Getting a Leg Up on the Competition... Even if the Competition Has 4 Legs and a Tail?

[seoulsearch]

Hey everyone,

I was watching random YouTube videos last night and somehow came across a woman who is obsessed with animals--and in particular, rats. The video showed her cuddling with several of her 19 rats, and her teenage son (her only child) described his mother's rats as, "my brothers and sisters."

What really caught my attention though, was when it was mentioned that the woman and her husband were currently separated, living in different residences, and while the husband very much wanted to reconcile, the woman told him (on camera), that the rats would always come before him (because unlike him, her rats love her unconditionally and don't judge her) and that he would have to accept that if they were ever going to get back together.

This reminded me of a guy I had been communicating with several years ago on a Christian dating site. He had a beloved dog whom he doted on and asked me if I thought that would be a problem. At the time, I wrote that I thought it was perfectly understandable to be understanding of a pet who had been in a person's life long before another person.

In his emails, this person would write me very detailed messages about his dog's personal schedule, emotions, and temperament, such as, "Today was our pedicure and grooming appointment, and it was a very rough day... 'Rosie' (for the sake of privacy, I won't use the dog's real name ) was very upset about it for several hours," (even though the dog apparently had these appointments regularly--I forget what it was about this particular day that upset her more than usual.) I would certainly be understanding of someone loving their pet. But, if it was a situation in which we were trying to have a relationship and he clearly cared more about his pet than about my feelings (within reason), I would probably feel as if there wasn't enough room for me in the relationship and would bow out.

Although I never wound up meeting this guy (we set up a tentative meeting but he never got back to me to confirm it; something like 7 months later he wrote me out of the blue and told me he was engaged--presumably not to his dog), it definitely got me thinking.

I am all for the love and companionship people find from having pets. But, is there possibly a point of going too far? Here are some questions I'm hoping you all might be interested in answering:

1. Have you ever been made to feel less important to someone than their pet, or animals in general? How did you react or cope?

2. If you have a beloved animal in your life, will it be a hard adjustment to include another person into your routine?

3. If you had to choose, would you choose your pet over a person? And, if you are the person who adjusting to someone with a pet, how understanding/flexible should you have to be? For example, would you take allergy medicines, if necessary?

4. Is there, or should there be a line? God certainly wants us to treat animals with dignity and compassion, but what would He say when we love animals more than people? (Are there specific Scriptures that address this? I would definitely be interested if anyone has any to share.)

Looking forward to your thoughts! =^.^= (<-- Not sure if I remember how make an emoticon of a cat , but hey, at least I tried...)

 

[Lynx]

I'm going to have to answer your questions in reverse order, because that's how the answers came to my mind before I even read the questions.

4. Of course there's a line, but people such as you describe are not what I would consider the norm. Such an involved relationship with an animal, to the exclusion of relationships with people, is not what I would consider normal.

3. Depends on the person. There are some people that frankly I would say my dog is a better human than they are. But I know a lot of people who are more human than my dog.

2. Only if they are allergic to dog or cat hair.

1. Nope. Never met anybody that involved with a pet before. I know they exist but I don't personally know any of them.

 

[JeniBean]

1.) Nope, Nada, Never
2.) Nope, Not at all - unless the animal did not like said person... listen to that animal instinct.
3.) Nope, Never - If I am allergic...example I am allergic to cats - they would have to chose and chose early on as the fur on their clothes would cause issues.
4.) I haven't got a clue, as I try to treat all living things that I am not allergic to with compassion.

 

[Lynx]

I have to add that I can see how a person could get more attached to a pet. Dogs and cats for the most part have cupboard love - they love you because you feed and pet them. (Yes, yes, I know all the stories about pets going above and beyond for their owners, but we're talking about the average pet.) Such a relationship is more shallow, but also more simple, predictable and easier to control.

 

[Willie-T]

I have to admit, I love dogs more than I do people.

 

[Donkeyfish07]

Im totally attached to my cats. I would choose them over a person anyday. They are just like children to me,.I am one hundred percent responsible for them and they are my babies. No more less family than any person would be.

 

[seoulsearch]

I have to admit, I love dogs more than I do people.

