Your thoughts on firearms, what does the bible say?

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ctc1989

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Being christians, I was curious to hear your thoughts on guns?? Luckily I was brought up around guns and going out to the woods with family and friends on the weekend and doing some pistol and skeet shooting. Because I've been raised like this I never looked at guns as bad because around me people don't use them against other people, they use them against paper or old milk jugs.

In my life I've shot around 100,000 rounds (mostly .22lr). Never against a person, thankfully. I see guns in a positive light but I've had friends that were absolutely opposed to guns. Most had never used them, so as often as I can I take them out and let them try a bunch ofmdiffrent types and calibers out in a relaxing safe environment. After shooting most have had a change of heart and realize that Bad people use firearms in a bad way, good people use guns in a safe and responsible way.

I'm curious to what your thought about firearms are?

Recently I've been reading the bible and praying about this... Obviously guns weren't invented in the time the bible was written but they still had swords and bows, which even back then kings and rulers feared common people owning.

I'd like to hear your thoughts and if you've got any on favorite bible verses. Please be respectful, I know this is a touchy subject for some people.
 
I am like you, grew up around them, my Father brought me a 20 ga shotgun when I was 12. I am real comfortable around guns in good peoples procession. I feel safe when I go to a gun store and the staff as side arm strapped to them.
 
My entire position on firearms can be summed up in a single logo:

nra-logo-350.jpg
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Yes, I AM a card carrying member.
 
I am in inactive life member of the NRA, 2nd Amendment Foundation, and a couple of others.

I see nothing in scripture that would lead me to believe that defending one's self against a criminal act in any way violates scripture. If you look at the Levitical law a man who shed the blood of someone who broke into his home at night was deemed innocent of the man's blood.

Years back I read an excellent book that included a chapter on the Biblical basis for self defense being justifiable, I'll try to find the title for you.
 
My dad and I used rifles to hunt birds when I was young. In Canada, there is no "right" to have a gun. In fact, we had a huge gun registry for years, to try and track illegal guns.

Personally, I would never own a gun, nor fire one. My dad gave up hunting back in the early 60's. I also gave it up! In Canada, there really is no need to own a gun, unless you are police or military. It is not dangerous to leave your home open, and there are no drive by shootings, from what I have seen in the news in recent years.So we leave defense to the people who are trained to do it, and live in a peaceful country.

I'm glad I don't have to worry about guns, as they are a non-issue in Canada. I don't know if God ever intended people to have machine guns to gun down civilians either. A sword can only kill one person at a time. I think we got beyond the scope of Biblical ethics for guns when guns started being able to shoot more than one shot at a time.

Go ahead, jump on me now. I'm Canadian and proud!
 
Angela53510 said:
My dad and I used rifles to hunt birds when I was young. In Canada, there is no "right" to have a gun. In fact, we had a huge gun registry for years, to try and track illegal guns.

Personally, I would never own a gun, nor fire one. My dad gave up hunting back in the early 60's. I also gave it up! In Canada, there really is no need to own a gun, unless you are police or military. It is not dangerous to leave your home open, and there are no drive by shootings, from what I have seen in the news in recent years.So we leave defense to the people who are trained to do it, and live in a peaceful country.

I'm glad I don't have to worry about guns, as they are a non-issue in Canada. I don't know if God ever intended people to have machine guns to gun down civilians either. A sword can only kill one person at a time. I think we got beyond the scope of Biblical ethics for guns when guns started being able to shoot more than one shot at a time.

Go ahead, jump on me now. I'm Canadian and proud!
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You are blessed if what you say is true.
But here in the US we have a lot of bad people who have guns, and not nearly enough police to protect us.
I hope I never have to use one of my guns to defind myself, my family, or my friends, but I will if necessary.
 
Angela53510 said:
My dad and I used rifles to hunt birds when I was young. In Canada, there is no "right" to have a gun. In fact, we had a huge gun registry for years, to try and track illegal guns.

Personally, I would never own a gun, nor fire one. My dad gave up hunting back in the early 60's. I also gave it up! In Canada, there really is no need to own a gun, unless you are police or military. It is not dangerous to leave your home open, and there are no drive by shootings, from what I have seen in the news in recent years.So we leave defense to the people who are trained to do it, and live in a peaceful country.

