Proverbs 31

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JFSurvivor

Senior Member
Jan 20, 2015
1,184
25
0
#1
So someone on here made a post about foolish women and then I posted about Proverbs 31. My response was this:

Ok so let's look at Proverbs 31 shall we? Yes women can be foolish so let's look at the opposite of a foolish woman and see what the ideal woman looks like so we can emulate that.

V.10: Who can find a virtuous and capable wife? She is more precious than rubies.
Rubies eh? Wow...must be PRETTY DARN VALUABLE to be compared to rubies.

V.11: Her husband can trust her, and she will greatly enrich his life.
Ok so a good woman is trustworthy.

V.12: She brings him good not harm, all the days of her life.
So a good woman should always want the best for her husband just like a husband should always want the best for his wife.

V. 13-14: She finds wool and flax and busily spins it. She is like a merchants ship bringing her food from afar.
So she's hardworking and in a way provides for the family.

V. 15: She gets up before dawn to prepare breakfast for her household and plan the days work for the servant girls.
So she makes good food and hands out the chores to the servants.

V.16: She goes to inspect a field and buys it; with her earnings she plants a vineyard.
So to me this sounds like she has some *gasp* authority!! *faints* Think about this for a minute a WOMAN making a FINANCIAL decision ALL BY HERSELF!! HOW COULD SHE??? THE HORROR!!!!! And to think she used her OWN MONEY TOO AND SHE'S MARRIED!!! Can you feel the sarcasm oozing through your computer screens yet? lol

V. 17-18: She is energetic and strong, a hard worker. She makes sure her her dealings are profitable; her lamp burns late in to the night.So let's get this straight: she is energetic andstrong! Doesn't sound like a mamby-pamby little house-wife to me. Her dealings are profitable--> so she's smart too! Who would have thought!!!

V.19: Her hands are busy spinning thread, her hands twisting fiber.
So she's skilled.

V.20: She extends a helping hand to the poor and opens her arms to the needy.
Well look at that a good woman is kind too and helping the poor could in some cases fall under making financial decisions.

V.21: She has no fear of winter for her household, for everyone has warm clothes.
Oh again with the providing for the family!!

V.22: She makes her own bedspreads. She dresses in fine linen and purple gowns.
So she's skilled, and she can be fashionable while still being modest??

V.23: Her husband is well known at the city gates where he sits with other civic leaders.
Well well well looks like behind every good woman is a good man too! (just kidding! I believe they should be partners in crime!) ;-)

V.24: She makes belted linen garments and sashes to sell to the merchants.
Looks like more business, financial decisions and skill.

V.25: She is clothed in strength and dignity, and she laughs without fear of the future.
I just wanna point out two words here: Strength and dignity.

V.26: When she speaks her words are wise, and she gives instructions with kindness.
So not only is she smart but she is wise. She also gives INSTRUCTIONS and not only does she GIVE INSTRUCTION but she does it NICELY. :-D

V.27-29: She carefully watches everything in her household and suffers nothing from laziness. Her children stand and bless her. Her husband praises her: "There are many virtuous and capable women in this world but you surpass them all!"
So this is her husband who is praising her! She's not lazy, and she has to keep watch of everything that goes on in her household.

V.30-31: Charm is deceptive, and beauty does not last; but a woman who fears the Lord will be greatly praised. Reward her for all she has done. Let her deeds publicly declare her praise.
Charm is deceptive and beauty is fleeting...these words are so true. It can be hard for women to not put a lot of emphasis on their appearance. This verse has helped me because it reminds me that my looks are temporary and that I don't have to impress God with how I look. Do I have self essteem issues sometimes? yes. But this verse can usually bring me back down to earth.

In conclusion I think women should strive to be what was described in these verses: strong, independent, smart and loving. Being a Christian woman doesn't mean we have to be bimbos and this proves it.

What are your thoughts on this?

So that's what I put. What are your thoughts on this and proverbs 31. (btw I hope this isn't obnoxious re-posting a response but I did want to make a thread just for proverbs 31. I hope that's ok.)

Anyways I think think Proverbs 31 is a great passage and it really is a great vision for women to aspire to. :)
 

Joidevivre

Senior Member
Jul 15, 2014
3,838
272
83
#2
Proverbs is a book about Wisdom. And it ends with the usage of wisdom in a down-to-earth way with household cares.
It could also be for men who, in our culture, share these things with the woman.

