Joyce Meyer -- False Teacher

[ladylynn]

Ok. Let us talk about facts. You can find film clips of Joyce Meyer and Creflo Dollar saying exactly core Latter Rain theology. On this very issue Joyce Meyer for instance has actually removed ideas about Jesus suffering in Hell tormented by demons, from her books, between 1999 and 2005.

Creflo Dollar - it was easy to find clips of him teaching we are a god. On his web site it was even simple to find him declaring "command theology" or "confession theology", words have creative power.

Now listening to their general sermons etc. does not mean they address these issues or display what their current take is on them. For me the point is not who teaches this theology, but who believes it.

This is not my mission to do anything other than share what I have found. You call me a liar. Well that is simply untrue. It does not take much research to find the truth, but maybe that is not what you want to hear.

Truth matters, especially when you claim to be a teacher.
If you are interested here is a open investigation into the WOF movement and its issues

www.youtube.com/watch?v=lowyJrEEJco

Now I have been trained through experience dealing with many different religious groups. It trains you words matter.
Labels also matter, and whether you are for or against certain ideas.

I am 100% against command theology and little God ideas. Now if you are happy with this theology, fine, but I am not.

Now this divide is becoming more important, especially in the developing world, where it causes real world issues, to the extent people are being banned from entering countries, churches are being thrown into confusion and peoples faith derailed.

But for you it is just a matter to labels. You are wrong, but that is not why I am saying what I am saying.

You obviously want to correct me, to I got to laugh, because you cannot correct truth.

I can correct you when you are saying I said something I didn't and that I believe something I don't. In this you need correcting for sure. I never called you a liar and would never do that. Of course truth matters and I never ever claimed to be a teacher...shhhessshhh. I'm just another Christian sharing my thoughts like anyone else here.

I went to the youtube.com you posted and the things the guy refuted were nothing of what I believed or what I've ever heard Joyce preach or Creflo D. Again, I know what I believe and the guy gave a list of things all word of faith people believe. Well, I don't believe what he said so it says to me that his idea of word of faith and mine are surely not the same. Just like with you PeterJen. Showing yet again how IMPORTANT it is NOT to put labels on people.

You say labels matter??? Labels are foolish and cheap tools that take out the individual from the equation and throw everyone under the bus as a group. In your case you are labeling individuals like me by some umbrella of what you say to be word of faith teaching. The problem is I don't adhere to what you call word of faith. So you are dreadfully wrong and you do need to be corrected.

But the more I try and reason with you PeterJen like the bible says we should do., you take the things I say and again attach some meaning to it that is not mine., but your preconceived idea . There is no way to get out from under your prejudice. I keep trying but it only causes more accusation from you.

So, unfortunately I see this back and forth banter going no where because you won't listen to my words, you insist on filtering everything I say through your ideas of word of faith. I can't work with someone who doesn't want to be confused with the facts. Plus, I don't enjoy getting thrown under this same old bus time after time.

 

[JesusIsAll]

.....[video=youtube;TAPhJM3bDc4]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TAPhJM3bDc4[/video].....​

 

[PeterJens]

Again, I know what I believe and the guy gave a list of things all word of faith people believe. Well, I don't believe what he said so it says to me that his idea of word of faith and mine are surely not the same.

Light bulb. What you mean by word of faith is not the same as WOF I am describing. Fine. But the point under discussion is not your understanding of word of faith, but what the main teachers believe it to be.

Part of the reason why one investigates such movements is to define their beliefs and then see if one personally agrees with them. Now personal loyalty to people or empathy etc means zero in this arena, because salesmen do this all the time.

Now your understanding of Latter Rain theology is obviously lacking because Tims description is 100% correct based on other sources and teachings from this group that are publically available.

Now I have no clue what your personal position is, but trying to correct me does not work unless you can show how the sources Tim and others use are faulty. You have got to realise I am happy to listen to all sources, I have no agenda.

When I started talking about the love of Jesus transforming ones soul, it was the WOF camp who started making fun and saying I was wrongly inspired. Now here you are trying to defend a teacher from this camp, using her ideas, yet putting a biblical spin on them. My problem is still the same, the tree is planted in the wrong place.

