Question for OSAS believers...

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elf3 said:
If you don't follow then I would say it's safe to say you were never saved to begin with. Reason? No on can fall from His hands. If we actually feel that we can fall from the hands of Jesus then according to John 10:27-30 God can lie. So can God lie or are we held safe in the hands of Jesus once we have the saving faith in Jesus? It's a one or the other it cannot be both.
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2 Peter 3:17
Ye therefore, beloved, seeing ye know these things before, beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own stedfastness.


is following a choice??? you did not read post#120 what was in red....did you? the purpose of the epistles is to keep believers from falling....which means men do fall....yet if one fall you say they were never saved to begin with....take a little time to read 2Peter 1:1-10 see what it takes or a man not to fall
 
newbirth said:
2 Peter 3:17
Ye therefore, beloved, seeing ye know these things before, beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own stedfastness.


is following a choice??? you did not read post#120 what was in red....did you? the purpose of the epistles is to keep believers from falling....which means men do fall....yet if one fall you say they were never saved to begin with....take a little time to read 2Peter 1:1-10 see what it takes or a man not to fall
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Sorry I didn't see anything in red. Since I do this on my phone and not a computer things are a little different.

Notice in verse 8 "for if these things are yours and abound" by the word "if" doesn't mean they are but might be. The promise of God's salvation is is to those who have the genuine persevering faith in Jesus. So I would say that those who have true saving faith will persevere till the end. Those who do not have the true saving faith obviously will not persevere till the end.

Those we see "fall" did not have that true saving faith as according to, again, John 10:27-30 "no one is able to snatched them out of my Father's hand".

So again I ask do you believe what is written in John or did God lie about losing those He saved?
 
3Scoreand10 said:
Now answer other two questions!
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Did I ever loose my salvation ?
By biblical standards I would have to say yes, as I was lost walking in my own ways from the age of 15 to 28. When one is lost they do not have salvation at that time. Then when I came back in repentance at 29 I then turned around and rededicated my life to Christ. Then at that time did I become saved again, and from age 33 to now at age 38 is when I have dug deep down in biblical studies.
Just like the prodigal son in Luke 15, while he was with his Father he was alive, but when he walked away was lost and dead. It was not tell he came back to the Father was he made alive again.

As long as you continue to walk in the ways of the Lord ( Walking by what He said, which is walking in the Spirit. ) Then you are saved. If you choose to walk away then you become in a lost state, that will lead to spiritual death, unless you come back in repentance. Also see parable of the lost sheep....
 
elf3 said:
Sorry I didn't see anything in red. Since I do this on my phone and not a computer things are a little different.

Notice in verse 8 "for if these things are yours and abound" by the word "if" doesn't mean they are but might be. The promise of God's salvation is is to those who have the genuine persevering faith in Jesus. So I would say that those who have true saving faith will persevere till the end. Those who do not have the true saving faith obviously will not persevere till the end.

Those we see "fall" did not have that true saving faith as according to, again, John 10:27-30 "no one is able to snatched them out of my Father's hand".

So again I ask do you believe what is written in John or did God lie about losing those He saved?
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brother Ijust han a man describe me as an unsaved stony heart hypocrite on another thread...all I can say is we understand scripture differently....you see scripture teaching man what is necessary to do for him not to fall...[SUP]10 [/SUP]Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall:......and still you say man cannot fall...and ask me if I believe what is written in John.......what can I tell you...I am happy for your positive thinking
 
newbirth said:
brother Ijust han a man describe me as an unsaved stony heart hypocrite on another thread...all I can say is we understand scripture differently....you see scripture teaching man what is necessary to do for him not to fall...[SUP]10 [/SUP]Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall:......and still you say man cannot fall...and ask me if I believe what is written in John.......what can I tell you...I am happy for your positive thinking
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Fine but you refuse to explain John 10:27-30. Explain how Jesus says these words yet we can lose our salvation if we have the true saving faith in Christ.
 
elf3 said:
Fine but you refuse to explain John 10:27-30. Explain how Jesus says these words yet we can lose our salvation if we have the true saving faith in Christ.
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I know you asked newbirth, but I would like to answer this.
This is because those who continue to stay truly rooted in the foundation that is Him, will never fault in their walk because they will continue to do what they are suppose to do. There are many who do not have a strong foundation with their faith, rather it be to false teaching, hardships, and misunderstanding from improper study of scripture. These are the ones who need help to be taught the proper path, or they can easily fall away. Example: How many people believe they are saved, and think they do not have to do nothing ???? The bible does not say that is possible.
 
kennethcadwell said:
Did I ever loose my salvation ?
By biblical standards I would have to say yes, as I was lost walking in my own ways from the age of 15 to 28. When one is lost they do not have salvation at that time. Then when I came back in repentance at 29 I then turned around and rededicated my life to Christ. Then at that time did I become saved again, and from age 33 to now at age 38 is when I have dug deep down in biblical studies.
Just like the prodigal son in Luke 15, while he was with his Father he was alive, but when he walked away was lost and dead. It was not tell he came back to the Father was he made alive again.