The foundation is found in verse 30. FEARING (a sense of awe and respect) THE LORD.
 

JFSurvivor

Senior Member
Jan 20, 2015
1,184
25
0
#3
Proverbs is a book about Wisdom. And it ends with the usage of wisdom in a down-to-earth way with household cares.
It could also be for men who, in our culture, share these things with the woman.

The foundation is found in verse 30. FEARING (a sense of awe and respect) THE LORD.
What? Soooo how would proverbs 31 be for men??
 

Blain

The Word Weaver
Aug 28, 2012
19,212
2,547
113
#4
I say enough with this whole men vs women thing that believers are arguing about. Women should not teach is one that I am particularly tired of hearing. God is not sexist he does not show favor over another we are not men and women to him we are not two separate types of believers to him we are simply his children end of story.
 

JFSurvivor

Senior Member
Jan 20, 2015
1,184
25
0
#5
I say enough with this whole men vs women thing that believers are arguing about. Women should not teach is one that I am particularly tired of hearing. God is not sexist he does not show favor over another we are not men and women to him we are not two separate types of believers to him we are simply his children end of story.
Well said! :)
 
3

3Scoreand10

Guest
#6
So someone on here made a post about foolish women and then I posted about Proverbs 31. My response was this:

Ok so let's look at Proverbs 31 shall we? Yes women can be foolish so let's look at the opposite of a foolish woman and see what the ideal woman looks like so we can emulate that.

V.10: Who can find a virtuous and capable wife? She is more precious than rubies.
Rubies eh? Wow...must be PRETTY DARN VALUABLE to be compared to rubies.

V.11: Her husband can trust her, and she will greatly enrich his life.
Ok so a good woman is trustworthy.

V.12: She brings him good not harm, all the days of her life.
So a good woman should always want the best for her husband just like a husband should always want the best for his wife.

V. 13-14: She finds wool and flax and busily spins it. She is like a merchants ship bringing her food from afar.
So she's hardworking and in a way provides for the family.

V. 15: She gets up before dawn to prepare breakfast for her household and plan the days work for the servant girls.
So she makes good food and hands out the chores to the servants.

V.16: She goes to inspect a field and buys it; with her earnings she plants a vineyard.
So to me this sounds like she has some *gasp* authority!! *faints* Think about this for a minute a WOMAN making a FINANCIAL decision ALL BY HERSELF!! HOW COULD SHE??? THE HORROR!!!!! And to think she used her OWN MONEY TOO AND SHE'S MARRIED!!! Can you feel the sarcasm oozing through your computer screens yet? lol

V. 17-18: She is energetic and strong, a hard worker. She makes sure her her dealings are profitable; her lamp burns late in to the night.So let's get this straight: she is energetic andstrong! Doesn't sound like a mamby-pamby little house-wife to me. Her dealings are profitable--> so she's smart too! Who would have thought!!!

V.19: Her hands are busy spinning thread, her hands twisting fiber.
So she's skilled.

V.20: She extends a helping hand to the poor and opens her arms to the needy.
Well look at that a good woman is kind too and helping the poor could in some cases fall under making financial decisions.

V.21: She has no fear of winter for her household, for everyone has warm clothes.
Oh again with the providing for the family!!

V.22: She makes her own bedspreads. She dresses in fine linen and purple gowns.
So she's skilled, and she can be fashionable while still being modest??

V.23: Her husband is well known at the city gates where he sits with other civic leaders.
Well well well looks like behind every good woman is a good man too! (just kidding! I believe they should be partners in crime!) ;-)

V.24: She makes belted linen garments and sashes to sell to the merchants.
Looks like more business, financial decisions and skill.

V.25: She is clothed in strength and dignity, and she laughs without fear of the future.
I just wanna point out two words here: Strength and dignity.

V.26: When she speaks her words are wise, and she gives instructions with kindness.
So not only is she smart but she is wise. She also gives INSTRUCTIONS and not only does she GIVE INSTRUCTION but she does it NICELY. :-D

V.27-29: She carefully watches everything in her household and suffers nothing from laziness. Her children stand and bless her. Her husband praises her: "There are many virtuous and capable women in this world but you surpass them all!"
So this is her husband who is praising her! She's not lazy, and she has to keep watch of everything that goes on in her household.

