Paying to be Fed or for Access?

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NikkiK

Guest
#1
#1
When we buy a book about God to read or pay to go see a special speaker or buy a CD to sing along a song about God; are we paying to be fed or are we paying for access to that experience that otherwise we cannot access?

If someone is given a gift, word, knowledge, teaching etc. Are these things that should be charged for? We know it costs money to print a book or to make a CD or to travel to arenas to preach so it can't really be free. However, does God want us to make our living off of these gifts he has given us to share?

I would like to hear opinions.

My opinion is split.
 
BruceWayne

BruceWayne

Senior Member
#2
Aug 7, 2013
3,694
357
83
Gotham City
#2
I think it's okay. 1 Corinthians 9 kind of talks about that. A preacher for example has the right to be paid, though he certainly doesn't have to use that right.

1 Corinthians 9:14: In the same way, the Lord commanded that those who proclaim the gospel should get their living by the gospel.

That's my opinion anyway. I don't want to get any more into that, because I've seen how discussions about verses end up here lol. :p
 
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NikkiK

Guest
#3
#3
BruceWayne said:
I think it's okay. 1 Corinthians 9 kind of talks about that. A preacher for example has the right to be paid, though he certainly doesn't have to use that right.

1 Corinthians 9:14: In the same way, the Lord commanded that those who proclaim the gospel should get their living by the gospel.

That's my opinion anyway. I don't want to get any more into that, because I've seen how discussions about verses end up here lol. :p
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Haha, I think that was used in a travel situation...right? There are expenses I cannot deny that.

That's really not what I am talking about, expenses need to be paid by someone and I am not opposed to paying for a book or CD.

It's the sharing of information that I wonder if it's right to charge for, not the expense/cost.
 
Willie-T

Willie-T

Banned
#4
Feb 7, 2015
22,418
413
0
#4
NikkiK said:
Haha, I think that was used in a travel situation...right? There are expenses I cannot deny that.

That's really not what I am talking about, expenses need to be paid by someone and I am not opposed to paying for a book or CD.

It's the sharing of information that I wonder if it's right to charge for, not the expense/cost.
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I kind of look at it as.... "Is it right NOT to pay them for their work and effort? Should we expect it for free?"

If all we do is just cover their costs, we limit them as to how much more they can turn out, because they will have to spend the time needed to produce such things, working at an outside job to pay for their food and housing and car, and insurance, and clothing, and kids.... etc.
 
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NikkiK

Guest
#5
#5
Ok then it would be equivalent to making a clay pot and selling it? And personally my book shelf is full and I like to buy Mp3's I am not disgruntled lol. I have traveled to see speakers and it's always a blessing.

I did go back and read 1 Cor 9 and I see what it says. There may be the "right" but I like Paul holding his higher standard for himself, it is a good thing to reach for.
 
Willie-T

Willie-T

Banned
#6
Feb 7, 2015
22,418
413
0
#6
Ever write a book? A song? Give a lecture?

These are not things you can easily do after getting home, exhausted, from a job... between cooking a meal, doing dishes, bathing the kids, washing clothes and the car, mowing the lawn, etc.

These things take thought, planning, , prayer, preparation, long, long hours of contemplation and relaxation time for inspiration to come...... then you can turn to the "practical and technical" part of studio time (songs) printing (books) packaging (all of them) warehousing, advertising, distribution, legal ramifications..... and a hundred and one other things.

This kind of stuff isn't just a part-time thing where they just dropped-in to have a conversation with you or me. This is a JOB, in itself.
 
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KennethC

Guest
#7
#7
BruceWayne said:
I think it's okay. 1 Corinthians 9 kind of talks about that. A preacher for example has the right to be paid, though he certainly doesn't have to use that right.

1 Corinthians 9:14: In the same way, the Lord commanded that those who proclaim the gospel should get their living by the gospel.

That's my opinion anyway. I don't want to get any more into that, because I've seen how discussions about verses end up here lol. :p
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Actually this is a bad rendering of 1 Corinthians 9:14, as this has nothing to do with financial gain.

