Can you be TOO FORGIVING?

[gypsygirl]

forgiveness is an act that we are called to do out of obedience. so no, i think that "being too forgiving" isn't possible. however, most people confuse forgiveness with restoration or even, co-dependency.

Be kind to one another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, as God in Christ forgave you. ephesians 4:32

For if you forgive others their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you, but if you do not forgive others their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses. matthew 6:14,15

forgiveness is about letting go of those painful things, and not allowing bitterness to take root in our heart. it's an act that releases us from the grip of those acts against us so that we can move forward without allowing them to change us, and harden our hearts.

forgiveness is not about being a pushover or having no boundaries for yourself. it's not about necessarily restoring the relationship in which the offense happened. ideally, restoration can and should happen.

but sometimes forgiveness means saying, "i forgive you, but because of what happened, things can't ever go back to what they were--but i hold no ill will to you, and wish you well."

the best example i've ever heard about describing the effect or evidence of real forgiveness is the following:

forgiveness is about reaching a resolution and peace such that you no longer think about and wonder why the event had to happen. it's letting go of "why did this happen to me?" and "what might have been if this never happened? it's acceptance that things happened as they did, and sometimes that means you're different because of what happened.

in fact, i have come to believe that part of why we are called to be forgiving is for our own good, as much as the other party, (maybe even more for our own good). i have seen a number of people become embittered, miserable, and "stuck" on an issue or painful event that they never seem to move past. it becomes like a ghost in their life, haunting the halls of their journey and relationships, casting a long shadow for which every event is viewed through. they expect everyone, and everything to make up for this deficiency.

further, i can't think of a single advantage or good thing that would come from someone holding a grudge.

sometimes people get stuck wanting to understand things that cannot be understood. making peace for things that are unexcuseable and have no resolution.

for part of my healing and recovery after being sexually assaulted years ago was attending a support groups for those survivors of such violence. eventually, i had to stop going for two reasons. first, i'd healed to the point where it was no longer of value to me to continue such a deep focus on it.

but the primary reason was because i noticed women who were several years out, yet were (for lack of a better phrase) "stuck in their recovery" at a place of needing to know why this had happened to them, and why they couldn't have done more, avoided it, or some other un-answerable question. for me, i had to move on, because i accepted there weren't many answers, but all i could do was forgive the guy who did this.

i received a phone call from one of these women a few years later, and it was very hard to listen to her. it was obvious to me that she had developed this attitude that seemed to encompass all men. she was a VICTIM and it was an identity that had swallowed her.

i think those are some of what happens to us when we fail to forgive those who trespass against us--it's a disease of the soul. it stains the lenses for which we view everything and everyone, and it becomes this raw, gaping sore that never closes. throbbing and gangrened, it poisons our very being with its toxins, weakening us and stealing our joy.

forgiveness is a gift to yourself as much as the one who wronged you. and more importantly, it's an act of obedience that we do because we love our Savior, and because He commanded us to do it.

 

[gypsygirl]

you know, after re-reading your post, i have a few more thoughts:

you say "you've had a lot of people screw you over". well, i have to tell you something. i'm a number of years older than you, and i too, have had a lot of people "screw me over". in fact, i'd say that most everyone in this forum will, before the end of their life, also be "screwed over" by many folks.

honestly, you need to assume that most people experience this, and in no way does it predict or absolve you from future unfair treatment. to believe that you're due for "better treatment" is something akin to karma, and that just isn't the way things work.

you can get better treatment but it's from changing your actions, rather than expecting better things to happen without any change on our part. one thing i've learned in life is that people treat you as well as you expect them to.

do you understand what i mean by saying this?

if you don't go to folks, your friends, or those who you love and let them know how you feel and learn to constructively share and negotiate how you are treated, people will have no reason to know that it is hurtful for you. it's YOUR standards and boundaries that determine what is okay for you, and what is not. and how you develop those lines is something that you do with your bible, your heart and in prayer, seeking guidance from the Holy Spirit.

perhaps you'd be surprised how many things we can do that we have no idea cause pain or disappointment for someone until they let us know. and in the same vein, when others aren't held accountable, you can develop a relationship that has a lot of co-dependency in it.