I'm glad I don't have to worry about guns, as they are a non-issue in Canada. I don't know if God ever intended people to have machine guns to gun down civilians either. A sword can only kill one person at a time. I think we got beyond the scope of Biblical ethics for guns when guns started being able to shoot more than one shot at a time.

Go ahead, jump on me now. I'm Canadian and proud!
Click to expand...

You're entitled to your opinions, and you're not saying that you want to take away other people's ability to defend themselves, so I don't know why someone is going to jump on you.

Here's my take on it - an armed populace isn't any less Christ like than an unarmed one. It's a bit of a long post, but it's an interesting discussion from the other side of the table (or at least I think so).

There is biblical precedent for self defense. There is also precedent that you don't have to defend yourself if you chose not to. What you do can literally be on a case by case basis when the situation arises, provided you haven't taken any options off the table.

I don't see how the number of rounds one can fire changes the scope of biblical ethics one bit. Swords were the machine guns of their day - that is to say they were the most dangerous thing available at the time. I've never seen a bible passage that said swords couldn't be as sharp as possible or anything that would limit their capabilities. A sword never runs out of ammunition. There were men in the old testament who killed a lot of people using nothing but a sharp edge or even just their bare hands.

There were many more who owned swords and never raised them in anger or had to use them to defend others. Just because a defensive capability exists doesn't mean it has to be used.

Police forces and militaries are all sized to protect a country during a period of relative civil ease - and even then they are typically reactionary in nature (even Canada still has a murder rate of 1.6 per 100,000). During times of large scale international conflict or civil unrest, police forces are not there when you need them. Why? Because they're busy protecting their own families, and because there just plain aren't enough of them.

In such a situation as that, I'd say banding together and loving your neighbor as you love yourself, and protecting those who may be less able to protect themselves either because they are not capable or have chosen not to wouldn't be a bad thing. It isn't about hurting people, it's about serving as a deterrent so that no one has to be harmed. Anyone harmed in that situation was going to do some serious bodily harm to an innocent person - I see no moral dilemma there.

I don't know if you're pre or post trib, that would probably influence your opinion on this topic pretty heavily. I usually point out to people that even pre-trib doesn't guarantee safety or security. Canada still allows private firearms ownership, which is a good thing provided that registry doesn't do more harm than good. Traditionally, governments like to go seizing things that are on registries. That would really really stink if the timing of the rapture was off by a few decades or so and the option to protect your fellow countrymen and women was no longer on the table.
 
ctc1989 said:
Obviously guns weren't invented in the time the bible was written but they still had swords and bows, which even back then kings and rulers feared common people owning.
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Just curious here, but on what do you base that statement? Thanks.

My opinion? I grew up with guns, spent 20+ years in the U.S. Army as an officer and combat helicopter pilot. I doubt anyone needs to ask me to further clarify.
lol.gif
 
Unless one is 'Cleansing the Temple' I can't actually feel any need for anyone to have any kind of weapon.

(British resident, so guns are not much of a 'thing' here'. Also grew up on a farm, so have seen, handled and used legal firearms.)
 
THere was a time when ALL Christians had rifles, guns, due to survival. What then? Did they sit around a campfire and discuss where they should have guns or not? lol There was a time when ALL Christians rode a horse, did they get upset when a 1902 oldsmobile rode past them and scare the horses? lol
 
People with guns stop criminals every day in this country. Ever had a felon point a loaded gun at you that they legally are not ever supposed to have in their possession lumberjack? I have. Ever had a criminal threaten you with a knife lumberjack? I have and I'm still here.

See lumberjack, it's in those moments you find that next to the one true creator Lord God and His magnificent son Jesus Christ your other two very best friends are Mr. Smith and Mr. Wesson.

"Researchers at the Cato Institute have reviewed eight years worth of news reports about shooting in self-defense and conclude, "the vast majority of gun owners are ethical and competent, and tens of thousands of crimes are prevented each year by ordinary citizens with guns."

CATO Study: http://object.cato.org/sites/cato.org/files/pubs/pdf/WP-Tough-Targets.pdf


lumberjack said:
Guns don't kill, people kill... :eek:
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ServantStrike said:
You're entitled to your opinions, and you're not saying that you want to take away other people's ability to defend themselves, so I don't know why someone is going to jump on you.

