Sanctification

[KennethC]

Kenneth
the only difference of opinion I have with that is that I feel that if I am not every second totally devoted to God with all my strength, all my mind, all my soul, and all my heart, then I'm guilty of sin. The thing is though I'm really free from sin ,but not because I can keep myself free but because of my faith in God's grace. To judge myself free by what I can accomplish is impossible because of my first statement, but to judge myself free and righteous because of Jesus is just and right because of his perfection.

I understand where you come from I really do because it is a common standard in the churches now days to teach we do not play a role in salvation through Christ, but a lot of scriptures are spoken directly to us on what we are to do like this one for instance;

Jude 1:21
Keep yourselves in the love of God, looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life.

Even Apostle Paul said this same standard multiple times that we must continue in the faith laying a good foundation in Christ unto eternal life. We can not deny what scripture says as it is the Word of God !!!

 

[shotgunner]

I understand where you come from I really do because it is a common standard in the churches now days to teach we do not play a role in salvation through Christ, but a lot of scriptures are spoken directly to us on what we are to do like this one for instance;

Jude 1:21
Keep yourselves in the love of God, looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life.

Even Apostle Paul said this same standard multiple times that we must continue in the faith laying a good foundation in Christ unto eternal life. We can not deny what scripture says as it is the Word of God !!!

Yes! I completely agree with those scriptures, and any others you find as well. I am completely saved by grace through faith and not by works, but my faith isn't a dead faith without works like James describes. My faith enables me and moves me to good works!! Praise God!!


See! It's just a different way to look at it.

 

[psalm6819]

We must remember one of the ways that the Lord Jesus Christ keeps us in Him is by having others call us out when we are walking improperly by the faith. This is not a condemning process if done properly, but it is done in love for correction !!!

I have the Holy Spirit, my Bible and my local pastor to correct me.

I don't need strangers telling me that Jesus Christ did not pay the price for my sins.

I'm sorry for people that think His sacrifice is not enough and need to accuse others of sinning because of trust in His mercy and grace.

Is the glass half full or half empty?

Focus on Jesus or focus on myself? I choose Him and He's faithful to change me.

And He has.

 

[posthuman]

i didn't open my own eyes, but i should use them, if they can see



when i falter, not by my own strength can i rise, but immediately His hand is there to hold me up

 

[KennethC]

I have the Holy Spirit, my Bible and my local pastor to correct me.

I don't need strangers telling me that Jesus Christ did not pay the price for my sins.

I'm sorry for people that think His sacrifice is not enough and need to accuse others of sinning because of trust in His mercy and grace.

Is the glass half full or half empty?

Focus on Jesus or focus on myself? I choose Him and He's faithful to change me.

And He has.

You completely misunderstand the purpose of our calling then, because Acts 20:28 says by the Holy Spirit we are put as overseers of the rest of the flock.

The Lord's sacrifice was that one time sacrifice we need and have no need of any other, but the scriptures tell us how to receive that remission of sins. And it nowhere says just simply believing He existed, died on the cross, and rose on the third day is enough.

Lord Jesus Himself even said those who believe in Him and have that foundation of their faith built on Him are those that do what He said. He said we must repent of our sins, be baptized, keep our confession in Him, forgive others, and walk properly in the faith by love.

1 John 1-2 shows that if you do sin again that you have to continue to walk in the light and confess those sins to be forgiven of them. It does not say anywhere that all sins were forgiven at minute one of faith, that is a misconception and usage of scripture for even Paul and Peter state only past sins have been forgiven.

 

[BarlyGurl]

I have the Holy Spirit, my Bible and my local pastor to correct me.

I don't need strangers telling me that Jesus Christ did not pay the price for my sins.

I'm sorry for people that think His sacrifice is not enough and need to accuse others of sinning because of trust in His mercy and grace.

Is the glass half full or half empty?

Focus on Jesus or focus on myself? I choose Him and He's faithful to change me.

And He has.

Seems to me Psalm, If you have the HS and a Pastor which you feel is adequate... then you have no reason to be commenting here. Why are you even enjoining yourself to the discussion? Looks like it is just to oppose those who recognize "the body" extends beyond themselves and whatever local corporate leader you infer we should be under submission to????

 

[Utah]

Seems to me Psalm, If you have the HS and a Pastor which you feel is adequate... then you have no reason to be commenting here. Why are you even enjoining yourself to the discussion? Looks like it is just to oppose those who recognize "the body" extends beyond themselves and whatever local corporate leader you infer we should be under submission to????

