Sabbath

valiant · Apr 5, 2015

are you suggesting that having faith in the Sabbath will save you? It figures. By all means trust in the Sabbath to save you if you want to. You will be lost in the end. I prefer to have my trust in Jesus Christ my Saviour and Lord.

Not seeing the promised land was specifically due to their unwillingness to enter into the land when God commanded them to. It had nothing to do with faith in the Sabbath. Their problem was lack of faith in God. READ THE SCRIPTURES instead of giving us your own strange ideas.

valiant · Apr 5, 2015

Jeff_56 said:

If that is how you interpret what I said you certainly are mixed up. Let me explain it in simple words. The first day of the week (SUNDAY) WAS observed in Paul's days. So how can it be due to Constantine? Far from confirming it I proved it WRONG. I prefer to go to the Scriptures rather than the Jews. I guess you are still under the yoke of bondage.

prove-all · Apr 5, 2015

valiant said:

No I am not suggesting,nor I never said the sabbath will save me,
only faith in Jesus and his blood,shed on the holyday of passover, can do that.

because of that, in the n.t. it says to keep [a feast]
then he goes on to tell us how to keep it, but he said to keep [a] feast day.

I did suggest that [they] died in the wilderness and [not] see there promised land,
because of the [dis] belief in his Sabbath days, and as an example for us today.

17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets:
I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.

18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall
in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

- so this is explained by some as till the cross maybe?

19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments,
and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven:

but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom..

-so how do you explain that verse? 2 groups of people , or verses in revalations?

Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that
[keep] the [commandments of God], [and] the [faith of Jesus].

anyone that has the [faith in Jesus] is a friend but.

The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom:
and the knowledge of the holy is understanding.

The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom:
a good understanding have all they that do his commandments:
his praise endureth for ever.

The fear of the Lord is the beginning of knowledge:
but fools despise wisdom and instruction.

God does not force his will on us, I feel it is up to you to decide,
I can not judge, but afraid people might miss out on knowledge and wisdom .

please do not knock it, untill you have tried it [in faith]

just-me · Apr 5, 2015

valiant said:

Ironic as it may seem "Sunday" is the term used to describe the worshiping of the sun god Baal. "Saturday" Is named after the god Saturn. Saturn (Latin: Saturnus) is a god in ancient Roman religion, and a character in myth. Saturn is a complex figure because of his multiple associations and long history. He was the first god of the Capitol, known since the most ancient times as Saturnius Mons, and was seen as a god of generation, dissolution, plenty, wealth, agriculture, periodic renewal and liberation. In later developments he came to be also a god of time. His reign was depicted as a Golden Age of plenty and peace. The Temple of Saturn in the Roman Forum housed the state treasury. In December, he was celebrated at what is perhaps the most famous of the Roman festivals, the Saturnalia, a time of feasting, role reversals, free speech, gift-giving and revelry. Saturn the planet and Saturday are both named after the god.

Take your pick in which god you desire to serve.

"And if it seem evil unto you to serve the Lord, choose you this day whom ye will serve; whether the gods which your fathers served that were on the other side of the flood, or the gods of the Amorites, in whose land ye dwell: but as for me and my house, we will serve the Lord." Joshua 24:15

Constantine from the first Roman Catholic church instigated these things into the church in order to bring Rome back together as it once was. It didn't work the way he wanted it to. If it would have been done God's way instead of his own desires, it would have worked because Rome didn't really matter to the Truth. Rome was NEVER the kingdom of God through Christ. And the church is not the Mediator.

valiant · Apr 5, 2015

prove-all said:

I am pleased to hear that. Don't you think it would have saved you whenever it was offered?

you really must cite Scriptures. your word is just not good enough especially as you have your own method of interpretation.

we are waiting for your Scriptures.

But Numbers TELLS US THE REASON. It had nothing to do with the Sabbath or its observance. Their sin was to refuse to invade the land when God told them to,

true and as I showed you He has fulfilled the Sabbath by giving us permanent rest.

until it is fulfilled. much of it has been fulfilled thus no more sacrifices, no Sabbath, and so on.

not by me. it will apply until it is fulfilled. it is of course true that some of its fulfilment was at the cross.

true until they have been fulfilled

yes they are permanent. but once some has been fulfilled It is replaced by what fulfilled it. the Sabbath has been fulfilled by Christ giving us rest (Matt 11.28-30)

well commandments of God is far wider than the ten commandments which were covenant stipulations. we do have to keep the commandments of God, until with regard to ritual it is fulfilled. Or do you still offer sacrifices? they were commanded by God.

