Conditional Salvation
- Thread starter SeaBass
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C
Last days persecution and final blessing offered to all which / that ...
Rev 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.
Rev 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.
Rev 22:14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.
What are these 'commandments' that Jesus gave us and John wrote into these 3 N.T. books?
John 14:15 If ye love Me, keep My commandments.
John 14:21 He that hath My commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth Me: and he that loveth Me shall be loved of My Father, and I will love him, and will manifest Myself to him.
John 15:10 If ye keep My commandments, ye shall abide in My love; even as I have kept My Father's commandments, and abide in His love.
1John 2:3 And hereby we do know that we know Him, if we keep His commandments.
1John 2:4 He that saith, I know Him, and keepeth not His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
1John 3:22 And whatsoever we ask, we receive of Him, because we keep His commandments, and do those things that are pleasing in His sight.
1John 3:24 And he that keepeth His commandments dwelleth in Him, and He in him. And hereby we know that He abideth in us, by the Spirit which He hath given us.
1John 5:2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, And keep His commandments.
1John 5:3 For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments: and His commandments are not grievous.
If these words offend us, we need to ask ourselves -- If He 'is' The Word of God, do we only approve merely parts of Who He is?
Do we throw away whole chapters as well - as in Matthew 25?
Rev 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.
Rev 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.
Rev 22:14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.
What are these 'commandments' that Jesus gave us and John wrote into these 3 N.T. books?
John 14:15 If ye love Me, keep My commandments.
John 14:21 He that hath My commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth Me: and he that loveth Me shall be loved of My Father, and I will love him, and will manifest Myself to him.
John 15:10 If ye keep My commandments, ye shall abide in My love; even as I have kept My Father's commandments, and abide in His love.
1John 2:3 And hereby we do know that we know Him, if we keep His commandments.
1John 2:4 He that saith, I know Him, and keepeth not His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
1John 3:22 And whatsoever we ask, we receive of Him, because we keep His commandments, and do those things that are pleasing in His sight.
1John 3:24 And he that keepeth His commandments dwelleth in Him, and He in him. And hereby we know that He abideth in us, by the Spirit which He hath given us.
1John 5:2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, And keep His commandments.
1John 5:3 For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments: and His commandments are not grievous.
If these words offend us, we need to ask ourselves -- If He 'is' The Word of God, do we only approve merely parts of Who He is?
Do we throw away whole chapters as well - as in Matthew 25?
C
Hi Brother! I'm sure I have. Followed his 'Last Days Ministries' back when he started it - receiving his newsletter-magazine. I loved those days. Such zeal. David Wilkerson & Leonard Ravenhill were frequently found in his magazine, besides those preachers that were in Heaven already when the three of them were still alive and preaching. Leonard Ravenhill gave classes there and I watch those on youtube. Classic stuff that came on the heels of the apostasy. Keith was hitting the hyperfaith heresy as it was getting rolling. I can only imagine how he'd be carrying on now that things have gotten so much worse. Seems 100 fold worse since back then.
He was an incredible young man, as were all the men that he aligned himself with in his ministry. I've often wondered if his plane crash wasn't martyrdom because of some specific topic that he wrote against. Not trying to be a conspiracy maker, but when he put out a series on that topic, because of his following - we all thought - "Uh-oh, Keith's in BIG trouble Now."
I'd like if you could find that song you're thinking of. That would really be appreciated.
Thank you lots!
He was an incredible young man, as were all the men that he aligned himself with in his ministry. I've often wondered if his plane crash wasn't martyrdom because of some specific topic that he wrote against. Not trying to be a conspiracy maker, but when he put out a series on that topic, because of his following - we all thought - "Uh-oh, Keith's in BIG trouble Now."
I'd like if you could find that song you're thinking of. That would really be appreciated.
Thank you lots!
E
Go figure the songs called "the sheep and the goats" lol
All of Keith's music was so...just touching the heart and made you think. Then you have his ministry and yeah even more convicting. Just in your face truth.
And as you say not trying to make a "conspiracy" but yeah certain forces (we know who) wanted him silenced. Kinda hard to silence someone when his stuff is still around lol.
I don't wanna sound puffed up or anything like that but I pray God will use me like that some day.
All of Keith's music was so...just touching the heart and made you think. Then you have his ministry and yeah even more convicting. Just in your face truth.
And as you say not trying to make a "conspiracy" but yeah certain forces (we know who) wanted him silenced. Kinda hard to silence someone when his stuff is still around lol.
I don't wanna sound puffed up or anything like that but I pray God will use me like that some day.
C
I agree with you completely, Brother. And you are far from puffed-up if you would like to impact the Church and the world as anyone like Keith did.