V.30-31: Charm is deceptive, and beauty does not last; but a woman who fears the Lord will be greatly praised. Reward her for all she has done. Let her deeds publicly declare her praise.
Charm is deceptive and beauty is fleeting...these words are so true. It can be hard for women to not put a lot of emphasis on their appearance. This verse has helped me because it reminds me that my looks are temporary and that I don't have to impress God with how I look. Do I have self essteem issues sometimes? yes. But this verse can usually bring me back down to earth.

In conclusion I think women should strive to be what was described in these verses: strong, independent, smart and loving. Being a Christian woman doesn't mean we have to be bimbos and this proves it.

What are your thoughts on this?

So that's what I put. What are your thoughts on this and proverbs 31. (btw I hope this isn't obnoxious re-posting a response but I did want to make a thread just for proverbs 31. I hope that's ok.)

Anyways I think think Proverbs 31 is a great passage and it really is a great vision for women to aspire to. :)
Fits my wife of 52 years to a T.
I am not worthy of her.
 
C

cmarieh

Guest
#7
Fits my wife of 52 years to a T.
I am not worthy of her.
She is one fortunate woman to have a husband that feels that way towards her. Congratulations on being married for 52 years.
 

jsr1221

Senior Member
Jul 7, 2013
4,265
77
48
#8
I agree with Blain. Too many people try looking for something that isn't in Scripture or try twisting it. Whether it's something like wisdom or something like submission. In this regards, it's just talking what a woman should be in eyes of the Lord. I mean if you look at successful marriages, aren't those things that you just posted what makes a good marriage?
 

JFSurvivor

Senior Member
Jan 20, 2015
1,184
25
0
#9
I guess I just want to get people's thoughts on this because I have heard so much on this forum "wives can't make finacial descisions. That's for the husband" and "wives have to be submissive." I wanna honestly get to the bottom of who a woman should be in Christ. I have heard from even a lot of people at my other churches that women are to be submissive to their husbands. I just can't accept that. From what I know of God I can't see why he would set it up where one sex has the power over money, family descisions and the other has to agree or at least go along with it all the time.

And the whole thing about men taking responsibility??? That makes no sense either cuz families don't die together. If the wife and kids were sinning the husband can't be like "punish me!" Cuz everyone is responsible for their own sin. So I wanna get to the bottom of this.

Also I hope everyone here knows I don't think of women as superior. I think of women as equal.
 

jsr1221

Senior Member
Jul 7, 2013
4,265
77
48
#10
I guess I just want to get people's thoughts on this because I have heard so much on this forum "wives can't make finacial descisions. That's for the husband" and "wives have to be submissive." I wanna honestly get to the bottom of who a woman should be in Christ. I have heard from even a lot of people at my other churches that women are to be submissive to their husbands. I just can't accept that. From what I know of God I can't see why he would set it up where one sex has the power over money, family descisions and the other has to agree or at least go along with it all the time.

And the whole thing about men taking responsibility??? That makes no sense either cuz families don't die together. If the wife and kids were sinning the husband can't be like "punish me!" Cuz everyone is responsible for their own sin. So I wanna get to the bottom of this.

Also I hope everyone here knows I don't think of women as superior. I think of women as equal.
Women are smarter than men in a lot of things. Organizing and planning are two of those. Finances fall into organizing. Everything is a team effort. As far as taking responsibility, I believe men do have to in a sense. It goes back to Adam and Eve in how Adam let Eve fall to sin and didn't do anything to stop her. Yes it is Eve's fault. But God spoke to Adam before hand. And since Adam watched and didn't do or say anything to stop Eve, that makes Adam equally if not more guilty. So I think because of that men have to have to be held to a higher standard in that regard. Not because men are more superior or vice versa. But because of the fall. If that makes sense. Now granted there are extreme circumstances. I could marry someone that was very good living a double life. That stole millions of dollars over a 20 year period and changed aliases. Some things are out of your control.
 
