SAVED BY WORKS

[kennethcadwell]

I will again show you james in context.

[SUP]21 [/SUP]Therefore lay aside all filthiness and overflow of wickedness, and receive with meekness the implanted word, which is able to save your souls.

[SUP]22 [/SUP]But be doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving yourselves. [SUP]23 [/SUP]For if anyone is a hearer of the word and not a doer, he is like a man observing his natural face in a mirror; [SUP]24 [/SUP]for he observes himself, goes away, and immediately forgets what kind of man he was. [SUP]25 [/SUP]But he who looks into the perfect law of liberty and continues in it, and is not a forgetful hearer but a doer of the work, this one will be blessed in what he does.

[SUP]26 [/SUP]If anyone among you[SUP][b][/SUP] thinks he is religious, and does not bridle his tongue but deceives his own heart, this one’s religion is useless. [SUP]27 [/SUP]Pure and undefiled religion before God and the Father is this: to visit orphans and widows in their trouble, and to keep oneself unspotted from the world.


Not everyone who james spoke to was saved, if they were saved, james would not tell them to recieve the word which can save them, for they would already be saved.

he just got done telling them to test their faith.

if a person is a sinner, they have not been saved yet, they are still dead in sin.

thats the part you can not fathom, your trying so hard to earn you way to heaven, and think you have made it you reject what james said

[SUP]9 [/SUP]but if you show partiality, you commit sin, and are convicted by the law as transgressors. [SUP]10 [/SUP]For whoever shall keep the whole law, and yet stumble in one point, he is guilty of all. [SUP]1[/SUP]

The law still condemns you, yet you claim it can not. you have been placed above the law. sorry bro, apart from the cross. this is not true.

James 1:2-3

My brethren, count it all joy when ye fall into divers temptations;
knowing that the testing of your faith produces endurance.

(1:12) Blessed is the man that endureth temptation: for when he is tried, he shall receive the crown of life, which the Lord hath promised to them that love him.

(1:26) If any man among you seem to be religious, and bridleth not his tongue, but deceiveth his own heart, this man's religion is vain.

(2:1)My brethren, have not the faith of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Lord of glory, with respect of persons.

(2:8-9) If ye fulfil the royal law according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself, ye do well:
But if you show partiality, you are committing sin and are convicted by the law as transgressors.

(5:10) Take, my brethren, the prophets, who have spoken in the name of the Lord, for an example of suffering affliction, and of patience.


James is showing that his whole epistle is to believers in the faith of Christ, and telling them how they can not act.
And he shows that if they continue to act in these ways there is no salvation coming to them, because ones actions, how they speak to others, and how they walk does matter when it comes to salvation. The final scripture says these brethren turn away from the faith, and you can not turn away from the faith if you were never part of it. Then he clearly says if you return them to the Lord, not bring them to Him for the first time, then you will save their soul from death.

 

[mailmandan]

The first problem with that type of debate about what James is saying, is that James multiple times clearly says they are brethren in the faith of salvation through Christ.

Once again, James said - Brethren, if anyone "among" you wanders from the truth.. Not everyone "among" the brethren are genuine Christians. As in 1 John 2:19, we read - They went out from us, (were among them) but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us; but they went out that they might be made manifest, that none of them were of us. Second, even IF they were truly part of the "brethren," death can mean spiritual or physical death depending on the context, so you have no concrete argument.

Then the second thing is how do we know that this scripture is speaking of the second death in the lake of fire? Because James here clearly says you will save their soul from death. Physical death in the flesh only kills the body, and the only person who can destroy the soul is God when He sends it to the lake of fire.

So in Matthew 26:38, when Jesus said - "My soul [psuche] is deeply grieved, to the point of death," He was talking about His soul being destroyed in the lake of fire? In Revelation 16:3, "The second angel poured out his bowl into the sea, and it became blood like that of a dead man; and every living soul [psuche] in the sea died." Every living soul in the sea was destroyed in the lake of fire? NO and NO.

Matthew 10:28
And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

Are you saying that the soul and the spirit are the exact same thing? Hebrews 4:12 - For the word of God is living and powerful, and sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing even to the division of soul AND spirit.. Only God can destroy both soul and body in hell. Man can only kill the physical body. So why didn't you address the many other passages of scripture that I shared with you in post #743?

