Twice dead

[gb9]

The grace and Spirit of God does approve of sin, be rather reproves the world of sin. That is where the lies of Hyper grace are exposed by not speaking out against sinful behavior, but rather saying you are saved despite your sinful behavior. This is the doctrine of the Devil that proclaims you can still sin and not die.

for the 1000th time NO ONE HERE IS SAYING THAT A PERSON CAN DO WHATEVER LIVE HOWEVER AND STILL BE SAVED. the real doctrine of the devil is saying that you are never REALLY saved, it bounces around. this keeps people in works bondage, which is exactly what you are saying.

 

[Grace777x70]

This is what believers in the grace of our Lord Jesus have to say about "sanctification"..the word itself means = "to be set apart"

We are perfectly sanctified in Christ now....very true....we as an identity the new creation in Christ will never be more holy....however there is a "sanctifying" of our behavior that is on-going that reflects our true nature in Christ...so in essence...we are becoming outwardly who we really are in our inner man which is in Christ.

God sets apart ( sanctifies )our attitudes and actions outwardly but you are 100% set apart ( sanctified ) as a person..the real you in your inner man..the new creation in Christ.

Hebrews 10:14 (NASB)
[SUP]14 [/SUP] For by one offering He has perfected for all time those who are sanctified. ( this is present passive..passive is that something is being done to you ...the Spirit of the Lord in us changing us. )

Here is what Jesus told Paul on the road to Damascus....having been sanctified ( perfect passive )..= done deal

Acts 26:17-18 (NASB)
[SUP]17 [/SUP] rescuing you from the Jewish people and from the Gentiles, to whom I am sending you,
[SUP]18 [/SUP] to open their eyes so that they may turn from darkness to light and from the dominion of Satan to God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins and an inheritance among those who have been sanctified by faith in Me.' ( perfect passive )



Sanctification to our "religious minds" could mean a lot of different things to different people as it depends on the religious beliefs formulated from our backgrounds.....not only the "biggie sins"...also like..no smoking..no drinking..no going to church..no reading your bible every day..no praying for an hour each day.....no going to a movie...reading a newspaper...no being a servant of God...the religious mindset says not doing "what I don't do.."..etc

 

[Grace777x70]

It is obvious from scripture that we are to walk out the holiness that is ion us. There is a difference between us as a person being "set apart" ( sanctified in our spirit ) and "setting apart " ( sanctifying ) our behavior.

1 Peter 1:15-16 (NASB)
[SUP]15 [/SUP] but like the Holy One who called you, be holy yourselves also in all your behavior;
[SUP]16 [/SUP] because it is written, "YOU SHALL BE HOLY, FOR I AM HOLY."

 

[mailmandan]

I know the Truth because He dwells in me. What you are doing is trying to misrepresent the truth in order to be in line with your false doctrine of OSAS. This doctrine denies that one can fall away from the faith, which is why you try to misrepresent the scriptures that prove the falling away from the faith is true.

I'm still waiting for you to answer my questions. *Please explain to me what YOU believe it means to be "saved by grace through faith, not works" (Ephesians 2:8,9). *Also, please explain to me what YOU believe it means to "believe the gospel" (Romans 1:16).

 

[InSpiritInTruth]

Unrepentant sinners (Luke 13:3) have not accomplished the will of God to receive eternal life (John 6:40) and are not saved. Those who are born of God "practice righteousness and not sin" (1 John 3:9-10) and are not looking to sin all they want and be in rebellion toward doing the will of God. Faith without works is dead does not mean that we are saved by works, but that genuine faith is evidenced by works. If a person SAYS-CLAIMS they have faith, but they have no works - James 2:14 (to back up their claim), then they have an "empty profession of faith/a dead faith," not genuine faith. Simple!

I'm not saying we are saved by works, but an obedient faith will produce good fruit, or else Jesus' parable about knowing a tree by it's fruit means nothing.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I'm not saying we are saved by works, but an obedient faith will produce good fruit, or else Jesus' parable about knowing a tree by it's fruit means nothing.

if an obedient faith produces fruit, then it is eternal. If it is not eternal. but dependent on continued faith (producing good works) Then your teaching one must be saved by works. only trying to use the back to to say it so you can convince yourself and others you do not teach that, when in reality, you do.

 

[InSpiritInTruth]

I'm still waiting for you to answer my questions. *Please explain to me what YOU believe it means to be "saved by grace through faith, not works" (Ephesians 2:8,9). *Also, please explain to me what YOU believe it means to "believe the gospel" (Romans 1:16).

It means exactly what it says, we are saved by grace through faith. But if we are truly walking in the faith of Christ we shall walk as he walked by the power and Spirit of God. But also part of this faith is also believing in the words of God that proclaim a person can fall from the faith as is prophesied in many parts of scripture. Those who deny the words of God as true, are not of the faith and have proven themselves to be reprobate by denying the words of God as true.