Here's my take on it - an armed populace isn't any less Christ like than an unarmed one. It's a bit of a long post, but it's an interesting discussion from the other side of the table (or at least I think so).

There is biblical precedent for self defense. There is also precedent that you don't have to defend yourself if you chose not to. What you do can literally be on a case by case basis when the situation arises, provided you haven't taken any options off the table.

I don't see how the number of rounds one can fire changes the scope of biblical ethics one bit. Swords were the machine guns of their day - that is to say they were the most dangerous thing available at the time. I've never seen a bible passage that said swords couldn't be as sharp as possible or anything that would limit their capabilities. A sword never runs out of ammunition. There were men in the old testament who killed a lot of people using nothing but a sharp edge or even just their bare hands.

There were many more who owned swords and never raised them in anger or had to use them to defend others. Just because a defensive capability exists doesn't mean it has to be used.

Police forces and militaries are all sized to protect a country during a period of relative civil ease - and even then they are typically reactionary in nature (even Canada still has a murder rate of 1.6 per 100,000). During times of large scale international conflict or civil unrest, police forces are not there when you need them. Why? Because they're busy protecting their own families, and because there just plain aren't enough of them.

In such a situation as that, I'd say banding together and loving your neighbor as you love yourself, and protecting those who may be less able to protect themselves either because they are not capable or have chosen not to wouldn't be a bad thing. It isn't about hurting people, it's about serving as a deterrent so that no one has to be harmed. Anyone harmed in that situation was going to do some serious bodily harm to an innocent person - I see no moral dilemma there.

I don't know if you're pre or post trib, that would probably influence your opinion on this topic pretty heavily. I usually point out to people that even pre-trib doesn't guarantee safety or security. Canada still allows private firearms ownership, which is a good thing provided that registry doesn't do more harm than good. Traditionally, governments like to go seizing things that are on registries. That would really really stink if the timing of the rapture was off by a few decades or so and the option to protect your fellow countrymen and women was no longer on the table.
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Nope, I'm amill. So no need for guns, trusting Jesus and his return! I just don't see all the symbols as being literally interpreted in Revelation.
 
T5 said:
I can't actually feel any need for anyone to have any kind of weapon.
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I dream of a world where this is reality, and so shall it be in Heaven. But for now, I'm locked and loaded.
 
Angela53510 said:
Nope, I'm amill. So no need for guns, trusting Jesus and his return! I just don't see all the symbols as being literally interpreted in Revelation.
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I see. So it's a bit different for you. My point is still the same though even in your case - what if things get bumpy before Christ returns. Note I never even mentioned my eschatology, though I will say I'm no prepper.

So your stance is that you really just don't care if you die because it means you get to go home earlier. That's fine too. I have friends with small children, and hope to have them myself some day. Getting to go home early is not a view I feel I have the luxury of having for another 20-30 years.

I don't really care if someone wants to be a pacifist to the point of dying when they might have lived. I only care if they want to make that decision for someone else - which you have not said you are for. So, you're still alright in my book.

T5 said:
Unless one is 'Cleansing the Temple' I can't actually feel any need for anyone to have any kind of weapon.

(British resident, so guns are not much of a 'thing' here'. Also grew up on a farm, so have seen, handled and used legal firearms.)
Click to expand...

Cleansing the temple. Sweet mercy, are you talking about some sort of revolution or something? The entire point of an armed populace is the citizenry is protected enough that it never gets to that point.

Not every gun owner owns a gun for the purpose of killing. I'd say 99 percent have no interest in using them that way at all. Even here in the USA where our gun laws are more permissive than most developed nations, I've never met someone who owns a gun because they're planning on using it on a human being.

I have met more than a few who if the need arose, would not hesitate to use it to protect others though. I don't see that as unbiblical - there is nothing wrong with protecting the innocent. I feel better knowing that there are people out there who can do so, who have felt strongly enough to take the steps necessary if the need arose, and did so for no monetary gain whatsoever.

Guns are either for recreation, or they are an insurance policy you never hope to need.
 
ctc1989 My motto is short and simple! " it is better to have a gun and not need one,then to need one and not have one!"
 
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