Some have said they are fake and invented by evil plotters. That kind of paranoia is worthy of the illuminti conspiracies.

I am glad you are not latter rain, do not believe confession has creative power, or we are little gods.
People do reap what they sow into their lives, if they sow love, care, grace and uplifting things that is what they reap.

Do you know muslims were actually more honest that you guys?

But hey, truth matters and what is being taught. If you believe is something sound then amen.

 

[Willie-T]

Let's just say I am sure glad I won't be in this guy's shoes when God asks him to justify those "seven minutes" of summing up people he knows nothing about. That's going to be a horrifying "seven minutes" for him.

 

[PeterJens]

Let's just say I am sure glad I won't be in this guy's shoes when God asks him to justify those "seven minutes" of summing up people he knows nothing about. That's going to be a horrifying "seven minutes" for him.

Dear reader - I can see nothing wrong with the description given Wesley Biblical Seminary. Willie obviously believes Ken Copeland is right.

Logically. I have asked people do they agree with these doctrines or not. Silence and attacks that I am wrong about what it stands for. Ok. Then a clear definition of the core system of values, and a statement they will have to answer to God for being negative.

These guys do not believe in theology or normal life, they have passed over to being gods.

This proves a simple point, they actually have no clue to the movement they belong to, and an emotional spiritual experience has convinced them this is God reality. What makes me go, yuck, is the lack of the cross, humbleness, repentance and real life and the massive display of worldliness, greed, sexual indiscretion by the teachers and leaders, without any sense this destroys their ministry.

 

[ladylynn]

Dear reader - I can see nothing wrong with the description given Wesley Biblical Seminary. Willie obviously believes Ken Copeland is right.

Logically. I have asked people do they agree with these doctrines or not. Silence and attacks that I am wrong about what it stands for. Ok. Then a clear definition of the core system of values, and a statement they will have to answer to God for being negative.

These guys do not believe in theology or normal life, they have passed over to being gods.

This proves a simple point, they actually have no clue to the movement they belong to, and an emotional spiritual experience has convinced them this is God reality. What makes me go, yuck, is the lack of the cross, humbleness, repentance and real life and the massive display of worldliness, greed, sexual indiscretion by the teachers and leaders, without any sense this destroys their ministry.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=68ZZ-3ckwiw


The Power of Grace Filled Words. The topic of this youtube very short message is just a short answer to what you are accusing to be un-Biblical. Your false accusations are easily and simply wiped away by this very short message. Words matter and truth does stand but false accusations are easy when you label people PeterJens. Again, I suggest you stop labeling people without knowing what they believe and posting youtube videos on what other people say they believe. My challenge to you PeterJens. I'd like to know what you think after listening.

 

[PeterJens]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=68ZZ-3ckwiw


The Power of Grace Filled Words. The topic of this youtube very short message is just a short answer to what you are accusing to be un-Biblical. Your false accusations are easily and simply wiped away by this very short message. Words matter and truth does stand but false accusations are easy when you label people PeterJens. Again, I suggest you stop labeling people without knowing what they believe and posting youtube videos on what other people say they believe. My challenge to you PeterJens. I'd like to know what you think after listening.

But there were also false prophets among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you. They will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the sovereign Lord who bought them—bringing swift destruction on themselves. Many will follow their depraved conduct and will bring the way of truth into disrepute. In their greed these teachers will exploit you with fabricated stories. Their condemnation has long been hanging over them, and their destruction has not been sleeping.
2 Peter 2:1

"Your false accusations"

I have to say, you are crazy. I have never met a christian who denies what certain teachers is saying is their theology which they openly preach. They have written books, describing these very facts, that is truth, that is what they have done. This is called fact.

If I repeat their doctrines and beliefs, which are repeated by other teachers, again this is not false.

If this is strange to you, then I am not talking to a normal sane person. I do not know what your problem is, or delusion.
Now I have spoken to schizophrenics who behave just like this. The idea they have is just stuck in their head, facts are irrelevent. God called this reality blindness.