a big part of having good friends and enjoyable relationships is good communication and conflict resolution skills. sharing your feelings, both positive and negative, and asking for theirs, and working out the constructs of the relationships that are pleasant and enjoyable for both of you.

learning to forgive someone without ever having the constructive conversations that lead to resolution and growth will not change anything, and lead to more of what you've already had.

further, i would really encourage you to examine this idea of "being screwed over a lot" and feeling as though you're due for being treated better. i think there might be something there that you could grow from examining. if anything that history is not evidence of your being "due" for better, but a pattern of something else, something that maybe you can answer for yourself. maybe it's lacking communication or unrealistic expectations leading to disappointment. only you can answer that.

God bless you, rachel. : )

 

[FriendlyGuitarist]

Nope you can never be too forgiving. Jesus wants us to forgive others every time they do something wrong with us no matter how hard it may be to forgive, the Bible calls us to forgive every time.

 

[mystikmind]

Oh trust me, I can say NO, lol. I should say YES more.....we did a class on that in church and man oh man, I am NOT a people pleaser, I just forgive!

Well, so long as you know how to say no, then i see no problem with being too forgiving..... and the danger of being too forgiving is that people could take advantage of you, but if you know how to say no, then that should not be a problem

 

[RachelP03]

you know, after re-reading your post, i have a few more thoughts:

you say "you've had a lot of people screw you over". well, i have to tell you something. i'm a number of years older than you, and i too, have had a lot of people "screw me over". in fact, i'd say that most everyone in this forum will, before the end of their life, also be "screwed over" by many folks.

honestly, you need to assume that most people experience this, and in no way does it predict or absolve you from future unfair treatment. to believe that you're due for "better treatment" is something akin to karma, and that just isn't the way things work.

you can get better treatment but it's from changing your actions, rather than expecting better things to happen without any change on our part. one thing i've learned in life is that people treat you as well as you expect them to.

do you understand what i mean by saying this?

if you don't go to folks, your friends, or those who you love and let them know how you feel and learn to constructively share and negotiate how you are treated, people will have no reason to know that it is hurtful for you. it's YOUR standards and boundaries that determine what is okay for you, and what is not. and how you develop those lines is something that you do with your bible, your heart and in prayer, seeking guidance from the Holy Spirit.

perhaps you'd be surprised how many things we can do that we have no idea cause pain or disappointment for someone until they let us know. and in the same vein, when others aren't held accountable, you can develop a relationship that has a lot of co-dependency in it.

a big part of having good friends and enjoyable relationships is good communication and conflict resolution skills. sharing your feelings, both positive and negative, and asking for theirs, and working out the constructs of the relationships that are pleasant and enjoyable for both of you.

learning to forgive someone without ever having the constructive conversations that lead to resolution and growth will not change anything, and lead to more of what you've already had.

further, i would really encourage you to examine this idea of "being screwed over a lot" and feeling as though you're due for being treated better. i think there might be something there that you could grow from examining. if anything that history is not evidence of your being "due" for better, but a pattern of something else, something that maybe you can answer for yourself. maybe it's lacking communication or unrealistic expectations leading to disappointment. only you can answer that.

God bless you, rachel. : )

I understand with what your trying to say. What you said is something I probably need to reverse the advise. I am very open with everything, probably too open. Everyone knows where I stand with a lot and if I disagree, you bet your bottom dollar I will share how when where why. Its probably why a lot of people do leave, but see I think that's what they miss with me. Is my intentions is out of love, but Im not a very loving, nurturing person when it comes to certain things, ESPECIALLY if you claim to be a Christian. Most advice or love that I give is biblical. If it contradicts the Bible or if its against the Bible then I open up my mouth and share it.

If you arnt a believer, then I tend to treat them more sensitive and teach them, rather then I guess "debate" them. I have lost friends by me sharing with what they are doing is wrong, in which they were believers and knew better. I expressed my concerns and they walk away, but the funny thing to me is......when I was living in sin and the same friends shared their concerns, which a lot was tough love also, I took it in. I accepted it and I thanked them. They know that they are now in the same shoes I was once in and they don't want to hear about it. When I was committing adultery, I told everyone I was committing adultery. I guess with me personally, I don't understand why people hide from Sin, maybe its because when I was younger, I was always told you cant hide it.