I do understand why people love animals more than people. As Donkeyfish said, it's a simple, unconditional love. You don't have to worry about whether or not your dog or cat is going to reject you no matter what you're struggling with. Your dog won't care if you drink every night or do whatever--he'll love you no matter what. You can have bad days or even be especially mean and your pet isn't going to desert you because of it.

I like animals with sweet, cuddly natures. I've always entertained the thought of getting two kittens because I work a lot and wouldn't want them to be lonely. But I've also known a lot of people who spend as much or more on their pets than on children, and for me, it's a personal expense (along with my allergies) I decided against. I've actually been hoping to meet someone whose cat(s) I could visit and buy toys for. (Just like with kids... for me, it's all about the toys! )

However, I've also always wondered where the line is between loving animals... and making them personal idols. Although God obviously wants us to care for His creations, the focus of the Bible is always on our service to other people.

If we get to heaven and have to honestly admit, "Lord, I spent more time, money, and energy/understanding on my cat/dog/ferret/iguana than on the people around me I see in need," what is God going to say?

 

[seoulsearch]

I've actually been hoping to meet someone whose cat(s) I could visit and buy toys for. (Just like with kids... for me, it's all about the toys! )

Before I get piles of hate messages/posts telling me I'm shallow and just want to date someone for their cat, I guess I should clarify: when I said I was "hoping to meet someone" who has a cat that I could visit and spoil, I was talking about a making friends with a neighbor, co-worker, someone at church, etc. who just happened to have a lovable pet.

Let me assure you that I am NOT looking just to date someone just because they have a cat, nor would I reject someone because they didn't have a cat. I am also NOT looking to use anyone for their cats and/or kids. It's just that if I happen to befriend cool people who have cool pets and/or kids that I can buy presents for, that's just a bonus and something I like to do.

You'd think a person wouldn't have to explicitly explain this, but seeing how some of the threads have gone here lately, I'm thinking it's best to be absolutely clear.

Donkeyfish, you can stop hiding your cats from me now.

(However... I saw this adorable stuffed "Gingerbread Man" squeaky toy the other day I would have loved to buy for someone's sweet, cuddly pet...)

 

[Abing]

Hey Kim! Coming from the eastern culture, I'll have to say this is a very rare topic and occurence. I had pets and loved them as, just that, pets. I lived with 4 dogs at most when I was younger and a few cats until high school. It never occured to me, and it certainly wasn't a society thing to us, to even buy our pets toys, even the thought of it. See, I've seen my pets *disturbing topic follows, please be warned* my pets killed in front of me (we weren't christians yet and our neighbors would get drunk and find our pets and cook them, i wont go into detail - i mean thats detailed enough, im sorry!!). I heard their dying cries and it scarred my innocence as a kid. But I'm not alone cause, see, in eastern culture, *some* pets are even eaten by their own masters. That's barbaric, yes. I can say that now having been introduced to other cultures. But most of the people who are still not exposed to this (and yes these people do exist, mind you, there's a lot of them that need Light) find it normal. We stopped having pets when I graduated highschool (reason being my brother was born and he was asthmatic). I haven't had a pet of my own since I started living alone. I thought about volunteering in an animal shelter but my mom was like, why not volunteer to teach kids or help the grannies? And I was like, oh yeah of course. I mean yeah we all had bad encounters with other humans, but there will never be a reason enough to put pets above them. Whatever that freaking reason is. Seriously.

To answer your questions (and I'm having a hard time quoting your post cause im on mobile and screen's too small >.<) It's beyond normal to me, that youtube video you've mentioned. If I was the guy, I wouldn't give it a second thought, that woman needs some serious help. But then again, it's loss of faith in humanity and as prophesied in the bible, days have come when people think of themselves as equal to animals, or worse, less.

 

[seoulsearch]

Hi Abing!

Thank you very much for your honest and eye-opening answer. I'm sorry if my thread is too "America-centric" in that it seems to focus on cultural issues here in the USA. One thing I enjoy about posts from users like Tintin, Roh_Chris, yourself, and many others is that you help enlighten us to different views around the world.

I was married to someone who grew up in the Philippines and whose mother occasionally cooked dogs as a meal. My ex's American father also said that whenever they had a dog as a pet, it would go missing because someone had stolen it for food or (perceived) healing properties. He told me that black dogs (and especially their livers) were seen as being medicinal and so they never lasted long if anyone had them.

