You're right. I specifically remember Jesus telling the Samaritan woman at the well to keep her mouth shut after she gave Him a drink of water. Gotcha!
Woman position ( 1 Corinthians 14:34-37)
- Thread starter MikkoAinasoja
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You're right. I specifically remember Jesus telling the Samaritan woman at the well to keep her mouth shut after she gave Him a drink of water. Gotcha!
You might remember that the Lord appointed Deborah to be a judge over Israel.
What on earth does this have to do with 1 Corinthians 14:34-37?
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No. Jesus told us to love our neighbors as ourselves. I would never think to tell a woman she couldn't talk in church, because I wouldn't want anyone telling ME not to talk in church.
This is the commandment we have from 1 Corinthians 14. Which is more valid. What we may prefer or what scripture tells us on this matter?
Jesus Christ said you are to love your neighbor as yourself. No authority exceeds his. Would you want someone to tell you not to talk in church?
So, you think Paul's statement in 1 Corinthians 14 is somehow at odds with Jesus' command to love you neighbor as yourself? Were not the writings of Paul given by the inspiration of the Holy Spirit? Both passages are the word of God.
I just realized something that may lend some clarification here.
Ac 18:5-17 and 1Cor 1:1 seem to indicate that the church at Corinth was generally observing the Sabbath in the Synagogue. If the same were true of Ephesis and Crete, then the assembly in question might well be the Synagogue.
It would certainly have been totally unacceptable to the Jewish members of a Synagogue to have women speaking out.
I will not dogmatically insist that this was the case; but it is worthy of consideration.
Ac 18:5-17 and 1Cor 1:1 seem to indicate that the church at Corinth was generally observing the Sabbath in the Synagogue. If the same were true of Ephesis and Crete, then the assembly in question might well be the Synagogue.
It would certainly have been totally unacceptable to the Jewish members of a Synagogue to have women speaking out.
I will not dogmatically insist that this was the case; but it is worthy of consideration.
Jesus loved his neighbors as himself too by example, but the scriptures still show us that Christ was the head of man..and God is the head of Christ....there is order in God's creation...not that all are created equally for the same purpose...In fact...some are created for more Noble purposes and some for common use...Oldhermit seems to be serving a Noble purpose in accurately discerning the scriptures.
That is possible but there were also many Christians in Corinth who met in homes as in the case of Aquila and Priscilla. The prohibition was not contingent upon where the Church met.
Jesus said to love my neighbor as myself. I intend to do that. I don't want anybody telling me not to talk in church, so I will not tell anybody not to talk in church.
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BarlyGurl
Guest
I perceive a very good reason for this admonishment to behavior...
This is the early church and it seems to harmonize with other "role" instructions. Disciples are learning, wives are to RESPECT their husbands and be in subjection to their leadership.... a woman who is asking questions in church is "speaking OVER" the boundary of her husband in an assembly. Now men reading this... has your wife ever spoke outside your boundary in a public place in anything? Did you like it? Did the ensuing embarrassment feel good? is this scenario a one which conveys respect to observers?
I think it is the same issue... specifically targeted to behavior in an assembly for that time and probably a good behavior admonishment for small group bible study gatherings too. Has anyone ever been to a small group where the husband sits an contributes nothing as his wife talks and talks and talks?
Women are prone to that... across the board... little verse in Genesis reveals that... know which one?
This is the early church and it seems to harmonize with other "role" instructions. Disciples are learning, wives are to RESPECT their husbands and be in subjection to their leadership.... a woman who is asking questions in church is "speaking OVER" the boundary of her husband in an assembly. Now men reading this... has your wife ever spoke outside your boundary in a public place in anything? Did you like it? Did the ensuing embarrassment feel good? is this scenario a one which conveys respect to observers?
I think it is the same issue... specifically targeted to behavior in an assembly for that time and probably a good behavior admonishment for small group bible study gatherings too. Has anyone ever been to a small group where the husband sits an contributes nothing as his wife talks and talks and talks?
Women are prone to that... across the board... little verse in Genesis reveals that... know which one?
Well, since the Church belongs to the Lord and this is his prohibition I should think what he wants done is far more relevant that how you or any of us feel about it.
This is true; however it seems possible that 'assembly' may specifically refer to synagogue worship; and may not include house to house fellowship on the first day of the week. Again, I would not insist on this reading; but it is worthy of consideration!
K
KennethC
Guest
Those who misuse 1 Corinthians 14 and a few others to try and say women can not hold the roles of a minister/preacher will also continue to refuse to do the leg work in study and see that women held these roles in the first centuries of the church.
The bible also even calls one woman (Junia) an Apostle, and another women (Phoebe) a deacon.
But they will continue to believe the cover up and the change of scripture to make these statements not true, as they added a "s" to Junia to make it the male form Junias and took and changed the word deacon to servant for Phoebe.
I know the Greek word means both deacon and servant, but that is a vague term in servant as we are all servants of the Lord rather in the role of an Apostle or the least position in the church. The Catholic church has tried their hardest to conceal the truth that women can hold those positions as well, but unless one actually does the leg work and does an in depth early church history study for truth will not know all of this and will continue to play it off.
The bible also even calls one woman (Junia) an Apostle, and another women (Phoebe) a deacon.
But they will continue to believe the cover up and the change of scripture to make these statements not true, as they added a "s" to Junia to make it the male form Junias and took and changed the word deacon to servant for Phoebe.
I know the Greek word means both deacon and servant, but that is a vague term in servant as we are all servants of the Lord rather in the role of an Apostle or the least position in the church. The Catholic church has tried their hardest to conceal the truth that women can hold those positions as well, but unless one actually does the leg work and does an in depth early church history study for truth will not know all of this and will continue to play it off.
IMO, the word apostle is used in two ways in the NT:
1) The 11 plus Paul, plus Matthias.
2) any missionary.
I believe that Junia is an example of the second usage.
There is NOTHING in Scripture to indicate that Deacon was a preaching or governing role.