Refute Against OSAS
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Originally Posted by valiant
See how deceived you are? You say 'are we actually in heaven already/' The answer is YES YES YES. We are seated WITH CHRIST in the heavenlies (Ephe 2.6). Our spirits are united with His spirit. We are with Him. Our live are hid with Christ in God (Col 3.3). We live and reign WITH HIM.
It is not 'mental assurance'. It is SPIRITUAL FACT. We are not 'mentally assured that we will be with Him.' WE ARE WITH HIM. Your spiritual experience is so lacking. We have been raised with Christ. We are seated with Christ in the spiritual realm. It is only our bodies which tread this earthly dust..
It is you whom Satan is deceiving. Our bodies are still on earth and will be transformed later (that is the day which has not come yet), but our spirits are with Him in heavenly places. (that has already come)
you see how blind you are to truth? We are NOT dead to trespasses and sins through ANYTHING that we do. We are dead to trespasses and sins because we died with Christ. It is because we have risen with Christ that we enjoy the fruit of the Spirit. It is all His doing. You are usurping His place.
They will if you try to obtain them on your own. Our continuing victory over sin is obtained by reckoning on ourselves as dead with Christ and risen with Him (Rom 6.11). It is through His power that we reign.
No wonder you struggle. We put away the things that cause us to sin by dying with Christ and allowing Him to live out His life through us. And we do it as those who are seated in heavenly places IN HIM. Doing it on your own is a guarantee of failure. You walk on your own, We walk with HIM..
It is not 'mental assurance'. It is SPIRITUAL FACT. We are not 'mentally assured that we will be with Him.' WE ARE WITH HIM. Your spiritual experience is so lacking. We have been raised with Christ. We are seated with Christ in the spiritual realm. It is only our bodies which tread this earthly dust..
It is you whom Satan is deceiving. Our bodies are still on earth and will be transformed later (that is the day which has not come yet), but our spirits are with Him in heavenly places. (that has already come)
you see how blind you are to truth? We are NOT dead to trespasses and sins through ANYTHING that we do. We are dead to trespasses and sins because we died with Christ. It is because we have risen with Christ that we enjoy the fruit of the Spirit. It is all His doing. You are usurping His place.
They will if you try to obtain them on your own. Our continuing victory over sin is obtained by reckoning on ourselves as dead with Christ and risen with Him (Rom 6.11). It is through His power that we reign.
No wonder you struggle. We put away the things that cause us to sin by dying with Christ and allowing Him to live out His life through us. And we do it as those who are seated in heavenly places IN HIM. Doing it on your own is a guarantee of failure. You walk on your own, We walk with HIM..
you have the wrong idea about the heavenlies. They are not UP THERE. They are another dimension into which our spirits have entered.
M
Never listened to him ...but even the catholics or Mormons can have some truth...don't change the fact that the truth is still true.
1Co 1:17 ¶ For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect.
18 For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.
1Co 1:17 ¶ For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect.
18 For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.
K
If he truly no longer chose to believe in the Lord then no he would not have eternal life, the bible clearly shows what happens to those who depart from the faith later in life and that ending is not eternal life.
Apostle Paul clearly shows this in 1 Timothy 4 and Colossians 1:22-23 that only those who continue in the faith and are not moved away from the gospel of Christ will have eternal life.
Eternal life through Christ is based on keeping the faith in the Lord, and those who depart from that faith their soul will not be saved as James 5:19-20 clearly says.
K
It shows that the verse you gave is another on mental assurance as our spirit is not in heaven physically already.
If that was the case then like James said you would be dead, because the body without the soul can not live on. It is a mental assurance that we will be seated with Him by keeping and standing firm in the faith.
Apostle Paul can not contradict himself and many many other places he clearly showed that salvation/eternal life is given later, and is not a physical possession right now. For the bodies we are in right now are corrupted physical bodies of flesh and blood that can not inherit the kingdom, therefore we have to be transformed into our new eternal uncorruptable bodies to inherit the kingdom. That inheritance is not given to us yet !!!
If that was the case then like James said you would be dead, because the body without the soul can not live on. It is a mental assurance that we will be seated with Him by keeping and standing firm in the faith.
Apostle Paul can not contradict himself and many many other places he clearly showed that salvation/eternal life is given later, and is not a physical possession right now. For the bodies we are in right now are corrupted physical bodies of flesh and blood that can not inherit the kingdom, therefore we have to be transformed into our new eternal uncorruptable bodies to inherit the kingdom. That inheritance is not given to us yet !!!
K
That is not silly as the bible clearly shows the dead works are to be repented of, and we do not repent of being baptized or turning from sin.
If you repent from turning from sin that means you change your mind and go back to it.
The dead works that is being spoken of in the bible is the once sinful nature we once walked in, but no longer as we are born again to walk in the Spirit. We repented of those old ways and no longer should have to repent of them again !!!