Because Psalm is glorifying the Lord with her open expression of her love for Him and His love for her. By her words she is justified, and Jesus is indeed going to acknowledge her before the Father because she has acknowledged Him to us.

 

[BarlyGurl]

Because Psalm is glorifying the Lord with her open expression of her love for Him and His love for her. By her words she is justified, and Jesus is indeed going to acknowledge her before the Father because she has acknowledged Him to us.

Are you her husband? If you are... then your answer is sufficient and acceptable... if you are not her husband there is no purpose in "running interference" to not answer my legitimate query... to HER.

 

[Utah]

Are you her husband? If you are... then your answer is sufficient and acceptable... if you are not her husband there is no purpose in "running interference" to not answer my legitimate query... to HER.

My relationship with Psalm, or the lack thereof, is none of your business. I'll interject anytime, anywhere, anyway I feel like it when it comes to glorifying God and supporting a fellow Christian against a hostile, condescending spirit, and there's not a thing you can do about it.

 

[BarlyGurl]

My relationship with Psalm, or the lack thereof, is none of your business. I'll interject anytime, anywhere, anyway I feel like it when it comes to glorifying God and supporting a fellow Christian against a hostile, condescending spirit, and there's not a thing you can do about it.

This is email... it is a discussion group... my questions were legitimate... the only one with the condescending spirit is the one who conjured it up. Since you apparently are not her husband... interject all you like... I will respond accordingly.

 

[slave]

My relationship with Psalm, or the lack thereof, is none of your business. I'll interject anytime, anywhere, anyway I feel like it when it comes to glorifying God and supporting a fellow Christian against a hostile, condescending spirit, and there's not a thing you can do about it.

At times God puts us thru the discipline of darkness to teach us to heed Him. Song birds are taught to sing in the dark and we are put into the shadow of God's hand until we learn to hear Him....Watch where God puts you into darkness and when you are there keep your mouth shut. Are you in the dark just now in your circumstances, or in your life with God? Then remain quiet....when you are in the dark, listen, and God will give you a very precious message for someone else when you get into the light.

 

[MikkoAinasoja]

Jesus did that for us at the cross. We are washed clean by His blood. If we could "purify" ourselves, we wouldn't need Jesus.

Many say that they are like pure, because our Lord, even though they do sin, and carry all kind of wrongness in they heart, and this kind of state of mind, is not pure, it is about loving of lie.

We have to truly purify our self if, we wish to see our God.

There is nothing unholy in God, but if our values are impure, then we do not him, and do not know where we are going to end.

Lord Yeshua died for us, and now if we take him in our hearts, and start to live like he lived, we are truly his follower, and he dwell in us, but if love this world, and the joys of it, then there is no room for God's love in us. The world has made us blind, and we most likely thank God, for this, world, even though the world do not know him.

 

[slave]

Many say that they are like pure, because our Lord, even though they do sin, and carry all kind of wrongness in they heart, and this kind of state of mind, is not pure, it is about loving of lie.

We have to truly purify our self if, we wish to see our God.

There is nothing unholy in God, but if our values are impure, then we do not him, and do not know where we are going to end.

Lord Yeshua died for us, and now if we take him in our hearts, and start to live like he lived, we are truly his follower, and he dwell in us, but if love this world, and the joys of it, then there is no room for God's love in us. The world has made us blind, and we most likely thank God, for this, world, even though the world do not know him.

I believe you and I are in agreement, I hope, of the finished message of the point you are trying to make here, but I would let the words you chose here filter thru Gods Word a bit more. The way it is left is to say Works toward Salvation is again recovered in thought. And of coarse this is not the Gospels message, yet what I believe you meant, and tell me if I'm wrong, "We have to allow, thru obedience, Christ's purity being wrought in us to a point of allowing God's glory to be seen in our everyday walk in life." We have no merit in the cleansing power of Christ in us, yet, we do have an obligation to use that which God has delivered.

Beware of false spirituality that is not based on the rugged facts of Christ's Church. One rugged fact is indeed the forgiveness of sins--"we have redemption thru His blood, the forgiveness of sins." We sometimes are trying to point out the other side of the argument, by bypassing the already heeded to point of grace, but to stay balanced is to include it all. Forgiveness is the Divine miracle of grace. We need to contemplate the amazing fact that God thru the death of Jesus Christ forgives us for every wrong we have ever done, not because we are sorry, but out of His sheer Mercy! To leave the center of the truth of that in the Gospel displayed is not to be disciplined.We sometimes lose our message when we go to prove a point for God. We must never do that. We must allow the Gospel to call us, and in response to it be fervently seeking it's accuracy.