 

[mailmandan]

It means exactly what it says, we are saved by grace through faith. But if we are truly walking in the faith of Christ we shall walk as he walked by the power and Spirit of God. But also part of this faith is also believing in the words of God that proclaim a person can fall from the faith as is prophesied in many parts of scripture. Those who deny the words of God as true, are not of the faith and have proven themselves to be reprobate by denying the words of God as true.

Please explain "exactly" what it means to be saved through faith. Do you include "believing that a person can lose their salvation" into "saved through faith" so everyone who believes they are eternally secure in Christ are not saved? Are you saying that ONLY those who have placed their faith in Christ for salvation AND believe that a saved person can lose their salvation are saved?

 

[InSpiritInTruth]

Please explain "exactly" what it means to be saved through faith. Do you include "believing that a person can lose their salvation" into "saved through faith" so everyone who believes they are eternally secure in Christ are not saved? Are you saying that ONLY those who have placed their faith in Christ for salvation AND believe that a saved person can lose their salvation are saved?

What I said was denying the words of God as true is not of faith. Do you think a person who rejects the words of God as true is of the faith and therefore still saved? Faith includes believing the words of God as true, if you reject the Truth, you also reject God's Son, which is Truth.

 

[mailmandan]

What I said was denying the words of God as true is not of faith. Do you think a person who rejects the words of God as true is of the faith and therefore still saved? Faith includes believing the words of God as true, if you reject the Truth, you also reject God's Son, which is Truth.

The question is, do you have faith in Christ as the ALL-sufficient means of your salvation. That is what your salvation depends on (Ephesians 2:8,9). My answer is YES. Not all Christians are going to agree on every interpretation of passages of scripture in the Bible but all genuine Christians agree on essential Christian doctrine. Not all Christians agree about eternal security or the rapture or whether or not tongues are for today etc.. but that does not mean if someone is wrong in that area, they will not be saved. Not being 100% right about everything the Bible teaches does not mean that someone is deliberately rejecting the truth and will not be saved. Christians are capable of error about certain things, but they all agree about the essentials. You make it sound like if someone is not 100% right about EVERYTHING in the Bible then they are not of the faith and will not be saved. You must think you are perfect!

 

[tourist]

Measure twice. Cut once.

 

[gb9]

The question is, do you have faith in Christ as the ALL-sufficient means of your salvation. That is what your salvation depends on (Ephesians 2:8,9). My answer is YES. Not all Christians are going to agree on every interpretation of passages of scripture in the Bible but all genuine Christians agree on essential Christian doctrine. Not all Christians agree about eternal security or the rapture or whether or not tongues are for today etc.. but that does not mean if someone is wrong in that area, they will not be saved. Not being 100% right about everything the Bible teaches does not mean that someone is deliberately rejecting the truth and will not be saved. Christians are capable of error about certain things, but they all agree about the essentials. You make it sound like if someone is not 100% right about EVERYTHING in the Bible then they are not of the faith and will not be saved. You must think you are perfect!

if I could like this 100 times I would. nailed it!!!! great job!!!!

 

[InSpiritInTruth]

The question is, do you have faith in Christ as the ALL-sufficient means of your salvation. That is what your salvation depends on (Ephesians 2:8,9). My answer is YES. Not all Christians are going to agree on every interpretation of passages of scripture in the Bible but all genuine Christians agree on essential Christian doctrine. Not all Christians agree about eternal security or the rapture or whether or not tongues are for today etc.. but that does not mean if someone is wrong in that area, they will not be saved. Not being 100% right about everything the Bible teaches does not mean that someone is deliberately rejecting the truth and will not be saved. Christians are capable of error about certain things, but they all agree about the essentials. You make it sound like if someone is not 100% right about EVERYTHING in the Bible then they are not of the faith and will not be saved. You must think you are perfect!

Ephesians 2:10 also says we are created in Christ unto good works, but I have heard many in the OSAS camp say our works do not matter. BALONY! Some have even suggested that ongoing wilful sin does not matter because we are covered by grace. BALONY! This stuff is false doctrine. That is also why they reject the notion one can even fall away from the faith because they have believed the lies of all these false teachers. If you deny the words of God as Truth, then you also deny Jesus Christ.

Ephesians 2:10
For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

2 Timothy 3:17
That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works.

Titus 1:16
They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Ephesians 2:10 also says we are created in Christ unto good works, but I have heard many in the OSAS camp say our works do not matter. BALONY! Some have even suggested that ongoing wilful sin does not matter because we are covered by grace. BALONY! This stuff is false doctrine. That is also why they reject the notion one can even fall away from the faith because they have believed the lies of all these false teachers. If you deny the words of God as Truth, then you also deny Jesus Christ.