I by no means am bragging about myself, but a lot of times, I want people to share their testimony with me as I get to know someone and they have nothing. They are ashamed of their past instead of using it for the good. They hide it, exactly where Satan wants them to keep it. Am I proud that I committed adultery, NO!!!! But someone out there might struggle or be in a situation where they might be tempted or cant seem to overcome their sin or past and I know God wants to use me to help others.

At the end of the day, I know no one is perfect and I will keep forgiving them because every single day I sin against the one who died for me and still he takes me in and loves me and blesses me. There is no greater love!!! Its true....you cant forgive too much!!!

 

[Dan58]

We forgive others as our Father forgives us. We ask God for forgiveness and repent, then God forgives us. Forgiving someone presumes that they want to be forgiven and regret their trespass, otherwise, I don't think we're obligated to forgive them. "If thy brother trespass against thee, rebuke him; and if he repent, forgive him" (Luke 17:3). If someone is repeatedly stabbing you in the back, you don't forgive them in-between the stabs, you forgive them when they've stopped and express sorrow for mistreating you. I doubt God expects Christians to be punching bags for people who exploit our forgiving nature. Jesus didn't go into the Temple and forgive the money changers, he set them straight. "Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you" (Matthew 7:6). Forgiving someone who doesn't want or care for your forgiveness can make you too forgiving. Flee from people who wish to harm you, don't invite them back into your life; "Then took they up stones to cast at him: but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by" (John 8:59)... Jmo

 

[mystikmind]

I understand with what your trying to say. What you said is something I probably need to reverse the advise. I am very open with everything, probably too open. Everyone knows where I stand with a lot and if I disagree, you bet your bottom dollar I will share how when where why. Its probably why a lot of people do leave, but see I think that's what they miss with me. Is my intentions is out of love, but Im not a very loving, nurturing person when it comes to certain things, ESPECIALLY if you claim to be a Christian. Most advice or love that I give is biblical. If it contradicts the Bible or if its against the Bible then I open up my mouth and share it.

If you arnt a believer, then I tend to treat them more sensitive and teach them, rather then I guess "debate" them. I have lost friends by me sharing with what they are doing is wrong, in which they were believers and knew better. I expressed my concerns and they walk away, but the funny thing to me is......when I was living in sin and the same friends shared their concerns, which a lot was tough love also, I took it in. I accepted it and I thanked them. They know that they are now in the same shoes I was once in and they don't want to hear about it. When I was committing adultery, I told everyone I was committing adultery. I guess with me personally, I don't understand why people hide from Sin, maybe its because when I was younger, I was always told you cant hide it.

I by no means am bragging about myself, but a lot of times, I want people to share their testimony with me as I get to know someone and they have nothing. They are ashamed of their past instead of using it for the good. They hide it, exactly where Satan wants them to keep it. Am I proud that I committed adultery, NO!!!! But someone out there might struggle or be in a situation where they might be tempted or cant seem to overcome their sin or past and I know God wants to use me to help others.

At the end of the day, I know no one is perfect and I will keep forgiving them because every single day I sin against the one who died for me and still he takes me in and loves me and blesses me. There is no greater love!!! Its true....you cant forgive too much!!!

You know what comes to my mind from this post? My wife is divorcing me, at this point i am over it, but back when i was still trying to save the marriage i remember a key thing my wife told me..... i asked her what she thinks God wants regarding our marriage and her answer was something quite significant, she said "sometimes you have to face reality".

This is what allot of Christians do i think, myself included, they don't want to let go of the justifications for things because they are stuck with that mindset that they have to deal with reality, and modern life is so different to biblical times it is easy to justify many things.

If your a Christian who justifies things this way, just let me ask you not to hold too tightly to those justifications (this is what i do for myself too) and as you go forward in your life and grow in Christ, allow yourself the opportunity to let go entirely of those justifications

 

[Kaycie]

Your friend gave you bad advice in telling you to just be you, we need to be like Christ, not like ourselves.