For the Apostle Paul clearly says in 1 Timothy 6:5 that anybody who thinks godliness is a means to gain we are to withdraw from such people, because their doctrine is built on greed.

Living by the gospel means that we are to confirm our lives to the way the Lord set before us to walk, as the Lord said freely you have been given freely you are to give. (Matthew 10:8)

The Lord did not say to charge for giving the word, healing, and any of the other gifts we will administer by the Holy Spirit.

I have no problem with them charging money for books they have written or CD/DVD's they have made, but if they use the money for self instead of edifying others then that is where I have a problem. Because the bible clearly warns of getting mixed up in the snares of evil that the love of money leads to, as it shows that some who once preached the truth do get drawn away in apostasy from it.
 
Willie-T

Willie-T

Banned
#8
Feb 7, 2015
22,418
413
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#8
Man, talk about being stingy! LOL
 
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NikkiK

Guest
#9
#9
I guess as a person I more desire to be communal (by choice and not force). To give freely what I have to offer with the ability I can. I spent day in and day out for years with nuns (I am no where near Catholic). I saw them give give give everything they had and did not expect anything in return. They were cared for, but they lived a very simple life. They ministered, taught, worked for the whole of the community. That therein lies where I am split. As for me, I served too, I gave my time outside of work with the gifts I had to offer and I would never want money for sharing those gifts.

So the idea of it's a job, yes all of it is a job, all service is. I am not a preacher or a teacher...in a perfect world I think we should all share what we have to offer freely.

Sure that can be a FT job, I don't dispute that. Maybe the burden of being a pastor should fall on more than one man? More than one person can step up to the plate. If ten people teach and preach a man can have a job and take the time it needs to contemplate, plan and think? I know there are men who are lead pastors and they work on top of it and I think that is highly admirable.

On the other hand, my favorite preacher is Joseph Prince and I know that he is more accessible because he can make it his job.

Like I said, I am split. I thought it is a good discussion to have.
 
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KennethC

Guest
#10
#10
NikkiK said:
I guess as a person I more desire to be communal (by choice and not force). To give freely what I have to offer with the ability I can. I spent day in and day out for years with nuns (I am no where near Catholic). I saw them give give give everything they had and did not expect anything in return. They were cared for, but they lived a very simple life. They ministered, taught, worked for the whole of the community. That therein lies where I am split. As for me, I served too, I gave my time outside of work with the gifts I had to offer and I would never want money for sharing those gifts.

So the idea of it's a job, yes all of it is a job, all service is. I am not a preacher or a teacher...in a perfect world I think we should all share what we have to offer freely.

Sure that can be a FT job, I don't dispute that. Maybe the burden of being a pastor should fall on more than one man? More than one person can step up to the plate. If ten people teach and preach a man can have a job and take the time it needs to contemplate, plan and think? I know there are men who are lead pastors and they work on top of it and I think that is highly admirable.

On the other hand, my favorite preacher is Joseph Prince and I know that he is more accessible because he can make it his job.

Like I said, I am split. I thought it is a good discussion to have.
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Well the positions in the Church (body of believers) is and was never to be taken as a job aspect, as that in turn would then make it into a obligation and nothing is to be done in a obligation manner.

Which is why the giving without expecting anything in return is a better way to live, because if we make it into a what do I get for doing this then we make it about self and not doing for others in love.

Out of love is what all things in the faith are to be done in, and Apostle Paul makes this clear in 1 Corinthians 13.
Anything done without love is worthless and means nothing !!!
 
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NikkiK

Guest
#11
#11
KennethC said:
Well the positions in the Church (body of believers) is and was never to be taken as a job aspect, as that in turn would then make it into a obligation and nothing is to be done in a obligation manner.

Which is why the giving without expecting anything in return is a better way to live, because if we make it into a what do I get for doing this then we make it about self and not doing for others in love.

Out of love is what all things in the faith are to be done in, and Apostle Paul makes this clear in 1 Corinthians 13.
Anything done without love is worthless and means nothing !!!
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Job was probably the wrong word to use as it does mean to get compensation. Not sure what other word but service.
 