Here in America and other places, I often wonder if we've gotten to a place in which a lot of people worship animals and place their value over that of human life. I was watching a news story about a woman who felt it was "her life's calling" to rescue rabbits, and so she her house and yard was absolutely filled to the brim with them.

I think rescuing animals can be a wonderful thing.

But I do have to wonder what God would say when animals become more important to people than other people.

 

[MadParrotWoman]

Hey everyone,

I was watching random YouTube videos last night and somehow came across a woman who is obsessed with animals--and in particular, rats. The video showed her cuddling with several of her 19 rats, and her teenage son (her only child) described his mother's rats as, "my brothers and sisters."

What really caught my attention though, was when it was mentioned that the woman and her husband were currently separated, living in different residences, and while the husband very much wanted to reconcile, the woman told him (on camera), that the rats would always come before him (because unlike him, her rats love her unconditionally and don't judge her) and that he would have to accept that if they were ever going to get back together.

This reminded me of a guy I had been communicating with several years ago on a Christian dating site. He had a beloved dog whom he doted on and asked me if I thought that would be a problem. At the time, I wrote that I thought it was perfectly understandable to be understanding of a pet who had been in a person's life long before another person.

In his emails, this person would write me very detailed messages about his dog's personal schedule, emotions, and temperament, such as, "Today was our pedicure and grooming appointment, and it was a very rough day... 'Rosie' (for the sake of privacy, I won't use the dog's real name ) was very upset about it for several hours," (even though the dog apparently had these appointments regularly--I forget what it was about this particular day that upset her more than usual.) I would certainly be understanding of someone loving their pet. But, if it was a situation in which we were trying to have a relationship and he clearly cared more about his pet than about my feelings (within reason), I would probably feel as if there wasn't enough room for me in the relationship and would bow out.

Although I never wound up meeting this guy (we set up a tentative meeting but he never got back to me to confirm it; something like 7 months later he wrote me out of the blue and told me he was engaged--presumably not to his dog), it definitely got me thinking.

I am all for the love and companionship people find from having pets. But, is there possibly a point of going too far? Here are some questions I'm hoping you all might be interested in answering:

1. Have you ever been made to feel less important to someone than their pet, or animals in general? How did you react or cope?

2. If you have a beloved animal in your life, will it be a hard adjustment to include another person into your routine?

3. If you had to choose, would you choose your pet over a person? And, if you are the person who adjusting to someone with a pet, how understanding/flexible should you have to be? For example, would you take allergy medicines, if necessary?

4. Is there, or should there be a line? God certainly wants us to treat animals with dignity and compassion, but what would He say when we love animals more than people? (Are there specific Scriptures that address this? I would definitely be interested if anyone has any to share.)

Looking forward to your thoughts! =^.^= (<-- Not sure if I remember how make an emoticon of a cat , but hey, at least I tried...)

Facebook is full of folks who are obsessed with animals, I have even argued with those who feel and make it know to others their feelings that animals are more important than people. I've lost count of how many times I've read comments such as: "I prefer the company of animals to people" or "my animals come first". I put it to one such person: "If there were a fire in your house who would be first on your list to rescue?" She answered "I wouldn't put one before the other". I unfriended her after that, it is so morally wrong and I felt for her daughter. One time, many years ago when my children were little, I took them for a walk along a beach and a huge dog came up to them in a threatening way and my children were frightened, the owner was way behind the dog. After checking my kids were OK I approached the woman owner of the dog and was met with a tirade of abuse and she used words such as "my dog has more right to this beach than your kids".

Please don't get me wrong I love animals and believe they should be treated well - even spoiled but God gave man dominion over them and they were used for food in Biblical times. Pets are companions of course but I don't believe any animal should ever take preference over a human being.

 

[Donkeyfish07]

Before I get piles of hate messages/posts telling me I'm shallow and just want to date someone for their cat, I guess I should clarify: when I said I was "hoping to meet someone" who has a cat that I could visit and spoil, I was talking about a making friends with a neighbor, co-worker, someone at church, etc. who just happened to have a lovable pet.

Let me assure you that I am NOT looking just to date someone just because they have a cat, nor would I reject someone because they didn't have a cat. I am also NOT looking to use anyone for their cats and/or kids. It's just that if I happen to befriend cool people who have cool pets and/or kids that I can buy presents for, that's just a bonus and something I like to do.