 

[Reborn]

James 1:2-3
My brethren, count it all joy when ye fall into divers temptations;
knowing that the testing of your faith produces endurance.

What about the introduction to James' epistle?
You went right to James 1:2 ?

 

[kennethcadwell]

Once again, James said - Brethren, if anyone "among" you wanders from the truth.. Not everyone "among" the brethren are genuine Christians. As in 1 John 2:19, we read - They went out from us, (were among them) but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us; but they went out that they might be made manifest, that none of them were of us. Second, even IF they were truly part of the "brethren," death can mean spiritual or physical death depending on the context, so you have no concrete argument.

So in Matthew 26:38, when Jesus said - "My soul [psuche] is deeply grieved, to the point of death," He was talking about His soul being destroyed in the lake of fire? In Revelation 16:3, "The second angel poured out his bowl into the sea, and it became blood like that of a dead man; and every living soul [psuche] in the sea died." Every living soul in the sea was destroyed in the lake of fire? NO and NO.

Are you saying that the soul and the spirit are the exact same thing? Hebrews 4:12 - For the word of God is living and powerful, and sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing even to the division of soul AND spirit.. Only God can destroy both soul and body in hell. Man can only kill the physical body. So why didn't you address the many other passages of scripture that I shared with you in post #743?

The group being talked about in 1 John 2:19 is not the same group that James is talking to.
The group in 1 John 2:19 says they are forms of the antichrist, meaning their whole purpose was to sneak in and deceive some from the faith. The group in James is clearly called brethren in the faith, as James opens up telling them that their faith in Christ will be tested and those that endure through the testing will receive eternal life. You are comparing two very different group of individuals by trying to place those of James as the same as those in 1 John 2:19.

We must put scripture in proper context as Jesus is not saying there in Matthew 26:38 that His soul will be put to death. What He is saying is that His sorrow will be carried with Him all the way to death. Revelation 16:3 says every living creature, not every living soul......

 

[kennethcadwell]

[/FONT][/COLOR]
[/FONT][/COLOR]

What about the introduction to James' epistle?
You went right to James 1:2 ?

I went straight to verse 2 and 3 because it shows James clearly calling them brethren in the faith.
Just because he is saying in the 1st scripture that he is writing to the 12 Jewish tribes does not change this situation, as Jewish believers in Christ have no different standards to follow in the faith the Gentile believers do. I do not know why some try to divide this issue and make who is being talked to as if it matters because of differences.
Apostle Paul clearly says there is no difference between a Jewish and Gentile believer in Christ, so rather James is talking to Jewish believers does not mean it does not apply to Gentile believers.

 

[kennethcadwell]

The other two arguments are the wanderer is either a professing Christian, whose faith is not genuine or a sinning Christian, who needs to be restored. For the former, the death spoken of in vs. 20 is the "second death"; (Revelation 21:8) for the latter, it is "physical death" (1 Corinthians 5:1-5; 11:29-32; 1 John 5:16).

*Notice - Brethren, if anyone "among" you wanders from the truth..turns a "sinner" from the error of his way.. Some would argue that James says this one who turned from the truth was a "sinner," and was "among" but "not of" the Brethren, so he wasn’t previously saved. That fits 1 John 2:19 - They went out "from" us, but they were "not of" us.. Also, 1 John 3:9 says that no one who is born of God practices sin, because His seed abides in him; and he cannot sin, because he is born of God. So how can one practice sin and lose their salvation if they are born of God, do not practice sin and cannot?

IF this person was a genuine believer, yet how do you know for sure this is the second death in the lake of fire? In Matthew 26:38, Jesus said: "My soul [psuche] is deeply grieved, to the point of death." Jesus was not saying that His soul was deeply grieved to the point of spiritual death, Rather, Jesus was talking about his human life. In Revelation 16:3, "The second angel poured out his bowl into the sea, and it became blood like that of a dead man; and every living soul [psuche] in the sea died". In 1 Peter 3:20 "... God kept waiting in the days of Noah, during the construction of the ark, in which a few, that is, eight persons, [psuche-souls] were brought safely (saved from drowning, physical death) through the water" by the ark (Hebrews 11:7). "Soul" is rendered from the Greek word "psuche" and is also translated as "life". The word "psuche" is never translated as "spirit." In 1 Corinthians 5:5, we read - I have decided to deliver such a one to Satan for the destruction of his flesh, (physical death) so that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus (no second death).