God's forgiveness, then, is only natural in the Supernatural domain.

Now, the answer to the listeners of the words you spoke...there is the balance of the Gospel that swings another way as well.Another rugged fact is the need for new birth--"Marvel not that I said unto thee, ye must be born again," that is, you must be invaded by the Spirit of God by means of a Supernatural recreation. Being born of the Spirit is an unmistakable work of God, as mysterious as the wind.

Beware of the tendency to water down this supernatural point in your religion, for how does your perspective of the supernatural act of God found in the over- whelming victory found in Christ, compare to your view of you in lew of this? Remembering that it must be Him that is the 'new you' and not you outside of His comparison. The events of your portrayal of that become the measurements of your judgement. For God knows of Christ's abilities, and they are not suspect to individual human concerns. We must lift Christ up, then we will be lifted up in Christ. The "being" of sin in you is dead then...and the Lord in you is victorious, we then must simply let out the Christ in us thru discipline in Him.!

 

[Utah]

At times God puts us thru the discipline of darkness to teach us to heed Him. Song birds are taught to sing in the dark and we are put into the shadow of God's hand until we learn to hear Him....Watch where God puts you into darkness and when you are there keep your mouth shut. Are you in the dark just now in your circumstances, or in your life with God? Then remain quiet....when you are in the dark, listen, and God will give you a very precious message for someone else when you get into the light.

Been there, done that, and glory be to God in Jesus Christ, I'm very much in the Light. And being in the Light empowers me to knock spiritual elitists from their perch.

Check out my posts; when I'm not putting Pharisees in their place, I'm sharing love, encouragement, and oh yeah, that little thing called grace, which God freely gives to those who meet His Son at the foot of the Cross.

Have a nice day.

 

[Viligant_Warrior]

Modern Christianity, in general, teaches that the New Birth is PURELY POSITIONAL and thus any ACTUAL MANIFESTATION is disconnected.

You are poorly informed to the extreme of what the Gospel of Jesus Christ teaches.This is the Gospel:

Titus 2, NASB
11 For the grace of God has appeared, bringing salvation to all men,
12 instructing us to deny ungodliness and worldly desires and to live sensibly, righteously and godly in the present age,
13 looking for the blessed hope and the appearing of the glory of our great God and Savior, Christ Jesus,
14 who gave Himself for us to redeem us from every lawless deed, and to purify for Himself a people for His own possession, zealous for good deeds.
15 These things speak and exhort and reprove with all authority. Let no one disregard you.
Titus 3
1 Remind them to be subject to rulers, to authorities, to be obedient, to be ready for every good deed,
2 to malign no one, to be peaceable, gentle, showing every consideration for all men.
3 For we also once were foolish ourselves, disobedient, deceived, enslaved to various lusts and pleasures, spending our life in malice and envy, hateful, hating one another.
4 But when the kindness of God our Savior and His love for mankind appeared,
5 He saved us, not on the basis of deeds which we have done in righteousness, but according to His mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewing by the Holy Spirit,
6 whom He poured out upon us richly through Jesus Christ our Savior,
7 so that being justified by His grace we would be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.​

Note particularly those last three verses. Works have nothing to do with it, good or bad. It is justification by grace -- nothing else! You foolishly deny what the Bible teaches in favor of a "gospel" of men who want to mislead you into legalism and ungodly doctrines.

As to the deeds accomplished in the first eight verses quoted above, note the first words: "For the grace of God has appeared, bringing salvation to all men ... " It is not by anything we do, but by God's grace that we are saved. Look at v. 14: " ... who gave Himself for us to redeem us from every lawless deed ... "

That's not just some empty promise! That is Jesus promise to us! "Every lawless deed" literally means EVERY! LAWLESS! DEED! None stand! Past! Present! Future! Wiped away by the blood of Christ! AND YET YOU DENY THIS?? How foolish do you need to be, to ignore God's very words?

The rest of v. 14: " ... and to purify for Himself a people for His own possession, zealous for good deeds." "Zealous" -- the Greek zeloteß (zelotes): "One burning with zeal; a zealot; used of God as jealous of any rival and sternly vindicating his control; most eagerly desirous of, zealous for, a thing." There is no requirement for obedience in that passage, only zealousness for a God so great that, by His grace He reached down and saved us when we did not deserve it!

Romans 5
8 But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.​

Perhaps you can tell me why a God so great that He would save us even "while we were yet sinners" would then cast aside when we act like we naturally are? Your "gospel" is foolishness!