Jeff_56 · Apr 5, 2015

i don't interpret what you said. I don't even care what you said or say, except for loss of souls as a cause or a result -- you speak against GOD'S WORD. GOD'S WORD is TRUE.
I speak GOD'S WORD.

valiant said:

valiant · Apr 5, 2015

just-me said:

I really do not care how it got its name. I am quite happy to speak about sunday. its origins mean nothing to me. it is the first day of the week on which the early Christians in Paul's times worshiped Jesus Christ.

some of you people get hung up on what is irrelevant.

KohenMatt · Apr 5, 2015

Some encouraging food for thought if it hasn't been shared already.....

Yesterday was the Sabbath (and Passover for many). Members of our church worked quite a bit Friday night and Saturday to help set up for it. There are some who would question if that's "working" on the Sabbath. When you look at the duties of the priests, they offered up double the work on the Sabbath in order to minister to God and others. As priests today (1 Pet 2:9), we can offer up double the "work" on the Sabbath, realizing that it is truly ministering to God and others.

That realization offers up quite a bit of freedom and blessing.

prove-all · Apr 5, 2015

valiant said:

Neither can a man call any other day of the week the Sabbath, or a Sabbath,
and make that day blessed or sanctified by God.

“Behold, I will rain bread from heaven for you; and the people shall go out and gather
a certain rate every day, that I may prove them, whether they will walk in my law,or no.

And it shall come to pass, that on the sixth day they shall prepare that which they bring in;
and it shall be twice as muchnas they gather daily”

-some of the people attempted to gather manna on the Sabbath.
God was angry with them and the entire nation—including Moses

“How long refuse ye to keep my commandments and my laws?(27-30)
This incident happened prior to the giving of the Ten Commandments.

-God considered it a gift: “See, for that the [Eternal]hath given you the sabbath …”

The miracle of manna continued each week until Joshua took them into
the Promised Land (Joshua 5:12)

And Noah kept it, because Noah was a preacher of righteousness (2 Peter 2:5)
and “all thy commandments are righteousness” (Psalm 119:172).

before moses Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments,
my statutes, and my laws.Genesis 26:5-27:8.

“The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath:

Therefore the Son of man is Lord also of the sabbath” (Mark 2:27-28).
Jesus Christ established here that He was the Lord, or Master, of the Sabbath.

-Jesus Christ kept the Sabbath. It was His custom to do so (Luke 4:16)

He said,“n it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant,
nor thy maidservant,nor thy cattle,nor thy stranger that is within thy gates” (Exodus 20:10).

Every human being is required to rest on the Sabbath day— men, women, children,kings,
servants and even visitors (strangers)and animals.

Verily my sabbaths ye shall keep: for it is a sign between me and you throughout your
generations that ye may know that I am the [Eternal] that doth sanctify you”(Exodus 31:13)

“It is a sign between me and the children of Israel for ever: for in six days
the [Eternal] made heaven and earth, and on the seventh day he rested, and was refreshed”
(verse 17) similar to Exodus 20:11.

-God the Father created the Sabbath through Jesus Christ! the Logos.
Study John 1:1-3 and Ephesians 3:9.

Jesus said, “The sabbath was made.”in Ephesians 3:9,“…

God, who created all things by Jesus Christ.” All things were made by him;
and without him was not any thing made that was made.

“Wherefore the children of Israel shall keep the sabbath, to observe the sabbath
throughout their generations,for a perpetual covenant(Exodus 31:16).

It is the everlasting sign that He is the Eternal Creator.
In addition, it is also the sign that identifies the true people of God.

“If thou turn away thy foot from the sabbath, from doing thy pleasure on my holy day;

and [call the sabbath a delight], the holy of the [Eternal],honourable; and[ shalt honour him],
not doing thine own ways,nor finding thine own pleasure, nor speaking thine own words”
(Isaiah 58:13)

“Then shalt thou delight thyself in the [Eternal]; and I will cause thee to ride upon
the high places of the earth, and feed thee with the heritage of Jacob thy father:
for the mouth of the [Eternal] hath spoken it”

study the Old Testament thoroughly,the history of Israel and Judah shows that when they
worshiped the true God properly and kept His Sabbath day holy, they were blessed immeasurably.