IF these "sinners" were never saved to begin with. Jesus covered our sins in one way (Romans 4:7) by bringing forgiveness for all believers, yet sins can also be covered in a different way. In Proverbs 10:12, we read: Hatred stirs up strife, But love covers all sins. In 1 Peter 4:8, we read: And above all things have fervent love for one another, for "love will cover a multitude of sins." Where there is strife, there is hatred and unless love prevails, the strife will get worse. Love covers offenses and sins when a believer turns back from error.

As for 1 Corinthians 5:1-5; 11:29-32 neither one of these is talking about physical death.
The first passage is speaking of those who continue to walk a sinful lifestyle while being a member of the church, and if they do not give up their ways then they are to be cast out of the church so that by being left and shunned by the church and left to handle their issues alone in a sinful world would cause them to repent and come back to the Lord by hitting rock bottom in their life.
The second passage is speaking of when we do something in an unworthy manner we would be judge and chastened by the Lord through the Spirit to get us to turn from that way and not get condemned with the rest of the sinful world.

1 John 3:9 does say one who is born of God can not sin, and that is because the fruits that come from the Holy Spirit will not lead one to sin as they are all done by love which is the opposite of sin. James tells us how a person who is born again can still sin, as he says they are drawn away in temptation by their own lusts. James then says to believers that if in turn you let that lust grow and get full grown it gives birth to sin, and that sin if it controls you again leads to death and not eternal life.

1 Peter 3:20 does say 8 souls were saved by water as in Noah and his family, as the rest of the wicked world was destroyed by the water. This time the destruction of souls will not come by water, but by fire in the lake of fire that will devour all adversaries of God; disobedient and unbelievers alike.......

 

[Jackson123]

[video]https://youtu.be/rez0izk5_gE[/video]

 

[mailmandan]

The group being talked about in 1 John 2:19 is not the same group that James is talking to.
The group in 1 John 2:19 says they are forms of the antichrist, meaning their whole purpose was to sneak in and deceive some from the faith.

So only unbelievers whose whole purpose is to sneak in and deceive some from the faith are anti/against/Christ but unbelievers whose whole purpose is to not sneak in and deceive some from the faith are not anti/against/Christ? They are for Christ? 1 John 2 still opens up with "My little children" but of course that does not mean that everyone being addressed in the letter is a Christian and it's the same with the book of James.

The group in James is clearly called brethren in the faith, as James opens up telling them that their faith in Christ will be tested and those that endure through the testing will receive eternal life.

So you see two separate camps of brethren/Christians? Those who endure and receive eternal life and those who fail to endure and do not receive eternal life? James 1:2 - My brethren, count it all joy when you fall into various trials, 3 knowing that the testing of your faith produces patience. 4 But let patience have its perfect work, that you may be perfect and complete, lacking nothing. Verse 12 says - Blessed is the man who endures temptation; for when he has been approved, he will receive the crown of life which the Lord has promised to those who love Him. Who endures temptation and loves the Lord? Children of God or children of the devil? In 2 Corinthians 13:5, Paul said test yourselves to see if you are in the faith; examine yourselves! Or do you not recognize this about yourselves, that Jesus Christ is in you-unless indeed you fail the test?

You are comparing two very different group of individuals by trying to place those of James as the same as those in 1 John 2:19.

I'm simply making the point that just because a letter is addressed to "My little children/brethren" does not mean that everyone being discussed in the letter is a genuine Christian. Ultimately, there are two groups of people. Believers and unbelievers. He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned already.. (John 3:18).

We must put scripture in proper context as Jesus is not saying there in Matthew 26:38 that His soul will be put to death. What He is saying is that His sorrow will be carried with Him all the way to death.