We don't worship any man - but Keith, as he grew in Christ, became a lot like Paul and His Lord that cleared the temple and rebuked the Pharisees.
Thanks for bringing him up. It's good to go back to those days in my mind. Andre Crouche {sp?} wrote & sang a song like, "Take me back, take me back dear Lord, to the place where I first received you...where I first believed"
"OH HAPPY DAY!" - another good song
Thanks again!
We don't worship any man - but Keith, as he grew in Christ, became a lot like Paul and His Lord that cleared the temple and rebuked the Pharisees.
Thanks for bringing him up. It's good to go back to those days in my mind. Andre Crouche {sp?} wrote & sang a song like, "Take me back, take me back dear Lord, to the place where I first received you...where I first believed"
"OH HAPPY DAY!" - another good song
Thanks again!
So it would appear this goofy topic is cleared up, hope hope... In conclusion, and as an important note for those folk who might make an (OP) statement that "salvation is conditional", you probably say that because for you, it very well could be... but that would only be as a result of one's own attitudes and actions, not because of God's. Make sense? So maybe it's housecleaning time...
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you say genuine faith will be accompanied by good works...which ties faith to works......which is what James says ...faith without works is dead...but you start by saying ...
you have to make up your mind....
can you be saved through faith without confirming your faith which would would make it a dead faith since it had not been confirmed by works...?
can you be saved through faith without confirming your faith which would would make it a dead faith since it had not been confirmed by works...?
Works are the result of faith, which are the fruit of faith. Jesus said, "Either make the tree good and its fruit good, or else make the tree bad and its fruit bad; for a tree is known by its fruit (Matthew 12:33). In Matthew 12:33, we read - But he who received seed on the good ground is he who hears the word and understands it, who indeed bears fruit and produces: some a hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty." Good fruit/bears fruit represents good works.
We are not saved by works, but through FAITH. From beginning "have been saved through faith" (Ephesians 2:8) to end "receiving the end of your faith--the salvation of your souls" (1 Peter 1:9) salvation is through faith and is not by works. Salvation has three tenses. We have been saved from the penalty of sin (Justification); we are being saved from the power of sin (ongoing Sanctification); we will be saved from the presence of sin (Glorification).
We are not saved by works, but through FAITH. From beginning "have been saved through faith" (Ephesians 2:8) to end "receiving the end of your faith--the salvation of your souls" (1 Peter 1:9) salvation is through faith and is not by works. Salvation has three tenses. We have been saved from the penalty of sin (Justification); we are being saved from the power of sin (ongoing Sanctification); we will be saved from the presence of sin (Glorification).
one is saved through faith and it is not until the end that one receives the salvation of one's soul. In the meantime it is all about being conformed to His Image, living a life of faithfulness through that faith. Many opportunities for man to reject, simply retract back into old sinful habits and thus lose the inheritance that was promised IF one remains faithful. Nothing is finite in this life. It is ONLY the end that will determine the outcome.
Do you believe that "have been saved through faith" (Ephesians 2:8) means that we are presently saved NOW or do you believe that believers spend the rest of their lives in a lost condition and are not actually saved until the end? John 5:24 - "Most assuredly, I say to you, he who hears My word and believes in Him who sent Me has everlasting life, and shall not come into judgment, but has passed from death into life. Does you believe this a present reality for believers? Or are you just arguing for NOSAS? So what in the end will determine the outcome? Just how faithful must you be (in addition to believing/trusting in Christ for salvation) in order to maintain salvation?
Philippians 3:8-14King James Version (KJV)
[SUP]8 [/SUP]Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ,
[SUP]9 [/SUP]And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:
[SUP]10 [/SUP]That I may know him, and the power of his resurrection, and the fellowship of his sufferings, being made conformable unto his death;
[SUP]11 [/SUP]If by any means I might attain unto the resurrection of the dead.
[SUP]12 [/SUP]Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect: but I follow after, if that I may apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus.
[SUP]13 [/SUP]Brethren, I count not myself to have apprehended: but this one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind, and reaching forth unto those things which are before,
[SUP]14 [/SUP]I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus.
[SUP]8 [/SUP]Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ,
[SUP]9 [/SUP]And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:
[SUP]10 [/SUP]That I may know him, and the power of his resurrection, and the fellowship of his sufferings, being made conformable unto his death;
[SUP]11 [/SUP]If by any means I might attain unto the resurrection of the dead.
[SUP]12 [/SUP]Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect: but I follow after, if that I may apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus.
[SUP]13 [/SUP]Brethren, I count not myself to have apprehended: but this one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind, and reaching forth unto those things which are before,
[SUP]14 [/SUP]I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus.