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No there is one Holy Spirit guiding the minds of thousands of people who start with thousands of presuppositions, backgrounds, and failure of understanding. Gradually He leads them into what is important and what is really true, He has most trouble with those whose minds have been brainwashed by man made churches and their dogmas and false traditions..
I am a proponent of [Intelligent] Purposeful Design, i am not a qualified Engineer but i know the core principle of human engineering is design. I can recognize design when i see design, i can recognize complex structures when i see them. In the natural world i can see complex structures, i also know that through scientific research we can observe even greater complexity, this complexity infers to me an orderly arrangment with highly intergrated complex components that to me also infers purposeful design. I ask myself how can i explain purposeful design in nature?. If it takes a designer to design complex structures then how do i explain to myself what that designer is?, is there an intelligent agent at work here?, if so what is that agent and what do i call that agent?. That is why i am drawn to the God of the Bible, if this agent i pondered is God then so be it. I want to get to know the mind of God yes.
Can I have a go ?
(1) "use them to deflect" implies a deliberate subterfuge when most are genuine "seekers-after-truth"
(2) of course
(3) 'willing' yes - but been there and done that many, many times - 'no answer' was the stern reply
(4) have read the bible probably more than most Christians - all I find is contradictions and ambiguity (and later additions)
Sorry, not gonna work. But who knows, Kedge might have more success.
(1) "use them to deflect" implies a deliberate subterfuge when most are genuine "seekers-after-truth"
(2) of course
(3) 'willing' yes - but been there and done that many, many times - 'no answer' was the stern reply
(4) have read the bible probably more than most Christians - all I find is contradictions and ambiguity (and later additions)
Sorry, not gonna work. But who knows, Kedge might have more success.
God is not the author of confusion.
1 Timothy 4
4 The Spirit clearly says that in later times some will abandon the faith and follow deceiving spirits and things taught by demons. 2 Such teachings come through hypocritical liars, whose consciences have been seared as with a hot iron. 3 They forbid people to marry and order them to abstain from certain foods,which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and who know the truth. 4 For everything God created is good, and nothing is to be rejected if it is received with thanksgiving, 5 because it is consecrated by the word of God and prayer.
6 If you point these things out to the brothers and sisters,[a] you will be a good minister of Christ Jesus, nourished on the truths of the faith and of the good teaching that you have followed. 7 Have nothing to do with godless myths and old wives’ tales; rather, train yourself to be godly. 8 For physical training is of some value, but godliness has value for all things, holding promise for both the present life and the life to come.9 This is a trustworthy saying that deserves full acceptance. 10 That is why we labor and strive, because we have put our hope in the living God, who is the Savior of all people, and especially of those who believe.
1 Timothy 4
4 The Spirit clearly says that in later times some will abandon the faith and follow deceiving spirits and things taught by demons. 2 Such teachings come through hypocritical liars, whose consciences have been seared as with a hot iron. 3 They forbid people to marry and order them to abstain from certain foods,which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and who know the truth. 4 For everything God created is good, and nothing is to be rejected if it is received with thanksgiving, 5 because it is consecrated by the word of God and prayer.
6 If you point these things out to the brothers and sisters,[a] you will be a good minister of Christ Jesus, nourished on the truths of the faith and of the good teaching that you have followed. 7 Have nothing to do with godless myths and old wives’ tales; rather, train yourself to be godly. 8 For physical training is of some value, but godliness has value for all things, holding promise for both the present life and the life to come.9 This is a trustworthy saying that deserves full acceptance. 10 That is why we labor and strive, because we have put our hope in the living God, who is the Savior of all people, and especially of those who believe.
V
May I suggest to you, then, that to know Him, and His plan for you, that the Gospel of John is essential? Let me know if you want some help with understanding it. I've got some good online sources that will help with that. Just let me know.
By the way, your reasoning to arrive at this desire is exact, precise, and well-thought out. May He guide you in your search.
By the way, your reasoning to arrive at this desire is exact, precise, and well-thought out. May He guide you in your search.
Ad, my dear Pumicestone and kedge. . .you are absolutely right, you cannot choose to believe what you do not believe.
You can't get here from there.