Jesus' soul will not be destroyed "put to death in the lake of fire" but His soul is still deeply grieved, to the point of death, in which He was talking about physical death, not spiritual death. Greek word for death "thanatos" can be used to describe physical or spiritual death, depending on the context. Definition: death, physical or spiritual.

Revelation 16:3 says every living creature, not every living soul......

Revelation 16:3 - And the second angel poured out his vial upon the sea; and it became as the blood of a dead man: and every living soul [psuche] died in the sea (KJV).

 

[mailmandan]

As for 1 Corinthians 5:1-5; 11:29-32 neither one of these is talking about physical death.

Excuse me? Destruction of the flesh is not about physical death? The word "sleep" refers to death, the physical death of believers, not spiritual death (John 11:11-12; Acts 7:60; 1 Corinthians 15:6,18,20,51; 1 Thessalonians 4:13-15; 2 Peter 3:4).

The first passage is speaking of those who continue to walk a sinful lifestyle while being a member of the church, and if they do not give up their ways then they are to be cast out of the church so that by being left and shunned by the church and left to handle their issues alone in a sinful world would cause them to repent and come back to the Lord by hitting rock bottom in their life.

Destruction of the flesh is more than simply being shunned by the church. This is grave physical consequences and goes beyond common divine chastening of the Lord - ólethros (from ollymi/"destroy") – properly, ruination with its full, destructive results.

The second passage is speaking of when we do something in an unworthy manner we would be judge and chastened by the Lord through the Spirit to get us to turn from that way and not get condemned with the rest of the sinful world.

God chastens His children. Weak, sickly and sleep do not equate to condemned with the world.

1 John 3:9 does say one who is born of God can not sin, and that is because the fruits that come from the Holy Spirit will not lead one to sin as they are all done by love which is the opposite of sin.

John said that no one who is born of God practices sin.. The idea of practice is to perform repeatedly or habitually and thus describes repetition or continuous action. The practice is habitual, as one's lifestyle or bent of life. Those who continue to practice such sins in Galatians 5:19-21 demonstrate that they have not been born of God. This does not mean that those who are born of God never sin at all. Christians are not sinless, without fault of defect, flawless, 100% of the time.

James tells us how a person who is born again can still sin, as he says they are drawn away in temptation by their own lusts. James then says to believers that if in turn you let that lust grow and get full grown it gives birth to sin, and that sin if it controls you again leads to death and not eternal life.

While sin does not result in spiritual death for those who are born of God, it can lead to premature physical death.

1 Peter 3:20 does say 8 souls were saved by water as in Noah and his family, as the rest of the wicked world was destroyed by the water. This time the destruction of souls will not come by water, but by fire in the lake of fire that will devour all adversaries of God; disobedient and unbelievers alike.......

8 souls were saved (physically from drowning-physical death) through water (1 Peter 3:20-NAS) but they were literally saved by the ARK (Hebrews 11:7). Notice that you said the rest of the wicked world was destroyed by water (you admit they were physically killed by the water) yet in 1 Corinthians 5:5, you soften the word destruction to mean something other than destroyed/physically killed.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

James 1:2-3

My brethren, count it all joy when ye fall into divers temptations;
knowing that the testing of your faith produces endurance.

(1:12)Blessed is the man that endureth temptation: for when he is tried, he shall receive the crown of life, which the Lord hath promised to them that love him.

(1:26) If any man among you seem to be religious, and bridleth not his tongue, but deceiveth his own heart, this man's religion is vain.

(2:1)My brethren, have not the faith of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Lord of glory, with respect of persons.

(2:8-9) If ye fulfil the royal law according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself, ye do well:
But if you show partiality, you are committing sin and are convicted by the law as transgressors.

(5:10)Take, my brethren, the prophets, who have spoken in the name of the Lord, for an example of suffering affliction, and of patience.


