yeah no doubt...broad and wide is the way that leads unto destruction.......
Works and Salvation
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yeah no doubt...broad and wide is the way that leads unto destruction.......
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Hoffco
Guest
It is obvious the devil's family vs, God's family. I throw "faith only" people out of my church. Even Jesus had to clean his house of the devil Judas. In the world , God allows the two families to grow together., but in His Church, Jesus wants us throw the devil's children out. For the fairness of delusion opps discussion, we are wise to leave the devil's crowd here in Chat rm. but the judgment day will clean them out, they will be "left behind". Love to all, Hoffco
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eternally-gratefull
Guest
Faith only people need to leave your church, Because your church leads people to hell.
Your church is nothing but a modern day jewish phariseeicle church, and will suffer the same fate.
Here is my view and its from the scriptures. James is tellign us that true saving faith will have works and without the works showing your faith you dont have true saving faith. You can read the whole passage from James 2, I will just post some verses.
[SUP]18 [/SUP]But someone will say [to you then], You [say you] have faith, and I have [good] works. Now you show me your [alleged] faith apart from any [good] works [if you can], and I by [good] works [of obedience] will show you my faith.
[SUP]20 [/SUP]Are you willing to be shown [proof], you foolish (unproductive, spiritually deficient) fellow, that faith apart from [good] works is inactive and ineffective and worthless?
[SUP]24 [/SUP]You see that a man is justified (pronounced righteous before God) through what he does and not alone through faith [through works of obedience as well as by what he believes].
[SUP]26 [/SUP]For as the human body apart from the spirit is lifeless, so faith apart from [its] works of obedience is also dead.
Yes it is by faith through grace we are saved, yet this type of faith produces good works and if it does not there is no salvation. Dead faith cannot save it's like the demons just believing and not trusting.
[SUP]18 [/SUP]But someone will say [to you then], You [say you] have faith, and I have [good] works. Now you show me your [alleged] faith apart from any [good] works [if you can], and I by [good] works [of obedience] will show you my faith.
[SUP]20 [/SUP]Are you willing to be shown [proof], you foolish (unproductive, spiritually deficient) fellow, that faith apart from [good] works is inactive and ineffective and worthless?
[SUP]24 [/SUP]You see that a man is justified (pronounced righteous before God) through what he does and not alone through faith [through works of obedience as well as by what he believes].
[SUP]26 [/SUP]For as the human body apart from the spirit is lifeless, so faith apart from [its] works of obedience is also dead.
Yes it is by faith through grace we are saved, yet this type of faith produces good works and if it does not there is no salvation. Dead faith cannot save it's like the demons just believing and not trusting.
How do those that hold that it is by our faith we are saved reconcile the following passages:
But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved, even as they.Acts 15:11
For we are saved by hope: but hope that is seen is not hope: for what a man seeth, why doth he yet hope for? Romans 8:24
Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth. 1 Tim 2:4
[SUP]9[/SUP]Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began, [SUP]10[/SUP] But is now made manifest by the appearing of our Saviour Jesus Christ, who hath abolished death, and hath brought life and immortality to light through the gospel: 2 Tim 1:9-10
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Hoffco
Guest
Romans 2:11 "For there is no partiality with God." This is why God will judge all persons by their works not by faith only. Rom. 2:7" Eternal life to those who by patient continuance in doing good seek for glory, honor, and immortality; But to those who are self seeking and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness-wrath and indignation." One reason why God gives us trials is to make us worthy of our inheritance. 1Thess1:5-8 Mary and Joseph were worthy to be chosen to bare and raise the Messiah Jesus ,God's son. After all the judgments on us are over, We will be fully worthy of our home on the new earth, as equals with our elder brother Jesus the Messiah, There will be no rank on the new earth. My followers will not call me Pastor Doug or bishop/elder Doug on the new earth, just Bro, Doug and Bro Jesus and so forth. for ever more equals. Love Hoffco
If work is the requirement for salvation, then we don't need to witness to dying person.
How must work need to be save?
I believe Faith will produce good work, but good work not produce salvation.
Good work is fruit not requirement. it is evident or salvation. not requirement.
How must work need to be save?
I believe Faith will produce good work, but good work not produce salvation.
Good work is fruit not requirement. it is evident or salvation. not requirement.
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OceanEagle1
Guest
"Works should follow faith; the Love of God in a believer is expressed by doing works."
Sometimes I have to work too have faith ... while other times ... I have to have faith it works. Make Sense?
Sometimes I have to work too have faith ... while other times ... I have to have faith it works. Make Sense?
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Ella85
Guest
When you have faith in the Lord you willingly do things that will please Him!!! THAT IS TRUE LOVE
Anyone that has not found the truth as of yet do NOT DO WORKS because they DO NOT HAVE FAITH!
Pretty simple analogy!
Anyone that has not found the truth as of yet do NOT DO WORKS because they DO NOT HAVE FAITH!
Pretty simple analogy!
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eternally-gratefull
Guest
amen, and not to mention, and when, by experience, you see how good things are when you do those things (how trustworthy God is) and how awfull it is when you do things your way, it becomes so much easier, and natural.
I don't quite understand what do you mean to work too have a faith.
But what I remember is the branch can't bear fruit of itself.
Good work only happen after we have faith in Jesus/ we abide to the vine.
Jn 3:16 does not say "believeth only". Comparing Jn 3:16 with Jn 6:27-29 believing is a work itself.
If one's faith has but no works, YOU said "then he NEVER HAD FAITH TO BEGIN WITH."
"Logically" then you made it IMPOSSIBLE for one to have faith without works.
If "faith only" saves then one would NEVER have to do any works at all.
So you are saying faith + works saves. For if one has no works then he never had faith so by implication you are making works necessary in order to be saved.
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eternally-gratefull
Guest
so much for the thief on the cross.
Do you people ever read the word of God and actually study it, Or do you just glance over it until you see something which supports you. then highlight it, while ignoring the rest?
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eternally-gratefull
Guest
lol.. No belief is not a work. It is not a work unless you can take credit for it. Who can take credit for standing still and allowing God to save you from yourself and your sin?
Again you people amaze me.
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eternally-gratefull
Guest
technically your right. there is no such thing as faith apart from works. (Although I know myself and many others have said this over and over, but you all seem to forget that. or ignore it!!)
where you error is, is that salvation happens the moment of faith. Works automatically follows.
You have salvation happening after works. which means a person must earn salvation, thus they can boast. and take credit for it. in other words, their faith is in their own ability to do the work, and it saving them, and not God.
Again, you people amaze me.
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eternally-gratefull
Guest
Nope.
Because salvation occurs in between the faith and works.
we are saved by grace through faith not works (the moment of salvation) what happens next? We (those saved by faith) are his workmanship CREATED in CHRIST JESUS (new creatures) FOR GOOD WORKS.. they will happen.
you want to carry the cart before the horse again you people amaze me