You'd think a person wouldn't have to explicitly explain this, but seeing how some of the threads have gone here lately, I'm thinking it's best to be absolutely clear.

Donkeyfish, you can stop hiding your cats from me now.

(However... I saw this adorable stuffed "Gingerbread Man" squeaky toy the other day I would have loved to buy for someone's sweet, cuddly pet...)

You have my permission to love on my kitties when you finally get down here for a visit. If you get hungry, there are plenty of strays around so Im sure mine will be safe

 

[seoulsearch]

You have my permission to love on my kitties when you finally get down here for a visit. If you get hungry, there are plenty of strays around so Im sure mine will be safe

But what if yours look the meatiest... and I'm REALLY hungry... I want a real entree, not just puny little appetizers!

*Yet another disclaimer: No, I don't really dine on cats. This is a long-running joke between DF and I because of my Asian-ocity. And no, DF and I are not a couple. But, we have been friends for a really long time. He lets me vent and be who I really am without criticism and I always appreciate that.*

Just thought it would be necessary to clarify!

 

[Donkeyfish07]

But what if yours look the meatiest... and I'm REALLY hungry... I want a real entree, not just puny little appetizers!

*Yet another disclaimer: No, I don't really dine on cats. This is a long-running joke between DF and I because of my Asian-ocity. And no, DF and I are not a couple. But, we have been friends for a really long time. He lets me vent and be who I really am without criticism and I always appreciate that.*

Just thought it would be necessary to clarify!

Everyone knows I have no girlfrend Kimmy, its all good. But fair warning, you better be ready to get on some rollercoasters. Wait the extra few minutes in line to get in the front seat. Don't be a chicken when you get here

 

[MissCris]

Sometimes I accuse my husband of being nicer to the cats than he is to me. Then he gets all like, "Ok, well that's not even true, because which one of these cats has their own car to drive?" And I'm all, "Zelda does! Don't think I didn't notice her cruising down the street in that fancy red car!" So then HE says, "Red car? Oh, you mean my dad? You just said my dad looks like a little black cat." But I go, "Well if the fur coat fits...!" And then he says, "I don't even know what that means." And I say, "That's because you only understand the cats, and never me!"

And then he just shakes his head like he can't believe the insanity up in here.

This is why I hate cats.

 

[seoulsearch]

Facebook is full of folks who are obsessed with animals, I have even argued with those who feel and make it know to others their feelings that animals are more important than people. I've lost count of how many times I've read comments such as: "I prefer the company of animals to people" or "my animals come first". I put it to one such person: "If there were a fire in your house who would be first on your list to rescue?" She answered "I wouldn't put one before the other". I unfriended her after that, it is so morally wrong and I felt for her daughter. One time, many years ago when my children were little, I took them for a walk along a beach and a huge dog came up to them in a threatening way and my children were frightened, the owner was way behind the dog. After checking my kids were OK I approached the woman owner of the dog and was met with a tirade of abuse and she used words such as "my dog has more right to this beach than your kids".

Please don't get me wrong I love animals and believe they should be treated well - even spoiled but God gave man dominion over them and they were used for food in Biblical times. Pets are companions of course but I don't believe any animal should ever take preference over a human being.

I know we're kind of veering off into another direction, but I think it's an important topic and I thank you for the feedback.

I had a friend in college who worked for Pfizer pharmaceuticals and she would tell me stories of animal rights fanatics (the ones who would prefer that humans die rather than animals) who obtained important jobs in the labs, etc., masquerading as regular staff--when in fact, they were there to purposely sabotage years of research for cancer treatments, etc., in the name of animal rights.

While I definitely think animal testing can be a tough subject to navigate--I certainly don't believe in torturing or mistreating animals, and the entire pharmaceutical juggernaut is yet another topic of endless debate--I most definitely don't agree with purposely destroying millions of dollars of research and years worth of work that could save countless lives and ease millions of people's suffering either.

It's interesting to me that in the Bible, God demands blood sacrifices and animal sacrifices weren't just expected from His people, but demanded as an integral part of worship. And when no animal could be found that could cover all our sins. God sent His own Son to shed His blood instead. I always wonder what the animal rights people of today would have thought of the Old Testament blood sacrifices that were a non-optional and very integral part of following the Lord.