But when they got into idolatry and disregarded the Sabbath, they suffered horribly

“Moreover also I gave them my sabbaths, to be a sign between me and them, that they might know
that I am the [Eternal] that sanctify them.

-But the house of Israel rebelled against me in the wilderness: they walked not in my statutes,
and they despised my judgments, which if a man do, he shall even live in them;

and [my sabbaths] they greatly polluted: then I said, I would pour out my fury upon them
in [the wilderness], to consume them”(Ezekiel 20:12-13).

this prophecy is dual. It was actually written down for the people of our day (Ezekiel 29:21; 33:33).

God promises when an individual keeps His Sabbath day holy:He shall live in them.

just-me · Apr 5, 2015

valiant said:

Do you find Saturday or Sunday in the Bible? There is no Biblical proof that Sunday was when the early Christians worshiped. No one knows. Sunday was endorsed to compromise the true doctrine with the doctrine of Baal the sun god known to us (in the Bible) as Nimrod. I go to church on Sunday also, but that doesn't mean I'm worshiping a pagan god in my heart. Saturday and Sunday is the time alloted according to the law of the land, but that certainly doesn't mean it's Biblical in any way. I neither condemn Saturday when some say that day is the Sabbath. I wish all would get over pushing this Saturday Sunday thing when in fact it doesn't matter. What matters in truly believing in Christ minus man made traditions.

michael56 · Apr 5, 2015

just-me said:

Amen. God will accept heartfelt praise, worship, and adoration any day of the week, that is what matters to Him, not which particular day it is given. And if you want to rest, he is cool with which day you do that also.

just-me · Apr 5, 2015

michael56 said:

What I think might be hidden by tradition, and seems not to be considered, is that there is also a 7 year Sabbath so the garden or field can rest. That Sabbath is timed according to when the soil was first tilled. I've tried it and the 8th year has always given a bumper crop. Last year was a land Sabbath, and this year is the 8th year. The onions have been planted and we are waiting for the new moon to plant the rest of the garden. Our Sabbath is not the same year as my neighbor's Sabbath

valiant · Apr 5, 2015

just-me said:

lol you really need to do some study. Baal was not the sun god. the sun god was Shemesh. Baal was the god of rain and storm and had nothing to do with Sunday.

So you are using SATURN'S day as your Sabbath? Shame on you. At least the SUN is respectable LOL

Don't you ever speak of Saturday and Sunday? Do you serve Saturn or Shemesh?

Well you are observing a mixture of Frius day and Saturn's day so we know who you serve.

There was no Roman Catholic church in Constantine's day. And worship on the first day of the week preceded Constantine by 300 years. You just use these things as bogeys to frighten the innocent who want to worship on the first day of the week like the early church did (Acts 20.7).

you have a very distorted picture of what Constantine did, and how the church responded. What has Rome got to do with the church worshiping on the first day of the week? They only took up the practise of the early church (in spite of their boasts)

valiant · Apr 5, 2015

just-me said:

experienced farmers do this all the time although doing it to a different field each year. It allows the ground to recover. You mean that you do not do it on the basis of a yearly cycle since creation? SHAME ON YOU>.

valiant · Apr 5, 2015

just-me said:

yes they are called the first day of the week and the seventh day of the week.

well Acts 20.7 is good evidence, or do you think they put that on for your benefit?

Paul knew. See Acts 20.7. Also 1 Cor 16.1.

That is simply untrue. Besides Baal was not a sun god. Where is Nimrod mentioned as the sun god? Ra was the sun god in Egypt. That should give you some fun. We should call Sunday Ra'sday lol

Nor does it for the rest of us. we don't even think of the pagan gods.

now you are talking. I only come to this thread to stop people from deceiving young believers. but some manmade traditions are useful. Thus Christmas day and Christmas carols fix the minds of many people on Christ.

atwhatcost · Apr 5, 2015

I hope I'm not entering a hornet's nest, but I wanted to answer OP's original question from a different perspective. (At least different than the first two pages I've read. Wow! 50 pages. Oy vey!)