James is showing that his whole epistle is to believers in the faith of Christ, and telling them how they can not act.
And he shows that if they continue to act in these ways there is no salvation coming to them, because ones actions, how they speak to others, and how they walk does matter when it comes to salvation. The final scripture says these brethren turn away from the faith, and you can not turn away from the faith if you were never part of it. Then he clearly says if you return them to the Lord, not bring them to Him for the first time, then you will save their soul from death.

oh he is? I guess you did not read anything of the latter part of that chapter, or chapter 2. where he claims people claim to have faith, but their faith is dead, which can not save anyone.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

The group being talked about in 1 John 2:19 is not the same group that James is talking to.
The group in 1 John 2:19 says they are forms of the antichrist, meaning their whole purpose was to sneak in and deceive some from the faith. The group in James is clearly called brethren in the faith, as James opens up telling them that their faith in Christ will be tested and those that endure through the testing will receive eternal life. You are comparing two very different group of individuals by trying to place those of James as the same as those in 1 John 2:19.

We must put scripture in proper context as Jesus is not saying there in Matthew 26:38 that His soul will be put to death. What He is saying is that His sorrow will be carried with Him all the way to death. Revelation 16:3 says every living creature, not every living soul......

no, this is not even true.

a person who snuck in to decieve would not leave, they would stay and keep trying to decieve.

the people who left BECAME antichrist, they were not antichrist when they were a part.

 

[kennethcadwell]

So only unbelievers whose whole purpose is to sneak in and deceive some from the faith are anti/against/Christ but unbelievers whose whole purpose is to not sneak in and deceive some from the faith are not anti/against/Christ? They are for Christ? 1 John 2 still opens up with "My little children" but of course that does not mean that everyone being addressed in the letter is a Christian and it's the same with the book of James.

So you see two separate camps of brethren/Christians? Those who endure and receive eternal life and those who fail to endure and do not receive eternal life? James 1:2 - My brethren, count it all joy when you fall into various trials, 3 knowing that the testing of your faith produces patience. 4 But let patience have its perfect work, that you may be perfect and complete, lacking nothing. Verse 12 says - Blessed is the man who endures temptation; for when he has been approved, he will receive the crown of life which the Lord has promised to those who love Him. Who endures temptation and loves the Lord? Children of God or children of the devil? In 2 Corinthians 13:5, Paul said test yourselves to see if you are in the faith; examine yourselves! Or do you not recognize this about yourselves, that Jesus Christ is in you-unless indeed you fail the test?

I'm simply making the point that just because a letter is addressed to "My little children/brethren" does not mean that everyone being discussed in the letter is a genuine Christian. Ultimately, there are two groups of people. Believers and unbelievers. He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned already.. (John 3:18).

Jesus' soul will not be destroyed "put to death in the lake of fire" but His soul is still deeply grieved, to the point of death, in which He was talking about physical death, not spiritual death. Greek word for death "thanatos" can be used to describe physical or spiritual death, depending on the context. Definition: death, physical or spiritual.

Revelation 16:3 - And the second angel poured out his vial upon the sea; and it became as the blood of a dead man: and every living soul [psuche] died in the sea (KJV).

If you want to call people who have walked in the faith and are still weak in the faith to where a trial, tribulation, or hardship takes and causes them to fall away from the faith as a form of the antichrist that is on you. People who hear the word and want to come to the Lord but are hindered by false teachers, or are not given the time and attention in love to help them grow in the faith and then fall away do to hardships is not forms of the antichrist. They are deceived people who need our help to guide them out of that deception. The scripture in 1 John clearly says in the previous verse the ones who is being talked about is forms of the antichrist who are deceivers, not the deceived.
Sin no matter how you look at it, if it is not repented/confessed of is not forgiven rather a believer or not.
James clearly is talking to believers and he says when sin gets full grown to where you obey it again instead of obeying the Lord, that sin will lead to death and the death he is speaking of is not physical death in the flesh. We know this from his final verse that their soul will be saved if returned to the Lord. Physical death in the flesh only kills the body and not the soul.

Excuse me? Destruction of the flesh is not about physical death? [/COLOR]The word "sleep" refers to death, the physical death of believers, not spiritual death (John 11:11-12; Acts 7:60; 1 Corinthians 15:6,18,20,51; 1 Thessalonians 4:13-15; 2 Peter 3:4).

Destruction of the flesh is more than simply being shunned by the church. This is grave physical consequences and goes beyond common divine chastening of the Lord - ólethros (from ollymi/"destroy") – properly, ruination with its full, destructive results.