The knowledge of the secrets of the kingdom of God has been given to you, but to others I speak in parables, so that, ‘though seeing, they may not see; though hearing, they may not understand.’
Luke 8:10

So deeply you believe your experience and your understanding there can be no flaw or problem. I have met many people like this in many religious groups, and they are so certain they are right, there is no doubt, but each group is different.

It is a mindset, which many call brainwashing. You only know you are in this state if you cannot see things from anothers point of view. If you can, you are probably seeing the truth, because fear of a different understanding does not stop you from looking.

Prince video is just censorship from your perspective. It is not an answer to false teaching and heresy. But that is where we stand. The problem with where you are, a small step and the chasm opens, and real spiritual authority takes over.

I did not think 40 years ago this is where it would end up. A bad day has come upon the earth, very bad.


Grace. I have great grace, more than you can imagine. I am called merely to witness to what is being said, why and what it means. It is up to people to investigate and find the truth. You cannot stop truth, it finds everyone out. It is the seed of reality, it undermines the strongest kingdoms and movements and cannot be stopped except through censorship and denial.

So your response speaks to me, this is 100% true because that is your only answer. Jesus is the truth, the bread of life, and the love He puts in our hearts renews every day. So praise the Lord, and may the Lord I worship fill you full of His revelation and love, transforming you into the likeness of Jesus, doing good works to bring glory to His name.

 

[PeterJens]

Dear reader,

Muslims use the attack so many times, slander the person and not answer the question or point.
It is done merely to silence the critic, because it gives them no respect and is equivalent to a personal assault.
Jesus called it pearls before swine. One advantage is on the internet I cannot be silenced, because it is the place of making points. I am not insulting anyone, just putting forward what people say they believe.

Be very worried when you repeat what they believe becomes a threat or a weapon that makes you an enemy.
It means their beliefs are flawed and wrong. Tell me anything I believe and I will discuss it. Anything, no problem.
I am not afraid of who I am, what I do, and where I am going. A sinner saved by grace, the Lord of glory who gave me access to highest heaven through His glorious Son, that love may conquer all through my heart.

If the Lord could show me what walking on water means, maybe I would show you too. But to date I do not know this, but please show me if you know. We only know of two people who have ever done this, Jesus and Peter.

But surely all the gods out there can exercise their faith and claim this reality, or is this beyond them? But they are Jesus reborn, so if He could they can. Maybe these people will grow up and face who they really are and stop playing stupid games.

 

[ladylynn]

But there were also false prophets among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you. They will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the sovereign Lord who bought them—bringing swift destruction on themselves. Many will follow their depraved conduct and will bring the way of truth into disrepute. In their greed these teachers will exploit you with fabricated stories. Their condemnation has long been hanging over them, and their destruction has not been sleeping.
2 Peter 2:1

"Your false accusations"

I have to say, you are crazy. I have never met a christian who denies what certain teachers is saying is their theology which they openly preach. They have written books, describing these very facts, that is truth, that is what they have done. This is called fact.

If I repeat their doctrines and beliefs, which are repeated by other teachers, again this is not false.

If this is strange to you, then I am not talking to a normal sane person. I do not know what your problem is, or delusion.
Now I have spoken to schizophrenics who behave just like this. The idea they have is just stuck in their head, facts are irrelevent. God called this reality blindness.

The knowledge of the secrets of the kingdom of God has been given to you, but to others I speak in parables, so that, ‘though seeing, they may not see; though hearing, they may not understand.’
Luke 8:10

So deeply you believe your experience and your understanding there can be no flaw or problem. I have met many people like this in many religious groups, and they are so certain they are right, there is no doubt, but each group is different.

It is a mindset, which many call brainwashing. You only know you are in this state if you cannot see things from anothers point of view. If you can, you are probably seeing the truth, because fear of a different understanding does not stop you from looking.

Prince video is just censorship from your perspective. It is not an answer to false teaching and heresy. But that is where we stand. The problem with where you are, a small step and the chasm opens, and real spiritual authority takes over.

I did not think 40 years ago this is where it would end up. A bad day has come upon the earth, very bad.