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R

RachelBibleStudent

Guest
#11
proverbs 31 is the sayings of king lemuel...teachings he learned from his mother...

in that way it completes the book of proverbs...all through the book there are references to instruction received from both fathers and mothers...and most of the book consists of wisdom from solomon and from other wise men...but this last chapter presents the wisdom learned from a mother...to make the book comprehensive an example of maternal wisdom had to be included too...

it is interesting also that in the new testament paul says that the older women should teach the younger women how to be good wives and mothers...i can imagine that proverbs 31 was a key part of that mentorship...
 
R

RachelBibleStudent

Guest
#12
I guess I just want to get people's thoughts on this because I have heard so much on this forum "wives can't make finacial descisions. That's for the husband" and "wives have to be submissive." I wanna honestly get to the bottom of who a woman should be in Christ. I have heard from even a lot of people at my other churches that women are to be submissive to their husbands. I just can't accept that. From what I know of God I can't see why he would set it up where one sex has the power over money, family descisions and the other has to agree or at least go along with it all the time.

And the whole thing about men taking responsibility??? That makes no sense either cuz families don't die together. If the wife and kids were sinning the husband can't be like "punish me!" Cuz everyone is responsible for their own sin. So I wanna get to the bottom of this.

Also I hope everyone here knows I don't think of women as superior. I think of women as equal.
submission is not slavery...unless the married couple misunderstands it in that way...

the proverbs 31 wife is in submission to her husband...but as you can see her submission does not deprive her of initiative...she does lots of work and makes lots of decisions...but notice that it is all for the good of her family...

so submission does -not- mean becoming useless...
 

JFSurvivor

Senior Member
Jan 20, 2015
1,184
25
0
#13
submission is not slavery...unless the married couple misunderstands it in that way...

the proverbs 31 wife is in submission to her husband...but as you can see her submission does not deprive her of initiative...she does lots of work and makes lots of decisions...but notice that it is all for the good of her family...

so submission does -not- mean becoming useless...
Can you elaborate please? I have heard from a lot of people that wives are not to make finacial descisions.
 
R

RachelBibleStudent

Guest
#14
Can you elaborate please? I have heard from a lot of people that wives are not to make finacial descisions.
well given proverbs 31 that would clearly be false...

although i think there has to be deference...i doubt that the proverbs 31 wife would hear her husband say 'this seems like a bad idea and i don't think i can support it' and then go and do it anyway...

i think an unwritten fact of proverbs 31 is that the husband -trusts- his wife to do these things...
 

Joidevivre

Senior Member
Jul 15, 2014
3,838
272
83
#15
The one in a couple who usually makes financial decisions is the one who has the best ability to do so. Sometimes it is the husband. Sometimes it is the wife. Usually in a good marriage, they discuss it together.

I do not like "roles" - having been married for so many years, it is a joint effort with both working in different ways as they are able to. For a time, my husband was better at certain financial matters. Now it is is me. People have a lot of health issues that come along. We work as a team. Sometimes I take the lead in things - sometimes he does. But it's always good and helpful for our marriage and enhances our love and care for each other.
 

Angela53510

Senior Member
Jan 24, 2011
11,786
2,957
113
#17
I think that the Bible is clear about what characterizes a godly man and woman. Proverbs 31 says it clearly and it is found in many other verses.

"The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom;
all those who practice it have a good understanding.
His praise endures forever!" Psalm 111:10
 
R

RachelBibleStudent

Guest
#18
i should clarify the last thing i posted...

the unwritten fact of proverbs 31 is that the husband trusts his wife to make these decisions and be in charge of these things...

and the fact that he trusts her shows two things...first of all that the wife is trustworthy...but secondly that the husband is not an authoritarian control freak...
 

JFSurvivor

Senior Member
Jan 20, 2015
1,184
25
0
#19
So I guess I don't understand how it's not an equal partenership with proverbs 31. Because if one is in charge and one isn't it can't be equal. If the husband trusts the wife then the wife should also trust the husband. Doesn't that sound like equality??
 

ArtsieSteph

Senior Member
Apr 1, 2014
6,194
1,321
113
33
Arizona
#20
I always thought this was an interesting passage of scripture. It's sorta seems like what a woman should aspire to be, but we're by no means perfect. I couldn't make clothes, though I could try and get up early for my family.

I guess the point is that this is a woman/mother who tries to do what is best for those she loves, and not let herself become complacent.