butch5]

Yes, he did. Jesus did not lie.

When does a day begin and end according to scripture? When did a day begin and end according to the Jews of that time? HInt - Jews still observe this as being the start and end of each day because it was as God created it.

Look it up and you shall see that God NEVER lies. Man only fails to understand.

By the way, this is also why there seems to be a discrepancy in the number of days from Jesus' death to rising. However, if you count the days the same way that God counts the days, it is in fact 3 days.

I'm aware of how the Jews counted days, however, John 832 has already laid out the argument, the verse about the thief is punctuated incorrectly. There was no punctuation in the original texts, it's added by the translators and they put it in the wrong place. The word translated Paradise means a garden, it's used in the Greek Old Testament of the Garden of Eden. The thief asked Jesus to remember him when He came into His kingdom, he wasn't concerned with his location later that day. Jesus didn't enter His kingdom that day, He was in the tomb for three days. Paradise on the other hand is in the kingdom.

7 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the tree of life, which is in the midst of the paradise of God. (Rev 2:7 KJV)

 

[Butch5]

If a prisoner got saved in a prison with no ability to get submersed for baptism does God issue him a waiver or is he just not saved?

God can save whoever He wants to save. If one cannot be baptized God knows that. However, there are those who teach that baptism isn't necessary which is contrary to what God said and they will have to answer for their teachings.

The proper way to come to the truth of Scripture is to take all of the Scriptures that address a subject and understand them in such a way that there is harmony with all of them.

 

[dalconn]

If we're going to be that emphatic about water immersion then we need to follow through with the rest of the argument. Do we baptize in the name of Jesus Christ or do we baptize in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit?

 

[Flamingspirit]

True baptism is death. Physical in its truest since and spiritual in the mind by "crucifying" the old man. We all go through this regardless of what we are called or what we did.

 

[Butch5]

If we're going to be that emphatic about water immersion then we need to follow through with the rest of the argument. Do we baptize in the name of Jesus Christ or do we baptize in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit?

Are you asking do we say all three names or are you considering this from a point of authority?