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KennethC

Guest
#12
#12
NikkiK said:
Job was probably the wrong word to use as it does mean to get compensation. Not sure what other word but service.
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Service or live in servitude would be a better way to put it, because out of love for Him we are to serve Him in the faith and not neglect the gift of the Holy Spirit given to us.

This is where I get in hot water with some, because the bible clearly warns on neglecting and denying the working of the Holy Spirit given to us. The Lord Jesus also gives examples of the dangers of being a disobedient servant, however I will not get into all that because I don't want your thread to get derailed.

So to keep with the topic we are never to do anything in the faith just for self, this is why the Pharisees were called hypocrites and vipers by the Lord. They were self-righteous who did things to be recognized by others and for self gain.
 
BruceWayne

BruceWayne

Senior Member
#13
Aug 7, 2013
3,694
357
83
Gotham City
#13
KennethC said:
Actually this is a bad rendering of 1 Corinthians 9:14, as this has nothing to do with financial gain.

For the Apostle Paul clearly says in 1 Timothy 6:5 that anybody who thinks godliness is a means to gain we are to withdraw from such people, because their doctrine is built on greed.

Living by the gospel means that we are to confirm our lives to the way the Lord set before us to walk, as the Lord said freely you have been given freely you are to give. (Matthew 10:8)

The Lord did not say to charge for giving the word, healing, and any of the other gifts we will administer by the Holy Spirit.
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I wasn't suggesting in any way, shape, or form that anyone has the right to use godliness as a means to gain or getting rich, so don't try to turn it into something it's not lol. Nothing I posted had anything to do with greed. Even those in ministry have the right to make a living from what they do, though. And I'll leave it at that :eek:
 
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NikkiK

Guest
#14
#14
I know everyone here's heart is in the right place..
 
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3Scoreand10

Guest
#15
#15
I find it strange that a person will buy a ticket to here someone sing or lecture or buy a book, but will not support the pastor of their local church.
 
tourist

tourist

Senior Member
#16
Mar 13, 2014
42,373
16,866
113
69
Tennessee
#16
3Scoreand10 said:
I find it strange that a person will buy a ticket to here someone sing or lecture or buy a book, but will not support the pastor of their local church.
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Perhaps, they figure that the services of the pastor are an entitlement.
 
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NikkiK

Guest
#17
#17
3Scoreand10 said:
I find it strange that a person will buy a ticket to here someone sing or lecture or buy a book, but will not support the pastor of their local church.
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I was a faithful tither.. but when you don't have a church building you attend you are free to give to charity. I would much rather give to VOM or Feed My Starving Children or help my neighbor pay his car payment than fund a building .
 
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NikkiK

Guest
#18
#18
Wow, it's nice how people judge. It is meant to be a conversation not accusations.
 
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Siberian_Khatru

Guest
#19
#19
NikkiK said:
When we buy a book about God to read or pay to go see a special speaker or buy a CD to sing along a song about God; are we paying to be fed or are we paying for access to that experience that otherwise we cannot access?
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To each their own. I should hope that, especially in all matters concerning growth, we are paying to be imbued, not to be superfluous.

If someone is given a gift, word, knowledge, teaching etc. Are these things that should be charged for? ...does God want us to make our living off of these gifts he has given us to share?
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Again, it's subject to each their own. Paid to teach/instruct? No issues there. Volunteer tutor (unpaid)? Also fine. (Speaking of volunteers, keep Doctors Without Boarders in your hearts.)

Maybe you elaborated already, but do you mind me asking why your opinion is split, Nikki?
 
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3Scoreand10

Guest
#20
#20
NikkiK said:
I was a faithful tither.. but when you don't have a church building you attend you are free to give to charity. I would much rather give to VOM or Feed My Starving Children or help my neighbor pay his car payment than fund a building .
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I said nothing about a building.
I said the pastor of a local church.
A true church is not the building but the people. The baptised belivers who have united together to preach the Gospel to all in their area.
If and when you choose not to be a part of a local church, you are out of fellowship with your Savior.
You will never find a perfect local church, so find the one that is reaching the lost and join in.
 
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