As long as you continue to walk in the ways of the Lord ( Walking by what He said, which is walking in the Spirit. ) Then you are saved. If you choose to walk away then you become in a lost state, that will lead to spiritual death, unless you come back in repentance. Also see parable of the lost sheep....
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If you lost your salvation the you are without hope as Hebrews teaches it is impossible to be renewed if you have partaken and then lose it........so...either you are eternally saved and sealed by the Spirit of God or you lost it and can never regain it (according to Hebrews) and IF you believe you can lose salvation!

So which is it?
 
elf3 said:
Fine but you refuse to explain John 10:27-30. Explain how Jesus says these words yet we can lose our salvation if we have the true saving faith in Christ.
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They contradict themselves with their heretical doctrine..if they can lose it then they are eternally sealed to the doom of destruction as Hebrews states emphatically that if you have partaken of the divine nature and then CAN LOOSE IT...it is IMPOSSIBLE to regain...so if they admit they have lost their salvation they also admit they are eternally doomed to hell/lake of fire.....that is if you take scripture and twists it like they do to teach you can loose something that cannot be lost.
 
dcontroversal said:
If you lost your salvation the you are without hope as Hebrews teaches it is impossible to be renewed if you have partaken and then lose it........so...either you are eternally saved and sealed by the Spirit of God or you lost it and can never regain it (according to Hebrews) and IF you believe you can lose salvation!

So which is it?
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That is not what Hebrews teaches, as it is only referring to those who walked away and stayed away because they did not want to give up their sins. I was a naive teenager and young adult that wanted the world, so I walked away from the church and the Lord to do my own thing. The bible says when you do this you are lost and not in a saved state, and the only way to come back is through repentance. It never says coming back in repentance is impossible, as that would only be for those who can not give up their sins for Christ.....
Take the Lord for example for the lost sheep parable, He said when one of the sheep gets lost they are not in a saved state. And we are called then to bring them back to that saved state by bringing them back in repentance. If you try and make Hebrews say this is impossible in all cases then you make Hebrews conflict what the Lord said in the lost sheep parable. And how Paul said in other places to bring them back in repentance......
 
I read the first few pages and then skipped ahead.. so forgive me if this has already been asked and answered.. How many of you believe you can accept the mark of the beast and still go to heaven? Can I? could I verbally renounce God, knowing that I am saved for all of eternity?
 
Deadtosin said:
I read the first few pages and then skipped ahead.. so forgive me if this has already been asked and answered.. How many of you believe you can accept the mark of the beast and still go to heaven? Can I? could I verbally renounce God, knowing that I am saved for all of eternity?
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No, you can not receive the mark of the beast and still stay saved as the bible clearly says you would have been deceived and fell away from Him. If you go by a few people that I have seen on here, they have claimed we already have received the mark but are still saved. Not biblical at all !!!
 
kennethcadwell said:
That is not what Hebrews teaches, as it is only referring to those who walked away and stayed away because they did not want to give up their sins. I was a naive teenager and young adult that wanted the world, so I walked away from the church and the Lord to do my own thing. The bible says when you do this you are lost and not in a saved state, and the only way to come back is through repentance. It never says coming back in repentance is impossible, as that would only be for those who can not give up their sins for Christ.....
Take the Lord for example for the lost sheep parable, He said when one of the sheep gets lost they are not in a saved state. And we are called then to bring them back to that saved state by bringing them back in repentance. If you try and make Hebrews say this is impossible in all cases then you make Hebrews conflict what the Lord said in the lost sheep parable. And how Paul said in other places to bring them back in repentance......
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Lost is lost...either you are full of it and never lost it or you lost it when you WILLFULLY walked away and cannot regain it....you bounce around more than a rubber ball kenneth.....You and your cronies say that sin breaks fellowship and willful sin leads to a loss of salvation and then will turn around and admit to doing exactly what you say will cause one to lose it and say that i never lost it or lost it temporarily...Hebrews states you cannot get it back...so according to your own doctrine you had better go party as your lost and in sin......!
 
dcontroversal said:
Lost is lost...either you are full of it and never lost it or you lost it when you WILLFULLY walked away and cannot regain it....you bounce around more than a rubber ball kenneth.....You and your cronies say that sin breaks fellowship and willful sin leads to a loss of salvation and then will turn around and admit to doing exactly what you say will cause one to lose it and say that i never lost it or lost it temporarily...Hebrews states you cannot get it back...so according to your own doctrine you had better go party as your lost and in sin......!
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If that is what you believe then you deny the direct words of the Lord !!!