Belief is a work of certainty by the Holy Spirit within the heart giving one to know beyond shadow of doubt that Scripture is truly the word of God.
That powerful work in the heart is the evidence and proof of Scripture as the word of God.
And then pursuing Scripture in belief, the Holy Spirit illumines them to one.
The key to entrance therein:
You must first agree in your heart that if God gives you to know Scripture is his truth,
you will submit to and obey them. . .no equivocating.
You can't get here from there.
Belief is a work of certainty by the Holy Spirit within the heart giving one to know beyond shadow of doubt that Scripture is truly the word of God.
That powerful work in the heart is the evidence and proof of Scripture as the word of God.
And then pursuing Scripture in belief, the Holy Spirit illumines them to one.
The key to entrance therein:
You must first agree in your heart that if God gives you to know Scripture is his truth,
you will submit to and obey them. . .no equivocating.
K
No it is the standard that applies to those who believe that just because they went to a man-made teaching system such as a bible college to think of themselves more knowledgabale in the Word then those who haven't.
For the first many centuries of the churches growth there was no such thing as going to a school or college to learn God's word. For it was given as the bible says it is given, and that is by God through the Holy Spirit to believers. Only if the believer was lead by the Spirit or told by the Lord personally did they go to others. The bible says believers will be lead in all truth by the Holy Spirit. So those who want to look down on others who did not go to a bible college or school for their learning, and make themselves out to be something, the bible says they will be made foolish.........
.
Well, I never thought that FancyNancy and I would both "Like" the same post.
Elin, you have created history.
.
First, Elin acknowledges our sincerity and our intelligence. Politely and with courtesy.
Second, her post is logical and rational - even if we disagree.
I would not presume to speak for Kedge
but if a 'Holy Spirit' were to somehow convince me that the "Scripture" (as we now have it) is divinely inspired, perfect, unchanged, unambiguous, and free of human error or duplicity ....
of course, I would joyfully grab it with both hands and probably strive to be a 21st Century Paul !
Unfortunately, all the evidence suggests, nay proves, that this man-made collection of myths, legends, fables and fibs is too chock-full of inconsistencies and downright silliness that I cannot see that I would ever be able to take it seriously.
Well, I never thought that FancyNancy and I would both "Like" the same post.
Elin, you have created history.
.
First, Elin acknowledges our sincerity and our intelligence. Politely and with courtesy.
Second, her post is logical and rational - even if we disagree.
I would not presume to speak for Kedge
but if a 'Holy Spirit' were to somehow convince me that the "Scripture" (as we now have it) is divinely inspired, perfect, unchanged, unambiguous, and free of human error or duplicity ....
of course, I would joyfully grab it with both hands and probably strive to be a 21st Century Paul !
Unfortunately, all the evidence suggests, nay proves, that this man-made collection of myths, legends, fables and fibs is too chock-full of inconsistencies and downright silliness that I cannot see that I would ever be able to take it seriously.
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You have the wrong criteria. . .only one thing matters.
The work of the Holy Spirit giving you to know with certainty that these Scriptures are the word of God.
You are underestimating God.
He gave his revelation in writings because it is his will that his people have them.
His will is done, and he providentially preserves the truth of his writings so his people can have them.
Again, you are correct. . .you cannot take it seriously because you cannot see that until the Holy Spirit works that seriousness in your heart.
And I've given you the key into that place.
The work of the Holy Spirit giving you to know with certainty that these Scriptures are the word of God.
You are underestimating God.
He gave his revelation in writings because it is his will that his people have them.
His will is done, and he providentially preserves the truth of his writings so his people can have them.
Again, you are correct. . .you cannot take it seriously because you cannot see that until the Holy Spirit works that seriousness in your heart.
And I've given you the key into that place.
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Tried that for many years - fruitless.
Incidentally controlled tests in hospitals over a large group of volunteer patients over a long period of time have established that prayer in no way impacted on outcomes.
Do you have the faith of a grain of mustard seed ?
I have a few mountains I would like moved.
Incidentally controlled tests in hospitals over a large group of volunteer patients over a long period of time have established that prayer in no way impacted on outcomes.
Do you have the faith of a grain of mustard seed ?
I have a few mountains I would like moved.