In order to save them, you can't save them. Let me explain. Even though you forgive them, you can't let on immediately that you have. They need that awkward silent moment to feel shame and a need for a savior. If you change the subject or give them immediate relief of that, you take away their opportunity to travel the road that leads to repentance- which leads to life. Just a pause, but do let them know you forgive them so that they don't travel the road of excessive sorrow- which leads to suicide.

 

[mystikmind]

Your friend gave you bad advice in telling you to just be you, we need to be like Christ, not like ourselves.

In order to save them, you can't save them. Let me explain. Even though you forgive them, you can't let on immediately that you have. They need that awkward silent moment to feel shame and a need for a savior. If you change the subject or give them immediate relief of that, you take away their opportunity to travel the road that leads to repentance- which leads to life. Just a pause, but do let them know you forgive them so that they don't travel the road of excessive sorrow- which leads to suicide.

I'm not sure God went to all that trouble making every person different and unique then hope they throw that uniqueness away? I think the idea is to be yourself 'in Christ'.

And the rest, i feel that advice iseems way too specific, because everyone has different circumstances.

 

[Jeff_56]

crucifixion helps

 

[pwrnJC]

A delicate situation, indeed. In your heart, GOD knows that you can and do forgive. Amen to that! However, the old saying is "Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me!" There is a balance between healing from the past and allowing continual 'abuse' coming back at you. You are NOT a doormat, you do not need to set yourself up for someone else's insults and stupidity again. I love your spiritual attitude, but..even when JESUS was dieing for mankind, mankind kept the insults, hurt and degradation coming. You need to hold your head high, allow the Holy SPIRIT to give you that 'peace that passeth understanding" that only a child of GOD can know. Realize also that those that continually insult and hurt you are needing the same TOUCH that you already have! Just tell them that you refuse to surround yourself with negativity and if they continue to be that way, ADIOS! That is what my daughter told me, her dad. I was acting more like my mom who is always negative and insulting, although she is a pastor's wife. Apparently, I was doing the same thing that she 'cursed" on me. Thank GOD my daughter put it to me bluntly with NO regrets. I have a deeper respect for her that I needed.

 

[crossnote]

IMHO,
We are always to carry a heart of forgiveness that is ready to declare forgiveness WHEN the other asks for forgiveness. But if the other remains unrepentant we are not under obligation to declare "I forgive you".

 

[mrh35]

Not too forgiving your just a genuine kind person who is going to right place,You may just sometimes to tell people when they wrong you and be stern. But always forgiving which I must is such a wonderful gift I personally find this probably the hardest thing as a Christian to do.

 

[pwrnJC]

Please get this published! Is there anyway this can 'stay' so that future scenarios and people with 'issues" can read this? This is so concise, so prevalent, so needed that it needs to be preserved for advice next year, or a decade from now. Thankyou for using your GOD Given spiritual gift of understanding and knowledge. This is totally awesome!

 

[Sirk]

Being generous with forgiveness is an entirely different thing from being a place for people to wipe their feet.

 

[RachelP03]

A delicate situation, indeed. In your heart, GOD knows that you can and do forgive. Amen to that! However, the old saying is "Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me!" There is a balance between healing from the past and allowing continual 'abuse' coming back at you. You are NOT a doormat, you do not need to set yourself up for someone else's insults and stupidity again. I love your spiritual attitude, but..even when JESUS was dieing for mankind, mankind kept the insults, hurt and degradation coming. You need to hold your head high, allow the Holy SPIRIT to give you that 'peace that passeth understanding" that only a child of GOD can know. Realize also that those that continually insult and hurt you are needing the same TOUCH that you already have! Just tell them that you refuse to surround yourself with negativity and if they continue to be that way, ADIOS! That is what my daughter told me, her dad. I was acting more like my mom who is always negative and insulting, although she is a pastor's wife. Apparently, I was doing the same thing that she 'cursed" on me. Thank GOD my daughter put it to me bluntly with NO regrets. I have a deeper respect for her that I needed.