God chastens His children. Weak, sickly and sleep do not equate to condemned with the world.

John said that no one who is born of God practices sin.. The idea of practice is to perform repeatedly or habitually and thus describes repetition or continuous action. The practice is habitual, as one's lifestyle or bent of life. Those who continue to practice such sins in Galatians 5:19-21 demonstrate that they have not been born of God. This does not mean that those who are born of God never sin at all. Christians are not sinless, without fault of defect, flawless, 100% of the time.

While sin does not result in spiritual death for those who are born of God, it can lead to premature physical death.

8 souls were saved (physically from drowning-physical death) through water (1 Peter 3:20-NAS) but they were literally saved by the ARK (Hebrews 11:7). Notice that you said the rest of the wicked world was destroyed by water (you admit they were physically killed by the water) yet in 1 Corinthians 5:5, you soften the word destruction to mean something other than destroyed/physically killed.

Destruction of the flesh is not about physical death, you have to read the whole context in that chapter.
Nobody can be saved after they physically die in unrepented sins, so making the destruction of the flesh being physical death does not fit scripture. The Lord Jesus clearly shows in His parables that once a person dies their chance at receiving eternal life is over, for He says we should have obeyed His ways while in the flesh. No repentance, no confession, then you die = No salvation.

That scripture in 1 John does not say practices sin, it says does not sin.
We do sin but the bible makes it clear that you can not continue to sin on an everyday basis, as to continue to do the same sins day in and day out shows no true repentance. The Lord says produce fruit worthy of repentance, which means if your repentance was true the Holy Spirit will be in you and the fruits produced thereof will not lead a person to sin. How can a person sin if they walk in love, they can't because love is the opposite of wrong doing. Every fruit of the Spirit will not cause or lead a person to sin, if you do sin it is because you have fallen away by giving into your own lusts. And once again James says if it gets full grown and controls you again it leads to death and not eternal life.

 

[kennethcadwell]

oh he is? I guess you did not read anything of the latter part of that chapter, or chapter 2. where he claims people claim to have faith, but their faith is dead, which can not save anyone.

Yes I did read that as I read the whole book multiple times, and it still does not go against what I said that James is talking to believers on how they can not act in the faith. He opens it straight up and repeats himself in his epistle they are in the faith and that their faith will be tested.
The speaking to them about having a dead faith goes exactly with what and how a believer must act, he says if your faith does not have works then it is a dead faith. Meaning the fruits of the Spirit will show through in one's outer actions/deeds/works. No sign of the fruits of the Spirit, no salvation. A person can not just profess to believe in the Lord if it is an empty profession with no sign of true love for Him that follows.

no, this is not even true.

a person who snuck in to decieve would not leave, they would stay and keep trying to decieve.

the people who left BECAME antichrist, they were not antichrist when they were a part.

They would not stay if they have been ousted from the church, which is what we are told to do about false teachers and those who continue to live a sinful lifestyle and do not want to give it up (1 Corinthians 5).

This is why we are told to test all spirits, as even those who are preaching from the pulpit in the churches we go to may not be lead by spirits of God. If there message does not line up with scripture then the spirit is not of God, and nowhere in the bible does it say to confirm the gospel to fit our lives, we are to confirm our lives to fit His gospel.

 

[michael56]

If you want to call people who have walked in the faith and are still weak in the faith to where a trial, tribulation, or hardship takes and causes them to fall away from the faith as a form of the antichrist that is on you. People who hear the word and want to come to the Lord but are hindered by false teachers, or are not given the time and attention in love to help them grow in the faith and then fall away do to hardships is not forms of the antichrist. They are deceived people who need our help to guide them out of that deception. The scripture in 1 John clearly says in the previous verse the ones who is being talked about is forms of the antichrist who are deceivers, not the deceived.
Sin no matter how you look at it, if it is not repented/confessed of is not forgiven rather a believer or not.
James clearly is talking to believers and he says when sin gets full grown to where you obey it again instead of obeying the Lord, that sin will lead to death and the death he is speaking of is not physical death in the flesh. We know this from his final verse that their soul will be saved if returned to the Lord. Physical death in the flesh only kills the body and not the soul.