Long ago we heard a sermon on this topic by a pastor recovering from a heart attack. His take was helpful. He studied the Bible on this matter, while he was convalescing and did some math. (And he studied this because he really had no idea what it meant to rest until he was stuck with orders to do just that.) God vomited the Israelites out of the land more than once. He told them it was because they were not worshiping him and keeping his commandments. It's been decades since I heard that sermon, and now my memory is fading, but the math worked right. For every Sabbath they ignored, for every Sabbath year they ignored, and for every Year of Jubilee they ignored they spent in exile, slaves to another nation. (The math is often divisible by 7.)

God doesn't need the rest. We do. The land does too. This I know from gardening -- plant the same crop in the same soil for more than six years and that next harvest is useless or worthless, unless I'm simply trying to grow weeds. lol That pastor did his own math. Being a pastor, he assumed he shouldn't/didn't get a Sabbath rest. He calculated it out, and the number of weeks he had to recoop from that heart attack equaled the number of Sabbaths he simply ignored. I was the same way. I worked full time, so who can go grocery shopping AND keep the house clean in one day off on a weekend? I was "pinched for time" if I went to church on Sunday, because I thought I could really use two full days to take care of what I couldn't when I worked. Now I'm disabled.

Of course I'm not saying that's why I'm disabled, however becoming disabled taught me the "importance" of having an immaculate house. (Can't do it even not working now, and yet it has not fallen apart.

)

How about a sensible approach? We ALL need time off to relax. If we don't take it, we're headed towards quicker decay. (I'm almost 59 and have already decayed faster than most 70 year olds. It is how life works.)

We were made in need of a Sabbath rest, and in need of focusing on God at all times. Let's face it. How much focusing can we do if...I need to get the dishes done, I need to get the bills paid, I have to go to work...and school, the doctor's appointment is this week? How do I eek out that time? Ohh, oh, the potluck is this Sunday? Let me get out the recipe books and decide what to make. Oh, nuts! We don't have any nuts. Got to go to the store. Oh, and Mrs. Johnson down the street is laid up, so I should check to see what she needs. And, nuts. The family will be home soon, where did the time go, and... and... and... Does this seem familiar? (I hope so, or I'll look as dumb as I feel too often. lol)

Well, what's wrong with taking a day off from that and actually enjoying some God time in the process?

Ever read the commandments -- all of them, not just the Big Ten. I have no idea how anyone was ever supposed to pull all that off, except for one thing -- God! He is the reason for all else, so what's wrong with remembering that? And what's wrong with enjoying a full day where we aren't plagued by all we "should be doing," but instead enjoying the one we're to do all things in?

Isn't it just easier to remember God? Much easier on a Sabbath rest, when the dishes can easier (I wish I could say "easily," but my roasting pans are laughing at me for not washing them last night) be ignored as they shout our names. I wish I had learned this earlier in life. Who knows? By now, maybe I'd get this better.

just-me · Apr 5, 2015

Good post atwhatcost! So true. The body needs rest and that's why our God is the Lord of the Sabbath and it was made for us.

Now to the controversial person with the name of "valiant". The scriptures we are given in the Bible about what day of the week it was or is defines it as the first or last day of the week. It is clear that there are 7 days in 1 week, but I find nowhere that the Gregorian calendar was in use at that time. If you can find a scripture that says they counted days back then as we do today, I sure would like to read it.

see this post

valiant · Apr 5, 2015

just-me said:

LOL I live in the modern world. I use a modern calendar. But it does not affect my relationship with God through Jesus Christ, nor does it affect my interpretation of Scripture or my doctrine, oh uncontroversial one

.

Jeff_56 · Apr 5, 2015

just-me said:

why? (p.s. it's not 'controversial' to disobey, it's disobedient) ...
and it doesn't help others to read it who are disobedient when they read it....
even the scribes and pharisees who were living at the time and knew it by heart but didn't obey yahshua the messiah - they didn't even recognize him when he was right there before them in person,
even though he did everything written in TORAH of him;
he did everything MOSES / TORAH said he would do.

valiant · Apr 5, 2015

just-me said:

as far as I am aware the Gregorian calendar had a seven day week. So does the Julian calendar. does it matter what we call the days if it helps others? ,

Sabbath

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