I wanted to share a story that recently happened. A few months ago, I had this co-worker who is literally my mothers age. We did Bible studies together and gave each other advice, considering we are only the 2 Christian co-workers in our area. Well our parking lot is on a hill and I have a 2 door sports car and when I got out one day the wind blew my door and hit her car and made a knick. I went inside and before I even say down I told her. A few days later she goes and looks at it, because she had to clean her car, (really she didn't, it was white car, but oh well) and I had told her that day that I will pay or it or I will use my insurance, it was clearly my fault.

A month goes by and she calls me and I call my insurance and my ins tells me for the small amount of damage it is, it would be best to pay out of pocket since I would lose my no claims and my insurance would go up. I tell her that and 2 weeks goes by and she dosent tell me anything. I needed for her to go get an estimate so I could give her the money.

She starts being rude and distant from me for a few days and then I get the call from my ins telling me there has been a file claimed. I texted her and asked her why did she file a claim, I will pay for it and she said, you told me your ins wouldn't pay for it, I told her, No I didn't, they told me that it would be best to pay out of pocket. So long story short, she lied multiple times to me, she went behind my back, she lied to my insurance (I did call and in the notes she said one thing and then told me another) and she even went to my boss when I brought up at work, IN WHICH she told the INSURANCE person that she would tell me how much the estimate was.

I understand if maybe she didn't feel comfortable with taking my money, but as a friend, TELL ME!!!!! Don't go behind my back, lie to me, lie to the ins and then go to the boss for no reason, BY THE WAY, my boss believed me and told me I have to watch out for her, cause IM NOT the first person she has done this too.

So months go by.......we don't talk, only work related things and there are times where we are the only 2 people in the room. One day I didn't care anymore....I didn't care, because I was over it. I DO REMEMBER AND OUR RELATIONSHIP WILL NEVER BE THE SAME!!!!!! But I will be her friend, I will be Christ like, I will help give her advice and like I mentioened before, she was the one where she asked me for 50 cents and wthout hesitiation I gave it to her, and she did pay me back the next day, but I sure wasn't relying on it.

Christ still loves her and wanna something? My ins called me the other day and was talking to me about my next 6 months and I asked if it was going up and they said, NO!!! They even told me that I could go on line and sign up for something and save money. God works and I Know holding that bitterness in my heart would do me ZERO good.



My ex husband cheated on me. We were together for 10 years, we were together since 15. One day he got up and left and had been cheating for about 3 months. Even during our whole divorce we were nice and we even went down together to file and he even consolded me on divorce day when I was crying. I had every right to hate him and to be mad and I cant say I never was, but I think LOVE TRIUMPHED the hate.

I think what this post was really about, was its not that I want to wlak around with this hatred and being mad, but I sometimes don't feel normal. SOmetimes I just want to yell and scream and punch someone, lol, because they did me wrong. I think Im just reminded that in the BIble, GOd will punish these that wrong me, more than I ever could, and it might be years down the road, BUT IM ALSO REMINDED that GOd loves them!!!!!!!

I have more stories, but Im sure this is long enough....ill be surprised if you finish!!!

 

[atwhatcost]

I didn't think I needed to write the forgiveness in this post, since it pertains to multiple people with different situations. Throughout my life, I have had people screw me over and I get upset for a bit and then I know what NOT forgiving does to someone, since when I was a teenager I pretty much hated a girl for 2 years and I was the one who was miserable. When I finally released that anger and gave it over, the hard way of 2 years, I realized the peace I had with forgiving. There have been multiple situations over the course of my life where I knew I could dwell in it or lay it at the cross. Do I forget? of course not.....I remember, I keep it with me, I watch for signs if that person does come back in my life of it possibly occurring again. Just like me and you though we all screw up or make mistakes.