Also, when Adam and Eve fell into sin, it's interesting to note that THEY chose to cover themselves in fig leaves, but when they were forced to reveal their sin to God, HE then clothed them with animal skins. ("The Lord God made garments of skin for Adam and his wife, and clothed them..." Gen. 3:21.) Presumably, He must have used animal skins, as no other human beings were around at this time, and maybe it's just me, but I highly doubt God would have clothed them with human skin even if other humans had been born by that time.

To my knowledge, the Bible doesn't say, "And God demanded a sacrifice, and then used the skins of the animals that were sacrificed to clothe Adam and Eve..." and if I'm wrong, I invite anyone to please list the passages that say otherwise because I find this fascinating. Did God make sure there was another purpose in the death of whatever animal(s) He chose for this, such as food or sacrifice? Or did the Lord God Himself choose to end the lives of certain animals in order to clothe the crowns of His own creation that had just disobeyed Him, with no other purpose but to used their skins for garments?

It's one of those questions I plan to ask when I get to heaven, even though it won't matter then--but I really want to know the answer.

Unless, of course, anyone else here can provide the answer in Scripture and I'd be most grateful--one more ? to cross of my list.

 

[seoulsearch]

Everyone knows I have no girlfrend Kimmy, its all good. But fair warning, you better be ready to get on some rollercoasters. Wait the extra few minutes in line to get in the front seat. Don't be a chicken when you get here

Ahem. What you really meant to say is, you'd better not be a rooster because I have every intention of being the one who fights off teenagers to get the front seat of the fastest, highest coasters... until my dying day.

I stood in line nearly 4 hours in the afternoon to ride this when it first opened, and another 2 hours to ride it again at night, so have no fears, DF.

I won't be crowing anytime soon. (You'd better be ready for a challenge to your Daredevil self! )

 

[Lynx]

Front? Pfft! With any given roller coaster the ride is different depending where you sit. Some are better in the middle, some better in the back seat. Some happen to be better in the front. It all depends on how long the roller coaster is and how each part hits the curve. You have to try all the seats to know which is best.


So seoulsearch, this person with a house full of rabbits... where did you say that place was again?
*Lynx gets out a cast-iron skillet and heats it up.

 

[Abing]

...To my knowledge, the Bible doesn't say, "And God demanded a sacrifice, and then used the skins of the animals that were sacrificed to clothe Adam and Eve..." and if I'm wrong, I invite anyone to please list the passages that say otherwise because I find this fascinating. Did God make sure there was another purpose in the death of whatever animal(s) He chose for this, such as food or sacrifice? Or did the Lord God Himself choose to end the lives of certain animals in order to clothe the crowns of His own creation that had just disobeyed Him, with no other purpose but to used their skins for garments?

It's one of those questions I plan to ask when I get to heaven, even though it won't matter then--but I really want to know the answer.

Unless, of course, anyone else here can provide the answer in Scripture and I'd be most grateful--one more ? to cross of my list.

This is interesting! (Sorry for derailing) This passage may not answer the question but I think this goes well with your example above.. Genesis 9:2-3 (After the flood, talking to Noah and his family...)The fear of you and the dread of you shall be upon every beast of the earth and upon every bird of the heavens, upon everything that creeps on the ground and all the fish of the sea. Into your hand they are delivered. Every moving thing that lives shall be food for you. And as I gave you the green plants, I give you everything.

It's also good to note that the covenant that God made (to never flood the earth again) wasn't only with humans but with every beasts on earth too (Genesis 9:9). So God cares for all His creations, includin animals, just that, animals were made for us and not the other way around.

 

[Donkeyfish07]

Ahem. What you really meant to say is, you'd better not be a rooster because I have every intention of being the one who fights off teenagers to get the front seat of the fastest, highest coasters... until my dying day.

I stood in line nearly 4 hours in the afternoon to ride this when it first opened, and another 2 hours to ride it again at night, so have no fears, DF.

I won't be crowing anytime soon. (You'd better be ready for a challenge to your Daredevil self! )

I don't think you can hang with my daredevil alter ego. Wanna up the ante? How about skydiving? Base jumping? Wanna rent some jet skiis and bet money on races? By insurance and jump them? There are alot of ways I could get an adrenaline fix I haven't tried yet, lol.