Destruction of the flesh is not about physical death, you have to read the whole context in that chapter.
Nobody can be saved after they physically die in unrepented sins, so making the destruction of the flesh being physical death does not fit scripture. The Lord Jesus clearly shows in His parables that once a person dies their chance at receiving eternal life is over, for He says we should have obeyed His ways while in the flesh. No repentance, no confession, then you die = No salvation.

That scripture in 1 John does not say practices sin, it says does not sin.
We do sin but the bible makes it clear that you can not continue to sin on an everyday basis, as to continue to do the same sins day in and day out shows no true repentance. The Lord says produce fruit worthy of repentance, which means if your repentance was true the Holy Spirit will be in you and the fruits produced thereof will not lead a person to sin. How can a person sin if they walk in love, they can't because love is the opposite of wrong doing. Every fruit of the Spirit will not cause or lead a person to sin, if you do sin it is because you have fallen away by giving into your own lusts. And once again James says if it gets full grown and controls you again it leads to death and not eternal life.

Does God have all the glory in your life if or when you live an ever holier life, or do you get some of the credit?

 

[psalm6819]

good point

 

[kennethcadwell]

Does God have all the glory in your life if or when you live an ever holier life, or do you get some of the credit?

God does have all the glory and gets all the credit for what He has done in my life, which is why I will defend His word and continue to defend His word all through out the bible.

People who were once in the faith of Christ can fall away by turning their back on Him.
Lord Jesus, Paul, Peter, James, and John all say this happens, and Paul even states the Holy Spirit saying this. I think I will believe all their testimonies over those who say people can't fall away. As they are the Lord and those lead by His Spirit who all agree with this, so by calling me a false teacher would be calling them false teachers because I just repeat what they said.

 

[michael56]

God does have all the glory and gets all the credit for what He has done in my life, which is why I will defend His word and continue to defend His word all through out the bible.

People who were once in the faith of Christ can fall away by turning their back on Him.
Lord Jesus, Paul, Peter, James, and John all say this happens, and Paul even states the Holy Spirit saying this. I think I will believe all their testimonies over those who say people can't fall away. As they are the Lord and those lead by His Spirit who all agree with this, so by calling me a false teacher would be calling them false teachers because I just repeat what they said.

I'm glad you agree you can take no credit if or when you live an ever holier life, it is only what God can do in you, not what you can do of yourself

 

[kennethcadwell]

I'm glad you agree you can take no credit if or when you live an ever holier life, it is only what God can do in you, not what you can do of yourself

Exactly which is why I say yes by ourselves we can not do anything.
But then I defend in His word how He says for those of us who believe, through Him all things are possible.
It really perplexes me people say they are born again yet say they still can not keep His commandments, this would be in contradiction to scripture that all things are possible for those who believe.

 

[michael56]

Exactly which is why I say yes by ourselves we can not do anything.
But then I defend in His word how He says for those of us who believe, through Him all things are possible.
It really perplexes me people say they are born again yet say they still can not keep His commandments, this would be in contradiction to scripture that all things are possible for those who believe.

And yet, you cannot yourself say you obey all of Christ's commands in the Gospels.

 

[TheMouse]

Dead works would be anything that is not done in a spirit of love. That is to say not from loving motives. Love is unselfish and self sacrificing. Much of the time we do things to gratify ourselves often at a cost to others. Jesus said that to love your neighbor as yourself is one of the most important commandments. In fact when we do this we are pleasing to Him because he loves people deeply, and it also helps people see what his character is like. We however by our own fault are corrupt and selfish, and so we cannot achieve this without first receiving Gods Saviour Jesus. That is to say we must ask Him to forgive us and to come into our lives as our friend to help us not to sin. Jesus said that the person who is forgiven the most will love him the most.
You may have heard that salvation is by faith alone.This means that a person has seen in Jesus (Who is God) the source of Gods forgiveness and so that person goes to Jesus to save him from himself. No matter how much effort I make, I cannot either make up for the badness of my sin, or change myself to be someone who is pleasing God. Jesus must do this for me.If I were trying to do all this for myself, no matter how many good deeds were involved, it would be dead works.Works done out of motives such as pride,lust and even guilt are dead works.