I think with people now a days, to them its better to walk away and forget about it then to work on it or go back and ask for forgiveness. I will admit when I'm wrong or if I'm sorry for upsetting someone, and I guess I just want that in return. I noticed God has been sending people in and out of my life very fast lately and ive noticed its been quite a lesson. I know that not everyone in our lives are supposed to stay there forever, but I went through a year of finding myself and now I feel like Im being tested. Its been quite a journey.[/QUOTE
Okay, let's try it this way. Are you happy if God thinks of you, "Man, she really screws me over. As long as she's been around she just screws me over again and again. And now look at her asking me for stuff. Oh, well, I forgive her." Does that just warm you to your bones? No? Then why do you think it works for you to others?

This is forgiving someone.

Matt. 18:15 “Moreover if your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault between you and him alone. If he hears you, you have gained your brother. 16 But if he will not hear, take with you one or two more, that ‘by the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.’ 17 And if he refuses to hear them, tell it to the church. But if he refuses even to hear the church, let him be to you like a heathen and a tax collector.
18 “Assuredly, I say to you, whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven.
19 “Again I say to you that if two of you agree on earth concerning anything that they ask, it will be done for them by My Father in heaven. 20 For where two or three are gathered together in My name, I am there in the midst of them.”

Matt. 5: 23 So if you are offering your gift at the altar and there remember that your brother has something against you, 24 leave your gift there before the altar and go. First be reconciled to your brother, and then come and offer your gift.

Hard, ain't it? Exactly why we need God and we need to work at doing the right thing -- get it straightened out with the person. Don't simply take more and more, and then think you're just too forgiving. You haven't forgiven yet.

 

[SarahM777]

IMHO,
We are always to carry a heart of forgiveness that is ready to declare forgiveness WHEN the other asks for forgiveness. But if the other remains unrepentant we are not under obligation to declare "I forgive you".

Did the soldiers ask Jesus to forgive them?

Luke 23

[SUP]32 [/SUP]Two other men, both criminals, were also led out with him to be executed. [SUP]33 [/SUP]When they came to the place called the Skull, they crucified him there, along with the criminals—one on his right, the other on his left. [SUP]34 [/SUP]Jesus said, “Father, forgive them, for they do not know what they are doing.”[SUP][c][/SUP]And they divided up his clothes by casting lots.

And can you please quote the scripture that says that says anything like this

But if the other remains unrepentant we are not under obligation to declare "I forgive you".

 

[MarcR]

What he meant by being myself was to keep being forgiving and not change into what my flesh wants. I sometimes want to follow my flesh and treat others as they treat me but at the end of the day I'm forgiving and I move forward.

Mt 18:21-22
21 Then came Peter to him, and said, Lord, how oft shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? till seven times?
22 Jesus saith unto him, I say not unto thee, Until seven times: but, Until seventy times seven.
KJV


From your post, you seem closer to the Lord's standard than most of us! That's a good thing! Don't loose it.

 

[SarahM777]

This is something from quite a while ago that the Lord taught me.

Forgiveness is an act of love given to the one that has been the offender. It releases the one that has been offended,from anger,bitterness and hatred. One that truly forgives cannot remain angry,retain a hurt,or harbor bitterness because it comes from love. It restores the offender and lets them let go of the guilt.

While it is very hard to do to forgive the uncle that raped you as a child,to forgive the father that despised you,the sister that takes you for over $40,000 and tries to get all the rest from you,to forgive the classmates that picked on you and called you horrible names,the guys who jump you in the bathroom,the roommate that steals your car,the roommate that tries to kill you,the co-workers that threaten to do you bodily harm,etc etc Never easy to do but it brings so great a release and sets the one who forgives free. It brings healing to the heart and soul.

Once it's done the first time it becomes so much easier,to just let it go. The things that at first seems so hard to overcome become so much easier,and even when someone else does the same thing it doesn't hurt as bad because is not compounded because the first was healed. It's an awesome thing.

How many of us really think about the words we say each week? Most of us say them time after time,week after week. Within those words contain a message that we often don't think about. It's an expectation,contained within the very prayer that we so often repeat. It's most often known as the Lord's prayer or as some call it the disciples prayer.

And forgive us our trespasses,
As we forgive them that trespass against us.

The expectation is that we will forgive in the same manner as which we seek to be forgiven by our Father in heaven. It is a practical application of showing the love we have for God by showing it to one another. Then it becomes an act of obedience out of love.