Grace. I have great grace, more than you can imagine. I am called merely to witness to what is being said, why and what it means. It is up to people to investigate and find the truth. You cannot stop truth, it finds everyone out. It is the seed of reality, it undermines the strongest kingdoms and movements and cannot be stopped except through censorship and denial.

So your response speaks to me, this is 100% true because that is your only answer. Jesus is the truth, the bread of life, and the love He puts in our hearts renews every day. So praise the Lord, and may the Lord I worship fill you full of His revelation and love, transforming you into the likeness of Jesus, doing good works to bring glory to His name.

I should have known better than to have tried one more time with you PeterJens., more name calling and personal insults is all you had for me. I go back to the post I wrote to you before and will not try and confuse you with the facts one on one. Your mind is made up. I will keep my responses to the general public here. I'm sorry there was no ability to come to any workable understanding from you. I tried.


Unfortunately I see this back and forth banter going no where because you won't listen to my words, you insist on filtering everything I say through your ideas of word of faith. I can't work with someone who doesn't want to be confused with the facts. Plus, I don't enjoy getting thrown under this same old bus time after time.

 

[PeterJens]

Sorry reader. Latter rain theology can be looked up on wikipedia. It history through Hagin etc is clearly documented.

Now my only question is do the people here deny these facts or are they saying they are different?

By the way I have pentecostal friends, friends in vineyard, friends in probably every variation of faith and none, so it is not like I am closed minded or do not understand exactly where you are coming from. So I wonder at your desire not to be straight, or even to suggest anything you have to say is new. Maybe the Holy Spirit is talking to you to say something, but I know it will not make sense, because I doubt it has much to do with the Lord.

 

[blondieindahouse]

I'm no Joyce Meyer fan but "for the same measure you use, it will be measured unto you" seems to indicate exactly what she is saying here.

Then why didnt she just say that? Because thats not what she was saying!

 

[PeterJens]

Insults, insults, insults. I mean repeating wikipedia is such an insult. What does the world know about what be believe, print, preach, openly and publically shout to everyone?

I remember the big mistake every victim of a con makes. I will be different, they cannot get me. Boom. It is so true, it is so fantastic, everything from my past was like nothing, I have arrived, everyone should have this zapping, then they would know being drunk is soooooo brilliant.

My question is if you really did not know the Lord properly before this experience, what on earth makes you think you have improved to any degree now. You could be literally fodder for the great apostacy, that overthrows what is already established with something totally new, while believing it has always been the original. Oddly the muslims argued the same from the revelation of an angel through a possessed prophet, who you could not question because that was blasphemy.

Notice any similarities with how these guys behave?

 

[iwant2serve]

Gotta say it again and again and again, so much time and energy is spent to prove someone a false teacher and little time spent getting your Pastor's message out there. If these TV Ministers are so far from the truth why aren't you trying to get your Pastor's messages out there to the world. To me this is energy placed in the wrong area. When you have time to prove others wrong you have time to prove others right. Which time takes less energy? I say the truth because you don't have to make clips to prove right you just let it play.

 

[NarrowRoadDisciple]

That isn't the only heresy that Joyce Meyer preaches. The whole word of faith "little gods" teaching is also quite a big heresy along with quite a few other things that she teaches.

iwant2serve, it's not the energy that is used to prove that someone is a false teacher that needs to be looked at. By their doctrine we know they are false teachers. The focus here is just to let people know who not be overcome by as a teacher by going under their teachings. It would not be love to allow a fellow brethren to continue learning from a false teacher and say nothing. It is love to be a watchman and warn them where there is error. TV ministers that are far from the truth pertain to most televangelists out there. Energy we spend on a day to day basis spreading the truth is energy well spent especially as we allow the Holy Spirit to lead us where we sow our seeds of truth.

 

[Willie-T]

Gotta say it again and again and again, so much time and energy is spent to prove someone a false teacher and little time spent getting your Pastor's message out there. If these TV Ministers are so far from the truth why aren't you trying to get your Pastor's messages out there to the world. To me this is energy placed in the wrong area. When you have time to prove others wrong you have time to prove others right. Which time takes less energy? I say the truth because you don't have to make clips to prove right you just let it play.