Salvation has been redefined, in their minds, to being some abstract concept or notion. This abstract concept or notion is premised purely on this invention of "Jesus paying the price owed" (which is not in the Bible).[/quote[]You've just denied the Gospel as clearly stated in God's word and therefore disqualified yourself from having any ability to participate in this discussion.

John 19
30 Therefore when Jesus had received the sour wine, He said, "It is finished!" And He bowed His head and gave up His spirit. ​

I know you've heard what I'm about to post said before, but what I've emboldened and underlined above tells me this is another biblical truth you unreasonably reject. The Greek to telestai (to telestai) translates to the English "It is finished!' But, it also is seen written across ancient Roman tax bills -- ironically, in red ink! -- to mean "paid in full." Tell me, Skin, what was He saying when He said those words from the cross?

This is what always happens when God’s people get their eyes off the basic truth of the gospel. The simplicity of the message of the cross does not split Christians apart. To the contrary, it binds them together. It is the glue that unites the church. Yet here you are, among others, being divisive, attempting to persuade us that sinless perfection in not only possible, but necessary. You lie, because you yourself have been lied to by others. Shake off the scales from your eyes! Awaken to the light!

You prattle on about "the service of sin" and can't even find that phrase in the Bible. "The service of sin" is not possible in the Christian. Sin is possible, but not the "service" of of it. Service, in the Bible and in the sense to which you refer to it, is latreia (latreia) refers only to the service and worship of God. Forms of it refer to public service, such as a tax collector or government official.

You accuse Christians of being able to alternately love Jesus and serve Him, and then offer that same kind of service to sin? Worship sin? Live sin? It is an ignorant thought, devoid of any knowledge of the action of the Holy Spirit within the true believer. In short, with a believer, it is impossible to be so double-minded, as James would call him/her.

Yet Christians do sin. That much is clear in John's first epistle.

1 John 2
1 My little children, I am writing these things to you so that you may not sin. And if anyone sins, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous;​

John says he is writing to that believers may not sin, but follows that with " ... if anyone sins, we have an Advocate with the Father ... " and He is Christ Jesus. So again, Skin, your "gospel" is sadly lacking in biblical truth. For it is obvious that Jesus Christ is not an Advocate for the sinning unbeliever. He must be an Advocate, therefore, to the believing Christian who falters. Making you dead wrong.

You have no response for this. I already know that. You will bluster, misquote or quote out of context, obfuscate, twist, even lie. But you have no response. Again, shake off the scales from your eyes! Awaken to the light! Be saved! For at this moment, you are not.

 

[psalm6819]

You completely misunderstand the purpose of our calling then, because Acts 20:28 says by the Holy Spirit we are put as overseers of the rest of the flock.

The Lord's sacrifice was that one time sacrifice we need and have no need of any other, but the scriptures tell us how to receive that remission of sins. And it nowhere says just simply believing He existed, died on the cross, and rose on the third day is enough.

Lord Jesus Himself even said those who believe in Him and have that foundation of their faith built on Him are those that do what He said. He said we must repent of our sins, be baptized, keep our confession in Him, forgive others, and walk properly in the faith by love.

1 John 1-2 shows that if you do sin again that you have to continue to walk in the light and confess those sins to be forgiven of them. It does not say anywhere that all sins were forgiven at minute one of faith, that is a misconception and usage of scripture for even Paul and Peter state only past sins have been forgiven.

1 Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received , and wherein ye stand ;
2 By which also ye are saved , if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.
3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received , how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;
4 And that he was buried , and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:




that is the gospel message which saves; to believe in Jesus. I do my best and He does the rest, not my fiflthy rag righteousness.

 

[psalm6819]

Seems to me Psalm, If you have the HS and a Pastor which you feel is adequate... then you have no reason to be commenting here. Why are you even enjoining yourself to the discussion? Looks like it is just to oppose those who recognize "the body" extends beyond themselves and whatever local corporate leader you infer we should be under submission to????

well that's certainly an attitude of love.

 

[psalm6819]

Because Psalm is glorifying the Lord with her open expression of her love for Him and His love for her. By her words she is justified, and Jesus is indeed going to acknowledge her before the Father because she has acknowledged Him to us.

Thank you, thye think I stand against them but I don't, I stand for Jesus and recognize that He IS the only way not my human efforts. I am willing clay in His hands. He is the Author and Finisher and I trust Him to be faithful.

 

[psalm6819]

well that's certainly an attitude of love.

Forgive me, I should not have spoken to you in that way, Barlygirl.

 

[BarlyGurl]

Forgive me, I should not have spoken to you in that way, Barlygirl.

Ok....tho the questions are still unanswered