Is it wrong to want equality in a marriage?

[Yeraza_Bats]

If God's laws do not improve society, what's the point of them? We have laws, principles, and norms to improve society or to at least keep it civilized. If large groups of people are either ignoring these laws, principles, or norms or abusing them for their own gain, they simply don't work.



No, I didn't. In fact, I chose the terms "gendered violence" and "gender relations" in order to include both men and women.



Of course you don't. If you did, you would be a nonChristian on the highway to Hell with me.

How many people are ACTUALLY following Gods law? This is why Christ died on the cross.
Do you know what Gods law is? For all of mankind?

And no, again I dont blame God for men being evil. The sins of the earth are not of God.

You still equate sin with Gods will. I dont believe you really are trying to understand who God is, but are thinking of the evils that happen and are blaming Him, forgetting that we are all held accountable, and without Christ, we will all be judged. and judgment will fall on men, women, black, white, young, old, Jew, Greek, slave, free, all of man.

 

[LionEyes]

How many people are ACTUALLY following Gods law? This is why Christ died on the cross.
Do you know what Gods law is? For all of mankind?

And no, again I dont blame God for men being evil. The sins of the earth are not of God.

You still equate sin with Gods will. I dont believe you really are trying to understand who God is, but are thinking of the evils that happen and are blaming Him, forgetting that we are all held accountable, and without Christ, we will all be judged. and judgment will fall on men, women, black, white, young, old, Jew, Greek, slave, free, all of man.

I told you to take it to a new thread!

Thou shalt not derail the thread!

 

[JFSurvivor]

I never said anything about women leaving their husbands. I was talking about people accusing God of evil because men sin. The evils of man have nothing to do with God. And I was talking about vengeance because God is bringing it down on the earth for its sins. It made the point that we are told to submit to our abusers, our persecutors, and even in the end times when the anti christ comes to kill you, let him kill you. It is Gods will that you submit to with faith in God, and this isnt just to women, this is for every human being who follows the path of Christ. If all your worried about is your body and earthly life, then you are living earthly.

As for whether or not God wants you to leave your husbands, Christ actually told us no one should ever be divorced. When he was killed He allowed it to happen. He didnt fight. He didnt try to get out of it. For some reason I cant copy paste, but there are tons of bible verses about submission. Ephesians 6:5, Colossions 4:1, 1Peter 2:18, and for wives- 1Peter 3:1-22,Ephesians 5:22-24, 1Peter 3:7, Ephesians 5:25, Colossians 3:19, 1 Timothy 2:12, Ephesians 5:33, one of my favorites- Proverbs 31:10-15

Keep in mind that submission is NOT all about women. All of us are to submit to God. When in slavery we are told to submit. When held captive we are told to let ourselves be captive, when to be killed we are even told to let ourselves be killed. Christ submitted to his captors and died for you, He asks you to do the same. Almost all of His deciples suffered His fate as well. They did it in faith.

All of men are put through hardships of all kinds. God tells you, He is going to put us through hardships. Read Isaiah 48: 9-11.
If we are to use Gods word to find out what to do, He tells us that we should let ourselves go as far as being killed with faith in Him. As for a woman leaving an abusive man, I dunno. I do not believe its Gods will. He also tells us that we should not remarry when we divorce, because we break our promise to Him.

I dont judge women who do, my mom left a very bad man to protect both her and her kids. Christ died to save us from our sins. But, if we are to use Gods teachings, his followers allowed horrible things to happen to them in order to serve God. He tells all, not just women, but everyone, to submit. It at least seems that those who endure suffering are held in greater honor by God.

I guess what I do not understand about your point of view is that you are grouping women in the same category as slaves. What I am reading is, "Women are no better than slaves so they should just submit". Also, when women are abused they are abused BECAUSE THEY ARE WHAT GOD CREATED THEM TO BE AND THAT IS WRONG! The disciples suffered for Christ. Women who are being abused, are not being abused because they are CHRISTIAN women, they are being abused because they are WOMEN.