Yeah, but you see, this kind of requires that you try to have the mind of Christ, and think of others in love, like Him.

 

[settled]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bGwgzPo4Fu0

Joyce Meyer preaches another gospel the bible says this if they preach another gospel let them be anathema cursed. check out this video i put together in 2010 have a great day guys love settled

 

[ladylynn]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0UMigpE8kj4


Instead of sound bites., listen to the proper perspective with complete sentences in a message on thinking about your self in God's sight when you receive the gift of no condemnation from Jesus. Selected sound bites give a distorted message of what someone says.

 

[blondieindahouse]

Gotta say it again and again and again, so much time and energy is spent to prove someone a false teacher and little time spent getting your Pastor's message out there. If these TV Ministers are so far from the truth why aren't you trying to get your Pastor's messages out there to the world. To me this is energy placed in the wrong area. When you have time to prove others wrong you have time to prove others right. Which time takes less energy? I say the truth because you don't have to make clips to prove right you just let it play.

Base you opinions on scripture plz. Just because a person has posted about a false teacher doesnt mean that person doesnt spread the good news of Christ as well does it? It is very unfair to make blanket assertions. It may be beneficial to state your view on things while abstaining from placing untrue banners upon peoples backs.So what message should we be heralding? The gospel! The Gospel of Christ! Not the "pastors message" but the messiahs message. And if it takes exposing false teachers along the way ;we have upheld scripture and have done what the Father has instructed us to do.

2 Timothy 4:3-4: For the time is coming when people will not endure sound teaching, but having itching ears they will accumulate for themselves teachers to suit their own passions, and will turn away from listening to the truth and wander off into myths.
1 Timothy 5:20 - Those who sin, before all rebuke that the rest of the people may fear.
Titus 1:13... Therefore rebuke them sharply that they may be sound in the faith ...
Ephesians 5:11-13: Have nothing to do with the fruitless deeds of darkness, but rather expose them.

 

[iwant2serve]

That isn't the only heresy that Joyce Meyer preaches. The whole word of faith "little gods" teaching is also quite a big heresy along with quite a few other things that she teaches.

iwant2serve, it's not the energy that is used to prove that someone is a false teacher that needs to be looked at. By their doctrine we know they are false teachers. The focus here is just to let people know who not be overcome by as a teacher by going under their teachings. It would not be love to allow a fellow brethren to continue learning from a false teacher and say nothing. It is love to be a watchman and warn them where there is error. TV ministers that are far from the truth pertain to most televangelists out there. Energy we spend on a day to day basis spreading the truth is energy well spent especially as we allow the Holy Spirit to lead us where we sow our seeds of truth.

How do you prove them wrong?I believe you get the right message out there not sit on a chat blog site and post edited videos to prove a point. Like I said what are you doing to get the truth out there besides talking about how false they are. That is wasted energy. If you cannot get your message or your Pastor's message out there then you are worse then the ones you call false.

 

[iwant2serve]

Base you opinions on scripture plz. Just because a person has posted about a false teacher doesnt mean that person doesnt spread the good news of Christ as well does it? It is very unfair to make blanket assertions. It may be beneficial to state your view on things while abstaining from placing untrue banners upon peoples backs.So what message should we be heralding? The gospel! The Gospel of Christ! Not the "pastors message" but the messiahs message. And if it takes exposing false teachers along the way ;we have upheld scripture and have done what the Father has instructed us to do.

2 Timothy 4:3-4: For the time is coming when people will not endure sound teaching, but having itching ears they will accumulate for themselves teachers to suit their own passions, and will turn away from listening to the truth and wander off into myths.
1 Timothy 5:20 - Those who sin, before all rebuke that the rest of the people may fear.
Titus 1:13... Therefore rebuke them sharply that they may be sound in the faith ...
Ephesians 5:11-13: Have nothing to do with the fruitless deeds of darkness, but rather expose them.

All that still means the same thing. People sit on their rusty tuts talking about everyone else and doing nothing them selves. When I read the Bible I don't see where they sat around making conversations about false teachers. Why? Because they were to busy spreading the truth.