Because the Lord Himself said His sheep can get lost, and the only way for them to come back is through repentance. And the Apostle Paul confirms every word the Lord said. If you want to claim a person who becomes lost can not come back, then I guess you can keep that faulty thinking. But the Lord says differently !!!!
 
Luke 15


The Parable of the Lost Sheep


15 Now the tax collectors and sinners were all gathering around to hear Jesus. 2 But the Pharisees and the teachers of the law muttered, “This man welcomes sinners and eats with them.”

3 Then Jesus told them this parable: 4 “Suppose one of you has a hundred sheep and loses one of them. Doesn’t he leave the ninety-nine in the open country and go after the lost sheep until he finds it? 5 And when he finds it, he joyfully puts it on his shoulders 6 and goes home. Then he calls his friends and neighbors together and says, ‘Rejoice with me; I have found my lost sheep.’ 7 I tell you that in the same way there will be more rejoicing in heaven over one sinner who repents than over ninety-nine righteous persons who do not need to repent.
 
kennethcadwell said:
If that is what you believe then you deny the direct words of the Lord !!!

Because the Lord Himself said His sheep can get lost, and the only way for them to come back is through repentance. And the Apostle Paul confirms every word the Lord said. If you want to claim a person who becomes lost can not come back, then I guess you can keep that faulty thinking. But the Lord says differently !!!!
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You just contradicted yourself again as the sheep he references is STILL A SHEEP....man wake up...serious!
 
dcontroversal said:
You just contradicted yourself again as the sheep he references is STILL A SHEEP....man wake up...serious!
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I did not contradict myself, and nice try to demeaner a fellow brother in Christ.
Which the bible says is not becoming of a Christian, nor should it be part of your walk. But the parable clearly says the sheep got lost, the only way it was brought back into the fold was through repentance. If the sheep never repented, it would not have been made a member of the fold again. The key word in the parable is repentance, without it you are not saved........period !!!
 
kennethcadwell said:
I did not contradict myself, and nice try to demeaner a fellow brother in Christ.
Which the bible says is not becoming of a Christian, nor should it be part of your walk. But the parable clearly says the sheep got lost, the only way it was brought back into the fold was through repentance. If the sheep never repented, it would not have been made a member of the fold again. The key word in the parable is repentance, without it you are not saved........period !!!
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If you thought I tried to demeanor you man you need to grow up bro...and you did contradict yourself...a sheep is a sheep is a sheep and NOT A GOAT..it is the GOATS that get separated from the SHEEP...Jesus calls HIM A SHEEP and not a GOAT...so again I say..wake up KENNETH and smell the truth!
 
dcontroversal said:
If you thought I tried to demeanor you man you need to grow up bro...and you did contradict yourself...a sheep is a sheep is a sheep and NOT A GOAT..it is the GOATS that get separated from the SHEEP...Jesus calls HIM A SHEEP and not a GOAT...so again I say..wake up KENNETH and smell the truth!
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Goats are those who believe that continue to not obey the Lord to walk in love my friend.
A sheep on the other hand is one of His unless they fall away (hince get lost) in sin again. We are then charged to bring them back to repentance, and if they repent their will be rejoicing because the sheep came back to Him. If they on the other hand do not repent they would remain lost, and if one remains lost they will not have salvation. I am sorry you can not understand that simple truth.
 
You cannot agree with John 10:27-30 and also disagree with it at the same time by saying you lost your salvation then regained it. It's a total contradiction of the verses.
 
kennethcadwell said:
Goats are those who believe that continue to not obey the Lord to walk in love my friend.
A sheep on the other hand is one of His unless they fall away (hince get lost) in sin again. We are then charged to bring them back to repentance, and if they repent their will be rejoicing because the sheep came back to Him. If they on the other hand do not repent they would remain lost, and if one remains lost they will not have salvation. I am sorry you can not understand that simple truth.
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I am sorry you make quotes concerning yourself...like the one highlighted above....Jesus does not call him a GOAT at the very moment he has LOST HIS WAY...he is still a sheep....it is you mi amigo that is blind to simple truth.....!
 
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