I can understand submitting to abuse for Christ, but not for being a woman.

 

[JFSurvivor]

LionEyes,

Yeraza makes some good points about sin not being Gods will. God NEVER intends for sin. God loves us and ALL ABUSE COMES FROM THE DEVIL! Everything that has happened to hurt women is from the DEVIL!

Jesus loves you as you are, a woman. He loves you inside and out and doesn't want anything bad to happen to you.

However, he does want you to grow in hard times when they come cuz he knows they will come because we live in a fallen world. He also wants to be there for us in hard times. Just because bad things happen, doesn't mean it's Gods will. Gods will is that NONE should perish, unfortunately people will perish so Gods will isn't always done. This is why we need to pray for it. (I learned that from a preacher guy).

hope this helps.

-JF

 

[ELECT]

[h=1]Genesis 3:16King James Version (KJV)[/h]16 Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee.

 

[JFSurvivor]

Genesis 3:16King James Version (KJV)

16 Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee.

Meaning, the part in red is the result of the sin, of a fallen world, not Gods punishment. I think he was telling them what was to come.

 

[ELECT]

Meaning, the part in red is the result of the sin, of a fallen world, not Gods punishment. I think he was telling them what was to come.

Why do you think the woman is the weaker vessel ?

 

[JFSurvivor]

Why do you think the woman is the weaker vessel ?

in what aspect? Physically yes. Mentally and intellectually, no. Why do you ask?

 

[presidente]

Comparatively, gender egalitarian societies (what few that exist) do work. In such societies, domestic violence and rape are virtually unheard of.

What do you have in mind, specifically? When you talk about gender egalitarian societies, I think of Sweden, a horizontally individualistic culture where feminist philosophy is strong and there are a lot of women in government. Other countries in Scandanavia are culturally similar. Looking at Wikipedia, it says that there were 63 rapes in Sweden per 100,000. Doing some math with a 320 M population in the US and the Wikipedia statistics for rapes in the US, there were about 28 rapes or sexual assaults in the US.


This article indicates that Scandinavia has high rates of domestic violence when compared to it's neighbors.
Sweden stands out in domestic violence study - The Local

 

[LionEyes]

Everything that has happened to hurt women is from the DEVIL!

Neither God nor the Devil are to blame for the actions of people.

and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee.

No.

What do you have in mind, specifically? When you talk about gender egalitarian societies, I think of Sweden ...

I was not referring to Sweden.

I'm not trying to argue that everyone should reject God's laws regarding gender roles. I'm only saying that I, personally, will not follow those laws.

 

[psychomom]

perhaps it would be wise to define equality in marriage?

 

[Sirk]

I'm not trying to argue that everyone should reject God's laws regarding gender roles. I'm only saying that I, personally, will not follow those laws.

What will you follow?

 

[LionEyes]

What will you follow?

Whatever's right.

 

[Sirk]

Whatever's right.

What is right based on?

 

[LionEyes]

What is right based on?

I'm not following God's laws. If that means I go to Hell, so be it. It's my choice. Leave me alone.

 

[Sirk]

I'm not following God's laws. If that means I go to Hell, so be it. It's my choice. Leave me alone.

I asked a serious question. You said that you will do whatever is right. How will you know it is right?

 

[LionEyes]

I asked a serious question. You said that you will do whatever is right. How will you know it is right?

I'm aware it was a serious question. But I've already been through this several times and I know how the argument goes, so I'm just cutting to the chase. You're not going to change my mind. This conversation is over.

 

[Sirk]

I'm aware it was a serious question. But I've already been through this several times and I know how the argument goes, so I'm just cutting to the chase. You're not going to change my mind. This conversation is over.

I'm not gonna juke you...I promise. I just wanna know how you will know what is right.

 

[LionEyes]

I'm not gonna juke you...I promise. I just wanna know how you will know what is right.

Well ... The story goes that there was this snake in a garden ...

 

[Sirk]

Well ... The story goes that there was this snake in a garden ...

I wanna hear your perspective.