Ephesians 2:10
For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

2 Timothy 3:17
That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works.

Titus 1:16
They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate.

eph 2 says all who are saved by faith will do works. Not that they might do works.

John says a true child of God will not live in willful sin..

again, Stop listening to men, Listen to God. and repent..

 

[mailmandan]

Ephesians 2:10 also says we are created in Christ unto good works, but I have heard many in the OSAS camp say our works do not matter. BALONY! Some have even suggested that ongoing wilful sin does not matter because we are covered by grace. BALONY!

We show our faith by our works (James 2:18). We are not saved by works, but UNTO/FOR good works (Ephesians 2:8-10). Big difference! Faith is the root and works are the fruit of salvation. Ongoing willful sin (practice sin) is not the lifestyle of someone who is born of God (1 John 3:9).

This stuff is false doctrine. That is also why they reject the notion one can even fall away from the faith because they have believed the lies of all these false teachers. If you deny the words of God as Truth, then you also deny Jesus Christ.

Who is teaching that believers "practice lawlessness" but are saved anyway?

Ephesians 2:10
For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

Yes, "unto" good works...that we should walk in them. NOT SAVED BY GOOD WORKS.

2 Timothy 3:17
That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works.

The word perfect "teleioi" comes from telo, end, goal, limit. It can be used as the absolute standard of our Heavenly Father, yet the word is also used for relative perfection as of adults compared with children. Thus it denotes those who have attained the full development of innate powers, in contrast to those who are still in the undeveloped state (children). Do you claim to be perfect in the sense being sinless, without fault or defect, flawless, exactly like Jesus?

Titus 1:16
They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate.

Titus 1:15 To the pure all things are pure, but to those who are defiled and unbelieving nothing is pure; but even their mind and conscience are defiled. 16 They profess to know God, but in works they deny Him, being abominable, disobedient, and disqualified for every good work. ​*Not descriptive of a believer.

 

[InSpiritInTruth]

We are not saved by works,

Never said we were.

 

[Jon4TheCross]

I believe to be twice dead, one must hate good and perfect, love, light, God, etc...after knowing God and experiencing the ability to give God. If we can give God to people even by measure, and then hate doing so to the point of approving of giving evil, then we have made our choice to fight God...knowing Him by measure and hating such a measure.
John 15:23-25Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)

23 He that hateth me hateth my Father also. 24 If I had not done among them the works which none other man did, they had not had sin: but now have they both seen and hated both me and my Father. 25 But this cometh to pass, that the word might be fulfilled that is written in their law, They hated me without a cause.
Hebrews 6:1-8Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)

6 Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God, 2 of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment. 3 And this will we do, if God permit. 4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost, 5 and have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come, 6 if they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame. 7 For the earth which drinketh in the rain that cometh oft upon it, and bringeth forth herbs meet for them by whom it is dressed, receiveth blessing from God: 8 but that which beareth thorns and briers is rejected, and is nigh unto cursing; whose end is to be burned.

Matthew 13:28-30Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)

28 He said unto them, An enemy hath done this. The servants said unto him, Wilt thou then that we go and gather them up? 29 But he said, Nay; lest while ye gather up the tares, ye root up also the wheat with them. 30 Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn.
Ephesians 4:17-19Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)

17 This I say therefore, and testify in the Lord, that ye henceforth walk not as other Gentiles walk, in the vanity of their mind, 18 having the understanding darkened, being alienated from the life of God through the ignorance that is in them, because of the blindness of their heart: 19 who being past feeling have given themselves over unto lasciviousness, to work all uncleanness with greediness.

 

[Jon4TheCross]

We are definitely saved by works...and whoever says otherwise is manifesting the spirit of error.....or was it manifesting rest when Jesus arrived and died on the cross for us? We are saved by the works of God...no doubt...which we do not deserve....and yes...what a great gift for Him to work on our behalf.

 

[KyleRae]

I know the Truth because He dwells in me. What you are doing is trying to misrepresent the truth in order to be in line with your false doctrine of OSAS. This doctrine denies that one can fall away from the faith, which is why you try to misrepresent the scriptures that prove the falling away from the faith is true.

Jesus said I know who are my sheep and no one takes them from me. Judus never fell away he never believed. If one truly believes they never fall away. thats what is being said.

 

[Base12]

LOL @ all of the hypocrisy!

"Second Death" this... and "Second Death" that...

"Twice Dead" here... and "Twice Dead" there...

Bla bla bla.

Yet the minute One asks... "Say, is Reincarnation Biblical?", what do you do?

You LIE to them and say "oh no... the Bible clearly states that Man dies only ONCE"...

Hebrews 9:27
"And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment"

Care to explain yourselves?